chinua
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Joined: 9/30/2005
Msg: 26 | |
| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 9:54:51 AM | | If Lewis and Tolkien weren't christians......would their books have been published? Or would they have been called satanists? | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 4:01:24 PM | RD - It's been a very long time, as in years and years ago, but I did borrow True Spirituality from a friend. I have a few of Lewis' books, but not as many as I'd like. I think Mere Christianity is a must read for every Christian. Ah...so many books, so little time. 
Chinua - I think Tolkein's and Lewis' books would have been published regardless of whether they were Christians. There's always a market for engaging, well-written books and neither one of them set out to write Christian fiction...they both just wanted to write good fiction. | |
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chinua
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Joined: 9/30/2005
Msg: 28 | |
| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 5:28:59 PM | | do you know the reaction to Star Trek when it first came out? Some people thought Spock represented satan.I know a christian who wouldn't have gone to see Harry Potter if the author hadn't said she was a christian....it's just something to think about. I don't think of any of these books as being from any religion......they just seem to be very medieval....... | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 7:52:10 PM | | Chinua - Yes, I'm familiar with the reactions to Star Trek and the Harry Potter books. Sometimes people can be afraid of things that are different and that they don't understand, and their fear can cause them to limit themselves. Tolkein's books were epic. Lewis' Narnia books, put together, are epic as well. And they're books, I think, that speak to something inside of us...something that hungers for more than the mundane here-and-now that we live in, and I think we can identify with the characters. That's probably why the Harry Potter books are so powerful. Harry Potter thought he was just an ordinary kid but he turns out to be someone special. I think that's something we all want...to be special. Kids in particular want that...they want to be unique and special, and sometimes they don't feel like they are. So they vicariously become that when they read those books, and they vicariously get to be the hero whose specialness is recognized by people around him. So, through these books...The Chronicles of Narnia, the Lord of the Rings Trilogy, and even the Harry Potter books...kids get to be part of a story that's bigger than themselves, where they have an important part to play, and where good triumphs over evil. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 8:29:58 PM | Lewis and Tolkien's books were published because they were good reading, not because they were Christians. In fact, The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings was not an overnight success. I think the Hobbit was published in 1939 and the LOR in the 50s. It was only when American college students discovered them in the mid-60s did the phenomenon begin.
Both Lewis and Tolkien were part of a group of scholars and authors that included Charles Williams and Dorthy Sayers, among others. Lewis and Tolkien were well known experts on Medieval and Renaissance literature. I think Lewis' book on the topic is still being used in college courses. | |
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chinua
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Joined: 9/30/2005
Msg: 31 | |
| Narnia
Posted: 12/16/2005 9:10:25 PM | | i agree with both of you; in those books.....no matter how bad things get; there is always hope.......if it seems like there is no hope.....you don't give up. I love the medieval/out of this world themes......seems familiar! | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/17/2005 1:59:16 AM | First, I loved the books and recently re-read them so that I could discuss them with some of the neighbourhood kids who were reading them in school.
Second, I thought the producers did an excellent job moving the story from book to film. It was fantastic. I loved the voice for Aslan. One (minor) complaint I have is that the witches sled was not nearly as ornate as I envisioned it to be. Nor was the addictive quality of the White Witch's food and drink made clear. But when the acting is so good and the CGI is so seamless and the story so well told, I can easily forgive!
Finally, the modern publishers are numbering the books incorrectly. I understand they are trying to publish according to the sequence of events in the story. However, I still believe the series should be read in the sequence as originally published. The order in which things are revealed to you makes more sense. Simply put, "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe" MUST be the first book.
