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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 8/9/2007 11:45:07 AM | Simply by referring to meds as "zombie pills" you have expressed your opinion. Clearly, you see such a diagnosis as a cop out.
Of course, some people-kids and adults-are misdiagnosed. Sometimes parents are stressed out by their kids and choose drugs over discipline.
I am an adult ADHD patient. For years I suffered the symptoms, but out of fear of ridicule, I never sought help. I am so glad I did finally.:) Furthermore, I have a son sho was diagnosed with Tourettes Disorder. The significance there is that all TD kids are also ADHD. I was always very cautious abt prescribing meds to kids. However, under the care of a neurologist, he is taking meds for his condition and is enjoying the benefits of feeling more in control of himself. Notice I said HE is enjoying the benefits.
It is an individual choice, and I would never want to bully a parent into choosing meds for a child. However, with the right motivation and a reputable doctor, medicine can be helpful for some patients of ADHD. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 8/10/2007 10:10:17 PM |
To call them zombie pills shows lack of knowledge on subject. Children who are ADHD, usually behave "normally" when on medication. That's not really correct. They act "normally" on meds WHEN it's the RIGHT dose. There are parents that over medicate their kids, and THAT'S when it makes them zombies. The kid I was talking about DOES have ADHD, but her family is such screwballs they totally over medicate her and treat her as if she's retarded. Now she acts like a totally retarded (not meaning any offence here) kid. She's very bright, but her family has messed her up now. They don't even want the school to grade her like the other kids. They don't even want her graded at all. It's rediculus.
So, when the pill if being referred to "zombie pills", it's just meaning that some kids on the meds are like that simply because they're being over medicated. Either that, or the meds are having a poor effect on them and need to be changed to something else. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 8/14/2007 5:39:54 AM | My son is ADHD...I took him to the ADD Clinic here in town, both the Dr and his son are ADD and ADHD...neither of them believe in Ritalin, but used Adderall back then..
My son never was a zombie using it, but it did make him more focused at school, the only negative thing was he never gained weight and was always very tiny until we took him off of it completely
Just so everyone knows I tried the whole routine of no sugars, dyes, caffeine, discipline, herbs etc etc..because I did not want the "zombie" syndrome for my child either.
The point is work with the Drs that really know ADD, get your child regulated with the meds...Did you know that a cup of coffee will help calm them down!!!!! | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 8/14/2007 8:21:58 AM | | Lol to MystyMom...stimulants do tend to calm ADD people. That is because we are wired differently. I take Adderall, which is a stimulant, and it has helped me the same way it helped your son. And, again, I would never try to convince anyone that meds are the only to go. But for this girl who went undiagnosed for the first 39 years of her life, it has certainly improved my quality of life. :) | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 11:53:25 AM | I think with any diagnoses of the month..Which is ADHD/ADD...we have to look at this carefully before jumping the band wagon to medicate...I have a 6 year old son who is diagnosed ADHD before i would give my son any medication I had two peditricians look at my son and 2 phycologists...I just wanted to be absoulutly sure that this was the way to go...Here's the twist!!! I then discovered that not only does he have ADHD, but Oppsitonal Defiance Disorder which now is moved on to Conduct Disorder, and Autisim...I thought they were joking but after 7 professionals, yes 7 assess my son and all came to these diagnosses.I never belived that multiple diagnoses could occur but I guess I was wrong..I have behaveoiral (bad grammar) managment, crisis intervention training for myself, a phycharist, 2 peditricians, physio thearpists, and the list goes on...I still have good days and bad days...the medication helps my son calm down, but it does not in anyway shape or form cure or lessen his other mental disorders...
Yes This is Real!!! But like with anything this day and age you have to get a second opnion and make sure before any medcinal intervention is applied...
Sadly people are misdiagnosed and catagorized just for convience..personally the people responsible for their lax attiutde towards another individual should be sued!!! This is their very lives that these quacks are dealing with just for the sake of convience..and the damages to these people suffer with can be for life both mentally, emotionaly and socialy...
