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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/4/2005 6:18:06 AM | As a fully functioning, contributing member of society, and a recreational user of psychoactive substances since the age of 17 (I'm now 48), I'd like to kick in a few of my own thoughts and observations on this topic.
Anything in excess is bad, period! There is no way that it can be stated any more simply. Whether it be drugs (alcohol certainly included here), sex, music, or religeon, anything pursued in excess will be harmful.
There have been times in my life where I allowed various drugs to color my every thought, and this is not a good thing :>( The only 2 promises I made myself when I began to "play" with various substances were that I would never use a needle in association with drug use or try herion. I have upheld these rules stringently even having had the opportunity to have done otherwise on numerous occasions.
Of all the drugs i ever tried, only 2 ever held any fascination, which are weed and acid. Both of these basically allow for "vacations of the mind" while never requiring a tank of gas or a passport to get there.
Though I like a buzz now and then, my typical useage is quite minimal, on the order of one to two jays a week. When I'm high, I find it hard to read or write, 2 things I really enjoy, and spend a lot of time doing. I can however loose myself in some favorite music, ponder deep social issues, explore various mechanical concepts from varying angles, all the while resting my brain from the constraints of the known and accepted concepts of our daily lives.
While the argument has already been stated here that certain drugs may make available certain awarenesses commonly not associated with sobriety, I take issue with that idea.
When much younger and experimenting regularly with LSD, I formulated an idea that I have held as a truism for many years now. Any "revelation" gained through a drug induced state of mind is an inherently flawed concept. Afterall, what validity can be attached to a thought process spawned by the mind in an chemically altered state ?
Recreational drug use is an unstoppable process which will continue no matter how much money and energy the governments of the world choose to throw at it. It's been going on since these substances were 1st discovered, and they will continue to be used, no matter what is done to discourage them from being used / consumed.
With that in mind, the money spent to stop the flow of drugs in the US alone would be far better spent in treating those with substance abuse issues than making common criminals of all who choose to do drugs, whether it presents itself as a real problem in their life or not, as is the case now.
During the Nixon presidency, the largest and most far reaching study ever undertaken regarding marijuana use, its short term effects and long term useage effects was done. The findings from this study were that marijuana was a harmless drug with its primary effects being that it calmed the user, made them happy, hungry and sleepy. Their stated opinion was that then single largest risk to marijuana users was of their being arrested and subjected to the woes of the American legal system from being found in the posession of or under the influence of the drug, whereas the drug (in of itself) didn't necessarily lead to more hard core drug useage, nor antisocial or psychotic behavior.
It's said Nixon was so peeved at their findings he simply trashed the study and proceeded with an increased war on the terrible weed ! This is the typical behavior of most any person or group when met with solid reasoning not in tune with their agendas.
In the days of governments always seeking new tax bases, I feel the needs of most governed peoples in the world would be best met by legalizing marijuana, taxing it, regulating it, thus taking away the dark underbelly associated with the illegal distribution chains now associated with procurement and distribution of it. I too feel there is more harm done in the legal world from the laws regarding marijuana, and from the forced underground dealings of drug suppliers than there is in the drug itself.
Just my thoughts .... Kim ¦¬] | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/4/2005 6:40:37 AM | Speaking about musicians...many in more recent times have quite short careers, or never quite reach the heights they did when starting out. Oasis are an example of the latter - many people would consider that the spark of genius they had in the past has fizzled out, to some extent.
Oasis were quite public about their drug use, but there is an argument that they have burned out because of such a lifestyle. Certainly they are a shadow of the band they used to be. Sure, you can call up examples of artists who used drugs and had long careers, but there are many, many stories out there (Keith Richards, etc) of musicians who ended up in a heap due to their use and abuse of substances. And a long list of those who have prematurely snuffed it too due to the physical or mental effects.
I think it is relatively easy to come up with a list of artists who used drugs. It is equally easy to come up with a list of those who have been messed up by their misuse. At the end of the day artists are creative people; to suggest drug use fuels their creativity is making a leap of faith (and trying to justify your own drug consumption??) rather than looking at the possibility that whatever drives them to achieve may also fuel their drug use. As another poster suggested above, many creative people may not be the happiest or most stable in the world! U2's Bono put it well when he asked, 'what kind of person needs the applause of 40,000 people each night to make them feel okay?'
Anyway, that is my tuppence worth.....! I'm not judging the original poster; I'm just saying that there is a counter-side to his argument. | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/4/2005 8:23:26 AM | There are several good books on drugs,how they became illegal and the effects before their prohibition and after."Acid Dreams"forget the author's name but it is about the history of LSD from the first time it was synthesized in 1947 in Basel,Switzerland,through the 50's CIA and US Army involvement(btw,the term "trip" wasn't coined by hippies,it was a US Army term.Ken Keasy who wrote "One Flew Over the Cuckoos' Nest was one of the Army's test subjects for LSD) and the 60's flower child days.Another is "Ecstacy:The MDMA Story",traces the history of the drug from it's inception in 1915 to the Rave years of today.It also has anecdotes from medical journals documenting thr progress test subjects made when MDMA was used therapeutically for depression,pain management,psychological scarring from trauma and marriage counseling.There's another book about the so called date rape drug GHB by Dr.Dean Morgenthaler,forget the title but it blows all the media hype out of the water. The story of drug prohibition is generally the same.A substance is made illegal for a reason,one usually having nothing to do with the effects of the drug or the the drug itself (Marijuana for example was outlawed in the 30's to try to keep Mexicans out.LSD was outlawed to cover up the CIA's involvement.MDMA and GHB were outlawed to keep them out of the legal drug market probably because they would take a bite out of sales of other drugs that are currently being used that are FDA approved).What follows is a media sensation scare tactic (in the 30's there were hilarious films like "Reefer Madness",in the 60's there were tabloid stories about genetic damage from LSD causing babies to be born hideously deformed and recently we now see scare stories about people dying at Rave parties and girls being date raped from GHB) that results in lawmakers putting a substance on a DEA schedule of controlled substances which then results in the "real" drugs going further underground and copycat drugs replacing them that really are dangerous.The price goes up and the purity and quality of the drug goes down which results in more people dying. | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/4/2005 10:45:53 AM |
If I was paranoid at all I would suspect that the reason behind making LSD illegal was because it enabled people to break through the normal context of thought that conventional dogma requires to appear absolute. People were getting pissed off about the war in Vietnam, and the government's other criminal activities, like overthrowing duly elected foreign governments and assassinating leaders and other people they didn't like. I wonder if the decision to outlaw those drugs was part of the effort to squish the anti-war movement.
This is quite interesting. It seems as though the CIA was very keen to explore the mind control potentials of LSD, cannabis, Mushrooms, DMT and mescaline. The problems for their agenda however was that what these substances actually do is allow people to realise that their sense of 'reality', their morlality, beliefs and sense of self are cultural constructed - they are shaped by the discourses of the powerful : from parents to politicians. I'm not a big advocate of LSD (as I think that the more organic substances offer a much more spiritual experiences) but it is clear that it makes people aware of how power operates and how people are attempting to control them. The main reason the CIA therefore abandoned the LSD programme is because it makes people less controllable rather than more so.
