| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/7/2007 9:19:56 AM | Before we open our mouths to chat with other, maybe we should ask ourselves "is this person going to have any interest in what I am saying?"
Personally, I don't want to hear about children, pets, and loved ones who have passed on. That conversation leaves me wondering why the person hasn't moved on and got a life.
I want to learn about the person that I am chatting with. Who they were in the past doesn't have much to do with who they are today because we are always changing....................or are some of us?
I am not trying to be harsh. I wouldn't bore people by chatting about things they can't or don't want to relate to. People aren't put there as our person listener to our memories. Memories belong in our brains, not to repeat again and again until others want to avoid the subject.
That is how I live, and how I am enjoying living. I enjoyed my late husband when he was alive, but he wouldn't have wanted me to stop growing and changing after his death. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/7/2007 9:29:39 AM | Well my feeling is till you have gone through the grieving process you shouldnt be thinking of dating. Is is not a panacea for becoming whole again. And yes if you have children the past will always be a part of the future, but its not a competition. I look forward to a future with someome new. I can't change whtever happened in the past.....that is behind me. AS for the widower vs the divorces thing. I admit there may be many reasons for divorce, but I must admit I would prefer to date a widower. I question in my mind when I see divorce and that may seem jusdgmental. Not that I wouldn't date someone that has been divorced. Ihe issue is getting to know the person in question. Putting people in categories is not something I do. I have seen some profiles however that make me question if the person is really ready to move on with their life. I think thats the main thing.
DONT TAKE AWAY SOMEONES DREAM........IT MAY BE ALL THEY HAVE!!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/7/2007 10:13:09 AM | Tears
Oh let them fall
like warm salt rain
like a shower
washing away hurt, pain
cleaning a heart
where you will remain
with all the others
the ones who grew away
or never grew
the cleanest clearest of leavings:
against both your will and mine.
each a flame, and claim
on who I have become
like root growing around rock
or the push of a persistent
coast wind on tamarisk
I am glad for each, for every
each, a teacher
But for you, the bonfire
in my heart, most of all:
who left that heart
an open door
1/04/2007 | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 1:56:32 PM | | Not sure if my reasons are the same as any other women's reasons, but I'd never consider dating a widower because I have had my own life, my own tastes and preferences. When a person is divorced, that should tell you that they left something they didn't like in search of something that they will (like) What man or woman our ages is willing to step in and take over SOMEONE ELSE's life??? What if my pot roast is different, what if I like solid curtains and she liked flowers, what if she liked soap operas and I like Science channel....how long would it take this "happily married" guy to pick apart every single preference I have because it doesn't fit into the happily married life that he dreams of replacing? | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 2:10:00 PM | "What man or woman our ages is willing to step in and take over SOMEONE ELSE's life??? What if my pot roast is different, what if I like solid curtains "
Say what????????????? You must be talking about folk who became widows yesterday. Lots of us widowed folks that have widowed for a decade or two. Pot roast and curtains..............who would remember unimportant stuff like that?? Not me. My world has been striped by my own hand and rebuilt just the way I like it---------to my taste and my taste alone. Anyone interested in being part of my life needs to bring their own individule personality/style. Anyone who could worry about take over someone else's life hasn't been in datingland long enough to figure out what is real and what is not. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 5:34:58 PM | Talk about narrow minded??? wow. I've talked to 2 widowed men, both on POF, both contacted me, not the other way around. First one was emphatic....rudely so that he intended to change NOTHING about his life...including the curtains on the windows and that he was looking for someone to fill the void. He'd been widowed 6 mos. When I said, sorry, but I'm really not interested.....he called me narrow minded as well.
Widow # 2 went on and on about how great he was due to being a widow, I politely expressed my condolences, asked how long....he said recently. Continued to tell me what I should do and not do to avoid sudden death....I asked if we could PLEASE not continue the death discussion. Turns out his "recently" was 4 years. Again asked if we could change the subject. Nope. I explained that I needed to go, but he kept talking. I said hey....I CANNOT talk to you about dieing ok....my CHILD died less than 6 months before that....talk about something else...fine, but not death.....not now. He proceded to tell me how much more traumatic losing a wife is than losing a child.
Yup, I'd call ME narrow minded and devoid of any human kindness....you sure called it right Simple. I stand corrected and guilty as charged | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 7:28:52 PM | Anybody who chats with a recently widowed (or divorced) person does so at their own peril. 4 yrs. can be recently to some people. Some divorced people (widowed too) never get over the hurt.