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 12:29:25 PM | I have ADD. My child does not.
I am on dexedrine (slow-release)..it doesn't "zombie" me out. I am actually able to function better with it. I'm more spaced without it because of the inattentiveness factor. (I don't have the physical hyperactivity)
I have noticed that red and yellow food dyes affect my kid's behavior. As does refined sugar. Diet is very important. Food allergies should be examined first. Only when everything else has been ruled out would I suggest medication. I would only consider meds if the ADHD was affecting my child in a negative way ie: schoolwork or social life. There is a lot more to treatment for ADHD than medication. Behavior modification is extremely important as is learning to utilize organizational techniques...and finally acceptance that ADD and ADHD seem to run parallel to creative abilities and enterpreneur-like qualities, people who think "outside the box". The important part is to foster the ADHD childs uniqueness but balance it with basic life skills. Here's the thing. I wasn't diagnosed until my thirties...those thirty years living with ADD were painful because I didn't know what was wrong. It affected my schooling, my social abilities and caused depression. My diagnoses and subsequent treatment plan has made a world of difference for me.
There is a lot of great info on the web about ADHD.
Peace | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 12:55:04 PM | I didn't read all the pages to this post, so forgive me if this info is already shared.
I am an adult with ADD and know full well its not a cop out.
After diagnosis, ADDerall was my primary medication for nearly 15 years. However after my doctor told me about some cases of sudden death from its use, as a Single parent I became very concerned and opted to discontinue that medication. Needless-to-say, life became very complicated and my ADD again reaked havoc on my life.
I finally found a new (not so well known) medication that again is helping keep the ADD from controling my life. It is not a mainstream ADD/ADHD medication since it is normally prescribed to treat other ailments. However, I would recommend anyone with ADD/ADHD to discuss the benefits of PROVIGIL compared to their current medication. PROVIGIL (Modafinil tablets) have far less side effects to worry about.
Check out the information on line for yourself. It may be an option you are interested in. ADD doesn't go away as you get older and long term use of some medication can increase the risk of serious heart conditions or premature death. I know as a single parent, I don't want to take that risk. PROVIGIL has helped keep me "out of the fog" and I am again catching up on the laundry!!!!! (Smiles) | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 3:49:02 PM | my son is four years old..
hes impatient, has a short attention span and agressive
his first reaction is to always hit..infact since he turned 3 he constantly jumps on me, punches, pinches, slaps and basically anything you can imagine when i'm home..
On the other side of the coin
hes smart..at 4 years old he can write his own name, he can count to 20 and only miss maybe 3 numbers, do some basic math (I teach him), do some addition and recognizes numbers by sight as well some letters..
My concern is he's incredibly hyper active due to his short attention span, he starts school in just 3 days and I'm nervous about how well he'll do in a classroom setting..I sent him to a preschool starter coarse last year and he lasted 2 weeks before he became bored and didnt want to attend anymore - I figured it was boredom because hes so advanced for his age (he has a great aunt and uncle who are teachers who've taught kids his age and even they have said so) and mostly because the teacher they had wouldnt give him attention - he loved this girl would cling to her and any time i've seen her just didnt seem as into the kids as a teacher should be..but in her defense she was young, i think maybe even younger than me..
now this being said, I know my son, his behaviour is not always good and though I try to redirect as much as possible it doesn't work. If a teacher suggests to me that I need to have him tested I will. Simply because hes my baby. Hes the only I have and it will help him improve all the better for it. As for his diet. This kid will eat fruits and veggies before he'll even consider any form of candy or junk food. I'd rather have a doctor prove the teacher wrong, than ignore the suggestion and have my child suffer for it.
