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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 9/21/2006 6:19:00 PM | | The Muslim religion is the fastest growing religion in the world and even here in the United States. I don't know how many of part of that particular sect. When and if they become the majority in the United States they can vote in any laws that they chose. Is anyone starting to see the value of seperation of church and state? And the value of a constitution? and a independent judicial system? | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 9/21/2006 6:42:40 PM | About time someone called a spade a spade. I think we should all email this article to our prospective goverments and local politicials of all levels. Maybe if they get bombarded with articles like this they may actually get a clue as to what should be done.
But of course I could be dreaming it would actually do any good. As its not really politically correct. | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/21/2006 9:47:36 AM | The great achievement of Western culture since the Enlightenment is to make many of us peer over the wall and grant some respect to people outside it; the great failure of Western Culture is to deny that walls are inevitable or important.
-James Q. Wilson
There is a sense in which current immigration policy is Adolph Hitler's posthumous revenge on America. The U.S. political elite emerged from the war passionately concerned to cleanse itself from all taints of racism or xenophobia. Eventually, it enacted the epocal Immigration Act of 1965. And this, quite accidentally, triggered a renewed mass immigration, so huge and systematically different from anything that had gone before as to transform- and ulitmatey, perhaps, even to destroy- the one unquestioned victor of WWII: the American nation, as it had evolved by the middle of the twentieth century. Today, U.S. government policy is literally dissolving the people and electing a new one...
-Peter Brimelow
It's a matter of pure arithmetic that, if nothing else happens, non-Europeans will become a majority and Whites a minority in the UK. That would probably be the first time an indigenous population has voluntarily become a minority in its historic homeland.
-Unknown demographer in UK (Quoted in the Observer, September of 2000 by Anthony Brown. Demographer wish to remain unknown due to fear of being labeled a "racist")
Do Western moral principles require that it's creators commit suicide in order to fulfill those principles? Such a belief is insane. It therefore follows that if the West is to survive it must come to grips, as Jean Raspail foresaw, with the profoundly destructive nature of it's moral beliefs. Any enduring moral order must be based on the following principles: 1) a dual code of morality, which is of evolutionary origin, binds the members of ethnic and racial groups together; 2) universal, self-sacrificing altrusim, in a world in which racial cohesion is elsewhere the norm, is lethal; and 3) the imperative of survival and the primacy of self-preservation supersede all laws made by man.
-Michael W. Masters
Liberalism is dauntingly powerful. But the one force it does not have on it's side is truth. And that finally, is its one invincible enemy, and our one unshakable friend.
-Fr. Ronald K. Tacelli, S.J.
Ladies and gentleman, it's time to shed the socially pressured political correctness that's threatening our nations existances... | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/21/2006 9:55:42 PM | | I believe that religion should not have anything to do with how a country is governed. Influence by religious values....sure. Most major religions essentially run off similiar moral values anyways. Should any one sect be run out of any country? Hell yeah....but ONLY if they are undermining the law/ gov't of the land and it is proving to be corrosive to the moral fiber of the country. In Canada it's a VERY fine line though....many guilty parties will undoubtably run to the UN claiming violation to their human rights and tie up any thoughts of extradition with litigation. Combine that with our governments unwillingnes to do anything that might offend any special interest group and well......it will never happen here...... | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 2:47:36 PM | If the United States were to do that, it would be labled as racist and intolerant by the rest of the world and give people just one more reason to bash the U.S
But if another country does it, its called standing up for your culture and national identity.
Just gotta laugh  | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 3:09:41 PM | If the United States were to do that
Um, isn't there separation of church and state that applies to the judiciary in the US?
But if another country does it
Canada doesn't recognize sharia law, I doubt any western nation's judiciary recognizes religious tribunals as bona fide civil law.
The OP was a chain email, it's made up of three different news sources, put together to be contentious.
Bigotry sells.
