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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 76 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/9/2006 7:36:30 AM | Sigh away, Late.
Yup, as there are only so many ways to explain to a blind man who won't understand that the sky is blue, and why.
My argument makes perfect sense and is in perfect keeping with the point of the original post.
As the OP basically starts by perpetuating a hoax (Mozart Effect), then compares the creation of an art form to the words of clergy preaching to their faithful, then takes a specific example of a consumer product and makes a generalized statement about people not related to the specific example, ....
You are right, the argument is simpatico with the OP as both share the resemblance of a particular material that falls from the back end of a steer, ...the only problem is, this kind of sense is usually preceded by the prefix, "non".
Don't you think it would be more impressive, less fallacious and more to the point if a person who disagreed actually paid attention to the original post and addressed the actual argument I'm making instead of merely trying to impress us all with his apparently vast knowledge of logic and Latin?
First you accuse another poster of a "cheap shot" because her analogy, which made sense, ...shot your premise full of holes, this of course after missing the point of a previous analogy, and stating, "Late, I'm not sure how to adapt your metaphor to my point so I won't try." ...then you proceed to build a strawman argument with the analogy because it isn't otherwise inclusive of your flawed reasoning.
Trying to impress? .....no need for your thinnly veiled personal attacks (^^^), if you stick to the topic by substanciating it with reasoned discourse, WHICH was the point in laying your own flawed logic on your lap. Thousands of years ago, specific bullshit was described and cataloged, what we are left with is a lexicon of the bullshit in the form of "logical fallacies". If you continually turn to fallacies in trying to further your views, expect to be called on it, and as my father used to say, "It's unwise to attack others for having a better understanding of something, it's not THEIR fault.
Oh, and try to remember another fact, lyrics AREN'T music, in the context of a video, they are it's libretto ...most musicians probably don't write lyrics.
lyric
n 1: the text of a popular song or musical-comedy number; "his compositions always started with the lyrics"; "he wrote both words and music"; "the song uses colloquial language" [syn: words, language] 2: a short poem of songlike quality [syn: lyric poem] v : write lyrics for (a song)
Try this analogy of your premise.
Meth labs make a drug that destroys lives, chemists should take partial blame for this as they have a moral responsibility not to destroy lives.
This would make sense too, except for the fact that any chemist, even one who's lips moved when they read, would see the flaw; the guys in the meth labs AREN'T real chemists.
If the target was "people who run meth labs", ......it would work, as would avoiding the same fallacy and addressing your premise to "purveyors of Gangsta' Rap", as opposed to ignoring your own specific example and insulting musicians....... and in so doing, perpetuating a fallacy?
It would still be a matter of degree.
LOVE and HARD WORK makes musicians
Despite any delusions to the contrary....
Gifts?
A poem -
"Tainted Praise"
For those who toss words around like "talent" and "gifted"
The praise you send is a slight, as it's aimed at a vacant paradise
With this choice of words you unknowingly short-change the artist and her work
Ending up only flattering yourself for answering your inspired gratitude's call
Understand this, she who can take sorrow, pain and betrayal from strife's forge
And hammer it upon an anvil with her bare hands, beating it into truth and beauty
Please, I implore you, give the word-smith her due, by staying your false gratitude
Rather, take from her these priceless pieces carved from the core of her being
And place them in your soul and cherish this sharing of a burdon of knowing
That the "gift' of "talent" is no gift bestowed to her freely by an invisble creator
But an earned skill of being able to reach into one's own darkest fears and torment
Borrowing from them for only a moments release, to shape into "gifts"
Bestowed upon you by a flesh and blood creator who gives them away freely
Asking nothing in return save a quiet plea to become a better you in the process
Thank her sincerely by allowing that this gift you recieved, came from her heart
"All the guy said was that musicians have God given gifts."
Of course, if you subscribe to the idea that whatever you want to call the dreck that Eminem and Snoop Dog do (pun intended), comes from God? ...put your "blame" where it belongs. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/9/2006 9:50:39 AM | Late my brother!
What an outstanding poem! Thank you, thank you and THANK YOU | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/10/2006 11:46:29 PM | Love and hard work makes a professional musician. A God's gift or talent is the bases on which that love and work is built and is needed to produce a musician rather then a technician. All three are important, but without the love and hard work, talent is worthless.
