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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/16/2007 7:02:24 PM | OP " share your advice on good gear and ask questions about components "
Well, I'm not into music yet, but invested less than $300 in some simple portable stuff that seems fine for digital quality stereo recording outdoors (I merely use it for voice recordings):
- RCA Lyra mp3 player/recorder (with a line input); ( I'd started with a Sony minidisc player but that broke down in short order, and minidisc players seem well along the path into obsolescence)
- Visivox Technologies: stereo mics (got them to include extra long cords) + a pocket 'pre-amp' (uses a 9-volt battery, for ~24 hrs usage time), which allows anything with a line input to be useful for lots of stuff, starting with stereo mics. They've their own site, but now mostly sell through eBay. I've a hunch that concert goers are getting good use out of such set-ups.
I've rigged up some battery packs so the setup just lasts forever and I don't need to worry about a 9-volt battery's voltage's fading, affecting the end result quality.
Someday, when I'm more free to get about, I'd like to get into nature recordings, using (Gibson) parabolic reflectors or homemade ones (heh, for the price he charges, almost $1,000; I'll first be seeing if papier mache homemade versions might suffice).
Beats the heck out of the four or five types of old analog microphones and tape recorders I'm used to, but then I never got into the high end stuff. I'd wonder, if there are more sensitive stereo mics out there (I'm no audiophile), for under a few hundred dollars. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/16/2007 10:12:03 PM | james 1
on the 'cheap but decent note'............
I have had great luck with audio technica at 3035 large diaphram condensers
ebay $189 us (new)
ya starve a bit and get a good mic pre
universal audio 610-the small brick one
For more channels......I have had good luck with an Allen and heath board
I have 16 channel but they have a nice 8 channel
check out ebay for some inexpensive CROWN pzm/boundary mics with xlr
not to be confused with the cheap radio shack version
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/17/2007 9:33:22 AM | Hey everyone,
Live and studio IMO are 2 different sides of the spectrum. Similar, however, WAY different.
Live is more forgiving. Meaning, when you make a mistake it's quickly forgiven.
Studio not forgiving at all. I've had people come in record themselves thinking they have it all figured out cause the night before they were just playing a huge concert with thousands of people cheering them on. When they come into the control room to listen to the playback the first comment I hear is, "Is that me? Do I actually sound like that?"
I reply,"the microphone does not lie."
The point I'm trying to make is the same scenario applies when talking about gear. Using live gear for studio doesn't ALWAYS work cause live gear is just not designed to handle studio quality.
James I will second "Lates" post he really has a lot of experience in and out of the studio. Where my experience lies more on the studio side.
Everytime a live guy comes into the studio with these cool new mics he just picked up. They quickly get swapped for something of studio quality.
Polyphony's Rant for the day:
You see how much BS we go through at the studio?
I mean we do all this audio purifying so kids can get online download the song/album and play them through computer speakers.
I'll be at the bar if anyone needs me!!!! | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/18/2007 5:03:56 PM | Where my experience lies more on the studio side.
Heh heh, yeah, ...but remember this?
http://homepage.mac.com/ewald/.Pictures/polyphony.jpg
That's you, second from the left, me on the extreme right.
It's too bad we never tried a studio version of that tune, it was kind of cool.
The point I'm trying to make is the same scenario applies when talking about gear. Using live gear for studio doesn't ALWAYS work cause live gear is just not designed to handle studio quality.
Almost never IMO.
Everytime a live guy comes into the studio with these cool new mics he just picked up. They quickly get swapped for something of studio quality.
Yup, magazines and websites have made BS a way of life, ...I love seeing the shock on a guys face when they actually hear a playback that's been done with quality gear.
You see how much BS we go through at the studio?
I mean we do all this audio purifying so kids can get online download the song/album and play them through computer speakers.
Yeah, don't you dare forget the old bastards who told you 'bout this. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/18/2007 9:36:25 PM |
You see how much BS we go through at the studio?
I mean we do all this audio purifying so kids can get online download the song/album and play them through computer speakers.
Just had to say AMEN to that one...yup...the industry kills it...
...I do a little recording in my basement as a hobby...we're talking VERY primitive stuff...
...one shure 57 beta mic in the middle of a small room for a live jam....
