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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 1:42:06 PM |
The "pool" of available men tends to get thinner as women age. Women tend to live longer than men. Men tend to avoid dating women who are older. (unless they want a good inheritance)
LOL ~ you and I obviously swim in a different pool. 
Men want a independent woman. 1835
Not all men. 
I agree. I am independent because I am alone. If in a good relationship, it's nice to not have to have any power, or gender struggles over anything. I haven't been there, truly since my divorce, but it will be interesting, meshing finances, and all when it does happen. I DO like being the feminine, nurturing one though, and as long as he takes good care of me it'll all be good. Not speaking financially here, but as a woman who likes the security of being in strong arms.............. 1839
I so agree. 
I would be more inclined to believe that if there weren't so many women on this thread who keep trying to blame men ("insecure", "intimidated") for their being single. 1842
Hmmm ~ guess I missed those particular posts. Seems to me that most women here are attempting to explain things from their own personal experiences. I may have missed the bra burning ceremony  the blame-game and those insisting insecurity/intimidation are the cause of their singleness. But then again, maybe I just read with an open mind versus instantenous judgments of people that are really just strangers in little white boxes. 
As long as the physical relationship is in tact ... there really never seems to be any other obstacle that presents itself that two people couldn't handle. 1843
cotter:  Yep, when the sex wains, disappears, becomes non-existent, or even faulters ~ it's usually a signifier in my relationship that there are some deep-seated other issues. And, it's usually the beginning/middle of the end (which inevitably follows shortly thereafter.) Sigh. 
Again, I think part of this problem stems from the fact that most women start to lose their cool when they realize that all men in the universe don't want them, even men they didn't want in the first place, which is just downright baffling.
Yes, I know for my own self, when a man does not show interest in me ~ I literally fall apart. I lose my composure, my self-esteem, my ability to eat, my world becomes a place filled with obsessive/compulsive thoughts screaming, "WHY? WHY? WHY?" (PFT............PLEASE ~ that is about the silliest statement I've read in weeks, good for a giggle though.  )
Folks, this includes men and women, have to stop finding things to focus on and blame to explain away why no one wants to date them. It really isn't that hard but people want to make it hard because they don't want to have to accept that they need to make changes to get the things that they want. 1847
If I need to change him or myself to make things workable, he's the WRONG man for me. It's pretty simple ~ like me, love me, or a combination of both, but you try to change me, it's O-V-E-R. Likewise, if I find myself wanting to change something or multiple things about any man ~ what's going to change is my "status" with that man. 
"Men are intimidated by my independence!"
Yeah, that's a load of BS. Men are never that complicated. If a man isn't paying you any attention or asking you out, he's not attracted to you. It's that simple. 1847
Ummm, I wonder if you neglect to realize that it takes two willing parties to meet/date/forge a relationship ???? I don't give a ratz-azz who isn't attracted to me, because it's probably quite mutual. I'm just as un-interested in certain men as they are lacking interest in me. I'm not sure about other women, but I never lost sleep wondering, "Why isn't he interested in me?" 
How can you call a woman independent if she keeps trying to blame others ("insecure men") for her own situation? I would hardly call a lack of willingness to take responsibility for their own situations being "independent". 1850
Personally, I'm single by choice. It's just that simple. No blame to place on myself or anyone else. I am single, have been and will continue to be by my own choice ~ I might be exceedingly "traditional" when in a relationship, but that certainly doesn't mean I'm willing to jump into a relationship just to be "traditional."
If you are happy with being alone, why advertise on a site?
Because I can.
Maybe in case prince charming meets your impossible checklist? On the other hand it really should be the onus on the guy to weed out from their selections women who really aren't looking. There are a lot of them out there, especially those out of the breeding age range.
Oh holy hell ~ I've been non-breedable since age 24. LMAO ~ I wonder if my ex's realize that they loved me when I wasn't breeding material.  Guess I should give a few of them a call to find out. (Errrr, maybe you meant "pro-creatable"..... because I'm certainly still "breedable" so to speak. Tee hee.  )
Most threads like these are debated ferociously by women who arent looking, and have given up, many of whom are over 40 debating younger men at a different stage in their lives. They cant find what they want or arent attractive enough for an ltr, so they unilaterally claim they don't need a man. Truth is emotionally we do need others and to claim otherwise is self deception. Thats why we are still on forums, becuase it makes us sociable even when single. 1851
I had absolutely NO clue being attractive was a pre-requisite to a ltr. I am now enlightened. 
~OT~ Drop the terminology, the labels, the hostility ~ leave forums and go profile lurking. Write a few emails, go out into the real world and meet a man/woman who likes you just as you are. There are plenty of men who prefer more "traditional" women and there are those who want more "equality" in their personal relationships. Dear me, it's not like re-inventing the wheel ~ it's simple male/female interaction.  | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 2:59:29 PM |
(Msg 1843) I agree whole-heartedly. As long as the physical relationship is in tact ... there really never seems to be any other obstacle that presents itself that two people couldn't handle.