First thing I check when talking to a new person is where they are in the healing process. I consider that checking on the healing is respectful to the other person and to myself. I am not about to get upset with anything a grieving person says. I am just going to get out of the line of fire. No one needs a date so bad that they need to be with someone who isn't ready to date yet. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 7:41:18 PM | | "I am not about to get upset with anything a grieving person says. I am just going to get out of the line of fire. No one needs a date so bad that they need to be with someone who isn't ready to date yet." Maybe I'm different, we all are in some way, but while I was actively in the grief process, the LAST possible thing on my mind was dating. I wasn't looking to "plug" snother man into my late husband's "shoes". I'd consider that disrespectful to his memory. Not that I couldn't love again or marry again but the idea of ever "replacing" him and expecting things to be the same is ludicrous! | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 7:48:03 PM | For grandmaboo
If your in a grief process yourself why are you dating before dealing your own ...loosing a child is hard i know i lost a few myself and the level of a partner is a different window higher on the wall...your avoiding discussing the very cards on the table in your own life...
to celebrate that child is to open up your memory and embrase the great memories and place a new value(validate) on them in the grief process...be it your partner or child then you are not ready to date untill your issues with speaking about death are delt...you can not avoid that energy and the longer you subdue those emotions the longer you will pack energy...
please talk about that child to someone...my goodness how can you refuse ,
that energy and wear a mask of healed and i am ready to take on the level of a partner...
hun you need to be free from that pain before you can discover an equal...your carring a heavy load and pretending it is insignificant and that you can avoid grief...you can't but to refuse to deal is making a choice to sabatog every relationship you encounter cuz it will come back and the next partner will pay for that residue...your expecting some human to do for you what you refuse to do for the other two you just met...is a equal reflection and i agree they where seeking validation not comparing but reevaluating there memories...you pretend you have it all under control by controlling your own grief by avoiding it...please consider to process that grief before you date at a serious level....
goodluck to you....do not ever pretend that others will not call you on you words cuz your lack of process cuz when they find out they will flag you like you flagged the 2 you met...
i am sorry for you loosing your child that had to be hard...awww i hope you share and feel good about comming here for a big hug to if you need one when those days are in your horizan...you can not pack grief energy and not save residual energy in positive...that is what i felt from those words...that energy. i can feel it and it isnot good girl to avoid that card...we know cuz we all tried to pretend it didnot bug us when it happen in our life to... smiles see we can be understanding but you need to be honest about yourown grief is why your avoiding others...you do not just wipe the slate when the person dies...is not good for you
...please make yourself the priority not a date...cuz us people who are on the healed patch gotta help one another sometimes and i care more about how your letting bad experience close the door on the chance that the next widow will have the skills to help you instead of the other way around.... just do not close an option that might be good next time... | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 7:48:59 PM | | Yup, that's what he said.....his 4 years was a recent loss.....my 6 months was old enough that I should be over it. I can see where I was wrong for turning down a guy who's that sensitive and caring. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 7:57:29 PM | Point is dating is pointless until we are healed and at peace with ourselves. We can't share ourselves with another until we are free (of pain) to do so.
So many create their own brick wall. Some don't realize they are doing it. Others hug their brick wall. Still others have torn down their brick walls a long time ago. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 8:11:08 PM | sweetheart it is ok we understand that cuz we where there once...you will have good days and bad ones...tell ya what when you have bad ones talk to us...cuz we are always here for you.... this is not only about dating this is about sharing our experiences and helping others cuz we know how hard it is,,,,awwwww
i sure hope to see you release that energy cuz it is critical to free yourself from the burdan of that weight...your child would want that ma..
.and just cuz you begin to process means your choosing to rejuvinate your value means your in there right
place...welcome to the thread and widow or child it still is the same validation for that
regrouping of the memory process...your not broken my sweet and every human here is here to give you help where ever you need it...some will whine but a healed fish will kick there sorry azz to....
one day at a time we will dig you out...no fear girl. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 8:22:17 PM | Some of our advice might seem harsh, but most of us make these statements because we know all the mistakes we ourselves made, and we don't want others to get hurt. Of course, making mistakes are sometimes necessary in the healing process. Just knowing that others have reacted the same way that I did helped me to feel sane and survivable.
Good bless all those who have a brick wall of pain. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 9:12:08 PM | Dear Boo, So sorry to hear of your loss.
I am also sorry to hear about the insensitive nature of the widower you were in contact with. How can we begin to compare our losses? Why would we want to?
Losing anyone in our life is devastating. Child, spouse, sibling, parent....
And how can a timetable for grief be attached to anyones loss?
People who are widows or widowers, and were insensitive and selfish before their spouses death, may continue to be insensitive and selfish.
Just because we have lost someone in our lives, does not mean that we are sweet and wonderful.
Losing someone can change us, and change us in positive ways. Make us more aware of the joys that we are missing. Make us love the people who are still with us more. Simple things like sharing a cup of coffee or touching a friends hand are wonderful loving moments.