I really don't think we are at risk of having Islam insinuated into our law books here, Christianity maybe......
What's really ridiculous is the fact that this thread was posted after the whole issue was already put to rest.
It goes to show you how fearful and ignorant people are about Islam, that this thread has lasted as long as it has.
Freakin' witch hunts...
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 3:16:50 PM | I was'nt just speaking as to the religious aspect of it. I was referring to the culture as a whole. Religion is a part of a persons culture but it does'nt consume it entirely.
Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off". "Basically, people who don't want to be Australians, and they don't want to live by Australian values and understand them, well then they can basically clear off
The original post referred to "values" That covers many things. And thats what I was referring to when I said that if that came from. ANYONE in the United States goverment who carried any weight they would be crucified for it while others in other countries would be championed for preserving their nations values and customs.
And I stand by what I wrote cause theres no doubt about it.
edit: actually, if you check the article it says many things. I clarified what I was responding to in particular and what I got out of it.
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 3:25:44 PM | The original post referred to "values"
The OP is from a "pass it on" email, I don't happen to give spam a lot of credibility, which I pointed out in my previous post.
Actually, if you check out the story, "values" specifically refers to, and I quote:
"democracy, the rule of law, the independent judiciary, independent liberty."
TONY JONES: It sounds like you're inviting Muslims who don't want to integrate to go to another country. Is it as simple as that?
PETER COSTELLO: No. I'm saying if you are thinking of coming to Australia, you ought to know what Australian values are.
TONY JONES: But what about if you're already here and you don't want to integrate?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, I'll come to that in a moment. But there are some clerics who have been quoted as saying they recognise two laws. They recognise Australian law and Sharia law. There's only one law in Australia, it's the Australian law. For those coming to Australia, I think we ought to be very clear about that. We expect them to recognise only one law and to observe it.
Now, for those who are born in Australia, I'd make the same point. This is a country which has a Constitution. Under its Constitution, the state is secular. Under its constitution, the law is made by the parliament. Under its Constitution, it's enforced by the judiciary. These are Australian values and they're not going to change and we would expect people, when they come to Australia or if they are born in Australia, to respect those values.
TONY JONES: I take it that if you're a dual citizen and you have the opportunity to leave and you don't like Australian values, you're encouraging them to go away; is that right?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, if you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country which practises it, perhaps then that's a better option.
TONY JONES: But isn't this the sort of thing you hear in pubs, the meaningless populism you hear on talkback radio? Essentially, the argument is if you don't like it here, you should go back home.
PETER COSTELLO: No. Essentially, the argument is Australia expects its citizens to abide by core beliefs - democracy, the rule of law, the independent judiciary, independent liberty. You see, Tony, when you come to Australia and you go to take out Australian citizenship you either swear on oath or make an affirmation that you respect Australia's democracy and its values. That's what we ask of people that come to Australia and if they don't, then it's very clear that this is not the country - if they can't live with them - whose values they can't share. Well, there might be another country where their values can be shared.
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 7:56:03 PM | Heh heh... did you get that from the International Society of Gays and Lesbians?
ummmm.....Late..how many years did you LIVE in an Islamic country?
Not the topic of the OP, but,
Never, I do however live in a part of Canada that has a lot of Muslims from many parts of the world. North Africa, Middle East, South Asia many are: Friends, Neighbours, Coworkers, Clients, My Mechanic, The guy who makes my pizzas, the guy who delivers it, most of the cab drivers I know now that I no longer have a car, my daughter's friends, one of her teachers, my landlord, several of the students in my class at college, my math teacher at the learning centre I attended this spring, the guy I bought my Syrian Oud from, who also taught me how to properly tune it and the technique to play it.... several hours that he didn't have to spend with me, he offered, I gratefully accepted.
Western Muslims (what the topic of the OP is about) in my experience are the same as everybody else I meet, with the exception that a few of my Muslim friends are probably some of the most honest and honourable people I've ever met.