The original sequence is:
1 - The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe (incorrectly labeled #2)
2 - Prince Caspian (incorrectly labeled #4)
3 - Voyage of the Dawn Trader (incorrectly labeled #5)
4 - The Silver Chair (incorrectly labeled #6)
5 - The Horse and His Boy (incorrectly labeled #3)
6 - The Magician's Nephew (incorrectly labeled #1)
7 - The Last Battle (ok, they got ONE right) | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/18/2005 12:53:38 PM | Well, I saw the movie, and I think it captured the book very well. Since there has been some mention in this thread of the friendship between Tolkien and Lewis, I will say that I didn't find it quite the homage that LOTR was, but it was very well done none the less. I loved these books so much as a kid that I've decided to reread them, and I'm loving them again. I just started "The Voyage of The Dawn Treader" and I think the opening line has to be one of my favorites in all of children's literature. This is the first line of the book-
There was a boy called Eustace Clarence Scrubb, and he almost deserved it.
Isn't that the greatest opening line? I love it. | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/18/2005 9:31:29 PM | | I saw the movie tonight and enjoyed it very much. Aslan's voice (Liam Neeson) was different than my imagination had it, but regal enough. I would like to say that if anyone is going to this expecting a Lord of the Rings type of film they will be disappointed. LOR was written for adults while the Narnia books were wrote for children though adults love them too. This is geared towards children. I found it a visually stunning film, with some weird creatures that outdid some of LOR. If you go see the film do NOT jump up and leave when the credits begin to roll. There is a neat little scene that plays in the middle of the credits. Nice touch I think. | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/18/2005 10:45:09 PM | ^^^
Yeah I've gotten in the habit of sitting in the theatre until the end of the credits because sometimes they like to sneak things in like that.
It was a neat little scene. I liked it too. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 11:15:30 AM | I saw the Narnia movie on Sunday 12/11/2005.
I give it 2 thumbs up (too bad humans only have 2 thumbs).
Here is a thought, I give it 8 fingers up, more than 2 thumbs.
Jennifer | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/19/2005 11:18:37 AM | I thought the Magicians Nephew was before the Lion one. I mean, the nephew and female friend (been nearly 20 yrs since I read the series) found Narnia after rescueing the Witch with the aid of magic rings.
The original sequence is:
1 - The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe (incorrectly labeled #2)
2 - Prince Caspian (incorrectly labeled #4)
3 - Voyage of the Dawn Trader (incorrectly labeled #5)
4 - The Silver Chair (incorrectly labeled #6)
5 - The Horse and His Boy (incorrectly labeled #3)
6 - The Magician's Nephew (incorrectly labeled #1)
7 - The Last Battle (ok, they got ONE right) | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 11:21:46 AM | This does go along with the thread, tho a little off center. When did Dungeons & Dragons come out? The reason I mentions this is due to the correlation of really good books that get read also end up being the backdrops for RPG.
Lewis and Tolkien's books were published because they were good reading, not because they were Christians. In fact, The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings was not an overnight success. I think the Hobbit was published in 1939 and the LOR in the 50s. It was only when American college students discovered them in the mid-60s did the phenomenon begin. | |
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chinua
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Joined: 9/30/2005
Msg: 39 | |
| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 11:49:36 AM | | Queen....someone already said that............. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 7:49:27 PM | I found time today to watch the film in a theater filled with four grade-school classes. Though some might feel the children would be noisy and distracting, I found the experience more magical as they clapped and cheered the heroes on.
George MacDonald also has some excellent fantasy books to his credit.
CS Lewis considered him to be a major influence in his writing. | |
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| Narnia - Publisher messed up the order
Posted: 12/19/2005 8:39:16 PM | There was a boy called Eustace Clarence Scrubb, and he almost deserved it.
Isn't that the greatest opening line? I love it.
That is a great opening line. And from what I remember of the book, he certainly got it whether he totally deserved it or not! Lions, and dragons, and ships...oh my!! LOL | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 9:04:29 PM |
This does go along with the thread, tho a little off center. When did Dungeons & Dragons come out? The reason I mentions this is due to the correlation of really good books that get read also end up being the backdrops for RPG.
The original Dungeons & Dragons, designed by Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson, was first published in January 1974 by Gygax's company, Tactical Studies Rules (TSR).
D&D was definitely inspired by Tolkien. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 9:07:17 PM | Absolutely! It's funny, I think I like the Narnia series least out of Lewis' works. That is to say, I LOVE them, and think they're brilliant, but found the Screwtape Letters, The Great Divorce and his 'That Hideous Strength' series more engaging as an adult.