As to the C Major scale, that is a rather recent invention and it was invented by man after discarding the modes of the church, not by God. On the other hand, it seems that there is a mathematical relationship to the frequency of C and the color Red. Also, it may be interesting to look into the human condition of synesthesia such as was present in the great composer Scriabin and painter Kandinsky as well as others. It is a rare condition of the interconnection of the senses. When you see a color you actually hear a sound or the other way around. Kondinsky painted music and Scriabin composed colors litteraly. And yes, ...there was music he wrote where he did write down what the colors were. It is a subject that is interesting in itself, but it points to the hidden power of the music. You could say that man can come closest to hearing God through music, whatever God means to you. Music transcends the limitations of the senses yet it unites them at its highest power, but very few will ever be aware of it and that is what makes it so effective as manipulation of the masses. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 12:29:55 AM | Listen, if you don't believe in God, fine, who cares? This isn't a religion thread -- so all of you who seem to get so disturbed if you even hear the word "God", please chill out. No need to come up with poems, elaborate arguments and bitter complaints because someone who does believe in God dared to use the simple phrase "God given talents".
The point is that your talent came from somewhere. If you have it, you were born with it and then, in the case of great artists, added all the hard work and dedication necessary to develop it to its fullest potential. Part of your responsibility as a human being and an artist is to use the talent that you were born with and have developed to a high degree responsibly and well, for creative and positive purposes as opposed to destructively and negatively.
Flamesoflove said it very well.
Love and hard work makes a professional musician. A God's gift or talent is the bases on which that love and work is built and is needed to produce a musician rather then a technician. All three are important, but without the love and hard work, talent is worthless....
You could say that man can come closest to hearing God through music, WHATEVER GOD MEANS TO YOU (caps mine). Music transcends the limitations of the senses yet it unites them at its highest power, but very few will ever be aware of it and that is what makes it so effective as manipulation of the masses. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 12:53:26 AM | | Thank you Artandsoul. I enjoy reading your thoughts as well. | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 82 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 12:58:16 AM | Who wrote the poem...
I did.
Listen, if you don't believe in God, fine, who cares?
If you do believe in God, fine who cares? Why bring it into the thread in the first place.
No need to come up with poems, elaborate arguments and bitter complaints because someone who does believe in God dared to use the simple phrase "God given talents".
No need to be the arbiter of "need" either.
No need to come up with poems?
That's a rather low opinion of what poets do isn't it, or do you only pay attention to those who express themselves via prose if it involves rape and murder, re: the OP?
If you have it, you were born with it
Those who disagree may be offended by this, it's valid for them to express this too.
Part of your responsibility as a human being and an artist is to use the talent that you were born with and have developed to a high degree responsibly and well, for creative and positive purposes as opposed to destructively and negatively.
As many reject the premise of "born with", that part is moot, the rest is false logic.
The proof of your conclusion is the premise = dishonest and false logic
destructively and negatively.
Not what "Artists" do.
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 3:07:48 AM |
If you have it, you were born with it
Those who disagree may be offended by this, it's valid for them to express this too.
Sure it is, Late. It's just as true that those who disagree with their disagreement as expressed in this line, "BITEME you friggin morons that think god makes musicians", may be offended by that and it's valid for us to express this too -- as I did.
re "God-given" talents:
Whether you believe that God gave talents to you or not, are you seriously going to deny that some people are born with greater natural talents in the area of music than others? What do you think of musical "child prodigies"? Does the fact that these kids show greater skill and artistry at the age of five than others who have studied and practised for most of their considerably longer lives will ever show not indicate that perhaps they had more to work with from the time they were born? What exactly is your point here?
"... destructively and negatively."
Not what "Artists" do.
Meaning what? That art has no value that can be described as "destructive" or "negative"? Again, what is your point? What DO "artists" do? Would it be fair to point out that most of your "arguments" consist of laconic one liners that presumably are meant to be profound and infallibly logical, of course, but which, in fact, say very little?
Try this analogy of your premise.
Meth labs make a drug that destroys lives, chemists should take partial blame for this as they have a moral responsibility not to destroy lives.
This would make sense too, except for the fact that any chemist, even one who's lips moved when they read, would see the flaw; the guys in the meth labs AREN'T real chemists.