Australia, like Canada isn't a Muslim state.
I don't have to bother at all with Sharia law, or the laws from any religious tribunal, this is covered in the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, but ...I do get to enjoy the music, food, and the many wonderful friends I have made from other parts of the world, some of them Muslim states.
I often talk to them about Islam, and like the Christians who denounce Hitler - a self-proclaimed Christian; they look upon the oppression and crimes commited in the name of Islam to be anti-Islam.
By the same token, I have many Jewish friends, most of who feel the same way about right-wing Zionism.
All of the sons and daughters of Abraham have many bad examples of those who claim to be faithful, doing some pretty nasty things.
Probably why I'm a nontheist. | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 10/22/2006 8:40:35 PM | Yet ....they are lobbying for change...the wearing of the veil, the kirpan, not wearing a helmet on a motorcycle because of religious head dress..etc.etc
Lobbying is part of our "values" as a democratic people, the kirpan and turban aren't Muslim, these are Sikh symbols, not Abrhamic, more of a Hindu derivative. The history of the veil predates Islam, and comes from local customs not the Ku'ran, nor is the veil exclusive to Muslim women, nuns where veils too. Some Jews wear yarmulkes, the Amish have their own kookiness, those things are protected freedoms.
Religious affiliation is no guarantee of sanity...lol
Too true.
My only prayer: "Please God protect me from those who believe in you".
Abide by the laws of the land, and quit shoving their religion down the throats of the adoptive country.
The only people who try to force their faith's views on me so far have all been Christians.
It's their lobby groups I fear the most.
Oh, BTW, happy belated DIWALI!!!!! | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 5/18/2007 1:03:19 PM | > I believe that religion should not have anything to do with how a country is governed.
I was afraid this was going to be another repetition of the short-sighted attitudes repeated by the media every other day...
> Influence by religious values....sure. Most major religions essentially run off similiar moral values anyways.
Until that. 100% agreed. Well said :)
> Should any one sect be run out of any country? Hell yeah....but ONLY if they are undermining the
> w/ gov't of the land and it is proving to be corrosive to the moral fiber of the country.
Disagreed on that. To me, the whole problem with our society (apart from capitalism) is that we don't appreciate new points of view enough. We tolerate new views, like those from the animal rights movement -- we may even admit they have some value. BUT, we don't actually get off our asses and change things. Then, when those fringe groups turn to violence or so-called "terrorism" to make themselves heard, we brand them as criminals and push them further to the fringes of society, where actual crazy people get attracted to their fringe status and ever-more-extreme attitudes. We create our own monsters that will eventually FORCE us to change by ignoring the earlier ethical reasons to change. | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 5/18/2007 2:23:34 PM | | I agree 100% with this thread. If you don't like the country you are in, get the Hell out! I am sick of Minorities trying to dictate to the Masses. If a person or group feels that they have been wronged take it through the proper channels. Native land claims come to mind in this thought. | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 5/18/2007 5:08:17 PM | | Okay, so I didn't have this worded 100% correct and leave it to you to put your twist on what I meant. I certainly do not appreciate my comments being twisted to imply that I am racist because that is incorrect. I was referring to groups that are using force to push their own aggendas. I do not seeing people discriminated against, but I am referring to those who terrorize other to push their aggendas. | |
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| BRITS, AMERICANS and CANADIANS.....ARE YOU LISTENING? This is Leadership
Posted: 5/19/2007 1:54:01 PM | Marita we may often disagree but on this I must concur.
I wouldn't dream of going to Saudi Arabia and being able to have a beer while I'm there as alcohol is forbidden by that countries laws, likewise I will not accept Sharia law in MY country. These people knew we have different values when they came here and THEY MUST ACCEPT our values if they are to stay. Our laws MUST take primacy, if they have acultural difference which DOES NOT contradict our laws they are more than welcome to express it as they see fit. But once they cross that line out they go. | |
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