This is a little bit of writing about the CIA psychedellic programme: (ps I will respond to that mans question about creaitivty and how people who used substnaces might have done extraordinary things anyway in a separate post below)
As recorded in a report prepared for a congressional committee investigating the CIA's mind control experiments (171), among the goals of the MK-ULTRA project were to develop:
"substances which will promote illogical thinking and impulsiveness to the point where the recipient would be discredited in public"
"materials to render the induction of hypnosis easier" - "substances which will produce 'pure' euphoria with no subsequent let-down"
"materials and physical methods which will produce amnesia for events preceding and during their use"
"substances which alter personality structure in such a way that the tendency of the recipient to become dependent upon another person is enhanced"
"substances which will lower the ambition and general working efficiency of men" As examined above, the CIA planned to use LSD as an aid in the interrogation of captured enemy agents, as well as a sort of prophylactic for training American agents in resisting interrogation in the event of capture. Another usage of the drug planned by the Agency was as a clandestine confusion agent, to be slipped into food, drink, or whatever to foreign leaders and politicians of a leftist slant in order to reduce them to quivering, hallucinating blobs of flesh, gibbering deranged nonsense in public speeches, embarrassing and disgracing themselves before the public and in the eyes of the world. (172)
Of course, the CIA claims that such a use of LSD was never contemplated against domestic targets. But the Agency, in violation of its own (pre-Reagan) charter, gathered domestic intelligence right from the start, and during the height of the anti-war movement, coordinated Operation CHAOS with the FBI, military intelligence, and various police departments, to infiltrate and disrupt those pesky peaceniks. (173) The CIA intercepted and opened mail, tapped phones, ran smear campaigns. (174) As we have already seen, during the heyday of MK-ULTRA, the Agency tested LSD on unwitting US citizens, in conditions that were far from clinical and in ways that were nowhere near being "scientific." They even used each other as guinea pigs. And there are still unanswered questions about what role, if any, the CIA might have played in inundating the 1960s counter-culture with LSD and other drugs during a crucial period, or even if they possibly created the counter-culture, through unforeseen circumstances, or even as the ultimate MK-ULTRA experiment in mass psychological control and manipulation through drugs.
Too absurd to even consider? Then stop reading now, you won't be able to take what's coming next...
There is something about the story of Mary Meyer-as-JFK's LSD- mistress that, if true, is naggingly bothersome. Like the assassination itself, it demands clarification, insists on being solved. Recall the plans of Al Hubbard and Humphrey Osmond to make the world a better, more peaceful place with the application of psychedelic chemical therapy to certain hand- picked politicians, and their claims of some success. All this quite a few years before Mary Meyer's similar campaign: was it a case of like thinking evolving from acid insight happening in two different places and times, or was Mary Meyer possibly acting as an agent for Hubbard and Osmond, or someone who was their direct agent?
Consider the Leary connection to Mary Meyer in light of his connections to Hubbard, Osmond, and Aldous Huxley. Consider Hubbard's career as an undercover agent for various government agencies and defense related industries, including his connection to the CIA. Consider his later career spent fighting against the youth counter-culture that one would otherwise think he would have been proud of as being the fruit of his labors. Then consider Mary Meyer herself, estranged wife of one of the CIA's seminal top operatives, and her affair with a president who developed a mutual distrust for the CIA, a president who swore he would shatter the CIA into a thousand pieces and scatter the remnants to the wind. A president believed by many to have been assassinated by that same CIA. Consider the CIA sex and drugs safehouse experiments conducted by George Hunter White. Consider the proposed use of LSD as a means of discrediting foreign leaders. Consider the list of substances developed by the CIA, or attempted to be developed by the CIA listed above.
Now consider this: was John F. Kennedy, president of the United States, the ultimate MK-ULTRA guinea pig? Was Mary Pinchot Meyer playing some sort of clandestine game, was she some sort of Mata Hari? Or was she perhaps unwittingly being used by someone in that capacity?
After all, if we can seriously consider a CIA ready, willing, and able to assassinate a president they came to see as a threat or a traitor, why not a CIA willing to dose a president with LSD and study him as a test subject? What other world leader could they try their theories out on while observing him in closely monitored, intimate situations?
Still too absurd to consider? Probably. I hesitate to even put it on paper myself. But that isn't even the most bizarre possible theory...
While LSD is not guaranteed to permanently alter the thought processes of those who experience it, despite the frequent claims to the contrary often made during the 1960s, it certainly will give those individuals possessed of some intelligence and discernment a lot to think about. During the time period when CIA agents were furthering the scientific testing of LSD by dosing each other without warning, most agents had their already well-entrenched paranoid worldviews reinforced: to them, LSD was a nightmare experience, one to be avoided at all costs. But to some it was truly a revelation. One agent, after coming down from the peak of a trip, broke down and wept in front of his fellow spooks.
"I didn't want to leave it. I felt I would be going back to a place where I wouldn't be able to hold onto this kind of beauty. I felt very unhappy. The people who wrote the report on me said I had experienced depression, but they didn't understand why I felt so bad. They thought I had had a bad trip." (173)
He was lucky they didn't slap a straight jacket on him and cart him away for good!
Another operative who came away from his trip without the usual paranoid residue common to spooks on dope had found himself with "A more global view of things. I found it awfully hard when stoned to maintain the notion: I am a US citizen -- my country right or wrong ... You tend to have these good higher feelings. You are more open to the brotherhood-of-man idea and more susceptible to the seamy sides of your own society ... I think this is exactly what happened during the 1960s, but it didn't make people more communist. It just made them less inclined to identify with the US. They took a plague on both your houses position." (174)
Certainly, this is a self-defeating philosophy for a spy to adopt. Did such experiences tempt any CIA agents to chuck it all, or to stay only to subvert from within? It's a farfetched speculation, with little evidence to support it. While there were several notable CIA renegades who would come to public knowledge with horrible tales to relate of their activities as covert operators, such men as Phillip Agee, John Stockwell, Ralph McGeehee, George O'Toole, and David MacMichael seem to have been impelled more by the resolution of their own troubled moral dilemmas than by psychedelic insight.
However, one obscure theory, most likely, implausible yet fascinating, comes from Lawrence Livermore, North California punk rock luminary best known for his column in punkzine Maximum Rock 'n Roll. Livermore claims to have once met a fellow who claimed to be the son of "a high level CIA operative who had inside knowledge of the Kennedy assassination" which he described as "a power struggle between the liberal and reactionary wings of the CIA." This fellow ran away from home, went to the Haight-Ashbury and blew his mind on ... well, you know what by now (as well as the irony of the situation ... ), but by the time Livermore met him, he was "in the process of drinking himself to death." The gist of this wretched fellow's tale was that:
"Within the CIA there were good and evil factions, and when the bad group ('the dark ones' ...) threatened to gain complete power via the Kennedy assassination and the escalation of the Vietnam war and its related heroin trade, the CIA's white knights struck back with LSD." (175)
It should be noted that Livermore's informant wove a tale that "tied together Tibetan monks, Hitlerian mystics, secret brotherhoods dating back to the days of Atlantis, and the manipulation of white and black magic in the name of saving or enslaving the human race, and would hiss at the televised image of Henry Kissinger and say, "He's one of them ... look at his eyes." (176)
It's hard enough to believe merely when it's a tale of black and white "knights" of the CIA jousting over control of the nation and the minds of the human race, when the other elements are added to it, it sounds more like an episode of the continuing saga of Indiana Jones, or maybe one of Trevor Ravenscroft's satanic fantasies.
Livermore himself gives the impression that he finds the story "far-fetched-sounding, yes, but minus the quasimystical elements, by no means preposterous." (177) Could it have been possible that some faction of CIA agents, their typical cold war super-patriot minds blown by acid, indeed flooded the country with LSD, not as part of some plot to forestall change or stifle rebellion, but to encourage it, especially in the aftermath of Kennedy's assassination by their dark counterparts within the agency? It would not be entirely improbable, if we remember Captain Al Hubbard and his plans to foster world peace by turning on world leaders even before Mary Meyer.
And if Kennedy and Mary Meyer were pursuing an acid dalliance, with crucial repercussions for foreign policy, would it be too hard to believe that possibly it was due to the influence of somebody or something else, some self-appointed clique of mystic manipulators, perhaps, denizens of the clandestine world and adepts of its covert activities yet ultimately rejecting the goals of that world, running their own program and agenda beneath the cover of something much more banally insidious, like the CIA's MK-ULTRA program?
