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| | are women playing GOD when they become pregnantPage 41 of 54 (14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54) | In The USA people do NOT own people. The War Between The States (Civil war) settled THAT issue. Parents are NOT each 50% responsible for children. Both patrents are 100% responsible for their children. If one can't carry the load, the other has to. It IS a partnership, and IS governed by business law pertaining to partnerships, and 'debts' incurred during the period of the partnership carry over beyond the point where the partnership was dissolved, and must be paid. The 'debt' in the case of pregnancy is the well being of any child born until it reaches 'majority'; usually 18 years of age.
Picture this:
You open a video store with a friend as a partnership. The day the business is formed the business borrows money from the bank to buy video games, tapes, and discs, to rent out. The term of the loan-the length of time to pay it back-is 5 years. Six months after going into business, your friend decides he does not like being in business-having to get up before noon, being polite to rude customers, etc-so he quits. He just walks away. Whether you keep the business going, or close it down, YOU still have to pay back that loan to the bank. If you can sell the store to someone who is willing to take it even with the debts, rather than telling you to pay the debts before the sale, then you will be lucky enough to not have to pay the loan off...but you may not find such a buyer. The bank which gave the loan can use the courts to get you to pay. If you know where your friend went to, you can also use the courts to make him pay you. Can any of the guys here see how this relates to the matters we have been discussing? | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:45:53 PM |
I'm sure you can't take what I said seriously... Maybe you don't grasp the concept that is takes two people to produce a child... It doesnt matter if you want him or her, what matter's is the kid, not YOU. It's not the kids fault, he/she is a product of TWO people f*cking and in some cases not being responsible. Again, the kid could give a rat's azz whose fault it was, really... he or she just want to be taken care of and that is the responsibility of the TWO people who made him/her. And for some women, abortion or the morning after pill is NOT an option, but I'm sure you won't be able to understand that either.
And the mother comment was not directed at you.
I completely agree it takes two to create a child, but these ARE children, they deverse respect and loving arms, ANYONE be it man or woman who wants to take that away from a child is being extremely selfish.
When can't people take the morning after pill or have an abortion? They're widly available... we're well past accidents being a viable excuse, and if a woman somehow managed to go a long time without knowing she was pregnant, and wants to HAVE a child, how is a man resonsible for HER choice? he shouldn't be, but since it IS his child, he should be given the priority in choosing wheather or not to raise the child himself. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:45:59 PM | Women have a Choice to have a child or not to have a child.
Yes
It isnt playing God it is reality.
When a women decides to have a child she is ultimetly deciding to have a child withor without the support of the other person.
Men also have a choice to be fathers or sperm donors.
When a women decides to continue with a pregancy her choice is now to have a child whether its fatherless or not.
She has to come to grips that she should not demand or use this childs father as an emotional punching bag if things go wrong or to use him as a bank.
If things go well then fine.
Often is the case that things do not go so well and issues crop up ..
it is the mothers responsibility to feed,clothe and raise this child the best that she can. It is her job to make sure that she protects , nurishs and enrichs their childrens lives as much as they can to raise them with morals and values and with love and understanding.
It is their jobs the moment that they decide to have them. That is THEIR decision.
If the father does not want to do any of this or only part of this or all of it then that has to be worked out in a manner that will ALWAYS protect the mental health and well being of the child, no onelses mental health is a concern but that childs!
Too often women have children to trap men or to fix relationships and yes some are pure accidents.
But using ones child to get back at , manipulate, use and emotionally torture the fathers is not a way to deal with rasising healthy happy emotionaly stable children.
Women dont play god we just know that what ever decision we decide to make it will be ours forever to live with and we need to be fully ready to be able to take that on without doubt. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:48:36 PM | njbris
Joined: 10/18/2009
Msg: 1058
view profile
History
are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:06:41 AM
hehe and it keeps going round and round.
If women want to take away men's ownership during pregnancy, that means men have the right to free away from responsibility. Very simple
It you want to flick on and off men's ownership of the child like a switch, men are entitled to it to.
True equality that many women on this thread can't handle
<----------- This guy is a genious! | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:51:28 PM | Sorry pal, you can't keep using that tired old saw. IF he walks away, you can sue him! IF I choose to sell the store I need his consent. IF i declare bankruptcy my debts are wiped clean.
She gets to abort, or she gets to carry to term, or she gets to give up for adoption, the man gets to do NOTHING!!!