An interesting note for folks who like Lewis and Tolkien:
Lewis and Tolkien were part of a writer's group together in Oxford called the Inklings. They would read and discuss their works in progress. (I've been to the pub in Oxford where they would meet, and wish I could have been a fly on the wall for any of their meetings).
It's interesting to see how their works mirror each other. To give one example: Look at the role of the trees in the battle in "Prince Caspian", and the role of the Ents at the battle of Helm's Deep
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/19/2005 10:04:10 PM | I have heard that Lewis would have preferred "the Magicians Nephew" to be numbered #1 in the series, so this numbering must go back a long ways.
Kudos Harry for mentioning George MacDonald. Fantasy lovers would like his books "Phantastes" and "Lilith". Yes, THAT Lilith. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/20/2005 9:50:22 AM | "It's interesting to see how their works mirror each other. To give one example: Look at the role of the trees in the battle in "Prince Caspian", and the role of the Ents at the battle of Helm's Deep"
It's funny, but I am rereading the series, and I noticed exactly that correlation. I was thinking as I was reading it "this is Helm's Deep." It is pretty obvious that they exchanged ideas.
The alternate numbering is simply chronological in relation to the story as opposed to chronological in relation to the publishing dates. It really doesn't matter much which order you read them in, as they are fairly independent stories. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/20/2005 11:05:14 PM | | Read a review today where it was stated that the first part of the film drags and that when they entered Narnia it did not "feel magic". The review went on to state that the film really moved once the Battle was being set. The reviewer ended by noting that the Christian symbolism was there for those who wanted it but for others they could enjoy the film without feeling like Jesus was being preached to them. I think it was a pretty fair assessment of the film, though I enjoyed even the slower first half. I do agree that entering into Narnia was lacking in "magic" somewhat, but I think these things are hard to accomplish on film. Once you started seeing the inhabitants of Narnia, there was no mistake that you were in a different world. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/21/2005 3:36:02 PM | Most of the time I don't agree with reviewers. I often wonder how much of what they say in their review is influenced by political correctness or the expectations of the popular culture. Besides, they get paid to dissect the movies they review. I didn't think the beginning was really slow, I think it had a good pace and laid the proper foundation of letting us see the relationships between the children and also gave us an opportunity to see the children's different personalities. Plus, if I remember the book, the entrance into Narnia was like a transition from being inside to being outside in the snow...I thought it was well done. Of course, I could be misremembering.  | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/21/2005 3:40:35 PM | ^^^
That strikes me as a review by someone who was expecting an action/adventure movie.
Narnia is not so much about the action, but more the setting and the characters. Action and adventure play a role, but they are not the focus and I personally prefer it that way.
As for the wardrobe not feeling "magic" enough, well part of the point was that the change, while surprising, was not sudden or tingly. I think it was well done for what it was trying to do. I just think the goals of the creators did not mesh up with the desires of this particular critic.
I still say it is the must see movie of the year, unless you've seen Firefly in which case that would be Serenity. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/21/2005 8:57:59 PM | My only real complaint is that they needed more screen time for Aslan. I also would have liked to have seen Him let out a roar before pouncing on the witch.
I did not care for Serenity, but the person I went with loved it. I found it a bit confusing. Don't know if that had to do with not being familiar with the tv series or not.
I have been averaging about 1 or 2 films a year at the theatres for the past 5 years or so. This year I have seen 3. Narnia, Serenity and Revenge of the Sith. King Kong is next on my list. | |
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| Narnia
Posted: 12/21/2005 9:04:24 PM | I average about one movie every two years. This year it was two, Serenity and Narnia. Last year I went to the Incredibles. I tells ya holywood is gradually dragging me back.
As for Serenity being confusing, yeah if you havn't watched Firefly it would be hard to get into. It is unfortunate that you watched Serenity first as it is a bit like reading the last chapter in a book before the rest of it. All the same I do highly reccomend watching Firefly at some point, great series.
Dogamnit, I think I just threadjacked my own thread.... soooo Narnia Woooo! | |
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