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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 6:50:50 AM | The belief that God is punishing people using nature and other unexplainable phenomena is nothing more than a manifestation of pride.It's akin to hitting a string of red lights in traffic and thinking that the traffic lights are conspiring against you.
People's pride cannot accept that these things are random chance natural things,so they attach behaviors to them in cause/effect terms.
The universe is indifferent,it does what it does,get over it.You are not the center of the universe,that's been proven. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 6:53:55 AM |
The belief that God is punishing people using nature and other unexplainable phenomena is nothing more than a manifestation of pride.It's akin to hitting a string of red lights in traffic and thinking that the traffic lights are conspiring against you.
People's pride cannot accept that these things are random chance natural things,so they attach behaviors to them in cause/effect terms.
The universe is indifferent,it does what it does,get over it.You are not the center of the universe,that's been proven.
Perfectly stated... | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 7:00:51 AM | | obviously we're all entitled to our own beliefs Taurus but the point i'm making here is that God is not responsible for the recent 'natural' disasters as this thread is referring to . Can i ask you a question ... do you have any faith in a higher power ? | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 7:10:01 AM | | Come on, you all know, its just Mother Earth trying to scratch the fleas (us humans) off her back....we really have become very annoying. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 2:44:26 PM | DG & Gorilla obviously don't read the same Bible I have... because if I remember correctly.. isn't there a verse that says "Judge not lest ye be judged"? Matthew 7:1
It amazes me how many "Christians" skip over that.
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
John 8:7
Maybe some of you who are professing such a grand understanding of your faith should re-read some things... just a thought  | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 2:46:40 PM | | Taurus, I won't paste your quote for a third time- I'll just say- very well put. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 5:37:13 PM | Can i ask you a question ... do you have any faith in a higher power ?
Yes,but unlike our friend Gorrila Grod,I don't know everything like he apparently does.I have no idea who or what controls the atoms in the universe but I do know one thing.It's a hell of a lot bigger than I am and it's bigger than any religion can dream up or name.I don't believe in anthropomorphic diety or celestial father figure,but moreso a collective intelligence incompassing everything in the universe,a creative force if you will,that binds and holds everything together.
Our personal happiness or misery,imho,is decided by each and every individual and his or her own choices in life.
I do have faith.This creatrive force or being,whatever you wish to call it,endowed me with a good healthy body and sound mind and put me in a decent home.I was given decent parents who raised me with common sense.What happens to me beyond that is based on the choices I make.If misforune befalls me,how I react to it will be what determines whether or not that I succumb or survive the misfortune.This is what I have faith in,not a bearded sky man on a throne ready to toss a lightening bolt at me if I stub my toe and shout,"God damn it!"
For those who think the misfortunes happening in the US are God's judgement,I am reminded of the story of Lot in Genesis.When the three angels visited Abraham to warn of the destruction of Sodom and Gomoorah,Abraham asked them if they would spare the city for the righteous and they told him that they would spare the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah for ONE righteous person.There were many innocent children and I'm sure many righteous people who perished in hurricane Katrina and the attack on the WTC towers.Did this God change his standards of who he should spare and who he shouldn't? | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 6:04:15 PM |
all hell would break loose, because without the salt of the Christians preserving the society, society would become anarchy and murder would reign.
GG, what about societies in the world today that are vastly non-Christian? They're not killing themselves off. If they did, there would hardly be any missionary fields. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 8:15:55 PM | | Thanks Taurus ... your response to my question was greatly appreciated ... I would be inappropriate for any so-called christian to judge others because their own personal beliefs don't agree with their own ... if there is one thing that the 'good book' instills in those who profess to be followers of Jesus is just that ... it is not for us to decide who finds favor with God ... who can read hearts ... some of the most vile and degraded people found favour with Jesus because He could read their hearts ... self-righteous pride is a dispiseable trait that finds no favour with Him ... I do also believe that everyone born on this planet has a built in moral code that directs him into committing acts that are of noble intent or wrong doing whether or not they worship a deity ... after all we are all free moral agents ... my question is if this ... as an intelligent thinking person which i believe you are , surely you must feel that things are heading to a boil on a global scale ... just wondering what your viewpoints are on this matter ? ... in regards to your to your statement ....."I have no idea who or what controls the atoms in the universe but I do know one thing.It's a hell of a lot bigger than I am and its bigger than any religion can dream up or name" .... if you have a copy of the Bible maybe check out this verse from ecclesiastes 3:11 thanks again for your well thought out reply .... its refreshing compared to some ...lol | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/1/2005 8:23:59 PM | | any typos were not intentional ...lol " 'it' not 'i' ...would be inappropriate for ......" | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 5:44:56 PM | Take it as one will, it is a mere questaion I had asked, giving a fair bit of background info on the place in question.
