| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 2:34:03 PM | Animal sacrifice was fulfilled by the complete sacrifice of Yahshua for all sin. There is no need to sacrifice animals because He fulfilled the law of animal sacrifice.
It is against the law of the United States to have/own slaves. No we don't own slaves.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 2:41:55 PM | Thank you once again, you are a beacon of light in a dark world. Yahweh bless you for your insightfulness.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 2:44:58 PM |
1 Kings 11:1-3
But King Solomon loved many foreign women, as well as the daughter of Pharaoh: women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Sidonians, and Hittites; from the nations of whom the LORD had said to the children of Israel,
"You shall not intermarry with them, nor they with you. Surely they will turn away your hearts after their gods."
Solomon clung to these in love. And he had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines; and his wives turned away his heart.
First Kings 11:1-3 indicates that King Solomon had 700 hundred wives and 300 hundred concubines, many from lands of which God had previously instructed the Israelites to avoid intermarrying. God knew that such intermarrying would lead to the worship of false gods. Why, then, did Solomon do this?
History reveals that Solomon was very aggressive in his foreign policy. In sealing treaties in ancient days, it was customary for a lesser king to give his daughter in marriage to the greater king (in this case, Solomon). Every time a new treaty was sealed, Solomon ended up with yet another wife. These wives were considered tokens of friendship and "sealed" the relationship between the two kings.
In the process of doing all this, Solomon was utterly disobedient to the Lord. He was apparently so obsessed with power and wealth that it overshadowed his spiritual life and he ended up falling into apostasy. He worshipped some of the false gods of the women who became married to him.
Moreover, in marrying more than one woman Solomon was going against God's revealed will regarding monogamy. From the very beginning God created one woman for one man Genesis 1:27; 2:21-25). Deuteronomy 17:17 explicitly instructed the king not to "multiply wives."
Moses' law said, the king "shall not multiply horses to himself... Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold" (Deuteronomy 17:16-17).
So Solomon sinned in various ways -- (1) he engaged in polygamy, (2) he violated God's commandment against marrying pagans, which ultimately led to his own apostasy, (3) he collected huge numbers of horses (a large chariot army), and (4) he gathered vast amounts of gold and silver.
Solomon's tolerance of his wives pagan religions led to terrible sins against God. 1 Kings 11:4-9 states,
For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father. For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Zidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites. And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father. Then Solomon built a high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon. And likewise did he for all his foreign wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods. And the LORD was angry with Solomon... | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 3:08:14 PM | Read the testment of solomon you will see that in the days before his death he made right with God. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 3:29:42 PM | So Solomon sinned in various ways -- (1) he engaged in polygamy, (2) he violated God's commandment against marrying pagans, which ultimately led to his own apostasy, (3) he collected huge numbers of horses (a large chariot army), and (4) he gathered vast amounts of gold and silver.
Solomon's tolerance of his wives pagan religions led to terrible sins against God. 1 Kings 11:4-9 states,
For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father.
How can David who was also a polygamous husband be perfect in his heart before Yahweh? We agree that what Solomon did was sinful but was it sinful to engage in polygamy because David then would have sinned as well wouldn't he? or was it sinful to marry pagans ie others who don't believe as he did.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 5:04:35 PM | Steve & Kara
My question to you about slavery and animal sacrfice was facetious, of course, but was in response to your initial post, wherein you posed the question about if something was done by Biblical figures, why would it be considered wrong now. I was trying to make a point.
I would hope that you would think slavery would still be wrong, even though it was the custom of Biblical times, and not just because it is "against the law of the United States to have/own slaves."
Polygamy too is against the law. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 5:14:30 PM |
Polygamy too is against the law.
And against human nature, what man or woman wants to be third place... | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 5:22:26 PM | I'm all for having wives... just one at a time though, I'm not greedy!  | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 6:31:00 PM | The question would be is polygamy against man's law, or Yahweh's law? And even is slavery against man's law or Yahweh's law.
Just a consideration, were you aware that the slaves that were kept in the south during the 1700's to 1800's were not kept in accordance with Yahweh's law. Yahweh actually had laws that protected slaves, and after 6 years of service the Hebrew people were required to release them in the 7th year called the year of Jubilee. Does this sound like the kind of slavery that was practiced by our wonderful founding fathers? See what happens when man tries to pervert Yahweh's law?
Just as an FYI we would never practice slavery, certainly not all people in the scriptures did, any more than all people in scriptures practiced Polygamy.
Can you cite the law that makes Polygamy illegal? We have extensive knowledge in the law of the US and particularly in the State we happen to reside in and there is no law against what we are considering doing, because we are not going to have a government sanctioned marriage. It would only be a marriage in the eyes of Yahweh.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 6:40:37 PM | We are curious to know who in your eyes would be in 3rd place. Certainly not Steve who would be the head of the true poly family, then possibly it's Kara who is willing to share her home with a covenant sister? Or would it be the covenant sister? Yahweh makes special provisions for plural wives in His scriptures which we must be obedient to follow. Kara will have an obligation to her as a covenant sister, the covenant sister would have an obligation to Kara and both would be bound to Steve under the covenant that both would have made to him. It is somewhat like a triangle but there is a connection between the covenant sisters through the covenant they each make to Steve. So the triangle is complete and unbroken. Who then in this particular diagram is in 3rd place?
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 6:42:42 PM | Article XX of the Arizona Constitution explicitly forbids polygamy. It states: "Polygamous or plural marriages, or polygamous co-habitation, are forever prohibited within this State."