...plugged into a tascam digital box...the mix is always pretty bad...seeing as there pretty much is no eq aside from the playing volume itself....
....makes me chuckle...
poker night...we finish up a jam early and play it back as the poker buddies start piling in..someone makes a remark about the music and us jammers start howling...
...one guy says "This is you guys? ...I thought this was professional quality shit"
nope...people have no clue...but then...a lot of people don't care either....
...I wanna get some old jazz on vinyl...now THAT's quality sound
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/19/2007 10:50:07 AM | Actually, it IS fun to watch the look on someones face who as never heard a professionally recorded playback of unmastered raw-tracks @24/96, .....eyes widen, jaw hits floor. 
The truth is, without the tools, you can't learn how to do this, ..with the tools, it still takes years to learn how to do this.
Polyphony took a VERY expensive course at FullSail in Miami, ...and learned ProTools in an environment that had all the bells and whistles. When he showed up on the doorstep where I worked? He had a diploma, sure, ...but he still didn't know how things worked in a pro studio.
So he spent 2+ years interning (that means working for free folks) for a producer who's not easy to work for. He got yelled at a lot, scolded everytime he didn't do something perfectly, and with this producer there's only one way - HIS way.
After a few years of this abuse, when he went to try and get a position as an engineer at Canada's biggest pro studio in Toronto? He had enough chops to pass the interview, they tried him out part-time/probationary, and he got on full-time before a lot of the other guys (some who had been there for years). I think he went from studio-rat to engineer in three months.
I bet the old-timers there still ask him, "How does a young guy like you know about that?" when he does things the "right way" the first time.
(Hint) - not from magazines and websites, ...or even one of the most prestegious recording schools in the US.
Hobby recording is fun, and it's everywhere these days, IMO, it's watered down the bottom line of what IS an acceptable production value, ...but what can you do?
It IS possible to make music that is dynamically rich and three-dimentional as the golden-age of the state of the art productions in the '70s. It's even possible to do it on CD. But not unless you use the same front-end tools from the 70's that set the bar for production values.
You see how much BS we go through at the studio?
I mean we do all this audio purifying so kids can get online download the song/album and play them through computer speakers.
And yes, ...if you compress the tracks down to teeny-tiny mp3 files, it will make a difference, especially if it's a well produced track, ...not so much if it isn't.
Most CD's these days fall in the "isn't" category, this is why "the kids" can't tell the difference, and don't care.
Those who do want to take the hobby thing to a higher level? Do yourself a favour, find a set-in-his-ways, cranky, old-guy who walks the walk and talks the talk, and offer to wind cables, run errands, clean-up, etc. for free, in exchange for looking over their shoulder, ....that's the best school you're going to find. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/20/2007 6:00:34 PM | | Ok, I havent gone through all the posts...I just did a simple home record using my GNX3. Used the CD quality record setting and did anywhere from 4 to 6 tracs for one song. Converted the mix to load up on my PC where I used the Cakewalk guitar tracks 2.0 to remix levels and convert to wma files. Sounded great. Very inexpensive. Has anyone else used the GNX in this way? | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/25/2007 9:00:49 PM | No home internet connection, so I didn't scroll through all the posts either. I have an 80's synth rig, an audio technica headset mic for live use an sm58 for home and my singer has her own sennheiser (I forget the model number). I use cool edit pro on my PC (and will on my laptop when I update in a few weeks). It's considered a poor man's pro tools, but screw it, I'm POOR! I love this programme, basically an computerised multitrack recorder
But I've recorded my most recent rehearsals on it and took them into my local community station and compared it to some released CDs. And even without reworking, it scrubs up okay. I'm looking forward to doing some proper recordings in the next few weeks!
Toe knee :-)
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 1/27/2007 12:32:13 PM | Sounds fun!
Keep it up....
Late is there a way we can post mixes in this thread?
URLs to files = OK, Hosting sites - no.
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| Explain Mastering ???
Posted: 1/27/2007 2:30:21 PM | | Sorry, I am one of the somewhat technically challenged people out here. It has alot to do with putting sound into words. I know what compression is when I hear it, but when I read a definition of what it is.... my brain twists into a knot. Same with mastering... thought I knew what it meant... apparently not !!! I've got a BOSS BR-864 digital recorder. It records to memory card and I need to master my recording before going to CD. ?????????????? | |
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| Explain Mastering ???