Try doing any or all of those things in family court. They will laugh at you and put you in jail, garnish your wages, or in this case seize your store. In other words, you HAVE NO LEGAL RIGHTS!!! Contract law, Business law or any other law not withstanding!!
The government merely says, this is how we are going to do it. Can you get this in your head for once and for all!!! | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:52:40 PM |
One would hope the men would take note of those who profess equality, and note their stand on this issue. These women are NO different than those men in white sheets of the KKK, they just wear skirts instead of sheets!!
Irrelevant hyperbole.
The only thing they want is for you to spend your money on them, no different then telling the slaves to go work the fields!!
Irrelevant hyperbole.
Let me know when you have a legitimate argument. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 10:55:03 PM |
CrumblePie........just because a child is fatherless, does not mean that it will be fatherless forever.
My friend was totally devoted to her step-father and showed him all the respect that he deserved/earned until the day he passed away. She took care of him when he had cancer, drove him to and from chemo, cooked meals, provided support and companionship when he needed it. She was with him when he drew his last breath and she paid for the funeral from her own pocket.
She knows her biological father, but she simply refers to him as the sperm-donor. She has photos of her step-father scattered thoughout her home, but none of her biological father.
Those situation are sad and good at the same time. its good she has a father, its sad she has to think of someone as a sperm-doner, and know half of her makeup/genetics come from that person..
I have a lot of respect for some single moms, some have actually had kids dumped on them, and ideally men who pretend they want a child then bail, should pay for it, it's cruel to do that to children.
I don't want women to have less rights, i don;t want men to have less rights, i want children to be valued in the eyes of the law. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:10:26 PM | Trust me, the women will not be going on any shopping spree's with that amount of money, it's for the kid you helped produce.
please don't assume youre anything like all women. Im not talking in this thread because im a man who faces this stuff, i don't, i always know who im sleeping with, and have never been in the possition of wondering if she will keep it or even wondering if she's pregnant, i have never had a child with anyone i didn;t want to, i can't see it ever happening. And i have little to no respect for a some men who do bail on some kids, but the facts still remain, the laws favour women over the fathers and the children, i have come in contact with a whole bunch of unfit mothers who deprive their kids of all sorts of things, because she views herself as number one not the child. thats why laws need changed. who cares about men and women. f*ck we're adults. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:13:13 PM |
Child support is not to protect women's rights, it's to protect children.
From what? money can't buy me love. kids don;t give a rats ass about money, and if a woman is facing the idea of a straving a child without extra money, she should NEVER EVER HAVE A CHILD. seriously how cruel could someone be?
Money can HELP to buy food, clothing, a secure home and education. A sole parent's income is just that - one income - to feed more than one mouth. Not everyone's income source is reliable or continuous. That extra child support money can make a huge difference.
You ask how cruel somone can be? Don't you see the irony in that?
Women need to act like adults here and take some responcibility for their actions, if they bring a child into the world, women should understand they are forever changing the life of two other people.
This is a bizarre thing to say. Take responsibility for your own fertility or shut up. And understand that pregnancy is a consquence from having sex - and it takes two people to have sex.
We also have the intelligence to recognise sex as pleasurable and want it more. Women's drives have evolved over the millenia so they don't go on heat once a month - the reason being, so I've read, is to keep men from straying.
blaming men for a sex drive now? the bonobos our closest relatives via DNA are a female controlled society, the females are larger than the male, and they seem to like it without being monogomus
FFS, I'm not talking about blame - I'm talking about fvcking biology. Evolution - ever heard of it? | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:27:09 PM |
Money can HELP to buy food, clothing, a secure home and education. A sole parent's income is just that - one income - to feed more than one mouth. Not everyone's income source is reliable or continuous. That extra child support money can make a huge difference.
You ask how cruel somone can be? Don't you see the irony in that?
No i don't, she made a choice, something she should be responsible for, it was a choice she could have made for several weeks.... if she refuses to accept she's doesn;t make enough money to support a child, why in heavens name should someone else be forced to pick up the slack?
How about me and you have sex, then i adopt a child in 9 month, and you give me a bunch of money every week/month for 18 years, sounds good to me, i wouldn;t mind adopting a child, but i don;t think i can afford one on my own....
You;re talking about a man taking care of you and your baby.... plain and simple. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:29:25 PM | Crumble pie, let me make clear, that I see your points.