I think ADD/ADHD is real. I know kids who've had it and I agree with other readers some kids you can moderate with diet changes others need the medication. My niece is one of them. Shes ODD. And believe me, much as I love her, you dont want her in your home. She wakes up at odd hours when the house is asleep and makes messes /everywhere imagineable. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 3:51:48 PM | | I should also add my friends daughter is add and my bosses wife, whose worked with special needs children in the past, suggested coffee. Not alot, but about tablespoon of it in a cup of water to calm her down. I never would have thought of it, but works. She started sending it with her daughter to school and the teacher would make her take it to settle her out. Who'da thought lol. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 5:43:19 PM | | My son has been in therapy since he was 6 yrs old now 12.Never disruptive in class but would daydream ,fidget, ect. at 7 his iq was 90 at 9 his iq was 121 .He could take an x-box or playstation 2 game beat in hours ,read the entire books [ones out at the time] in 9 days scored 100 on each books test but to sit a classroom and pay attention no way .His doctor explained it this way a person with ADD their brain is constantly moving games or where he can read as fast as he wants can keep up with his brain speed but to sit and have to listen is like watching a movie in slow motion and his brain can't slow down.Last year we tried Adderall low dose 5mg. And boy has it made a difference and he says he feels better.So yes meds can work with therapy too and a parents commitment .By the way christmas holidays/spring break and the summer he does not take meds.Nor does his therapist give him the meds. He strictly only talks to my son and said whether to medicate or not was between me and his pediatrician.So my advice to you is talk to everyone involved with the child before medicating and remember you may have to try different meds. before finding one that works for him.If he is old enough get his imput and always ask how he feels while on the meds. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/2/2007 8:20:13 PM | Hey the only way to find out for sure is to go to a good psychiatrist. The Md's are not experts! And the family doctors is not either. There are ways to handle this without meds! It takes training and help from a good psychiatrist to get a handle on it.  | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/3/2007 6:40:58 AM | Sherry, that is not always true....my son and I went thru therapists(Human Behaviour Institute), herbs, the no caffeine, no sugar, no dyes........ADD/ADHD is a chemical imbalance and Psyches cannot diagnosis that!!! I did not take my son to his regular pediatrician to find this out, we went to the ADD clinic here in town and they do all kinds of tests, including blood tests to find out if the person is ADD/ADHD.
Back in the hold days, yea they sent these kids to Psyches and they prescribed them with phenobarbital and drugs like that..believe me I did my research and worked with everything before I put my child on drugs and definately would never have put him on Ritalin. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/3/2007 9:55:56 PM | This is so true guys. caffeine realy dose calm them down.My son could not take adderall so he was one of the ones yall call Ridalin kids. But i refused for years to put him on it, untill he tried to kill my other son and laughed about it. He has been diagnosed as ADHD and ODD ( opisitional defiant disorder ). It is verry real. It is a chemical imbalance in the brain. You can tell if a child needs it or not. If it dose slow them down just a little bit then they do need it. If it makes them even more hyper they don't need it. If it slows them down to much ajust the amount they are takeing.
My son is not a zombie he is still enerjetic but it helps him focus in school so he gets better grades. without it he gets in trouble and failing grades. He is not on ritlen any more he is on concerta witch is the same medicen just time released diffrently. And i do not medicate my son to make him a zombi i do it so he can focas and get the best education he could possably get. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/3/2007 10:57:27 PM | ADHD and ADD are very real  , but terribly overdiagnosed. I suspect that many people believe the ailments are not real because about 3 out of 4 diagnoses are not accurate. Psychologists and teachers cannot diagnose ADD/ADHD, but most experienced teachers do know when something is wrong and can make helpful suggestions to parents if they are so inclined and parents are willing to listen.
A parent who suspects a child has such a problem should certainly try all available alternatives first. Allergy testing alone is insufficient. You have to try eliminating foods from a child's diet to see if there is a change in his/her behavior. While processed sugars and red dye are well-known culprits, I also found that my son reacted badly to white grape juice. Notice sometime how many juices on the shelf contain either corn syrup (a processed sugar) or white grape juice!