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DMT
| Joined: 12/3/2004 Msg: 30 | |
| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 4:50:19 AM | Irlandes said something like:
Oasis were quite public about their drug use, but there is an argument that they have burned out because of such a lifestyle. Certainly they are a shadow of the band they used to be. Sure, you can call up examples of artists who used drugs and had long careers, but there are many, many stories out there (Keith Richards, etc) of musicians who ended up in a heap due to their use and abuse of substances. And a long list of those who have prematurely snuffed it too due to the physical or mental effects. I think it is relatively easy to come up with a list of artists who used drugs. It is equally easy to come up with a list of those who have been messed up by their misuse. At the end of the day artists are creative people; to suggest drug use fuels their creativity is making a leap of faith (and trying to justify your own drug consumption??) rather than looking at the possibility that whatever drives them to achieve may also fuel their drug use.
I'm not sure how many people would consider Oasis to be a very good example of very creative people. They are ok, but they didn't really come up with anything original, they seemed to be simple-minded John Lennon fans who were playing at being 'stars'. They are quite typical of lads from manchester, and not unusal for taking or bragging about their substance use. It's hard to imagine them however even going near a stage if they weren't using substances, including alcohol.
I'm cautious about sounding like Aldous Huxley did when he argued that vision-inducing substances should be the exclusive domain of intellectuals and artists. This is not only elitist (before he took mescaline and LSD Huxley was incredibly dismissive of working people, arguing that most people should be put in holes in the ground and machine gunned - of course his genocidal fantasy came true soon after in the second world war), but it is also impossible. A small group of psychotherapists were the ones intially using MDMA at parties in the 1970's but it was inevitable (and arguably desirable) that ecstasy became more widely available, costing (in real terms) 50 times less than it did in 1987.
There is a considerable difference between people being addicted to things like cocaine, crack and heroin and people using mind-enhancing and etheogenic (opening one up to the gods) substances. Despite all of the media hype there have been very few cases of people getting into difficultues due to mushrooms, lsd, mescaline, dmt, salvia divinourum, ayahuasca, iboga, or 2cb etc. And, as people on here have shown, it is easily manageable to use such substances and conduct one's life in an enjoyable and effective manner. And, while governments have supressed research into the effects of entheogens, the research that there has been has shown that people regularly using the dmt-containing tea ayahuasca experience improvements to health, lowered anxiety, improved memory, improved concentration, lower levels of conflict with others and problems with the law, heightened senstivity to others and an appreciation of spirituality.
This study was known as the Hoasca project and can be viewed here: http://leda.lycaeum.org/?ID=16806 and I will paste a summary of it below in case for some rreason the link doesn't work.
Ayahuasca: An Ethnopharmacologic History (1998) Dennis J. McKenna, Ph.D.
Introduction
Of the numerous plant hallucinogens utilized by indigenous populations of the Amazon Basin, perhaps none is as interesting or complex, botanically, chemically, or ethnographically, as the hallucinogenic beverage known variously as ayahuasca, caapi, or yage. The beverage is most widely known as ayahuasca , a Quechua term meaning "vine of the souls," which is applied both to the beverage itself and to one of the source-plants used in its preparation, the Malpighiaceous jungle liana, Banisteriopsis caapi (Schultes, 1957). In Brazil, transliteration of this Quechua word into Portuguese results in the name, Hoasca. Ayahuasca, or hoasca, occupies a central position in Mestizo ethnomedicine, and the chemical nature of its active constituents and the manner of its use makes its study relevant to contemporary issues in neuropharmacology, neurophysiology, and psychiatry.
What is Ayahuasca?
In a traditional context, Ayahuasca is a beverage prepared by boiling - or soaking - the bark and stems of Banisteriopsis caapi together with various admixture plants. The admixture employed most commonly is the Rubiaceous genus Psychotria, particularly P. viridis. The leaves of P. viridis contains alkaloids which are necessary for the psychoactive effect Ayahuasca is unique in that its pharmacological activity is dependent on a synergistic interaction between the active alkaloids in the plants. One of the components, the bark of Banisteriopsis caapi, contains ß-carboline alkaloids, which are potent MAO-A inhibitors; the other component, the leaves of Psychotria viridis or related species, contains the potent short-acting psychoactive agent N,N-dimethyltryptamine (DMT). DMT is not orally active when ingested by itself, but can be rendered orally active in the presence of a peripheral MAO inhibitor - and this interaction is the basis of the psychotropic action of ayahuasca (McKenna, Towers, & Abbott, 1984). There are also reports (Schultes, 1972) that other Psychotria species are similarly utilized in other parts of the Amazon. In the Northwest Amazon, particularly in the Colombian Putumayo and Ecuador, the leaves of Diplopterys cabrerana, a jungle liana in the same family as Banisteriopsis, are added to the brew in lieu of the leaves of Psychotria. The alkaloid present in Diplopterys, however, is identical to that in the Psychotria admixtures, and pharmacologically, the effect is similar. In Peru, various admixtures in addition to Psychotria or Dipolopterys are frequently added, depending on the magical, medical, or religious purposes for which the drug is being consumed. Although a virtual pharmacopoeia of admixtures are occasionally added, the most commonly employed admixtures (other than Psychotria, which is a constant component of the preparation) are various Solanaceous genera, including tobacco (Nicotiana sp.), Brugmansia sp., and Brunfelsia sp. (Schultes, 1972; McKenna, et al., 1995). These Solanaceous genera are known to contain alkaloids, such as nicotine, scopalamine, and atropine, which effect both central and peripheral adrenergic and cholinergic neurotransmission. The interactions of such agents with serotonergic agonists and MAO inhibitors are essentially unknown in modern medicine.
Focus of the Present Historical Perspective
The present chapter presents a brief overview of the history of ethnopharmacological investigations of ayahuasca, which has been a topic of fascination to ethnographers, botanists, chemists, and pharmacologists ever since it first became known to science in the mid-19th century. For expository purposes, the history of ayahuasca ethnopharmacology can be divided into several segments, starting with the prehistorical orgins of the beverage and leading up to the present, where ayahuasca is still an active area of research. The modern history of ayahuasca can be dated from the mid-19th century. The focus of the present chapter is on the ethnopharmacologic history of ayahuasca, though it should be noted that this unique beverage has historically impacted religion, politics, and society, as well as science, (e.g., in the Brazilian goverment’s acceptance of the legitimacy of the sacramental use of ayahuasca beverages by the UDV and other Brasilian syncretic sects) and the implications and consequences of its continued and spreading use is likely to be felt on a number of levels now and in the future.
Prehistorical Roots of Ayahuasca
The origins of the use of ayahuasca in the Amazon Basin are lost in the mists of prehistory. No one can say for certain where the practice may have originated, and about all that can be stated with certainty is that it was already spread among numerous indigenous tribes throughout the Amazon Basin by the time ayahuasca came to the attention of Western ethnographers in the mid-19th century. This fact alone argues for its antiquity; beyond that, little is known. Plutarco Naranjo, the Equatorian ethnograper, has summarized what little information is available on the prehistory of ayahuasca (Naranjo, 1979, 1986). There is abundant archeological evidence, in the form of pottery vessels, anthropomorphic figurines, snuffing trays and tubes, etc., that plant hallucinogen use was well established in the Ecuadorian Amazon by 1500 - 2000 B.C. Unfortunately, most of the specific evidence, in the form of vegetable powders, snuff trays, and pipes, is related to the use of psychoactive plants other than ayahuaca, such as coca, tobacco, and the hallucinogenic snuff derived from Anadenanthera species and known as vilka and various other names. There is nothing in the form of iconographic materials or preserved botanical remains that would unequivocally establish the prehistorical use of ayahuasca, although it is probable that these pre-Colombian cultures, sophisticated as they were in the use of a variety of psychotropic plants, were also familiar with ayahuasca and its preparation. The lack of data is frustrating, however, particularly in respect to a question which has fascinated ethnopharmacologists since the late 1960’s when its importance was first brought to light through the work of R.E. Schultes and his students. As mentioned above, ayahuasca is unique among plant hallucinogens in that it is prepared from a combination of two plants: The bark or stems of Banisteriopsis species, together with the leaves of Psychotria species or other DMT-containing admixtures. The beverage depends on this unique combination for its activity. There seems small likelihood of “accidentally” combining the two plants to obtain an active preparation when neither is particularly active alone, yet we know that at some point in prehistory, this fortuitous combination was discovered. At that point, ayahuasca was “invented.” Just how this discovery was made, and who was responsible, we may never know, though there are several charming myths which address the topic. Mestizo ayahuasqueros in Peru will, to this day, tell you that this knowledge comes directly from the “plant teachers” (Luna, 1984), while the mestres of the Brasilian syncretic cult, the UDV, will tell you with equal conviction that the knowledge came from “the first scientist,” King Solomon, who imparted the technology to the Inca king during a little publicized visit to the New World in antiquity. In the absence of data, these explanations are all that we have. All that we can say with confidence is that the knowledge of the techniques for preparing ayahuasca, including knowledge of the appropriate admixture plants, had diffused throughout the Amazon by the time the use of ayahuasca came to the attention of any modern researcher.