I really do not have all the answers as the Holy Bible says.
Vocal in regards of Judging who is really?
God's word? and If you know the glass is full of poison you would tell the person not to drink it right?
Just a few thoughts.
Feral you pick little points out but what the larger picture paints is there was sin is God mad or is Nature a fluke by nature?
Now think about it.
And do not give me the old line the russians are controlling the weather.....LOL
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 6:36:53 PM | my question is if this ... as an intelligent thinking person which i believe you are , surely you must feel that things are heading to a boil on a global scale ... just wondering what your viewpoints are on this matter ? ... in regards to your to your statement ....."I have no idea who or what controls the atoms in the universe but I do know one thing.It's a hell of a lot bigger than I am and its bigger than any religion can dream up or name" .... if you have a copy of the Bible maybe check out this verse from ecclesiastes 3:11 thanks again for your well thought out reply .... its refreshing compared to some .
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Yes,things are definitely happening on a global scale,they always have happened and will continue to.I suppose the argument can always be made that in this time we now have the ability to be informed about what's going on globally,but still,I don't see where one particular religion has the market cornered on what's going on.Perhaps it will be the next growth step for the human race.I don't see it being end times per se,but more of a turning point.
Ecclesiates 3:11"He has made everything beautiful in it's time.He has also set serenity in the hearts of men;yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end."
Pretty well sums up the mind of an infinite being.Whatever is in control,it's far beyond what man can comprehend.Ecclesiastes is my favorite book of the Bible. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 6:59:50 PM | ^^^ Well said, taurus. Now that we can learn what's happening all over the world in real time, it does make things look worse to us in our living rooms. I remember when many Christians though the year 2000 was going to be the end.
I believe someone is indeed saying "Death to the infidels, the sodomites, and the fornicators!", but it is the militant Muslims, not God. | |
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funn1
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Joined: 1/8/2005
Msg: 89 | |
| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 8:00:32 PM | | Why does GOD get the blaim all the time. The devil is called the prince of this earth. He was the one that made the great wind that killed Jobs kids and for that matter all the rest of the bad stuff that happend to him. The devil has power over things of this earth and uses them to make all the trouble he can, so dont blaim GOD for every bad thing that comes down the pipe. | |
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dud
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Joined: 9/9/2005
Msg: 90 | |
| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 8:09:33 PM | | ...or maybe the weathers just different this year. global climates have changed continuously since earth started | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/2/2005 8:51:17 PM | | .... Although its true we live in a age where we have more access to information than we've ever had before thus making things 'appear' to be worse than they actually are , if a person has any faith in the bible and its prophecies of an impending judgement day they are going to take heed ... the majority of the people aboard the Titanic were warned that the boat was sinking but yet many of them put faith in the builders of that vessel as being 'unsinkable' . These prophecies have been written down for centuries and contrary to what people say the have been unchanged for the same duration ( the dead sea scrolls are a testimony to this fact ) Too much faith has been put into science and technology today and we as consumers are lulled into a false sense of security by being 'dazzled and amazed' by these technological wonders and look ahead to 'the next best thing' in whatever field fancies our own personal interests. The scriptures have made it clear that God has an appointed time for His will to be accomplished . But we as humans are impatient . "why does God allow suffering ?" " Why are there wars ? " Why do innocent ones suffer at the hands of those who rule with power and ego as their best interests ?" I'm sure you've heard someone or perhaps yourselves ask such questions ... i know i have. This verse states why 2 Peter 3: 8,9 What most people don't seem to get from the bible is that it has a continuous