Your behavior management plan must be as consistent as possible. Let's face it, parents, we are all human and consistency is NOT easy. However, these children thrive on structure and consistency, and perform much better in activities and at school as well as at home if the environment, expectations, and consequences are structured and consistent.
Therapy gives the child someone not involved in daily life to vent to, as well as providing useful feedback and suggestions. I have been surprised to find that some places only provide ongoing therapy for patients who take medication, as those who are trying to solve the problems without medication need it even more.
Medication should be a final resort. When my son was diagnosed ADHD and ODD at age 4, the doctor's first question was whether I wanted medication for him. He is in Gifted classes and is extremely bright. These drugs have not been out long enough to know what the long-term effects might be. During my many years as a middle-school teacher, the ADD/ADHD students were generally placed in my classes. While some do seem to "grow out of it" (and no one knows why), in my experience most just learn better coping skills. Most of my ADD/ ADHD students reached adolescence and, due to hormonal changes, the medication they had received since second grade no longer worked. These children had been medicated for so long they had never learned any coping skills.
On the other hand, one student who was particularly out of control was hospitalized during his time in my class and put on medication while in the hospital. The medication gave HIM control of his life for the first time. For the first time in his life he could focus, pay attention to something that wasn't throwing rapid constant feedback at him, and he did very well. His parents later allowed him to stop taking the medication, and I am aware of two long-term consequences. He injured me, and his cousin (who was in my class a few years later) told me he was in prison.
A final note: My son hates to take it because he says it tastes bad, but I have had some success with Hyland's formulation known as  "Calms." It is an herbal preparation made of familiar ingredients by the same people who make the teething tablets given to babies. It doesn't make him an angel, nor does it make him a zombie. It does, however help him to be a little more controlled. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/3/2007 11:04:49 PM | | Sorry, I forgot. If you're interested in trying Calms, you can find it in the herbal preparations section of your local health food store. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/4/2007 7:18:54 AM | | Ms T....I also tried CalmChild from the herbal store and yes it did help some when he was first diagnosed but as the school work got harder and he got older we finally went with adderall......he only used it when in school....the side effects were shown when he stayed at 50 lbs for 2 years(healthy tho), we took him off of it when he turned 10 for a month and he gained 20 lbs. He is now 17 does not take it and has terrible stretch marks from that fast weight gain......I do recommend that if any child is on these meds to make sure of a very healthy diet because these meds are speed(basically) and they tend to keep the weight down. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/27/2007 1:03:36 PM | Well obviously, you don't have a child with this disorder. I would gladly love to see someone with this attitude try to deal with these types of children. My child has ADD and ODD......These children you can beat absolutely to death and it still does not make a difference. It is a frickin chemical imbalance in the brain that stems from numerous medical rationales. Cop out....I THINK NOT!. My oldest child does not have this.....obviously since I birthed both of them.....I should know the difference in my children....and I believe I have been parenting both of them....
Ignorance is bliss isn't it! | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/27/2007 3:25:56 PM | There are always three sides to every story.
Side 1
Side 2
and the truth
It is true that "back in the day," our mother's gave us a swat on the behind or took away a privilege, and we behaved. If we acted up in school, we were called brats.
But that was then - and there is more medical knowledge now. There used to be a time when we didn't know what diabetes was - and didn't have insulin - and diabetics died.
There used to be a time when we had no knowledge of transplant surgeries and dialysis- and when our kidneys failed, we died.
I have an 18 year old son that has been medicated, off and on, since he was 7. We have been down the roads of chiropractic, herbal supplements, sugar control, diet control, Ritalin, Adderal, Concerta, Strattera, behavior modification - you name it, we've tried it.
My son has ADHD - and ODD - probably slight manic/depression, and was classified as socially maladjusted by the school system. They NEVER suggested medicating him. His doctor, when I went to him in tears, suggested it, and said point blank "if your son were a diabetic, would you deny him his insulin?"