Scientific “discovery” of Ayahuasca - the 19th Century
The archeological prehistory of ayahuasca is likely to remain inextricably bound up with its mythical origins for the rest of time, unless some artifact should be uncovered that would unequivocally establish the antiquity of its usage.
By contrast, what might be called the modern or the scientific history of ayahuasca, is traceable to 1851, when the great English botanist Richard Spruce encountered the use of an intoxicating beverage among the Tukano Indians of the Rio Uapes in Brasil (Schultes, 1982). Spruce collected flowering specimens from the large jungle liana used as the source of the beverage, and this collection was the basis for his classification of the plant as Banisteria caapi; it was reclassified as Banisteriopsis caapi by the taxonomist Morton in 1931 as part of his revision of the generic concepts within the family, Malpighiaceae.
Seven years later, Spruce again encountered the same liana in use among the Guahibo Indians on the upper Orinoco of Colombia and Venezuela, and, later the same year, found the Záparo Indians of Andean Peru taking a narcotic beverage, prepared from the same plant, which they called ayahuasca. Although Spruce’s discovery predates any other published accounts, he did not publish his findings until 1873, when it was mentioned in a popular account of his Amazon explorations (Spruce, 1873). A fuller exposition was not to appear until Spruce published his account in A.R. Wallace’s anthology in 1908, Notes of a Botanist on the Amazon and Andes (Spruce, 1908). Credit for the earliest published reports of ayahuasca usage belongs to the Ecuadorian geographer Manuel Villavicencio, who, in 1858, wrote of the use of ayahuasca in sorcery and divination on the upper Rio Napo (Villavicencio, 1858). Although Villavicencio supplied no botanical details about the plant used as the source of the beverage, his account of his own self-intoxication left no doubt in Spruce’s mind that they were writing about the same thing.
Throughout the remainder of the 19th century, various ethnographers and explorers continued to report on their encounters of the use of an intoxicating beverage prepared by various indigenous Amazonian tribes, and purportedly prepared from the “roots” (Crévaux, 1883), of various “shrubs” (Koch-Grünberg, 1909) or “lianas” (Rivet, 1905) of uncertain botanical provenance. Unlike Spruce, who had the presence of mind not only to collect botanical voucher specimens, but also materials designated for eventual chemical analysis, these later investigators did not collect specimens of the plants they observed, and hence their accounts are now of little more than historical importance. One notable exception was Simson’s (1886) publication of the use of ayahusca amongst Ecuadorian Indians, noting that they “drank ayahuasca mixed with yage, sameruja leaves, and guanto wood, an indulgence which usually results in a broil between at least the partakers of the beverage.” None of the ingredients were identified, nor were voucher specimens collected, but this report is the earliest indication that other admixture species were employed in the preparation of ayahuasca.
While Richard Spruce and other adventurous Amazonian explorers were collecting the first field reports of ayahuasca from 1851 onward, the groundwork was already being laid for important work on the chemistry of ayahuasca that would take place in the second decade of the twentieth century. The 19th century witnessed the birth of natural products chemistry, starting with the isolation of morphine from opium poppies by the German pharmacist Sërtuner in 1803. A disproportionate number of natural products isolated for the first time during this period were alkaloids, probably because these bases are relatively easy to isolate in a pure form, and partly because the plants which contain them were and are important drug plants with obvious and often dramatic pharmacological properties. It was during this period of feverish alkaloid discovery that German chemist H. Göbel isolated harmaline from the seeds of the Syrian Rue, Peganum harmala. Six years later, his colleague, J. Fritsch isolated harmine from the seeds in 1847. More than 50 years later, a third alkaloid, harmalol, was also isolated from Syrian Rue seeds by Fisher in 1901. Harmine, like the other ß-carbolines named after the species epithet of Peganum harmala, would later turn out to be identical to the major ß-carboline found in Banisteriopsis caapi; the definitive establishment of the equivalence of the ayahuasca ß-carboline to harmine from Syrian Rue however, would not take place until the 1920s, after harmine had been independently isolated by several investigators and given a variety of names. The final 19th century event of signicance in the scientific history of ayahuasca took place in 1895, with the first investigations of the effects of harmine on the central nervous system in lab animals by Tappeiner; his preliminary results were followed up more systematically by Gunn in 1909, who reported that the major effects were motor stimulation of the CNS with tremors and convulsions, followed or accompanied by paresis and slowed pulse (Gunn, 1935).
Ayahuasca In the Early 20th century (1900-1950)
The early decades of the twentieth century witnessed the publication of Spruce’s detailed accounts of his Amazonian explorations and his observations of the use of the narcotic beverage among several tribes that he contacted. Although brief reports had been published earlier by Spruce and others, it was Spruce’s account of his travels in a volume edited by the famed naturalist and co-discoverer of evolution A.R. Wallace in 1908 that may have rescued the knowledge of ayahuasca from the depths of academic obscurity and brought it to the attention of educated lay people.
During this early twentieth century period, progress in the understanding of ayahuasca took place mainly on two fronts: Taxonomic, and chemical. With some notable exceptions, pharmacological investigations of the properties of ayahuasca were relatively quiescent during this period.
The botanical history of ayahuasca during this period is an amusing combination of excellent taxonomic detective work by some, and egregious errors compounded upon errors by others. Safford, in 1917, asserted his belief that ayahuasca and the beverage known as caapi were identical,and derived from the same plant. The French anthropologist Reinberg (1921) compounded the confusion by his assertion that ayahuasca was referable to Banisteriopsis caapi, but that yajé was prepared from an Apocyanaceous genus, Haemadictyon amazonicum, now correctly classified as Prestonia amazonica. This error, which apparently originated from an uncritical reading of Spruce’s original field notes, was to persist and propagate through the literature on ayahuasca for the next forty years. It was finally put to rest when Schultes and Raffauf published a paper specifically refuting this misidentification (Schultes and Raffauf, 1960), however it still crops up occasionally in technical literature.