Posted: 1/27/2007 6:36:36 PM | Explain Mastering.....
Well mastering is nothing more then making your original mix loud.(for a simple definition)
So when you get your CD played on the radio or any sound system for that matter ...it is loud enough to compete with other CD's possibly with a higher budget.
How they accomplish this:(this is what we use at our studio)
EQ-GML
Compression-Manley Variable Mu or the original L1
Tape-yes we go to 1/2inch before we convert once again to digital....
It's not cheap but it certainly serves a purpose.....
Now for your BOSS BR-864 digital recorder I wouldn't spend money mastering what you've recorded.....why? well, I'm not sure what the purpose of your recording is but I'm assuming it's just a CD that you'd like to have so you and your friends can listen. If that's the case then just run a plug in across the 2mix called Ultramaximizer....you can find it in the Waves bundle....in all honesty I don't think mastering will make or break your project....in other words, it won't effect record sales....
Hope this helps clear up a few things.
Good luck and keep it up,
P. | |
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| For Late & Polyphony,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Posted: 4/24/2007 7:43:16 PM | This is kind of off the subject, but you guys sound like you've been around....
My beef is the way which studios are dishing out the final product,,
Most of the music today, in particular rock,hip-hop, & a lot of the pop stuff,,
IS SO DAMN compressed it sound like crap,,,pure crap....
WHY do they do this...?????????? It's a square wave from beginning to end........
They sqezzzzzzz the last .1Db out of the spectrum,,,,,why,,,,,,,,
I'll take listening to my boston and styx Lps any day...:) | |
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| For Late & Polyphony,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Posted: 4/24/2007 8:19:44 PM | ^^^^^^^^^^
great question !!!!
here is a good article on 'loudness wars'
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war
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| For Late & Polyphony,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Posted: 4/25/2007 1:43:44 PM | Thanks for that. Excellant site and great links...!
And for those of use that are tried of this type of noise you might want to check this spot out.. http://www.petitiononline.com/RHCPWBCD/petition.html | |
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| For Late & Polyphony,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Posted: 5/24/2007 8:30:15 PM | Hey guys,
It's been awhile since I've checked this site out. Just been so busy.
Well guess we should just jump right into it.
You see the problem began with a little device called a computer. At first, it was strictly a tape recorder with some really cool editing features. BUT that is where, in my world, it should have stopped.
People nowadays, are mixing/recording recorders In The Box(ITB) meaning in a computer. Eliminating, those big analog mixing consoles. Now, pause for a second, .......
When you mix /record ITB(computer) you have no choice but to use a device called a word clock. a wordclock locks all digital gear to a pulsed generated of course by the clock. It has been proved that even the best digital wordclock on the market is guessing where all instruments are landing in time. Granted, it's only a peco second, but nevertheless still out of time. Which generates a feeling that is negative in thought or emotion. I won't say it's impossible to record and mix using a computer to MONITOR from but it just hasn't worked for me yet.
So computers, in my opinion, have lowered the bar for the recording industry. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 5/31/2007 8:23:52 AM | Hi guys,
I am currently looking at a few PA systems and would appreciate some feed back.
Currently three options for about the same price and features, although two are New and the third Used. As I have never made a warranty claim in my life (they always seem to run out just before things fall apart) I really don't see it as a factor.
Atlo PS4LA
Crate PA6FXsys2
Or
Kustom K300 (used 1970s).
I personally am leaning to the Kustom. Any one ever use any of these, any comments?
And Guitarman you've got 4 tracks better then my Fostex, Curses. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 5/31/2007 1:32:03 PM | trewq 36
I am not familiar with those models
I tend to go for the mixing board /rack power amp set up
cause it is more versitle
also check out the powered mackies and a mixer
also you live in T.O
what does yorkville have? | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 5/31/2007 9:44:40 PM | File me under the weekend amateur type....
Started with an 4 track cassette Fostex X-15 about 25 years ago, which is not exactly a "hi-fi" set up. It was a good source of experimenting and learning , however. You can not only learn a bit about the production side with something like that , but it also gives you a wonderful chance to improve your playing, and arranging skills.