No - ADD and ADHD won't kill you - but it can severely negatively affect your behavior, your focus, your ability to complete simple tasks, and your interaction with society.
It is real.
Is it overstated? Probably.
But for some children, it is real. And to live in the body of some of these children must be a horror.
And imagine what a horror it was years ago when we just called them brats and ostracized/shunned/beat them.
All the love, rewards, structure, discipline in the world will not cure an ADD child - they will just make him so afraid that he can't function.
And for those of you who say "they thought I was ADD - and I function fine now as an adult," we are MUCH better at subconsciously hiding our lack of focus - how many times do you get up from your desk and walk around? That helps you keep focus. But in school, they're not allowed. You go out to lunch. They go to the cafeteria.
One side says it's a cop out
One side says it's not
The TRUTH is that it's real - but overdiagnosed.
But for those for whom it's real - PLEASE don't tell either us (as the parents) or the kids that it's a copout. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/27/2007 4:53:11 PM | | Sure ADD/ADHD is real. However I'd say it's WAY, WAY, WAY too overly diagnosed. It IS used in quite a few situations where the parents just want an excuse for their bad parenting. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/28/2007 7:19:44 AM | I havent read all the posts so if I'm repeating something that has already been said then I apologise.
Anyway, my son has ADHD and is on medication but is NOT a ZOMBIE. All the medication does is calm him down so that he can sit still and concentrate at school. He doesnt have to have the medication everyday and as he is ok without it at home I don't give it to him at weekends and only on certain days during the hols. Another reason why I don't always give him his medication during hols is that when he is at home there is not a great deal of difference in his behaviour wether he has taken it or not. I know that I made the right choice for my son, as he is now getting on so much better at school, he is able to show how smart I and his teachers now him to be, he is also much happier and enjoys going to school again.
Also the pschologist who diagnosed my son told me that out of all the children he had prescribed medication for only one has needed to carry on taking it in adulthood, he said that once they become teenagers they seem to be able to start controlling it without medication.
I was wary about putting my son on medication as I had only heard about ritalin but once the pschologists explained that the medication only calms him down enough to be able to work I said yes to it staight away as my soon had started to hate school and was very negative about himself. Anyway the medication worked but stopped him from being able to sleep so I spoke to the nurse about it when I saw her and she put him on a drug that was basically the same as the one he was on but had a different release so that it didnt last as long and would be out of his system by tea time.
EDIT: Only a Mother Could Love Him: How I Lived with and Triumphed Over ADHD by Ben Polis . Have a read it may change your view. I feel that the people who say ADHD/ADD is a cop out don't really understand it. If this is not real then there are a lot of people out there making money with books about it, guess they should be classified in the fiction section instead of non-fiction. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 9/28/2007 7:56:04 AM | personally my oldest daughter which is now 8 years old has been on meds for high level adhd since she was 3. i did not let her dr put her on them either. we were referred to a clinic that evaluated her over a 4 day period. i mean 4 eight hour sessions is what we went through and then she had to go to a neurologist. And then they found out that she not only is high level adhd but alos borderline juvenile bipolar. however she has now been completely taken off all meds since she has a straight a average in every subject. but yes some dr. will use it as a cop out. i strongly suggest any parent look deeply into it even if it means getting a second opinion from another eduacated source. | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 10/11/2007 2:27:18 PM |
So, when the pill if being referred to "zombie pills", it's just meaning that some kids on the meds are like that simply because they're being over medicated. Either that, or the meds are having a poor effect on them and need to be changed to something else.