I tried it, Late, and found it wanting and pointless. So -- who are "real artists"? Are we arguing over semantics here? Are you saying that "real artists" wouldn't write songs that glorify rape and murder? If so, I would agree with you -- as I already have in another post that you conveniently ignored. Not all musicians, according to that definition, are "real artists" then. Be that as it may, it in no way refutes the point made in the original post to which you keep referring:
"I believe that songwriters and musicians have far greater power than they realize -- or perhaps than some would care to acknowledge -- and should therefore take some thought as to how they use that power. Songs that glorify rape and murder, for instance, are a blatant example of musicians misusing their gifts for the sake of the almighty dollar or the fame that such a misuse of their talents may bring them in this world that these days seemingly can't get enough of the worst excesses of human behaviour."
Oh, and try to remember another fact, lyrics AREN'T music, in the context of a video, they are it's libretto ...most musicians probably don't write lyrics.
Another irrelevance in the context of the original post. Songwriters ARE often musicians that also write lyrics. Also, the musicians who collaborate by providing the music for those songs to lyricists who glamorize rape and murder are collaborators in this misuse of the gift of songwriting and hence should be similarly called to account.
Of course, if you subscribe to the idea that whatever you want to call the dreck that Eminem and Snoop Dog do (pun intended), comes from God? ...put your "blame" where it belongs.
Now, speaking of cheap shots and straw man arguments, my ever so clever friend, is this not a prime example? Despite the fact that my entire post was an argument against "the dreck that Eminem and Snoop Dog do", now somehow you have me arguing that it "comes from God"? Nice try ... so much for arguing with logic and integrity!
"Late, I'm not sure how to adapt your metaphor to my point so I won't try."
If this is what launched us off on this battle, I'll take some responsibility. I see how you could have taken offence from it though none was intended. What I meant was: I wanted to make a counter point and keep using the same metaphor but I wasn't sure how to do it. It was not meant to ridicule your metaphor at all. I can see though that, to get this across, my wording could have been better. If it was offensive to you, I apologize. I, on the other hand, have taken offence to posts such as this: " ^^^^^^^ syllogism. Another fallacy." No real refutation of my argument, just a patronizing dismissal. | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 85 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 5:36:26 AM | "BITEME you friggin morons that think god makes musicians", may be offended by that and it's valid for us to express this too -- as I did.
Sure, but you also made your statement inclusive of anybody who disagreed with you, BTW, if my poem offended you, .....(shrug). Further, you were the one who said: "No need to come up with......"
That was you.
are you seriously going to deny that some people are born with greater natural talents in the area of music than others?
Show me a newborn carrying a tune and I'll grant you this.
Creativity is innate to all humans, it's one of the attributes of our evolution as a species, the choice to exercise it is up to the individual and largely dependant on his environment. Mozart (musician) played at a very young age, was he born this way, or could the fact that his father was a concert-master have had anything to do with it?
More recently, the late-great Lenny Breau (musician), arguably the greatest guitar player who ever lived was said to have sung harmony with his mother and father at the age of two, born with this? Or could the fact that mom and dad were the leaders of a touring music show (where Lenny grew up) have anything to do with it?
Music is a part of who we are, wind (reed)instruments have been found as far back in our history as 40,000 years ago in caves with great acoustics, and stalactites with stick marks on them, with sticks found under them. Long before the words "God", "Allah", "Zeus", et al, were uttered by a human voice.
It's innate, not a gift.
Like the great Dizzy Gillespie (a "real" musician) said:
"All children are born artists, some folks just grow out of it."
"I believe that songwriters and musicians have far greater power than they realize -- or perhaps than some would care to acknowledge -- and should therefore take some thought as to how they use that power. Songs that glorify rape and murder, for instance, are a blatant example of musicians misusing their gifts for the sake of the almighty dollar or the fame that such a misuse of their talents may bring them in this world that these days seemingly can't get enough of the worst excesses of human behaviour."
Already covered this, you still haven't shown me a "real" musician who glorifies rape and murder, we've already covered "gifts". As for "the power", the bit about the "Mozart Effect"? Been there, read it .....saw it debunked many times, you?
Also, the musicians who collaborate by providing the music for those songs to lyricists who glamorize rape and murder are collaborators in this misuse of the gift of songwriting and hence should be similarly called to account.