theme . Very simply put - - -Paradise lost ---Paradise Restored ... the Lords prayer contains that very theme " let your will take place on earth ...as in heaven... " now i don't expect anyone to have faith in the bible in its entirety . But i do , and if that makes me seem weak and uneducated ... so be it . But i do have faith ... Hebrews 11:1 says ..." Faith is the assured expectation of things hoped for , the evident demonstration of realities though not beheld" We are on God's timetable not our own . God has promised to rid this earth of those who not worthy to be its occupants . Is this a bad thing ? Do we want the murderers , the rapists , the pedophiles , the war mongers , every other diabolical display of human debauchery that is showing no signs of slowing down if anything gaining momentum ? I know as a peace loving individual i am sick of it . But the only thing i can change in the big scheme of things is to do my best to make sure that i dont harm my fellow human being in accordance with Jesus example within my limitations as an imperfect human being . What do i have faith in ?....not just one scripture but this one pretty much sums it up... Daniel 2:44 what is written here has not taken place but will when God Almighty says its time , and according to the 'signs' stated in Matthew 24:3-14 this day is approaching whether we acknowledge it or not. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 6:59:44 AM | Space,you have an intelligent faith.It doesn't fly in the face of logic,it doesn't impinge upon anyone else's free choice and it's non judgemental.Guys like Gorilla Grod should pay close attention to posts like yours.I really hate to see religion and faith,which though I myself don't practice but have great respect for,used to justify someone else's judgemental attitudes,self righteousness and bigotry.
As far as prophecies,they've been with us a long time.Jules Verne's story of a trip to the moon was so close to the Apollo 11 mission,even naming the spacecraft "Columbiad"(missed it by one letter)as to be considered "prophecy" by some.Furthermore,these prophecies are interpreted differently by varying religions to the point where it gets confusing.I have no doubt though,that in ancient times,many of these prophets,such as Daniel had some kind of vision of future times.Daniel even mentions this and says that he was so overtaken by the vision,it made him ill for days and that he didn't understand it.Also other civilizations have had "prophets" who have said similar things and were persecuted for their beliefs in their places and times and just didn't get the press the OT did.
My main problem with the Bible are the stories that are so obviously other versions of the same thing such as the Enuma Elish (Babylonian creation) and Gilgamesh(flood).Scientists have studied these and say there is an element of truth,but niether story could possibly be true in their original form.Perhaps both stories originated from an older,as yet undiscovered text.I also have a problem with the fact that over the years all religions have edited their holy books for political and economical advantage.The possibility that Jesus could've actually been married to Mary Magdellin,I mean,what IS the problem with that,other than the fact it would screw up church politics?Church politics be damned,I want the truth!(the journalist in me is showing,lol)
Also too,if God wanted to give man a prophecy,why shroud in symbolism such as in the book of Revaltion,where religions can debate(Pre Trib,Post trib,blah,blah,blah),why not just say,"OK I'm returning and this is what's happening,tell your people to watch CNN (will explain televison in another text)on such and such day,and Fox news on this day..."?
That and the fact that I just can't imagine a supreme being in an anthropomorphic form.It just...lacks imagination imo. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 8:20:31 AM | I think that the closest we're going to come to Punishment from the deity, is what we're experiencing from the likes of certain Fundies right now, who are reinforcing their own faith by threating others with obliteration and damnation.
They get upset if they are compared with others who held similar views (like Hitler and Stalin and Mao), but who else are we to liken them to? Certainly not good people! There is nothing more evil than those who talk about goodness while carrying hatred in their hearts. The Fundies are guilty of this in Spades. Their problem is that they are so deep in denial that can never confront what they are doing to others straight on.
Our "curse" is having to deal with "God's self styled representatives on earth", who are not in fact representative of a loving God at all, but a real dyed in the wool monster. Read any other their postings and this becomes obvious.