Among the investigators who helped to clarify, rather than cloud, the taxonomic understanding of ayahuasca botany must be mentioned the works of Rusby and White in Bolivia in 1922 (White, 1922) and the publication by Morton in 1930 of the field notes made by the botanist Klug in the Colombian Putumayo. From Klug’s collections, Morton described a new species of Banisteriopsis, B. inebriens, used as a hallucinogen, but he also asserted that at least three species, B. caapi, B. inebriens, and B. quitensis, were used similarly and that two other species, Banisteria longialata, and Banisteropsis rusbyana may have been used as admixtures to the preparation. Curiously, it was two chemists, Chen and Chen (1939) who did the most to clarify the early taxonomic confusion about the identity of the ayahuasca source plants. These investigators, working on the isolation of the active principles of yagé and ayahuasca, supported their investigations with authentic botanical voucher specimens (a rare practice at that time) and, after a review of the literature, concluded that caapi, yagé, and ayahuasca were all different names for the same beverage, and that their source plant was identical: Banisteriopsis caapi. Subsequent work by Schultes and others in the 1950’s would establish that, in fact, Malpighiaceous species other than B. caapi were implicated in the preparation of the beverage, but considering the reigning confusion of the time, Chen and Chen’s contribution was a rare light in the forest of prevailing darkness. From subsequent fieldwork, it is now quite clear that the two main botanical sources of the beverage variously known as caapi, ayahuasca, yagé, natéma, and pinde are the barks of B. caapi and B. inebriens.
The first half of the 20th century was also the period in which the first serious chemical investigations of the active principals of ayahuasca were carried out; and, like much of the initial taxonomic work taking place during this same period, scientific progress on this front was marked at first by confusion arising from the simultaneous investigations of several independent groups of investigators. Gradually, as these investigations found their way into the scientific literature, clarity began to emerge from a fairly murkey picture.
Harmine, which consensus would eventually establish as the major ß-carboline alkaloid of Banisteriopsis species, had been isolated from the seeds of Peganum harmala in 1847 by the German chemist Fritsch. Its unequivocal indentification was still several decades in the future when an alkaloid named “telepathine” was obtained from unvouchered botanical material called “yajé” by Zerda and Bayón in 1905 (quoted in Perrot and Hamet, 1927). In 1923, an alkaloid was again isolated from unvouchered botanical materials by the Colombian chemist Fisher Cardenas (1923), and was also named telepathine; at the same time, another Colombian team, chemist Barriga-Villalba and Albarracin (1925) isolated an alkaloid, yageine. This may also have been harmine in an impure form, but the formula assigned at the time and the melting point were inconsistent for a ß-carboline structure. To compound the confusion, the vine with which Barriga-Villalba worked had been “identified” as Prestonia amazonica, but he later revised this identification to Banisteriopsis caapi. In all of these instances, the lack of botanical reference specimens rendered the work of dubious value.
Things began to get slightly better from 1926 into the 1950s. Michaels and Clinquart (1926) isolated an alkaloid which they called yageine from unvouchered materials. Shortly afterward, Perrot and Hamet (1927) isolated a substance which they called telepathine and suggested that it was identical to yageine. Lewin, in 1928, isolated an alkaloid which he named banisterine; this was shown to be identical with harmine, previously known from the Syrian Rue, by chemists from E. Merck and Co. (Elger, 1928; Wolfes & Rumpf 1928). Elger worked from vouchered botanical materials which had been identified at Kew Gardens as Banisteropsis caapi. At Lewin’s urging, based on his own animal studies, the pharmacologist Kurt Beringer (1928) used samples of “banisterine” donated by Lewin in a clinical study of 15 post-encephalitic Parkinson’s patients, and reported dramatic positive effects (Beringer, 1928). This was the first time that a reversible MAO inhibitor had been reviewuated for the treatment of Parkinson’s Disease, though harmine’s activity as a reversible MAOI was not discovered until nearly 30 years later. It also represents one of the few instances where a hallucinogenic drug has been clinically reviewuated for the treatment of any disease (Sanchez-Ramos, 1991).
Working from vouchered botanical materials supplied by Llewellyn Williams of the Chicago Field Museum, Chen and Chen (1939) succeeded in confirming the work of Elger and Wolfes and Rumpf; these workers isolated harmine from the stems, leaves, and roots of B. caapi, and confirmed its identity with banisterine, previously isolated by Lewin. In 1957 Hochstein and Paradies analyzed vouchered material of ayahuasca collected in Peru and isolated harmine, harmaline, and tetrahydroharmine. The investigations of the constituents of other Banisteriopsis species was not undertaken until 1953, when O’Connell and Lynn (1953) confirmed the presence of harmine in the stems and leaves of vouchered specimens of B. inebriens supplied by Schultes. Subsequently Poisson (1965) confirmed these results, by isolating harmine and a small amount of harmaline from “natema” from Peru, identified by Cuatrecasas as B. inebriens.
Mid-20th Century (1950-1980)
The first half of the 20th century witnessed the initial scientific studies of ayahuasca and began to shed some light on the botanical sources of this curious hallucinogen and the nature of its active constituents. During the three decades from 1950 to 1980, botanical and chemical studies continued apace, and new discoveries laid the groundwork for an eventual explanation of the unique pharmacological actions of ayahuasca.
On the chemical front, the work of Hochstein and Paradies (1957) confirmed and extended the previous work of Chen and Chen (1939) and others. The active alkaloids of Banisteriopsis caapi and related species were now firmly established as harmine, tetrahydroharmine, and harmaline. In the late 60’s however, the first detailed reports of the use of admixtures as a regular, if not invariant, component of the ayahuasca brew began to emerge (Pinkley, 1969), and it soon became apparent that at least two of these admixtures, Banisteriopsis rusbyana (later reclassified by Bronwen Gates as Diplopterys cabrerana) and Psychotria species, particularly P. viridis, (Schultes, 1967) were added to the brew to “strengthen and extend” the visions. A further surprise came when the alkaloid fractions obtained from these species proved to be the potent short-acting (but orally inactive) hallucinogen N,N-dimethyltryptamine (DMT) (Der Marderosian, et al. 1968). This compound had been known as a synthetic for some decades following Manske’s initial synthesis; but its occurrence in nature and its hallucinogenic properties had only come to light a few years earlier, when Fish, Johnson, and Horning (1955) had isolated it as the putative active principle in Piptadenia peregrina (later reclassified as Anadenanthera peregrina), the source of a hallucinogenic snuff used by Indians of the Carribean, as well as the Orinoco basin of South America.
The pharmacological rationale for the discovery by Schultes, Pinkley, and others in the late 60’s that ayahuasca depended for its activity on a synergistic interaction between the MAO-inhibiting ß-carbolines in Banisteriopsis with the psychoactive but peripherally inactivated tryptamine, DMT had already been provided in 1958 by Udenfriend and coworkers (Udenfriend, et al., 1958) These researchers in the Laboratory of Clinical Pharmacology at NIH were the first to demonstrate that ß-carbolines were potent, reversible inhibitors of MAO. During this same period, clinical work and self-experimentation by the Hungarian psychiatrist and pharmacologist Stephen Szara (1957) with the newly synthesized DMT lead to the publication of the first reports of its profound, though short-lasting, hallucinogenic actions in humans. Szara’s experiments also lead to the first recognition that the compound is not orally active, though the mechanisms of its inactivation on oral administration were not fully understood. Ironically, several decades later, the DMT pioneer Szara would be appointed as the head of NIDA (National Institute on Drug Abuse).
In 1967, during the height of the Summer of Love in the Haight Ashbury, a unique symposium was held in San Francisco under the sponsorship of what was at the time the U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare. Entitled Ethnopharmacologic Search for Psychoactive Drugs (the proceedings were later published under that title as U.S. Public Health Service Publication #1645, issued by the U.S. Government Printing Office) (Efron, et al., 1967) this conference brought together the leading lights of the day in the emerging field of psychedelic ethnopharmacology. Participants included toxicologist Bo Holmstedt of the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm, ethnobotanist Richard Evans Schultes, chemist Alexander Shulgin, newly credentialed M.D. and marijuana researcher Andrew Weil, and others. It was the first time that a conference on the botany, chemistry and pharmacology of psychedelics had been held, and as it happened, it was certainly the last time that such a conference would be held under government sponsorship! This landmark conference, and the publication issuing from it which was to become a classic of psychedelic literature, was the first forum where the state of the art at the time regarding ayahuasca in its multidisciplinary aspects were revealed to the world. The symposium volume included chapters on the chemistry of ayahuasca (Deulofeu, 1967) , the ethnography of its use and preparation (Taylor, 1967) , and the human psychopharmacology of the ß-carbolines of ayahuasca (Naranjo, 1967). It is an ironic commentary on the paucity of knowledge of ayahuasca at the time that the uses of tryptamine-containing admixtures, and their activation via MAO-inhibition, did not even surface for discussion at the symposium; the prevailing assumption was that the psychoactivity of ayahuasca was due primarily if not entirely to the ß-carbolines.