I think that "genius pills" is a more apt term. I took the stuff on and off growing up. When I was off my grades were generally "C's" and a few "B's". When I was on the medication I got straight A's. The fist time I took the SAT I was not on any medication, they let you take it a second time and I was on ritalin the second time I took it, and my score went up over 200 points. When I was a kid it raised my score on an IQ test by 25 points putting me clearly in the genius range, so if a pill makes you a genius, why not take it? Then when I was stressed at work on my first real job after college I got re-diagnosed and tried some meds, then I told my girlfriend at the time I started taking them and she threatened to dump me if I didn't quit, she was one of those people who believed it was a cop out I think, she was also a neat freak and didn't like certain ADHD aspects of my personality when I was not on the meds, so she probably would have dumped me anyway had I complied with her ultimatum. good riddance to her. However, I wanted to do other things that the government would not allow me to do if I was taking the medication, so I have been medication free for most if my adult life, but it is not always easy trying to stay focused and organized.
so, tell me, those who are so anti-medication, would you take a pill if it literally made you a genius? | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 10/11/2007 3:44:23 PM | Hi there,
Unfortunately, many kids and also adults get diagnosed with ADHD because many of the symptoms of Bipolar Disorder also mimick the symptoms of ADHD so a good child psychiatrist is a gret resource. The treatment for ADHD works for a while for children who are true bipolars but eventually the mood swings get stronger, the rages, and the anxiety increases. When the anxiety increases and irritability then the person becomes hyper and this is often confused with ADHD. ADHD and Bipolar disorder is very often hereditary. For more information you might try to go to this wonderful link www.thebipolarchild.com and read the newsletters, the "Bipolar Child" book is also a great resource. Often kids who are bipolar and given ADHD meds (amphetamine derivatives) develop worse symptoms with age and can become really psychotic and manic. Hope this information helps!!! | |
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| ADHD and ADD the real thing or a cop out?
Posted: 10/11/2007 4:55:14 PM | and some people just have ADHD without all that other stuff. A former girlfriend of mine had Bi Polar, and that was a nightmare to deal with and can totally understand why someone would not want to date someone with bi polar. In her case she had a history of cutting herself, suicidal thoughts, very extreme mood swings from week to week, she would talk about how great I was and how she loved me and a few hours later after she left my place she would call me in a rage and blame me for irrational things. ADD/ADHD people do not do those kinds of things at all, nor do we involuntarily blurt out cuss words at people(nothing against those with tourettes, but ADD and tourettes are not the same thing).
It is also possible to have this "disease" and be successful if the person nurtures their strengths and doesn't fight it(i.e. try to become an accountant when they know they will suck at it). Einstein is thought to have had ADD, he made a great physicist but I don't think he would have been as successful if he had worked a normal corporate job. Leonardo Da Vinci was a textbook case from what they know of his biography/accomplishments, Thomas Edison, Ansel Adams, Galen Rowell(famous National Geographic photographer) are others thought to possibly had had ADD/ADHD. Ansel Adams even admitted it. They did things that they knew they were suited for and worked with their personality, and they were successful at unconventional careers. That is what I am trying to do now, better late then never. Many men say they are creative or adventurous, or try to act like it to impress women(the daredevil/exciting/adventurer/bad boy persona), ADD/ADHD men really are this way and cannot choose to be any other way or they would be bored silly. It is true that many anal retentive women and people in general don't get along with an ADD person, but that is fine, I don't really try to get dates from here anyway, and it is alot more fun to speak my mind in these forums and I don't give a rat's arse what the women here will think of me. I still want to set the record straight for those who meet a great guy whom you find out is ADD.
He will probably be averse to boring paperwork and cleaning, and may not seem like he is always giving you his undivided attention when you are talking to him, but that doesn't mean he doesn't care for you deeply, and they can be good at being romantic, original, creative, funny, and adventurous. They are the kind of guy who will want to go someplace new and exciting for the weekend whether then sit around the house drinking beer and watching TV. They will want to take you on their motorcycle, or go climb a mountain, ski down it, or go sailing in Greece, dive the Great Barrier reef, trekking in Nepal or see the wildebeast migration from a balloon in Africa. They can make great cooks, artists, musicians, and poets, and can talk about a wide variety of things with you, basically you will probably never be bored with them even if they sometimes annoy the crap out of you. Buy usually they don't mean to, that is just how they are. | |
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