I have children, they are grown, I paid my child support. I have had no children from any other relationship outside of my marriage.
I have however, seen other men I know, get roped into situations by the courts. One was told 60 days after the child was born, it was his (surprise!) and that he owed support. While the individual situations are not relevant, the fact that these men were left with a fate a compli, was not right. No input, no recourse and yes some of them had used condoms.
How is it that 2 people agree upon a course of action (recreational sex), then after the fact, your choice is to pay or to pay? No input, she had input on her willingness to have sex. some even initiate it.
These are tough times, raising kids is not easy, nor cheap. But to say to someone, you are going to have a child, like it or not. You are going to pay for that child like it or not. I can do what ever I want, even move that child hundreds of miles away, WHILE you pay for it, like it or not. Is just plain BS, and the government, which you pay for, which says you have rights in ALL other situations, says no you don't, this is the way it is. OH and by the way, she decides it all. That is patently wrong.
See after I posted this I saw the other response. If you can't afford to raise a child that YOU CHOOSE to have, give it up for adoption. YOU CHOSE TO HAVE IT!! I'm sorry there are some things in life, in fact most where we all get only 1 guess. Here she has 3 and you have none, it's wrong. It's not as though we're talking about a short term thing, this is 18 years at least. | |
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njbris
| | Joined: 10/17/2009
Msg: 1013 | |
| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:31:02 PM | As I will say over and over again, if a woman chooses to take away a man's rights during pregnancy (the decision of abortion) the man is entitled to take away his responsibility.
You can’t take away his ownership/rights in one stance and then expect him to not take away his. Equality is equality…live with it
How hard is it to comprehend? | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/19/2009 11:46:43 PM | Mr Evil, im not saying or suggesting men should pay.
I guess im being a little to broad with everything im saying, mostly because there's some extremely bias opinions here, and i don;t see myself as a man or a woman, though im clearly only a man.
I'm more focused on the children, i would like to see all purely financial support abolished, its absurd thatin todays world men are expected to pay, even for women to pay because some women do, unless they WANT TO, and usually people who want to create a child, and discover they don't match up well with their mate, still want good things for their children, and would love to financially support them.
I can;t see the logic in fathers needing to pay, i'll admit it's my own bias opinion and disgust for some people that has me thinking some men should pay. if someones there through the pregnancy pretending that hey're going to be there when the kid is born, and takes off right away, i just have no use for them, i don;t know many people spare the ones who would do that who feel those people should get off scott free. even though the whole idea of forcing someone into a form of slavery is a bit much. sex shouldn;t be a punishable experience when agreed to mutually. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:04:04 AM |
How about me and you have sex, then i adopt a child in 9 month, and you give me a bunch of money every week/month for 18 years, sounds good to me, i wouldn;t mind adopting a child, but i don;t think i can afford one on my own....
I like this example.
I have sex with a woman, birth control is used. 9 months later, I adopt a baby orphan who would otherwise live in a state orphanage (it's a crappy life and no substitute for an actual home). I tell the girl, hey, you need to pay me $8000 every month for child support for next 18 years. We had sex, sex can result in kids , you knew it was a risk. You have no choice but to pay, it's the law that you have to pay and if you don't pay I will force you to pay through the courts.
Women, does this sound fair to you? | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:08:51 AM | Mr.Evil...the selling of the store would be like a woman giving the child up for adoption...which none of the men here have said they would oppose, so-for the sake of the analogy-it was presumed that the friend would not oppose the sale...as it would get him out from under the debt as well as get you out from under. On the other hand, the friend would not be able to force you to sell the store if you did not want to. Some of the men here think they should be legally able to force a woman to put their children up for adoption. Men DO have legal rights in these situations...the right TO SUPPORT THEIR CHILDREN. That is the very right they are trying to avoid.
Sincer your pals are too chicken shizz to answer, how about you? What, exactly do YOU want?
The right to force a woman carrying your seed to have an abortion on your whim?
The right to force a woman bearing your child to give it up for adoption on your whim?
The right to walk away and not support your child without any legal consequences?
or what?
Grow some balls, ands say. Vague statements about wanting equal rights don't cut it, as to be equal you would have to be the same...a woman...and you are not.
