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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 7:06:12 AM | I have to be picky im 6'0 tall, i find alot of 'short guys' ( and they dont even think they are short) are very attractive, but thats just one quality i WONT budge on. Why should a shorter guy classify himself as "short" when that connotation is inherently negative to so many people? That makes no sense.
This is a classic preference turned into a requirement via rationalization. A six foot woman probably comes across NO other women her height in a given month, unless she plays basketball or volleyball. She probably comes across very few single guys her height or significantly taller, many of which seek shorter women. Why would she limit her pool of guys to date by blindly eliminating guys who are actually interested in her?  She'll likely submit to other rationalizations like "love isn't fair ", "that's the way it is", "I can't help myself", or in this instance "I have to be picky".
The only rational argument I heard from a taller woman regarding her requirement for taller guys was that she was raised in a household which consisted of men all of whom were taller than average. In essence, she was behaviorally conditioned. But even she twisted it into a prejudice by claiming guys average or shorter than average looked like "boys" to her.
I have dated short men. The ones that believed in themselves were great. But too, many have the "Napoleon Syndrome"(the need to try to make others feel inferior to themselves.) I've witnessed lots of taller or bigger guys do the same thing, intimidate or bully other people, primarily by trying to leverage their size. But the funny thing is these guys often aren't labelled by other people as having inferiority complexes. That's the heightism prejudice that many people exhibit. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 9:31:38 AM | Yes, BUT, have you shown interest in shorter men?
Yes I have. I'm 5' 10" and I have dated men that were 5' 6" or 5' 7". I have mentioned this before in this thread and other height related threads. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 12:03:30 PM | ^^^^
no worries, we know you're not hostile towards shorter men at all. You're actually one of the more sensible women on this site judging from your posts.
To anyone who simply wants to dismiss short guys as "whinners" bikeman, JD 4duty and others who are not even short, are even appalled by the amount of heightism and shallowness being displayed by women in these threads.
just goes to show you. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 12:16:37 PM | | Tiny man = tiny**** Sorry, but it's true. My male friends say there's no correlation but in my experience there is. I've dated a few, and they've all been tiny (in both ways). Sorry. No more shorties for moi. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 12:46:04 PM |
Tiny man = tiny**** Sorry, but it's true. My male friends say there's no correlation but in my experience there is. I've dated a few, and they've all been tiny (in both ways). Sorry. No more shorties for moi.
Ron Jeremy is 5'6" | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:12:10 PM | Executive Summary
= = = = = = = = = = =
Re: Message 1424
The question is always around the rationality of height filtering and this merely attempts to deflect that query. Application and applicability are two different things.
A relationship of “jealousy to shortness” is only uncovering a symptom related to the bigotry of heightism.
This is a forum discussion on the roots of height bigotry. Discuss the issue or prove by the deliberate employment of deflection and intimidation that one has absolutely no defense.
Re: Message 1434 and the like.
Resorting to tired old myths and disparaging remarks are further proof that heightism is nothing but projected self-image issues.
= = = = = = = = = = =
Msg 1424
You'll get no argument here - the question is, are the tall men really better managers, or are taller men being promoted over more deserving shorter men due to superficial perceptions? The true talent of a supervisor is in the perceptions of those below them in rank. If height is an important component of that, then that is a consideration.
Nope. The question is always around the rationality of height filtering and this merely attempts to deflect that query. Application and applicability are two different things.
As to 'substantive discussion' - for every one poster who can manage a thought, there are ten who find the use of two-syllable words highfalutin. Concepts like 'Napoleon complex' are just a crutch for the thinking impaired. Technically the term "Napoleon Complex" does not exist as a mental disorder. It's a social stereotype aimed at short men. The working term for this is "inferiority complex" and it is based on Alfred Adler's work. The word Napoleon was coupled with is, as Adler used Napoleon as an example. Actually, Napoleon was said to be of average height for a Frenchman of that period.
Related to this subject, there was a study at Cornell in 2005 where men become aggressive if they feel their masculinity is threatened. Height was not directly researched in this, but inferences may be made as you please. It's not a long stretch if masculinity perceived by females is relative to height.