Let's look at this for a moment:
1) God hates anyone who dares hold an opinion not sanctioned by Jews from 3,000 years ago, or Christians from 2,000 years ago. They will go to Hell and burn there forever when they die. Which begs the question why should they be allowed the pleasure of living at all?
2) That 3/4 of the planet have never heard of this God is beside the point, they are all going to go to Hell when they die and stay there for ever.
Seems to me I'd much rather hear nothing from religions than be forced to hear this crap 24/7 which is what Heaven is going to be like. Think people! Think!
In the name of Neptune (he can quench the fires of Hell), put an end to their ravings of Hell and God's damnation of the innocent!
Ed.. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 9:45:45 AM | Right on, Edward.
These odd beliefs in divine retribution come from faith. Faith is not based on proof, otherwise it would be knowledge. There are good and bad sides to faith and belief. Either way, without proof, it is the same as superstition. Sophisticated superstition, perhaps, but still superstition. All the more dangerous for being too complex to clearly refute - but, you can't prove a negative anyway.
Nature seems to work well on its own, even if we don't like the outcome. There have always been disasters, but there hasn't always been good communications. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 9:51:57 AM | well i haven't read everypost, there's alot to read there.. but i've got something to say?
Has anyone even thought of the fact that maybe it's just simply the greenhouse effect that's altering our eviroment? I mean.. there's over 5 million people just in manhatten island alone! Imagine what the ozone layer above that city looks like. Like the knees in my 4th grade levi's. I'd say that's roughly 200,000 vehicals for every 250,000 people. Cuse.. common when ya got a car.. who acctully buses.
It's no surprise were getting all this unnatural weather.. our ozone layers been ****ed for years, it's no surprise. Or.. it can simply be that; that's the way our weather is just simply evolving. I live in the praries in Alberta Canada... it's a dry area of Canada. We reicived in just this rain season alone more then 15X more parcepitation then we have in the last 10 years altogether. Thats some abnormal shit right there. Extreme heat in the eastern side of Canada, like cali weather in Canada, you know that sounds off. EarthQuakes, Typhoons, Hurricans.. and now the San Andreas fault line is shifting something feirce, i'd get the hell outta doge if i were on the west side the San Andreas fault line if ya know what i mean. They've been tracking that one for ever 10 years.. it's bound to go sometime and when it does.. bye bye Sweet Cali, bye bye Beautiful British Columbia most of ice cold Alaska and even some of mexico i hear. That fault line runs all the way from the Yukon all the way down the side of the rockie mountains all the way into Colorado i think. There's gonna be chaos when that happens. You people think it's chaos now, wait till San Andreas breaks.. omg.. Millions will be killed.
I donno, i wouldn't consider myself religous so i don't think God has really anything to do with it.. and if he did he'd be the guy sitting back in the comfy lazyboy watching the end of the world, and to tell you the truth.. i'd be sitting next to him, cheerzing the world away over a cold one.
Another rant if you dare read on:
I really truly donnot understand how people could beileve in God sooo much. Specially when they read it out of a bible that's well over 200 years old. Do you know how many greedy self rightous money grubbing priests have got there dirty little hands on that book. All to many. Back in the day, priests would make people, cuse they were stupid cuse of the priests, pay money to repent for the sins. Mother ****ers might as well been soliciters. The point is.. is that book got rewritten and changed sooo much.. and i bet there people making changes to it now even as i type. At first you might not believe that... but when i say changes i mean subtle things... like the color of someones hair or the setting in which some stories take place, or what a person said in that story simple things like that. People were denied any education in those times becuase they knew if they gave the people even a shread of intelligence there entire structure... known as Catholicism(i don't think christainity was around at this point,i could be wrong.) would come crashing down around them. Then there would be no such thing as a highclass and lower class. Just mutual respect, idealy anyway. Humans are ruthlas creatures so it'd be no surprise that there might not be a mutual respect.. but it's nice to think that things could have gone a different way.