Later this year I'll probably wind up getting a 2007 era version of the X-15. I've looked at thing like the Zoom multi-track recording gear, and others, and they seem to be what I'm looking for.
The decrease in price for equipment like this is stunning. Now one can get multi-track recorders, with built in effects and amp simulators , and even drums for a reasonable price.
Are we looking at studio quality ?
Ummm....no.
For someone like me, who doesn't really want to turn one room into a recording studio, they offer a perfect compromise. Small, easy to set up, and inexpensive.
They are like a sketch pad, and one can simply take it out, set it up, and quickly put down something. The quality is acceptable enough for that purpose. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/1/2007 8:25:50 AM | what does yorkville have?
Yes they do and have a dealer not far away (Long & McQuads). Two systems with 6 channels and 12" speakers at 150 or 325 watts (Trying to get pricing).
Is Yorkville worth it? I have never been sure of their quality I always thought it was Long & McQuads house brand.
Also I have seen a Warfedale PM-600. I know Warfedale is noted for their Home systems, is their Pro stuff any good?
And both the Crate and Kustom are 6 Channel power Mixers with matched speakers. The Alto system has no mixer only 2 channels with no EQ or such but more watts and speaker then the Crate.
Oh and just found out Alto is a Yorkville product. But I have one of their mixers that I am Not impressed with.
@ Montreal Guy.
What kind of budget?
I too have been looking to get a bit more up to date and have seen products ranging from several hundred to several thousands. I saw a used Yamaha 16g (I think that was the model) for about $550. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/1/2007 10:13:33 AM | I have a decent Yorkvill system but probably out of your price range.
A pair of Unity 15's
a pair of LS800P subs
A Powermax16 board,
monitor setup (used and abused Peaveys)
Bunch of rack gear:
EQ's
Compressor
quadraverb
etc.
Buncha mics (58's and 57's)
DDrum trigger setup with an Alesis DM5 brain
snake
etc etc.
Never had any problems with the setup, pumps all to hell. Never feeds back. Great setup. They are definately worth checking out, even the lower stuff. 2 year "even if you break it" warrenty.
Worth having a look at, I don't know. Maybe not for the cork sniffers, but it brings a smile to my face when you feel the bass thumping with a full room. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/7/2007 12:16:57 PM |
How much would we be talking about getting started with the basics for a home recording studio? Is Pro Tools spendy?
Don't know if this has been answered but you can actually get Pro-Tools for free if you have a PC but it will only work with Windows 98/Me. Should work well with a decent soundcard...the rest of the dedicated Pro tools hardware can get pricey though. | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/14/2007 5:42:14 AM | Yes, you can get a Protools free version. http://www.digidesign.com/ptfree
I think this will help in deciding.
If you're looking for an opinion, personally, I wouldn't even think about recording a record with less than 8 channels.
If you do a google search you'd be surpised how cheap protools is now.
Do alittle research check out sweetwater.com or proaudiocanada.com
The best way to buy gear is to ......LISTEN to it! | |
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Kesiah
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Joined: 6/10/2007
Msg: 174 | |
| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/14/2007 6:24:25 AM |  Wow what a great thread... will have to read through it all and learn... think the dating will have to go on the back burner... my love for music is far more exciting!
ok here's a really simple question for you...
I write lots of classical music and then lift bit of it to make songs...
I compose this on my piano - cos it is meaty and fuller than using my Roland E70... old I know but great for what I need to do...
Can you suggest some software that I can download... for free is nice! - but suggest what I can do do get myself recording stuff via the net.
I would also love to see my classical stuff written out ... you know on sheet music.. although I can do the music theory... I just don't have the time to do it... my head is spinning with music and I am sure my brain is running out of RAM so it would be really cool to see it in notation.
Any ideas for me.
I would also be able to compare and contrast my abilities with other composers... seeing as when I play and write ... although I know it is good and clever.. it would be a real boost to know that it is up there with the best. I can't judge my word... when I am playing it... cos I am too involved in it's creation ... any ideas? | |
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| the HOME RECORDING STUDIO thread
Posted: 6/15/2007 8:48:11 AM | What I find helps me to conclude if one of my tunes is any good.
Is to record it and then listen to it over and over and over. If after a few hundred listens I still think it's good, I edit again till I think it's GREAT.
The down side with this is I have to listen to a lot of crap.... | |
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