This diversion to masculinity and the loss thereof is a sly attempt to label any opponent to height restriction as only reacting to a perceived loss of manliness. This is non sequitur. The truth is that bigotry is a repugnant act which causes many (be they tall, short, male or female) to speak out against it.
Another study published recently from the University of Groningen in the Netherlands, ties shorter stature to a higher levels of jealousy among males, but a study from the University of Central Lancashire, found short men were less aggressive. However the British study included only 20 men and the study in the Netherlands contained 219 men. As far as the study goes since they are not the exact same sort of experiment it is like comparing apples and oranges.
Sporadic anecdotal citation like this is meaningless. It is “cherry-picking”. Weak defenses are created based on biased selection of empirical data. We are pretty sure we can find a poorly constructed analysis for anything. However, only quoting the bad ones would not negate findings by more reliable studies.
As far as the “jealousy to shortness” correlation, that would be the usual “cart before the horse”. One could perform a statistically significant study on the relationship between, “satisfaction of pay rate vs. gender” and likely find that women are generally less satisfied. Of course, that is only a exposing the fact that women are paid far less than men for equal jobs. Similarly, a relationship of “jealousy to shortness” is only uncovering a symptom related to the bigotry of heightism.
There are all kinds of preferences that people have when choosing a date. Height may and or may not be one of them. Just because someone has a preference, does not make them a "shallow skank". It makes them a person with preferences.
This is yet again the weak attempt to deflect the discussion with the truism that “filters exist” and purposely ignores the rationality of any given filter. The discussion is about the filter based on height. Having a filter doesn’t indicate that someone as shallow or not. Having a filter on height, does indicate that the person is behaving irrationally (with the possible exception where they are choosing within a height range above AND below but near their own height).
Repeatedly shrouding illogical choices in false logic, badgering opposition with suggestions that they are “whining”, changing or hijacking a topic are all actions common to those who wish to not have certain truths exposed. As far as being a shallow person, this may require more analysis.
Just remember when you are trying to find a date, that it is not a helpful strategy to sit around and bemoan the reasons why you don't have one. This calls attention to your, pardon the pun, shortcomings. It makes you look like a bitter person, and that is not a very attractive feature in anyone, regardless of their position in life.
Speaking of typical tactics, this only attempts to make critics reluctant to speak out lest they be seen as “bitter”. It is good to see it though as it serves as a reminder to how prejudice is often defended by fear mongering. Rather than discuss the issue, focus is redirected towards a potential “personal cost” for opposing the view of the dogmatist.
It is irrelevant. This is a forum discussion on the roots of height bigotry. Discuss the issue or prove by the deliberate employment of deflection and intimidation that one has absolutely no defense.
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:18:55 PM |
To anyone who simply wants to dismiss short guys as "whinners" bikeman, JD 4duty and others who are not even short, are even appalled by the amount of heightism and shallowness being displayed by women in these threads. When I go out, I'm a bit of a people watcher. Heightism is something I pay particular attention to when I go out socially. More than half the time, I'd say the shorter guy is confronted with prejudiced behavior of some sort, moreso from many women but definitely from some guys as well. I get amused when I sense a woman assessed me as unattractive because I'm 5'10" and then notice she gets all aflutter when a taller guy makes an approach. 5'10" is seen as insufficient by lots of women, especially those who go out to singles spots. It's laughable, but maybe not so if one were continually subjected to that heightism prejudice.
Overweight people experience similar prejudices. So do people of race when they are in unfamiliar environments. I'm not saying to force yourself to be attracted to anyone, just have a bit more of an open mind and perhaps explore any sort of knee-jerk rationalizations you make about others not only as it relates to height, but also to their weight, culture, and race/ethnicity/national origin. The world would be a hell of a lot nicer place. Peace. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:44:41 PM | Touche. I wouldn't sleep with him either.
Like I said, this has only been my experience. If this prejudice will make me miss out on a wonderful short guy in the future, I guess I'll have to take that chance. No more gerkins!! | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:50:23 PM |
Well, of course....but we're talking weight here not height, obesity can make any person look unappealing while HEIGHT does NOT.