In the five years following this conference, progress was made in understanding ayahausca pharmacology and chemistry. Schultes and his students Pinkley and der Marderosian published their initial findings on the DMT-containing admixture plants (Der Marderosian et al., 1968; Pinkley, 1969), fueling speculation that DMT, orally activated by ß-carbolines, was responsible for much of the activity of the brew. This notion, although plausible, would not be scientifically confirmed for another decade.
In 1972, Rivier and Lindgren (1972) published one of the first interdisciplinary papers on ayahuasca, reporting on the alkaloid profiles of ayahuasca brews and source plants collected among the Shuar people of the upper Rio Purús in Peru. At the time, their paper was one of the most thorough chemical investigations of the composition of ayahuasca brews and source plants that referenced vouchered botanical collections. It also discussed numerous admixture plants other than the Psychotria species and Diplopteris cabrerana, and for the first time provided evidence indicating that ayahuasca admixture technology was complex, and that many species were on occasion used as admixtures.
In the later 1970’s a team of Japanese phytochemists became interested in the chemistry of Banisteriopsis, and reported the isolation of a number of new ß-carbolines and the pyrrolidine alkaloids shihunine and dihydroshihunine (Hashimoto and Kawanishi, 1975, 1976; Kawanishi et al. 1982). Most of the newly reported ß-carbolines were isolated in extreme trace amounts, however, and the possibility was later raised that they might be artifacts resulting from the isolation procedures (McKenna, et al., 1984).
Late 20th Century (1980-present)
Following publication of Rivier’s and Lingren’s paper, there was little further progress on the scientific front for the remainder of the 1970’s. There was no comparable follow-up to Rivier and Lindgren’s work until McKenna et al., (1984) published the results of their chemical, ethnobotanical, and pharmacological investigations of ayahuasca and its admixtures, based on vouchered botanical specimens and samples of brews used by mestizo ayahuasqueros in Peru. This paper was significant because it represented the first time that the theory proposed to explain the oral activity of the beverage, i.e., that the active principle was DMT, rendered orally active by ß-carboline-mediated blockade of peripheral MAO, was experimentally confirmed. Assays of ayahuasca fractions in rat-liver MAO systems showed that the brews were extremely potent MAO inhibitors even when diluted many orders of magnitude compared to full strength. A further important discovery was the finding that the levels of alkaloids typically found in the mestizo ayahuasca brews exceeded the levels found in the upper Rio Purús ayahuasca by Rivier and Lindgren, sometimes by an order of magnititude or more. Based on the known human pharmacology of DMT and ß-carbolines, McKenna and co-workers showed that a typical dose (100 ml) of the mestizo ayahuasca samples contained enough DMT to constitute an active dose. The investigators suggested that the lower levels of alkaloids found in the Shuar samples of Rivier and Lindgren (1972) may have resulted from the different methods used in preparation. The Shuar typically soak the Banisteriopsis and admixture plants in cold water; they do not boil the plants, nor do they reduce the volume of the final extract, as is typically done in mestizo practice. These factors explained the discrepancies in alkaloid concentration found in the two different studies, or at least provided a plausible rationale to explain the differences.
The decade of the 1980’s also witnessed the early contributions of the anthropologist, Luis Eduardo Luna. Working among mestizo ayahuasqueros near the cities of Iquitos and Pucallpa in Peru, Luna’s work was the first to articulate the importance of the strict diet followed by apprentice shamans, as well as the specific uses of some of the more unusual admixture plants (Luna, 1984a; 1984b; 1986). He was also the first to report on the concept of “plant teachers,” (plantas que enseñan), which is how many of the admixture plants are viewed by the mestizo ayahuasqueros. In 1986, McKenna, Luna, and Towers published the first comprehensive tabulation of the species used as admixtures and the biodynamic constituents contained in them, pointing out that these relatively uninvestigated species comprise an extensive folk pharmacopoeia worthy of closer scrutiny as potential sources of new therapeutic agents (McKenna, et al., 1995).
While conducting fieldwork together in the Peruvian Amazon in 1985, McKenna and Luna first began discussing the possibility of conducting a biomedical investigation of ayahuasca. The superior health of the ayahuasqueros, even at advanced ages, seemed remarkable and something that could be amenable to scientific study. The logistical challenges of carrying out such work in Peru, however, seemed daunting, since access to storage facilities for plasma samples was limited and local concepts of witchcraft made it unlikely that ayahuasqueros would submit to medical procedures such as collection of blood and urine samples. The workers wrote a preliminary proposal for the project following their return from the field but did not pursue funding.
In 1991, however, a fresh opportunity to initiate such a study presented itself in Brasil. McKenna and Luna were among several foreigners invited to participate in a conference in São Paulo by the Medical Studies section of the União do Vegetal (UDV), a Brasilian syncretic religion that used ayahuasca in their ceremonies. The group’s use of ayahuasca in a ritual context (under the name hoasca, vegetal, or simply cha, tea), while permitted by the Brasilian regulatory authorities, was subject to provisional review. Many members of the UDV were themselves physicians, psychiatrists, or had other kinds of medical expertise, and so were most receptive to the notion of conducting a biomedical study of ayahuasca when it was proposed to them by Luna and McKenna. It turns out that this had been a part of their own unspoken agenda all along and was part of the reason for inviting the foreign investigators to the first Medical Studies Conference on Hoasca. Besides the opportunity to satisfy scientific curiousity about the human pharmacology of hoasca, the UDV had a political motive for carrying out such a study; they wanted to be able to demonstrate to the Brasilian health authorities that the long-term use of hoasca tea was safe, and did not cuase addiction or other adverse reactions. The UDV physicians were hoping to enlist foreign scientists to collaborate in the study. The question of how the study was to be funded had yet to be answered.
Following the 1991 conference, McKenna returned to the United States and drafted a proposal describing the objectives of the study that was to become known as the Hoasca Project. Initially, the objective was to submit the proposal to the National Institute on Drug Abuse, but as the proposal took shape it became clear that funding for the study would be unlikely to originate from any government agency; not only were there legal, logistical, and political problems with securing NIH funds for a study to be carried out in Brasil, it was also clear that given the nature of government drug policy, the NIH would not look favorably on a proposal that was not aimed at demonstrating serious harmful consequences resulting from the use of a psychedelic drug. Fortunately, McKenna had affiliations with Botanical Dimensions, a non-profit organization dedicated to the investigation of ethnomedically important plants, and through this venue he was able to solicit generous grants from several private individuals.
With sufficient funding assured for at least a modest pilot study, McKenna enlisted the collaborative talents of various colleagues in the medical and academic communities. Eventually, a truly international, interdisciplinary study team was formed, consisting of scientists from UCLA, the University of Miami, the University of Kuopio in Finland, the University of Rio de Janeiro, University of Campinas near São Paulo, and the Hospital Amazonico in Manuas.
The team returned to Manaus in the summer of 1993 to begin the field phase of the research, which was conducted using volunteers who were members of the Nucleo Caupari in Manaus, one of the oldest and largest UDV congregations in Brasil. The team spent five weeks in Brasil administering test doses of hoasca tea to the volunteers, collecting plasma and urine samples for later analysis, and carrying out a variety of physiological and psychological measurements.