You may continue to insist that people who digitally sample other peoples work and cut and paste it on a computer are musicians, I'll still leave this one on the ground behind the cow.
Not all musicians, according to that definition, are "real artists" then.
No wonder you found it pointless, again you didn't "get it". The "chemist" in the analogy is the "musician"
Musician
n 1: someone who plays a musical instrument (as a profession) [syn: instrumentalist, player] 2: artist who composes or conducts music as a profession
Source: WordNet ® 2.0, © 2003 Princeton University
Can you cite a representative enough sample of those who fit the definition ^^^^ who advocate rape, murder, etc.
Not:
Lyricist
n : a person who writes the words for songs
Source: WordNet ® 2.0, © 2003 Princeton University
(Remember, we've already dealt with the subject in the context of Jimi, the Byrds, Neil, and the Man in Black)
Meaning what? That art has no value that can be described as "destructive" or "negative"?
No, what was meant was best expressed in the poem, aside from that I would strongly suggest you look up the antonyms of the definition of "art".
Despite the fact that my entire post was an argument against "the dreck that Eminem and Snoop Dog do", now somehow you have me arguing that it "comes from God"? Nice try ... so much for arguing with logic and integrity!
You are the one insisting they are musicians, not me. I don't even consider what they DO music, much the same as I don't consider snuff films: Art.
When you truncated the quote, you left out:
"...put your "blame" where it belongs."
What I did suggest is that you blame those who perpetrate the "wrong", and not lump them in with those who don't, BTW, when you do, don't be surprised if it insults musicians when you decide to hold them responsible for the actions of hacks and the parasitic sucking of society by the scum of Wall st. and Madison Ave. Making noise isn't necessarily making music, nor does it make one a musician.
If this is what launched us off on this battle
Not at all, any resentment I have for the premise you push, is partly for the smoke and mirrors that from where I sit, only serves to absolve the responsible for their crimes against culture, society and yes, those who commit violence against their fellow man. If you had a case to make for this, I haven't seen it yet.
You seek to hold a vocation responsible, by degree for something that has it's root causality in far more sinister folk than a handful of hacks and reprobates.
You debase a vocation I have spent the last 38 of my 43 years in, by saying that we must be accountable for the worst manifestations of pop culture, when in fact, we are their worst enemy.
The most sacred responsibility of a musician is to his art, without this, he/she is NOT a musician.
If I STRONGLY object to the twisted logic that you employ to arrive at the conclusions to the premise you're promoting, it's also because I deplore dishonest discourse. In order to form this argument, you've had to exclude the worst of the causalities of not only the worst of pop culture, but the culture of violence itself, and in doing so, ....trivializing the worst evils found in the human condition via marginalizing them.
Aside from the idea that I think (and believe I've illustrated) you have the causality ass backwards, this is the point.
You write well, lovely prose...... too often ruined (in my mind) by the insistance of co-opting logic and meaning in order to shape the evidence to a conclusion as opposed to the converse.
That, my friend, is what "started this".
The conclusion (which I strongly disagree with and find insulting to what I have been for all but f years of my life - a musician), and the means you arrived at it. (The use of fallacy in a conclusion makes me angry when the conclusion itself is insulting, hence I will pick it apart passionately)
No real refutation of my argument, just a patronizing dismissal.
Offended?
I didn't say:
syllogism
n : deductive reasoning in which a conclusion is derived from two premises
I said:
syllogistic error
Specifically:
Relating two separate ideas just because they share some common property.
No real refutation of my argument, just a patronizing dismissal.
The former, not the latter.....
Not meant to offend but to refute. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 5:46:06 AM | | I have to say I honestly think musicians/artists in general think differently than the "general public"... No words to splain it though Ricky, just think it to be so~~ | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 87 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 5:56:42 AM | Well said, and perhaps the real "power of music" lies in those differences.
I'm reminded of the words of the painter, Degas:
"Painting is easy for those that do not know how, but very difficult for those that do!"
I am privileged to work with people in the business who have a great understanding of the mechanics of the facets of music that "affect us" (not talking about "lyrics here). From "psychoacoustics", to the physics behind the fabrication of the equipment that allows us to record the properties of sound while inaudable (non-psychoacoustic), have as much affect on us physiologically and emotionally than cognatively.