Uh, I'd have to disagree with you there. Height does make a person look more or less physically appealing. Any physical trait does depending upon your tastes.
I'm not saying to force yourself to be attracted to anyone, just have a bit more of an open mind and perhaps explore any sort of knee-jerk rationalizations you make about others not only as it relates to height, but also to their weight, culture, and race/ethnicity/national origin.
No offense, but it does sounds like some viewpoints do want women with height requirements to force themselves to be attracted to guys below a certain height. Most women with height requirements would rather be alone and complain about there being no good guys left than try to be happy with a guy they don't find sexually attractive (short men). Everyone has requirements, but some requirements are judged to be "shallow" and pointless. To each their own. I'm glad that I can be happy with a guy that's 5'2" or 6'2". I feel sorry for women who can't and understand why they have a problem. It would suck if I only found men 6' and up sexy. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:53:47 PM |
Uh, I'd have to disagree with you there. Height does make a person look more or less physically appealing. Any physical trait does depending upon your tastes.[/quot]
Anyone knows that cellulite is less appealing than height. There are attractive short people out there. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 1:58:27 PM |
Anyone knows that cellulite is less appealing than height. There are attractive short people out there.
I never said height was less appealing than obesity. I said height does make a person look more or less physically appealing depending upon your tastes. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 2:15:18 PM | Ok guys now that you are done taking everything I said apart and analized it and made fun of it, I want to say something else. :)
The crushing thing was ment as a joke....was trying to be funny.
I was replying to the OPs question and althought I never made hight an issue with dating I have to be honest about sertain feelings that come up as I was replying.
George Clooney is 5'10? I didnt even know that by the way lol hmm...
okeedokee444...5'9 sure its ok . I guess I got a bit into the numbers there in my first post.
I guess I came off like a wacko running around with a mesuring stick..turning down any guy under 5`10 .lol jeepers..NOT TRUE :)
I am not shallo and I agree with some of the things you guys said regarding my post, but I think besides me feeling protected I have to feel `womanly`, I know its MY PROBLEM.
I have a bit of a hang up about being taller then my man and my big feet and hands although they are far from ugly.
Maybe it comes from the images lots of people have that men have to be taller, bigger have bigger hands and the woman be shorter, have tiny hands and feet?
I have to add that If the guy is confortable with my hands or feet being bigger then his and me being taller and does not feel inferior, then I am fine and couldnt care less what others say about him or me .
I find that a lot of shorter men are not confortable with a tall woman with big hands and feet lol and that wouldnt make the woman feel sexy at all. Honestly havent you not heard from guys saying 'I dont want to date her, her hands would make my penis look small'...lol Now THATS shallow!
So yes it is more about selfimmage and feeling confortable in my own skin then being shallow. A guy that has more body mass as another poster added can appear more protector like...I guess, I dont say that shorter guys are weak by any means. not at all if that came across that way I officially apologize.
Summary as long as both partners feel totally confortable with each other, nothing else really matters.
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 2:18:10 PM |
Everyone has requirements, but some requirements are judged to be "shallow" and pointless.
Exactly right. And just as people are within their rights to judge others unacceptable due to physical characteristics, others have the right to judge people based on unattractive personal qualities, like ignoring a group of persons based on an inch or two of height. Height queens are within their rights, but no one is forced to like or respect them. Like some have to live with the label 'short', some have to live with the label 'shallow.'
Don't like it? The world isn't fair, you know. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 3:00:40 PM |
George Clooney is 5'10? I didnt even know that by the way lol hmm... Welcome back Sunshine. I think Clooney supposedly is 5'10 1/2" and goes around saying he is 5'11". He ain't no giant. Most Hollywood actors aren't. See, I read lady's profiles. 
I sort of was teasing you about your preferences. Honestly though, if what you stated as preferences are actually requirements, you likely are missing out on meeting lots of good guys, unless you actually are proactive and take initiative with guys you find attractive (most women don't do this). Sunshine, just read through the thread a little bit (if you are bored to death for some reason); you'll see other women state "preferences" similar to your preferences, and then see how they spun the preference into a rationalized requirement.