I can no more forget the wonderful years my husband and I spent together, than you can forget the joy of having a child.
So perhaps the people who advise others to not date widows or widowers have a valid point. Perhaps our experience has made us different and we are a more risky challenge.
I am hoping that the right person will see that I am worth the chance. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/9/2007 9:51:55 PM | OMG, unbelievable....an hour ago I was beneath contempt for stating that I wouldn't consider a widower and now I'm a hero because my beautiful daughter died? That's a man's game....NOT mine.
your avoiding discussing the very cards on the table in your own life... I avoided nothing, I clearly stated that I wasn't ready to take on his grief issues...it was HE who insisted that his was more valid than mine.
please talk about that child to someone...my goodness how can you refuse not with a widower remember.....he lost more than you did.
This is not a grief forum, it's a widow/widower forum.
your carring a heavy load and pretending it is insignificant and that you can avoid grief...you can't but to refuse to deal is making a choice to sabatog every relationship you encounter cuz it will come back and the next partner will pay for that residue... I'm neither pretending nor sabatoging anything. At the time of my conversation with that particular widower, it had been 6 months, it has now been almost 16 months. I have not put grief on a time table....I have the rest of my life. It's not like I'm going remarry and she'll no longer be my child. As for relationships, they know upfront that I've spent the last 16 months practicing being emotionally numb and it's quite likely as I allow myself to feel emotions again...they could very well be weird. I have a great many 1st's yet to experience, but I'm NOT looking to have my behavior excused, just understood.....or not...their choice.
But back to the topic: and as I admitted in my first post, I haven't talked to that many (widowers); and admittedly, I MAY be overly sensitive about the entire issue....but I find it very tacky to use being a widow as an excuse for not dating. I don't know if there's a forum for grieving Mom's....cause I haven't looked. It's never occurred to me to complain that I haven't been on a date just because men don't want to date grieving Mothers. I certainly have compassion for anyone who's lost anyone they love...I still can't even watch a movie where a child dies. I still have to question how would this man's deceased wife feel knowing that he's using her to troll for women? Ok, well, I obviously shouldn't be here so....good luck to all! | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/10/2007 11:02:46 AM | "I find it very tacky to use being a widow as an excuse for not dating"
Please explain. I can't think of a meaning for the above. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/10/2007 11:17:32 AM | "But back to the topic: and as I admitted in my first post, I haven't talked to that many (widowers); and admittedly, I MAY be overly sensitive about the entire issue....but I find it very tacky to use being a widow as an excuse for not dating. I don't know if there's a forum for grieving Mom's....cause I haven't looked. It's never occurred to me to complain that I haven't been on a date just because men don't want to date grieving Mothers. I certainly have compassion for anyone who's lost anyone they love...I still can't even watch a movie where a child dies. I still have to question how would this man's deceased wife feel knowing that he's using her to troll for women? Ok, well, I obviously shouldn't be here so....good luck to all!"
First off my sincere condolences for your loss.
It's your right to have preferences (like everyone ELSE) in who you date and who you don't and don't "owe" anyone any explanation. It's your choice to make, people waste far too much energy giving someone a hard time over something that isn't their business and doesn't affect them.
I probably wouldn't have had the patience you did, pushing discussing the topic of death when you'd already asked to redirect the conversation. No matter that the topic, that's inconsiderate and disrespectful behavior. An indication of a selfish personality...dodged a bullet on that.
Just an FYI, Hospice has lots of resources (materials, videos, support groups) for people grieving the loss of anyone close. There are certainly similarities and differences in losing a child or a spouse.
I wish you happiness and if you're still grieving, healing and comfort and hope for that day that you are whole again and can embrace your future with joy. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/11/2007 8:48:43 PM | The assumption that people make regarding widows/widowers is that the spause that remains behind will pine over the lost spouse while a divorced individual left because they no longer loved their spouse. The fallacy here is that most widow(er)s realize their marriages were not perfect. Also, many divorced people were in love with their spouse up to the date the divorce was final and beyond (i.e. The other spouse wanted the divorce, not them.).