However, as you say, if this would only be a marriage 'in the eyes of Yahweh" , that would not be illegal in Arizona. Don't try moving to Utah - that state defines bigamy to include cohabitation while either person is legally married to somebody else. The broader definition has helped Utah successfully prosecute polygamy. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 6:46:46 PM |
We are curious to know who in your eyes would be in 3rd place. Certainly not Steve
No, certainly not Steve - he'll be the one with the harem. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 7:14:59 PM | | I am curious as to who YAhweh is. I've never heard of this diety. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 8:01:40 PM | | He is God it is one of his Names it is the name Judism and some Christians use. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/27/2005 8:04:41 PM | | Sister, I would consider moving to a small rural community where people useally mind their own bussiness. As long as you make lots of friends there you will be able to live your life as you choose. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/28/2005 9:53:46 AM | We researched this and you are correct, clearly it's a good thing that this will be in the eyes of Yahweh only. And no worries, we never plan to move to Utah.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/28/2005 9:55:02 AM | Lol, very true, I just had visions of us in an I dream of Jeannie costume.  | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/28/2005 9:57:56 AM | I truly would love to move to a rural community, sadly, I married a city boy and he feels the country is not for him. Ah well, sometimes being in a big city isn't so bad, nobody here pays attention to their neighbors.
Steve & Kara
PS the friends and relatives we have chosen to inform about what is happening are very supportive. Mind you they think we're a little nuts but then that's par for the course for us.
We feel we march to the beat of a different drum. | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/28/2005 11:26:10 PM | "I think sister_wife profile is a troller.... maybe they/it should move to utah"
Hell.......we dont want them either.......They can stay in Az......The polygmist's here tend to rape and marry their neices....and other family member's......Incest is rampant .....Look at the Goodmans.......Sick damn people who will pay for their sins one day! | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 7:07:21 AM | we wholeheartedly agree without the foul language, raping underage children is wrong, wrong, wrong, and unless they repent they will be judged by Yahweh.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 12:50:17 PM | "we wholeheartedly agree without the foul language, raping underage children is wrong, wrong, wrong, and unless they repent they will be judged by Yahweh."
Raping anyone is wrong!...Polygamy is wrong period......Read your bible...not jst the old testament....
Forcing young girls into marriage with a man 20-30 years older then her......who happens to be a relative is called incest my dear.......Not the right thing to do......Your are the one's who will be judged by GOD!
You need to repent or you will be the ones burning...... | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 12:52:54 PM | "How can David who was also a polygamous husband be perfect in his heart before Yahweh"
Again......READ THE WHOLE BIBLE........NOT JUST THE OLD TESTIMENT!
unless your Jewish and do not believe in the word of Christ.....You need to learn the new testiment.....Can you show me anywhere in the NEW TESTIMENT that says you should have multiple wives?.....Didnt think so........
your wrong my friends....... | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 12:55:17 PM | | So long as all the parties involved are adults, and nobody is coerced and all enter willingly into the agreement, I see no problem with polygamy, but then my morals are based upon a pragmatic foundation and not a religious one. Therefore I can't comment on who will or will not "burn in hell." | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 5:03:07 PM | Hello again friend,
you write "unless your Jewish and do not believe in the word of Christ"
We are Jewish and do believe in Yahshua as our Messiah. This classifies us as Messianic Jews, just as an FYI, we have extensively studied the whole of the scriptures, both old and new testament and while we find no condemnation of Biblical polygyny in the new testament, there is also no mention of it being an outlawed practice. Our personal belief is that Yahshua has no need to speak about Polygyny in the New Testament scriptures because in the well know Sermon on the Mount, Yahshua speaks in Matthew 5:17 & 18 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Our personal belief, and all salvation is a personal walk, is that Yahshua only fulfilled one part of the law, the sacrificial law, Yashua being the perfect sacrifice for all our sins, and if we accept Him in our hearts and and confess our sins we are saved and will have eternal life in heaven. We believe that the Old Testament is still to be practiced minus the sacrificial law because of this perfect sacrifice, our reason for believing this is that the heaven (sky) is still here and the earth is still here and since they are, that means that the law certainly hasn't passed either.
We know that scriptures speak of the church leaders are to only have one wife, in 1 Timothy 3:2 but let me explain, we certainly are not bishops, Kara couldn't be a leader of the church being that a woman is to keep silent in church, and if she has any questions to ask them of her husband. Steve has never felt called to be a leader and so would be classified as a common man who certainly has no such prohibition on him to have only one wife. It was a commonly accepted practice among the Jewish people who were not leaders to have more than one wife in the New Testament. So common in fact that there was no need to speak of it, although Roman Emporer Charlemagne outlawed polygyny in 800 AD, given the hatred of the Jewish people at this time and that the punishment if caught in a polygynous marriage was death, it stands to reason in our eyes that being married to more than one wife would NOT have been talked about because it meant losing your life if it was found out.
The US didn't follow the customs of this emporor until 1862 when they also outlawed polygyny. Although to this very day we certainly know of people who have more than one wife in the US.
Steve & Kara | |
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| Biblical Polygyny
Posted: 11/29/2005 5:06:27 PM | Thank you you have stated our belief quite nicely. We also don't think it is our place to judge who and who will not burn in hell. That is certainly for Yahshua to decide at the Judgement Throne.
Steve & Kara | |
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