Honestly havent you not heard from guys saying 'I dont want to date her, her hands would make my penis look small'...lol Now THATS shallow! Only an friggin idiotic moron would say this to you Sunshine!  | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 4:45:01 PM |
Like some have to live with the label 'short', some have to live with the label 'shallow.'
We're all shallow in some way. I'm not a height queen, but if someone called me shallow for preferring brunettes over blondes that's completely within their right. You can't please everyone, so you might as well please yourself. Life's too short to worry about labels. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:02:21 PM |
We're all shallow in some way. I'm not a height queen, but if someone called me shallow for preferring brunettes over blondes that's completely within their right.
Yeah, but being shallow is not a good thing. It's a fault. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:11:50 PM | | The sad thing is that women tend to judge men on things that is impossible to change- height, balding,****size. And they think they've got it hard being judged on weight. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:21:23 PM |
Yeah, but being shallow is not a good thing. It's a fault.
I wasn't implying that being shallow is a good thing. I believe we all are shallow in some way and if people want to call you out on whatever you happen to be shallow about, then its within their right. Labeling from other people shouldn't bother you. You're the only one who has to live your life, so live it and enjoy.
The sad thing is that women tend to judge men on things that is impossible to change- height, balding,****size. And they think they've got it hard being judged on weight.
Its harder to be judged by age than weight from my point of view. Although weight limits your pool, it doesn't decimate it. At some point a woman's age is going to drain her pool dry and there is nothing she can do about it. She can't make more money, get a better job or do anything that will counterbalance the fact she's 60. A guy can. No matter how old, short, balding or lacking a guy may be...he can always make more money to increase his options. A girl can't.
Dem the breaks.
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:28:35 PM |
The sad thing is that women tend to judge men on things that is impossible to change- height, balding,****size. And they think they've got it hard being judged on weight.
Reminds me of that cop husband in "Deuce Bigalow: Male Gigolo" who kept telling Deuce he had a "thin d***". Speaking of weight, since moving back to the small town where I spent my teen years, I've seen girls I had a crush on back in school and now they're HUGE. I'm thankful now that they didn't go for me. What is it with women letting their health go to pot once they get married? And then there are those women who let their health go to pot before getting married.... | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:34:15 PM |
A guy can. No matter how old, short, balding or lacking a guy may be...he can always make more money to increase his options. A girl can't.
That's women's fault. Most men won't date a women they don't find attractive no matter how much money she makes. Some women, on the other hand, will get into a relationship with a rich man just for the money. Anyways, its not always possible for a guy to make more money. There's an increasing disparity in wealth nowadays, the rich get richer, the poor get poorer. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:46:39 PM |
And they think they've got it hard being judged on weight.
You guys are young, so you probably have no experience with women in their 40s and 50s. Believe me, the aging process is tough on women who rely too much on looks for ego gratification when they start to get older. It's like the Kubler-Ross stages (right name?) of coping with terminal illness - anger, denial etc. I think it's harder on them then it is on us.
If you can't see the value in others beyond physical minutiae, you probably can't see value in yourself either, beyond what's in the mirror.
Really, adherence to media created tastes in looks is a loser's proposition. | |
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| Ladies: your take on short guys?
Posted: 4/30/2008 5:47:02 PM |
That's women's fault. Most men won't date a women they don't find attractive no matter how much money she makes. Some women, on the other hand, will get into a relationship with a rich man just for the money.
I wasn't saying that the fact men can increase their options was a bad thing. I was saying that men almost always have the option to increase their options when women don't. I wasn't implying it was bad or good. Only that no matter what complaints a guy has about his options, he always has the opportunity to increase them. While a woman who complains about her options doesn't always have the opportunity to increase them.
You'd think guys would be happy that no matter how physically unattractive they are whether it be because of weight, height, hair line, age or unfortunate genes they can still get a girlfriend (a hot one if they're lucky) if they're resourceful. An ugly old woman is screwed. And not in a good way.
Hey, I feel for short guys. I've been told point blank that regardless of how devoted, understanding, loving, supportive and appreciative I can be as a mate the answer is still no. It sucks, but if you've got lemons you make lemonade. | |
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