Exactly! It seems there are very few people who realize that. They think that sex is only about....well, sex.
But my question to the men would be ... If a woman said the same thing "There must be sex" ...
**Would he feel "used"?
**Would he eventually get "performance" anxiety?
**What happens then? I've seen threads in here where men are complaining ... a woman can go anytime, but a man has to be able to "perform".
**If he has something on his mind, or is getting older and experiencing problems with ED ... would that be the end of the relationship?
Because sex is about more than sex, meaning actual intercourse, there is no reason for a man to feel inadequate. If one of the many medications on the today’s market can’t help there are still ways to satisfy ones partner. After all, many women already satisfy themselves sexually without a man except for the human touch, that is.
I think the hidden "fear" is if a man can not keep up sexually with his gal he knows she can easily supplement it. On the other hand it would be a great problem to have.
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 3:15:37 PM | If I'm feeding myself and putting a roof over my head, it's obvious if I am independent or not. I don't have any trouble finding dates so clearly men WILL date independant women. I don't scream it to the sky, because it's not necessary...
BUT, and I've posted this before... The majority of men's profiles that I read list "must be independant" as a requirement — seriously, just about every profile. I have said before and will say again that some of the women proclaiming it in their profiles MIGHT simply be reacting to having seen this so many times.
So I don't see why it's such a bad word.
I do think though that while some of them are proclaiming to women, by requiring independence, that they will not pay their way so don't look for a free ride, others might just be saying that they don't want someone that is clingy and doesn't have a life of her own apart from him.
So while it shows up on 90% of the mens' profiles I view, it probably means one thing to one half and something completely different to the other. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 3:41:02 PM | Message 1852: I don't think that the independent women you are referring to really cares why a man doesn't want to date them, and if she ends up alone then her view is "so be it" - that's what they mean by independent.
Message 1853: Of course they care.
Who doesn't want to have someone to come home to and feel cared for and appreciated and loved? And that's not just women, that's everyone. Everyone wants that deep down inside whether they want to admit it or not. Being lonely sucks. No one wants to be lonely.
Someone screaming to the sky that they are independent is really just letting all the men out there know that no one wants them. That's all there is to it.
Well, my guess is there is something else going on here. I don't think women would scream out to men that no one wants them - how does that make any sense? Do you really think that a woman would advertise that the reason she thinks she's still on a relationship site is that no one wants her?
Instead, it could be that women care, but that there are emotions other than lonely to consider. Some women might feel lonely at times, but many have to ability to cope with those feelings and to resolve it by ways such as spending time with friends and family. They might ache to have a relationship with a man, but can process those feelings and get some peace from them. Like the women in Japan who are choosing a career over marriage, I suspect that there are other emotions that collectively outweigh the feeling of love for another person in a romantic way. The feelings from being in love with another person are right at the top for many, but when a person has a lot of other emotions going on then the yearning for love could be overcome as women and men demonstrate all the time.
If this is the "place" an independent woman is in, then why not just recognize that they aren't ready for someone less than quite perfect in their eyes and move on? It's nothing that any individual man is responsible for personally. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 3:50:18 PM | I have had the request in my profile since day one.
You may call it a call sign, hell you may call it whatever you want. I want a woman that can stand on her own so when we do come together it is an added benefit, not a required one. I am not talking monetarily, even though that fits, I mean someone that can make her own decisions and having me is a plus, not a "have to".
Even if this doesn't make sense to most, to the few, it means even more... | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 3:58:02 PM |
If this is the "place" an independent woman is in, then why not just recognize that they aren't ready for someone less than quite perfect in their eyes and move on?
But, that's what many of us men have done and continue to do. We show our interest in the brassy, ballsy, obnoxious, self-proclaimed and self-aggrandizing 'independent' women by running away.
Why don't women just accept that and quit asking "Why, why, why are men so intimidated by us?" despite how many times we say we do like truly independent women?
Yumpin' Yiminy, there was yet ANOTHER 'Why are men intimidated by independent women?' thread started again today over in "Ask a Guy" forum. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 3:58:40 PM |
The majority of men's profiles that I read list "must be independant" as a requirement — seriously, just about every profile. While I do have a sneaking suspicion that a lot of men have their own view (perhaps preconceived) of what it means when a woman writes in her profile that she is "independent" ...
I wonder how the men (who have that as a requirement in their own profiles) would define it ...
... I wonder what they mean by "must be independent"?
Personally I would interpret it to mean that they do expect the lady to be self-supporting.
On the other hand, I have experienced that some of the gentlemen are wanting a lady who can be free to travel with them ... no family obligations (children, grandchildren, caregiver situations, no pets, etc.)