The "hows" and "whys" of this are often far less mystical than some believe. And are often quantitatively and qualitatively; measureable.
While some may think that "the power of music" is something that can be translated via digital means, ie: CD, ...mp3. It's amazing how much is lost in converting music to binary code. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:02:28 AM | | Forget it, Late. There's no end to this argument with you. I haven't used any twisted logic nor have I ever insulted the entire musical profession. I've been a professional musician myself for most of my life and am currently the president and founder of a non profit music association that has hosted hundreds of live music events and seeks to discover and develop young emerging musical talent. To suggest that in any way I have slammed musicians in general is as ludicrous as are most of the arguments you have posted against me here. It's pointless to continue bickering with you. We'll just have to agree to disagree. Enjoy your false, selfserving analyses of my logic and the feeling of intellectual superiority that they seem to give you while you can. I'll go on defending my contention that music is powerful and that those who make it have a responsibility to be aware of that power and use it wisely. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:10:23 AM | That's the thing about artists though artandsoul~~I don't think there's anything logical about them at all.... Artists invented a whole other part of the brain to think with---not just left-sided or right-sided.... You think>? Hmmmmm~~~ ((contemplating)) | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:29:42 AM | | Well, Livewire, I think that artists can be as logical and/or as illogical as any other group of people. Also, I think artistry isn't confined to those we normally identify as artists, eg, painters, musicians, sculptors, etc. A guy who landscapes his yard beautifully or a woman who decorates her home beautifully both demonstrate artistic talent. Some of us are fortunate enough, talented enough and/or determined enough to be able to make a living from our particular type of art. I agree that, in certain cases of particularly brilliant artists, they seem at times to get their inspiration from a source that few of us can tap into on a consistent basis if at all. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:35:23 AM | Art,
the rub of this argument lies here. Equating the likes of snoop dog and p-diddy to the likes of John Coltrane and Lenny Breau is pure blasphemy. All do make audible pitch, well somewhat, but all are NOT NOT NOT musicians. Snoop is NOT a musician. P-diddy is NOT a musician. Snoop et al is to music what spam is to fine dining. | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 92 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:35:53 AM | I've been a professional musician myself for most of my life and am currently the president and founder of a non profit music association that has hosted hundreds of live music events and seeks to discover and develop young emerging musical talent.
That's what makes it all the more insulting.
It's pointless to continue bickering with you. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
Uh huh, the two sentences that follow this, don't exactly follow it.
Pointless indeed.
Not only will I not step in the bovine byproduct, I will continue to point it out to others so they too, can avoid having to scrape it off their shoe.
I haven't used any twisted logic nor have I ever insulted the entire musical profession.
More than that, you've insulted those who seek to actually DO something about the culture of violence.
Enjoy your false, selfserving analyses of my logic and the feeling of intellectual superiority that they seem to give you while you can.
"seem"
Synonyms:
assume, hint, imply, insinuate, intimate, look, look like, pretend, resemble, show, sound, sound like, suggest
I reject the insults and your assumptions of me.
I'll go on defending my contention that music is powerful
Who said it wasn't? It's in the understanding of it where we part ways.
those who make it have a responsibility to be aware of that power and use it wisely.
All have a responsibility to be aware and speak out against the real causes of cultural violence, and not hide them behind half-baked unsubstanciated backwards logic.
Your conclusions are as bad as, "she was asking for it".
The responsibility for cultural violence is far more collective than you would paint it. I would have no problem with "blame" if it was based on something real like: "poverty", "exclusion", "racism", "corporate exploitation", etc. The fact of the matter is, the "causality", you claim, is a symptom of something far more sinister than "gangsta' rap". Look past your blindered vision, beyond the "bad musician" boogyman, and see the big picture from the frame of reference of human behaviour, social science and the human condition, and those who exist as parasites on society, while profiting from, "poverty", "exclusion", "racism", "corporate exploitation", etc. | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:37:00 AM | I consider my ex an excellent artist. He works for a major gun manufacturer making as well as repairing guns, which takes more than patience, stamina and imagination at times. He also does taxidermy on the side. But I still think people that have that certain "instinct" tend to think differently than everyone else. Only my submissive opinion though~~~ | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 94 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:44:19 AM |
a major gun manufacturer making as well as repairing guns
Hmmmmm.....