The only thing you can do is listen to them and decide for yourself whether they are ready for dating based on their actions, not just what they say. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/12/2007 3:31:30 PM | | My Husband died at 41yrs old.....I waited several years before I even attempted dating. Went to counseling and my Daughter moved out of the house.........I had my ducks in a roll before I even attempted to date. It has been five years since his death and I have been dating a year. Because of being married for a long time first I had to get use to dating again. I felt like I was in high school. After going on a few dates....those poor Men were very nice. I started relaxing. I had other things to discuss than the topic of my Husband's death. I waited a long time to start dating again because I had been raising a family and dealing with his death. During that time I found other things to do and slowly started making a life for myself again. So whenever I started dating the focus wasn't on my Husband's death and I didn't compare my date to him. I have interesting things to talk about. But it takes awhile to get to that point. And it takes pratice. If I do get to know someone we will discuss him but we also discuss their X wives. I haven't found it to be a hinderance yet. I have put him in my heart but I stay focused on the here and now. The counseling has helped but time is what has helped more. I have had enough time to place him in my heart and move on. This way you can heal and with time comes distance. I could never even see myself moving away from him but like they say Time Heals,,,,,,,Blue | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/12/2007 5:50:34 PM | Alone...I am a widow who lost her husband a year and a half ago. I think the problem could be that when you meet someone and all you do is talk about your spouse it turns that person away. They think that maybe your not over your love for your wife/husband. When I met my husband, he was married but his wife passed away and in the beginning all he use to talk about was her. It was very difficult to handle. I listen and listen, and listen. Finally I just said, if you and I are going to try and make this, we need to concentrate on us. I am NOT saying your doing this but sometimes people feel threaten especially if you had a good marriage.
It is very hard being in the position were in because I've noticed a lot of my married friends backed off also. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/12/2007 8:37:02 PM | | I am a widow but as I see it, it isn't threatening, it is just down right bored to spend every minute with someone we care about having them talk only about the deceased, whether it was a spouse or other love one. It makes perfect sense to begin with, and until the person has healed - I am not talking about during this time. I am talking about when the person moves into dating. You are dating but the subject always goes to the late spouse. That says this person still needs time to fill themselves with interests, and a lifestyle to share with others. I am not trying to be harsh. Please - do you want to hear about how wonderful the person's late spouse was, or do you want to hear about how wonder the sunset was last night etc. I believe if folks are dating they need to stop and smell the roses, and leave the sadness behind. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/13/2007 9:50:33 AM | I've had more trubble with the one I'm with bringing it up, and questioning if I'm ready to move on. Sure, Edwin's part of me, as are my kids, friends, sibs, exes, teachers, and other life experiences. To put an artificial block on just the one name seems krezzy to me.
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/13/2007 10:10:44 AM | I have been a widow for 15 years no. There is no aftificial block going on. My long term friends knew my late husband, but there hasn't been a reason to speak of his in years except maybe something will be said like "Oh he so enjoyed his cats", (that is maybe every few years.) The past is in the past.
My parents have passed on too. I didn't have a reason to talk much about them before they died short of stuff like "Oh, I will be away visiting my parents, and can't go with you to...............".
I guess I just have so much stuff I enjoy going on in my life that is so much more interesting to discuss with people than chatting about what happened a decade ago, or many decades ago.
I understand that new people may ask things like our status and how we have coped with it. A few words can cover that.
I have completely renovated my home years ago, even moving walls etc. There is no reason to pull my late husband into the converstation with such things as "Oh, he painted the room..............., built this deck etc. I have travelled at least 6 x's a year to fair away places in the last decade, so trips I took with my late husband just don't come up in conversation.
I would guess that new neighbours probably think that I am divorced or never married because I don't go up to new people and introduce myself as a widow or bring it into the conversation. I think that people would be far more interested in who I am in 2007 than who I was in the early 90's.
In fact the only place I talk about being a widow is here in the forum. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/13/2007 12:36:46 PM | I don't have a problem with a person who talks about an ex or his late spouse by saying something like, "I went to the Smokies with Sue all the time and we loved it."
I wouldn't expect him to drop her from that statement. I don't want to have to give up ten years of happy memories just so someone new won't feel threatened. If someone has been in my life for ten years or so, their name is going to pop up once in awhile and I consider that natural.
That's different then trying to replace them or trying to compare a new love with an old one. I still tell funny stories about my ex....like when we set the clocks back so we could put the kids to bed an hour early......I think it's a sign of healing when you can bring up the ex's or the late spouse's name and NOT be teary eyed or upset doing that. When you can recall happy memories........
Now if they are stuck in the past or stuck on their ex or their late spouse, that's different but for their names to come up here and there.........to me, it's not a big deal. | |
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| Widows & Widowers - a brick wall
Posted: 11/13/2007 12:52:49 PM | I think it is a "time thing". How long has it been since becoming widowed? and just what have people done with their lives since.
If you went to the Smokies (wherever that is) with the s/o often, then spent 15 years travelling to international destination plus visiting many places in your own country, it is doubtful that the Smokies would come to mind that often.
I live in the same house that I did with my late husband. However, the town is six times as big now. The whole area has been developed. Many people have moved to other places. Lots of people my age have retired and moved away. Life doesn't stand still.
What the heck has the fact that I was once widowed got to do with my life today? Threatened? After this much time, if a person is the type of feel threatened by anything, it is far more likely that my not remarrying after all this time would threaten them, not the fact that I am a widow. | |
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