And ya know if they haden't set things up like.. i bet the human race would have been alot further along the evo line then we are now. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 12:53:58 PM | As has been stated before.
Weather has only been tracked for about the last 100 years.
If you look at what the believe the world looked like originally, then some pretty strong global stuff had to happen to split things apart.
I can't even imagine the amount of earthquakes and volcanic action it took to separate continents plus probably Tsunamis from all that.
And before all these areas were developed and 100's of thousands of people moved into them, we would have had no idea what was going on.
God's hand? nah.......just good ol' Mother Earth doing her thing. | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 1:35:03 PM | Man is of self Destructive nature, take a good look at yourself. Now all the stuff creating the world we currently live in? It was perfect in the Holy Bible on the sixth day people, we MAN screwed it up!
Our own self destructive nature and our greed for more monies. Sure some have done such but those that know the Holy bible would never buy into such B.S.
The Bible is 5000 years old the New testament is just over two thousand.
My dear friends, I appreciate all the posts and thoughts you all have portrayed.
I merely wish for you to do some honest thinking. I don't want you to forget what God's prophets said would happen. You must never forget what the holy prophets taught in the past. And you must remember what the apostles told you our Lord and saviour has commanded us to do.
But first you must realize that in the last days some people won't think about anything but their foolish desires. They will make fun of you and say, "Didn't your Lord promise to come back? Yet the first leaders have already died, and the world hasn't changed a bit." They will say this because they want you to forget thats long ago the heavens and earth were made at God's command. The earth came out of water and was made from water. Later it was destroyed by the waters of a mighty flood. But God has commanded the present heavens and earth to remain until the day of judgement. then they will be set on fire, and ungodly people will be destroyed.
Dear friends, don't forget that for the Lord one day is the same as a thousand years, and a thousand years is the same as one day. the Lord isn't slow about keeping his promises, as some people think he is. In fact, God is patient, because he wants everyone to turn from their sin and no one will be lost.
The day of the Lord's return will surprise us like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a loud noise, and the heat will melt the whole universe. then the earth and everything on it will be seen for what they are.
Everything will be destroyed. So you should serve and honour God by the way you live. you should look forward to the day God judges everyone, and you should try to make it come soon for God is fair and just. On the day the heavens will be destroyed by fire, and everything else will melt in the heat. But God has promised us a new heaven and a new earth, where justice will rule. We are really looking forward to this!!
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"All that I do I do unto myself." | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 3:57:13 PM | Man, Taurus, and you call yourself intelligent? You can't imagine God in human form? Have you ever heard of the only God, who came to earth to save us, His name is Jesus Christ? He is a man, incarnated in human form.
Wow, I've seen some people are so scientific they are blind, I like being a person who is intellectual, has degrees, and still has faith. It is not blind faith, as you suppose, probably thinking you are a liberal elitist who is better than the poor ghetto people of faith.
regards.
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First off,I never called myself anything.I leave that to others to form their own opinion based on what they read from me.Secondly,I am familiar with the beliefs of Christianity,ALL forms of Christianity,not just Fundamentalism.I grew up in a Christian home, my parents were TV Gospel music performers for over 40 years in the South,so I am very familiar with Christianity.
It's difficult for me to imagine a supreme being in an anthropomorphic state because our little blue planet makes up a miniscule portion of the universe,not even a grain of sand in a sea of space.To me it seems myopic and egocentric to consider homo sapien to be the only beings in the cosmos the supreme being is concerned with.
If you possessed more than blind faith,you would not be so judgemental and ready to see everyone else condemned for simply seeing life a different way.I don't hold people of faith in contempt nor do I feel myself better,in fact I have great respect for people of faith and have many freinds in the clergy of many faiths.Unlike you,they respect my choices and beliefs as I respect theirs.
BTW,that pic you have up,is that really you? | |
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| Is God cursing the US?
Posted: 11/3/2005 3:58:54 PM | So your saying that you do not honestly place this into any form of thought?
Humm and yet I am merely wishing for you, God's prromises have always come true. Take a look at Ezekiel and tell me that Egypt is anything more than what God has described then.
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