The result was one of the most comprehensive multi-faceted investigations of the chemistry, psychological effects, and psychopharmacology of a psychedelic drug to be carried out in this century. Both the acute and the long-term effects of regular ingestion of hoasca tea were measured and characterized; extensive psychological reviewuations, and in-depth structured psychiatric interviews were conducted with all volunteers; the nature of the serotonergic response to ayahuasca was measured and characterized; and the pharmacokinetics of the major hoasca alkaloids were measured for the first time in human plasma. Since completion of the field phase of the study, the results have been published in a number of peer-reviewed papers (Grob, et al., 1996; Callaway, et al., 1994, 1996, 1998), and have recently been summarized in a comprehensive review (McKenna, et al., 1998). Among the key findings were that long-time members of the UDV commonly underwent life-changing experiences that changed their lives and behavior in positive and profound ways; that there was a persistent elevation in serotonin uptake receptors in platelets, possibly indicative of similar long-term serotonergic modulation occurring in the central nervous system that may reflect long-term adaptive changes in brain functions. The study did establish that the regular use of hoasca, at least within the ritual context and supportive social environment which exists within the UDV, is safe and without adverse long-term toxicity, and, moreover, apparently has lasting, positive influences on physical and mental health.
The Future History of Ayahuasca
The field and laboratory phases of the Hoasca Project have been completed for sometime, and now that the last and final major paper resulting from the work has been accepted for publication, the Project is in its final stages. Always conceived as a pilot study, the objectives of the hoasca study were modest and intended to indicate directions for future research. In this regard, the study was a remarkable success; like all good science, the study raised more questions than it answered, and suggested several promising directions for future research. Now that ayahuasca has been clearly shown to be safe, non-toxic, and therapeutically useful as medicine, it is to be hoped that future researchers will devote sufficient interest, as well as funds, to the exploration of its healing potential.
Some Speculative Issues
With the completion of the Hoasca Project, there now exits a solid foundation of basic data to serve as the underpinning of future scientific investigations as their focus moves from the field to the laboratory and the clinic. But outside the perimeter of the cold light of reason cast by scientific scrutiny, there remain a number of issues surrounding ayahuasca that are unlikely be resolved by science alone, at least not by scientific methods as they are now understood. Ayahuasca is a symbiotic ally of the human species; its association with our species can be traced at least as far back as New World prehistory; the lessons we have acquired from it, in the course of millenia of coevolution, may have profound implications for what it is to be human, and to be an intelligent, questioning species within the biospheric community of species. Although we have no certain answers, the question of the nature and meaning of the relationship between humanity and this visionary vine, and by extension with the entire universe of plant teachers, persistently troubles us. Why should plants contain alkaloids that are close analogs of our own neurotransmitters, and that enable them to “talk” to us? What “message” are they trying to convey, if any? Was it purely happenstance, purely accident, that led some early, experiment-minded shaman to combine the ayahuasca vine and the chacruna leaf, to make the tea that raised the curtain on the Invisible Landscape for the first time? It seems unlikely (neither of the key ingredients are particulary inviting as food), and yet what else could it have been? The ayahuasqueros themselves will simply tell you that “the vine calls.” Others, trying to be more sophisticated and “rational” but proffering no more satisfying explanation, will talk about plant alkaloids as interspecies pheromonal messengers and the carriers of sensoritropic cues that enabled early humans to select and utilize the biodynamic plants in their environment. Still others, such as the McKenna brothers in their early work, and a more recent reformulation of a similar theory by anthropologist Jeremy Narby (McKenna & McKenna, 1975; Narby, 1998) argue that by some as yet obscure mechanism, the visionary experiences afforded by plants such as ayahuasca give us an insight, an intuitive understanding, of the molecular bedrock of biological being; and that this intuitive knowledge, only now being revealed to the scientific worldview by the crude methods of molecular biology, has always been available as direct experience to shamans and seers with the courage to forge symbiotic bonds with our mute but infinitely older and wiser plant allies.
Such notions are surely speculative and are certainly not science; but to an observer of the contemporary world, who has been involved both scientifically and personally with ayahuasca for many years now, I find it very interesting that such “wild” speculations keep reasserting themselves, no matter how much we try to “desacralize” the tea and render it down to a matter of chemistry and botany, receptor sites and pharmacology. All of those things are important, certainly; but none of them will ever “explain” the undeniable and profound mystery that is ayahuasca.
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 5:13:32 AM | | In direct answer to first post, just because something good comes out of drugs does not make drugs themselves good. They do not help your health of lifestyle in the long term when used too regularly, even the mildest drug has side effects. | |
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DMT
| Joined: 12/3/2004 Msg: 32 | |
| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 6:13:56 AM | are you talking from personal experience Bells? I just seems a bit vague to say that "drugs are bad" or harmful. Most people who have used substances would argue that they go out of their way to buy and set aside time for them becuase they have a positive impact on their lives.
Having worked psycotherapeutically with quite a broad range of people...people who have used substances, people who haven't, people troubled by realtionships, people avoidant of life, people addicted to food control issues, people addicted to family obligations, people enchanted by religion, etc etc... my understanding is that some people actually do themselves harm by NOT taking substances. It is often the people who have experiemented with substances who are the ones more likely to recognise the need for adaptabilty and facing up to the realities of life. Contrary to the opinions of daily mail columnists vision inducing substances do not help people escape from reality, they help people encounter it in all it's astonishing, capricious and ineffable beauty.
People who are afraid of experiementing with substances are often afraid to experiment with life generally. They are likely to be the one's who have very limited enjoyment of life and do not take on personal adventures. They 'live' in a partially lit world... in constant fear of the excitment of losing control, and using their undeveloped creativity to moralise about those who have a richer experience of life. People are often afraid of their own potential, and the careful use of entheogens can show people their potential and the potential of others. and, the longer people leave it before taking steps to unearth their own power the harder it is and their prejudice against extraordinary experiences hardens.
Anyway, where is the magical message 13 Bells? | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 7:20:27 AM | I have experimented in the past but not to a large extent, and have worked with people whos lives have been ruined by addiction to various drugs. I think that the choice to take drugs is up to the individual as long as they are educated enough to make that decision. Drugs can provide a euphoric feeling and be beneficial in some senses to those with problems in the short term, but their long term side effects are far worse than any benefits if used in excess. Whilst in some ways drug laws and societys attitude should move along, it shouldnt be done to the point of losing respect or even fear for the severe affect that they can have on people that use them.
I disagree that people who choose not to experiment do so out of fear, some may do, but some will choose not simply because they feel no need to enhace their life in anyway through artificial and harmful ways, that does not mean they are afraid to experiment with life in general, i personal think that saying no to using a drug because it is not for you is a much harder thing to do in this age than going along with the crowd. People who take drugs are no more enlightened than someone who doesnt because it is artificial and fake, drugs do not increase your potential as a human being or in a majority of careers. Just because some people have written some amazing songs or painted some amazing paintings does not mean that acid, cocaine, heroin etc should ever be accepted as a legal part of our society, because it cannot be forgotten that these can also cause violent tendencies, rapid brain cell death, psychotic episodes later in life, increased risk of heart failure, damage to kidneys, liver and stomach etc. | |
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DMT
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 9:38:08 AM | you need to be more specific and look at each substance individually, rather than making blanket statements. Not all drugs are just superficial eurphorics, like coke is. They have dimensions that you can't really understand until you have experienced them.
As for being artificial - you could also argue that food is artificial as it is something from outside of you that you are putting into yourself, or waking yourself up with an alarm clock somehow invalidates what you might achieve that day, or that Australia is somehow synthetic if you need a aeroplane to get there. All substances come from nature and we have a symbiotic relationship with the plants etc that give us these interesting compounds. Many of the substances I have mentioned can lead to encounters with a larger spiritual reality that exists independently of substanes. The drugs are really just like an aeroplane or springboard - they don't create the destination.