How, exactly do you think you can achieve the equal rights you feel you are being denied? | |
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~§~
| | Joined: 10/3/2009
Msg: 1017 | |
| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:14:28 AM |
How about me and you have sex, then i adopt a child in 9 month, and you give me a bunch of money every week/month for 18 years, sounds good to me, i wouldn;t mind adopting a child, but i don;t think i can afford one on my own....
I like this example.
I have sex with a woman, birth control is used. 9 months later, I adopt a baby orphan who would otherwise live in a state orphanage (it's a crappy life and no substitute for an actual home). I tell the girl, hey, you need to pay me $8000 every month for child support for next 18 years.]
Thats one of the most stupid analogies Ive ever read.
Its not her freakin DNA... NOR is the consequences of HER actions.
Seriously... some of you shouldnt be having sex... you're too stupid to even be able to do it.
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:15:30 AM | | njbris-men do not have a right to decide on abortion. Which right in the bill of rights, or which federal code, state staute, or city ordinance, do you think gave you this wonderous right? Since it never existed, no woman ever took it away from you, so you do not have the right to take away your responsibility. Even if that logic were legal, your responsibility in this case is not to the woman. It is to the child, and to the state. You have no ownership rights to another person; not in America. That is what we fought, and won, The Civil War over. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:19:27 AM |
The right to walk away and not support your child without any legal consequences?
Correct. You, Belle Lass, and other illiterates, please shut up about "just what exactly are you suggesting?" That is exactly what has been suggested in direct words.
Thats one of the most stupid analogies Ive ever read.
Its not her freakin DNA... NOR is the consequences of HER actions.
Seriously... some of you shouldnt be having sex... you're too stupid to even be able to do it.
DNA has nothing to do with it. She had sex and was consenting to the risks of a child being produced. That's the argument as to why men should pay and the argument has nothing to do with DNA. DNA is about biology, nothing more. We are arguing about why men should pay. And the reason is because he had sex and was consenting to the risks thereof.
So again, answer the question. Does this seem fair to you? No? Then why is it fair for women to do the same to men? | |
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~§~
| | Joined: 10/3/2009
Msg: 1020 | |
| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:24:10 AM | DNA has nothing to do with it. She had sex and was consenting to the risks of a child being produced.
^^^
HER child, HER DNA
DNA and HER actions has EVERYTHING to do with it
Please... stop typing... get a vasectomy and dont breed.
Edit...
If you think for one minute thats an argument that in any way, shape or form is worthy of debate and parallel... you're welcome to take accept the title of stupidity.
Im not making you
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:26:44 AM |
Thats one of the most stupid analogies Ive ever read.
Its not her freakin DNA... NOR is the consequences of HER actions.
Seriously... some of you shouldnt be having sex... you're too stupid to even be able to do it
that was mean and uncalled for. i write something and all of the sudden im to stupid to breed? ouch.. I've heard of insensitive people, but you take the cake...
it could be a consequence of her action if it were the law.....
women need to stop hiding behind the laws to make their points or us men are gonna take the right to vote away again lol. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:31:38 AM | | Njbris - after reading your posts I can understand why you are unemployed, and single. I wouldn't hire, or marry, a dozey bugger like you if I had the chance. Now that I see-from your profile-that you are in Queensland, I guess I have to cut you some slack. Being in Oz, you are unfamiliar with laws in America. I am not familiar with the specific laws in Australia which pertain to this topic, but I'll bet you a week's worth of VB they are not much different than laws here in CONUS. Here we do not get to own people...not even our spouses...not even our children. I bet it is the same in Australia. If it is not, send us a copy of the legislation which allows you Down Under types to own people. That I'd like to see. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:34:40 AM |
How about me and you have sex and there your analogy ends because I would be using protection to ensure no children were conceived. I managed to remain childfree until my 30s. How do you think that happened? A miracle? But where's your end of the deal? Don't you have the same responsibility?
Can't you guys get what we are saying? If you don't want a child, ensure you're not making one. Then there is no blame game. | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:34:45 AM |
HER child, HER DNA
DNA and HER actions has EVERYTHING to do with it
Wrong. The argument as to why men should pay, is that they had sex and were consenting to the chance that a child would be produced from having sex. The argument is not "their DNA was used to make a child and thus they must pay." If it was, then sperm donors would also have to pay child support.
Again, I have provided proof that it has nothing to do with DNA. You are merely saying "not her DNA, not her responsibility" without providing any support for that statement. That doesn't work in a debate.