Do you think he should be responsible for the bad things people do with guns?
I'm not saying he should, just curious what you think? | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 6:44:39 AM | Hey live,
check out san jose jazz society. A good buddy works there and that is a wonderful source of great music | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 96 | |
| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 7:02:07 AM | You're in the mid-west eh? Some of the most powerful and influencial jazz of the latter part of the last century is so evocative of the mid-west.
It's amazing how much more powerful instrumental music is on the imagination.
I suppose it's because the mind is forced to fill in the "gaps".
When I hear Pat Metheny, Charlie Haden or even the great orchestral works of Aaron Copland, I can close my eyes and almost feel the prairie sun on my face.
For me, jazz really paints the most vivid pictures in my mindscape, and raises the most goosebumps on the backs of my arms.
I've been spoiled by having seen so many greats live, that the lack of the same "evocative" reaction fostered by "live" music ...not being "there" in recorded media, has me rarely listening to it anymore.....
What's the scene like where you are, live music wise, ....do you get to go to any of these "chicken-skin" shows? | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 7:05:14 AM | Jazz, where is it exactly that I am supposed to have compared Snoop to Lenny Breau? I made it pretty clear how I feel about rap in general. For the most part I can't stand it. Rappers aren't the only ones who create songs glorifying violence, rape, etc. Musicians do it as well. There's no point in arguing about what a "real" musician is. Hip Hop, for instance, may not be your definition of music and it's hardly my favorite either. But it does contain melodies, rhythm and other characteristics of music that qualify it to be called music. It seems that this whole argument has gotten bogged down in definitions. I'm using the terms "artist" and "musician" in the way they are normally used by most of the world.
My point is that, given the power that music does have, a popular recording artist who pens or performs songs that glorify things like rape and murder is abdicating his responsibility not only as an artist but as a human being. Now, suppose that a talented musician/singer/songwriter decided to write a song advocating the assassination of George Bush because he disagrees with his politics. No doubt if such a song could ever get past the censors it might make him a lot of money because there is definitely a lunatic fringe out there who would buy it. Do you think that would be a responsible use of his talents? And would it be surprising if some nut listened to that song over and over and one day tried to actually do the deed? Was that guy a nut before he heard the song? Sure he was. Nevertheless, who's to say that song wasn't a contributing factor in pushing him right over the edge? "The pen is mightier than the sword", they say. Books have changed the history of the world. Now, take the power of the written word and add a melody that you can't get out of your head. Why couldn't that be even more powerful? | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 9:55:04 AM | late,
What's the scene like where you are, live music wise, ....do you get to go to any of these "chicken-skin" shows?
The Kansas City music scene is alive and well. Actually thriving! Most people dont realize it but there is more live jazz in the Kansas City Metro then anywhere in the states...yep even more then NYC. On any given night there are 80+ clubs with live jazz!
I am very lucky..I lived in the east for a time but the lifestyle here is much more to my taste. I love playing here and the clubs I get to play in. The people know music and truly love it and what you do! I am lucky...very very lucky. One of the better and more well-known spots is "The Blue Note". That is on the corner of 18th and vine in a neighborhood that has been "rehabilitated". It is also the birth place of what we know as jazz. Hell...on that spot, Benny Moten, Count Basie...all ALL the greats played there.....I am honored to get the chance. Now if I could really play! LOL | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 8:07:20 PM | Art, anyone who will argue that Mozart had not the greater talent then anyone else and was just in the presence of his father, etc. should not be debated IMHO.... :-) It won't help and is a common insecurity that leads to films like Amadeus and people who like to "examine" the illnesses and personal lives of the great composers. As to these who will pigeonhole the "Artist" as borderline insane and a "different thinking logic" all I can say is that which we do not understand, we fear.
Now that I have the target painted on me... blast away people! LOL By the way, ... no, I am not interfering with a conversation, I am defending the honor of musicians everywhere.
Flames | |
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| The power of music
Posted: 1/11/2006 8:38:13 PM | | My only comment late is that people kill people, not guns.... I was raised learning to use a gun as were my children. It's our constitutional right. And if they were banned, the criminals would still have access to them.. In fact, banning something seems to make it much more "attractive"... Especially to criminals. | |
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