Have you read the previous post about the Houasca project? If so it is odd that you would continue to make indistinct statements about physical harm cause by medicines.
There are side effects to almost all medicines, but the side effect of entheogens are often overstated for moralistic and political reasons. There is no evidence of mushrooms, lsd, mescaline, salvia divinorum, ayahuasca, 2cb, dmt, yopo, etc etc causing any damage to the body or mind. The narratives of people who have used these things indicates that if used with understanding then people can be improverd mentally and emotionally by their experience - and if people's emotional and mental health improves their physical health improves or is promoted.
There was a great outcry against the use of MDMA (ecstasy) by people who had not used the substance. Scientists who should have known better, were used by governments and lobbyists to argue (without evidence) that it would cause death, parkinsons disease and incurable brain damage. This has proved wrong. People are much much more likely to be damaged by sausages, bacon, chocolate, unhapppy relationships or frozen sh*t falling from aeroplanes, than they are by sensible doses of MDMA.
The most dangerous problems of such substances is for those who seek to control people and who are themselves caught up in some moralistic discourses. Entheogens are only dangerous becuse they can set you free, and if there is one thing people fear more than their own freedom it is other people being more free than they are. | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 1:11:07 PM | Drugs are not bad for a majority of people and most people take them and do not have any problems it is perhaps 5-10% of people who have addictive personalites that have the probs with drugs. Plus the press demonise them that makes them more attractive to young people.
Nathan | |
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| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 2:12:10 PM | | DMT, you've got it right too, she is agreeing with you, I am kinda put off by the way you dismiss others opinions to validate your own, it only works until someone agrees with you. This is a complicated issue and not to be broken down into pigeonholes. My personal preference would be to have absolutely no drugs available to anyone (or guns!) and see what sort of society we develop from there. I know about drugs, more than anyone should have to and I don't have any real answers but I recognize the need for a strategy or solution. FB | |
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| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 2:22:48 PM | | ok... so while I'm not going to read the epic encyclopedia style posts above, I am curious what kind of drugs we're talkin bout here. Are these the standard cocain, heroine, crack lynchings or is this one that's branching out into the pot, peyote, mushroom column as well?... | |
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DMT
| Joined: 12/3/2004 Msg: 38 | |
| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 2:30:59 PM | Firebug,
I didn't mean to sound argumentative with Bell, I was in a hurry and rushed that post off while preparing food. The main point I was trying to make is that it is not useful to categorise substances together. It is neccessary to understand each substance individually, and as has been said it is really important to see beyond the media and political rhetoric. I'm sure Bells wasn't offended
Noodler, I have refered mainly to enthegens - things like peyote, mushrooms, mescaline, dmt, ayahuasca, iboga, salvia divinorum and 2cb etc. There substances can't be realisitically classified with heroin and crack etc, because they are non-addictive and they can offer insight into spirituality and healing. | |
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| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 3:10:40 PM | In my terminoligy... it's the natural stuff right?... or no...
should marijuana be in that group?... | |
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| If drugs are so bad then why? Posted: 1/5/2005 3:20:12 PM | I think that any dependancy on any drug is not good for the person development. Being truly creative just requires a supportive environment for the act to occur. That and a very organized room, no furniture what so ever. as it gets in the way of ones self because less is more! Anyone that forces drugs on you is a totalitarian or a pawn of the conspricy. | |
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| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 3:23:41 PM | | sorry, I'm just being an a** lately, I'm not sure why I'm being so cynical lately though? Ignore me. FB | |
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DMT
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| i like your view better Posted: 1/5/2005 4:32:38 PM | | I actually haven't noticed you being an a_rse Firebug, you seem to be just speaking your mind. I don't know what you said to who but let's hope you don't get kicked out of this place. | |
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DMT
| Joined: 12/3/2004 Msg: 43 | |
| magical substances Posted: 1/5/2005 4:40:54 PM |
In my terminoligy... it's the natural stuff right?... or no... should marijuana be in that group?...
Noodler,
you could say that marijuana should be there but I didn't mention it for a reason, whereas I did refer to some things that are chemical deriviatives. The reason I didn't mention MJ is that I was refering to substances that one can use in short bursts for glimses into other worlds. The problem with MJ is that many people use it all the time, it has been genetically modified and produces profound changes in consciouness that become everyday 'reality' for many users. This might be good for many people but it can also get people into difficulties. Very often people lose insight while thinking that they are gaining it. The advantages of short acting vision-inducing substances, is that they wear off more quickly and people don't tend to want to use them on a daily basis, so their minds have the chance to experience the other culturally constructed realities that surround them and others. I'm not dismissing cannabis use as many people find it useful, I just was keen to draw attention to important substances that are sometimes either neglected in discussions or erroneously categorised together with things that are entirely different.
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| magical substances Posted: 1/5/2005 10:12:48 PM | DRUGS ARE GOOD. well some of them not all. I like them i use them i intend to for a while.. | |
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| magical substances Posted: 1/5/2005 10:20:00 PM | | god made pot, man made beer....... which one is worse??? | |
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| magical substances Posted: 1/5/2005 10:25:04 PM | Yeah, but going by that logic ..... God made man..... what really is worse? MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...............
Voltron lives!
the giggleparts | |
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| magical substances Posted: 1/5/2005 10:30:41 PM | When someone says man or mankind in that way, it is referring to the human race in total....
Man and woMAN
womb and man = woman | |
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| magical substances Posted: 1/6/2005 2:41:27 AM | Dmt, no i wasnt offended it at all!!
My post was completely generalised, so i apologise! But i was replying more to the title and original post, which were also completely generalised, perhaps you should change your title to - if mushrooms, lsd, mescaline, salvia divinorum, ayahuasca, 2cb, dmt, yopo, etc etc are so bad then why? rather than the blanket term drugs?! ;-)
Drugs do alter the destination that you get to, your brain works in a completley different way when you've been taking drug of any kind including alcohol, and they may start naturally but by the time they get to a majority of the people that are taking them, they have been altered from their original natural state. I agree that taking drugs for some people can be an amazing experience, especially the ones that you have mentioned that are not physically addictive, my point is merely that it is not that way for all people and whilst in my opinion there is too much criticsm of drugs such as marijuana, mushrooms etc society has to be very careful of where it draws the line on what is and isnt harmful. As for ecstasy having known three people to have died from taking it i am slightly biased on that subject. The main difference between sausages/ bacon and illegal drugs is if you get damaged by a random sausage or piece of bacon then someone is held responsible. If you are killed through an adverse affect to an illegal drug, who is held responsible? Since we are not making indistinct statements, could you please recommend what you think a sensible dose of MDMA is, obviously taking into account, the body weight, tolerance levels, and general physical health and mental state of the user. You are also not guaranteeing that a person will have a good trip, some people arent left feeling free and enlightened, they are left feeling depressed and scared, there are rehabilitation centres with people who are still suffering the effects of bad trips!
You can set yourself free in a variety of different ways, please don't tell me that you are so narrowminded that you believe that taking drugs is the only way to set yourself free, because that makes you no better than someone telling me im going to go to hell if i dont go to confession ( and i am not digging at people with religious beliefs here, i respect your opinions, i just dont quite agree with them all!). Meditation etc can also provide you with enlightenment and 'set you free' without any of the risks.
The reason entheogens and drugs in general are dangerous is because they are not properly controlled, it almost impossible to predict someones reaction and there has been no real investigations into the long term side effect of taking these on a regular basis, since a lot of drugs have a cumulative affect, i dont believe that at this time people can make a truly informed decision.If the drugs you have specified were made legal they would be more expensive and have more limitations put on them not to mention government tax, which would mean people still went to the black market to buy possibly artificial or contaminated versions.
( I apologise for any spelling errors, grammatical errors or missed words, i've actually been given work to do today! So typing has had to be fast but unfortunately my mind works faster than my fingers!) | |
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