So, answer the question you keep avoiding. Is that unfair for a man to do that in such a case? If so, then why should women not be held to the same standard? | |
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| are women playing GOD when they become pregnant
Posted: 11/20/2009 12:37:11 AM | My attitude disgusts you ??? I don't see why.
I think that men should stay out of their kids lives PERMANENTLY if they don't want the kids they helped produce. I think they should WALK AWAY and never turn back. No connection EVER, not when the child is growing up, not when the child is adult.
You made a kid because you were careless or didn't have the balls to get the slice and bingo the women you slept with is knocked up. You don't want the responsibility. I say Fine then go away.
It only proves that men more and more don't want kids but want the freedom of fuuking whom ever they want. I think they should be able to never see the kids. And the law should ban them from EVER seeing this child. I agree don't pay support, we know you don't have the goonies to be responsible for a child and you don't have the goonies to take charge of your own life and protect your weenie from reproducing.
Why in the world would any woman want a man to have any connection to a child she loves by a man filled with resentment and even perhaps hatred.
I have said nothing other than men get fix if you don't want a kids, don't screw indiscriminately if you don't want a kids, use condoms if you don't want a kid .... and if you still screw-up go away. Yea I don't think you should pay one thin dime .... just drop out permanently.
Most women don't want money from azzholes who walk away when they get their boxers in a knot because two people weren't careful enough to protect an innocent child from being born, yet the mother is willing and loving enough to accept the responsibility but the men again with the very small nuts can just turn their backs. They want equal rights to the fetus, to their sperm even though it has be sprung by their own actions and seem to want to have right to force abortions or adoptions. That is your half of the choice, while the mother have different choices, and is making different choices. And HELLO it is her body. Her body that will deliver the child and her body that will feed the child ... the only thing you can offer is support (caring for the child) and financial support, you want to give neither then you are un necessary in this childs life.
You don't want the responsibility of a child that you made .... GOOD. We know what type of man you are right a the beginning. Irresponsible. If you were really responsible you would have taken precautions from the start.
It does happen that there are women who might try to trap you into have a kid, but again you could have protected your own rights. GET FIXED. WEAR A CONDOM. You did;t follow through ... the baby is hear and we can see you have no love for your new born child. That says allot to me. You money is nothing in comparison to the father you could chose to be ... better you aren't in the picture at all. If the woman decided to keep her child, you opp out .... bye bye bye then. What do you care what she does now.
But don't come back. I think if a man refuses his child the woman should get a life long ban on this man ever being able to take part in the childs life. After all we know that story .... oh the kids is past needing support then maybe I will make a connection to my son or daughter because now I am old and I feel the need for connection.
Nope you should be done. You don't get to know if the child looks like you, you don't get to know if the child has made a great life for themselves ... why would you need to know your rights were given up at birth. There should be no turning back ...
I have not said anything about who should or shouldn't pay support ... I am more interested in a man who walks away from his new son or daughter and say fuuk them I didn't want them so they can fall off the planet as far as I am concerned attitude.
I wouldn't want a man saying to a child ... I didn't want you I wanted to abort you. I didn't want you a part of this world, I didn't want you a part of this life. What cruel and nasty thought that could put into a child's mind.
You don't like my profile, well it isn't for you to like. I am not looking I am here for the forums ... so what do you care. I would never on any circumstances date a man who is posting here .... I like real life with real men. It is mostly in the forums that these damaged attitudes spew out of the mens mouths. I avoid them at all costs.
I like to post in the forums ... I have the right and I am entitled to my opinion.
so you don't want that kids you produced ... LEAVE and never be seen again. Go to your death knowing you had a child unwanted, and you lost a connection with your DNA, your own flesh and blood. I say Yahhhhh for all the men with peanuts for balls.
It is so easy to go get fixed but yea I know you are scared you will lose your manhood. News flash ... you lost your manhood when you turned you back on your new born child. Hurts doesn't it. Would have been better if she aborted, gave the child up ... well you aren't going to get that choice unless you step up and take the unwanted child into your life.
Anyway there are millions of men turning their backs on their offspring. All over the States and Canada the proff is in the stats. And yea you men are looking worse and worse all the time. If you have children already ... for gawwwwds sake don't tell them they have a brother or sister that they will never see. What a way to teach them to walk away on their responsibilities too ... like father like son.
Your money isn't required, your presence isn't required, your love for the child isn't required ... you are just not needed.
OMO | |
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