I know this because that is what they tell me they want from me. (Obviously my age plays a factor in that equation.) I do have retired gentlemen contacting me and they are ready to put their suits in the closet and slip into their casual wear and hit the road. I cannot accommodate that as I am still pursuing my career and would get 2 weeks per year for such purposes ... tops.
So no matter how much I'd like to pursue a friendship / eventual relationship with them, I already know from the git go that my not being free to just drop everything and go will be a big deal. No sense in even putting time into it because we all know that is already going to put a real drag on things.
What choice do I have except to say ... "Sorry, I got a late start on my career and I have to stay put 50 weeks out of the year in order to pay my bills." Otherwise, I would become just that what he is trying to avoid ... a burden. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:02:04 PM | *sigh* VGE: You can speak for me anyday..(hugs) Nuff' said.
Lass: I feel the same way about you..(hugs) You go, girl!!
Guess I'll just take my pathetic little "independant" self and grill a filet mignon, change the oil, pay the bills, and feed my 4 starving cats and pray TO GOD a man appears at my door to take these burdens from me!!!! NOT!!! haha!!!!
What's really sad is that I've had to behave like more of a "man" as a "woman" than any of the prior bozo's that I've dated in the past. These dang guys can't even locate the "hood latch" on an SUV...they just want to "call in a mechanic" to fix the problem..haha!! They get all bent out of shape when little miss 5 foot tall munchkin can fix the problem and they can't.!! haha..talk about their ego getting bruised..what noobs!!
Oh..and for the record, I grilled the filet mignon for my 4 cats. I'm having a peanut butter and jelly sandwich tonight.
Sans | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:04:21 PM | But, that's what many of us men have done and continue to do. We show our interest in the brassy, ballsy, obnoxious, self-proclaimed and self-aggrandizing 'independent' women by running away.
Why don't women just accept that and quit asking "Why, why, why are men so intimidated by us?" despite how many times we say we do like truly independent women?
Yumpin' Yiminy, there was yet ANOTHER 'Why are men intimidated by independent women?' thread started again today over in "Ask a Guy" forum.
There are a lot of threads that pop up over and over again. If you're tired of them, it's very simple - don't look and don't answer. If you know that your answer won't be listened to, don't provide one. If you don't like the traits of the women you name above, then pass them by. This is a relationship site, and no one is responsible here for resolving anything for anyone here other than themself and the person they are looking for. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:04:34 PM | Message 1852:
why isn't it just assumed that women have their own jobs, pay their own bills, etc etc, just like men are assumed to do these things?
Well said Realist59. I agree totally. With the above assumption the term 'independent' then becomes superfluous within the context of needing someone, as oppossed to wanting someone to share life with.
If ever person who has posted on this topic was asked to write their own definition of 'independent' in 50 words, there would be many similar definitions but few would be indentical in every aspect.
As for anyone using the term independent within their profile, I reckon it should be read within the context of the entire profile, not as a 'stand alone' statement. If anyone reading it does not think it fits within their scope of friendship/relationship possibilities simply move on 'Live & let Live', unless they dance with steel caps on and use your toes as a landing strip. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:05:41 PM | Me, in msg 1842:
I would be more inclined to believe that if there weren't so many women on this thread who keep trying to blame men ("insecure", "intimidated") for their being single.
Verygreeneyez's response, in msg 1855:
Hmmm ~ guess I missed those particular posts. Seems to me that most women here are attempting to explain things from their own personal experiences. I may have missed the bra burning ceremony the blame-game and those insisting insecurity/intimidation are the cause of their singleness. But then again, maybe I just read with an open mind versus instantenous judgments of people that are really just strangers in little white boxes.
LOL I believe this is called selective listening; or, selective reading, in this case. I quoted two examples in msg 1840 of this happening, and they were posted as recently as yesterday. And anybody who cares to can go back through the 70+ pages of this thread and find example after example of women saying "men are just afraid of our independence". So if you have "missed those particular posts", it's because you're not paying attention. "Open-minded", huh....?
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These last couple of pages is a perfect example of why one person in this thread (whom I quoted in msg 1840) said in frustration that it's pointless trying to have a meaningful conversation with women. Here you have no less then SIX different guys all saying basically the same thing. And while some of the women responding are smart enough, or emotionally mature enough, to actually listen, there are even more women who want to argue and write about non sequitors like Japanese women! Rather than look at your own compulsion to argue and refute anything you don't want to hear, you just keep repeating the same tired mantra: "Men are intimidated by my independence!". Yeah, right. How's that working for ya?
If you're not willing to take what has been said here (ad nauseum) to heart, and do a little introspection, then you truly have nobody to blame but yourselves. And to think, men get a bad rap for not listening....
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In msg 1857, Irreverent Lass said:
BUT, and I've posted this before... The majority of men's profiles that I read list "must be independant" as a requirement — seriously, just about every profile.
That's interesting. I don't often peruse mens' profiles (heh heh) so I can't really say what's on them. But my personal opinion is that guys shouldn't use the word either; it's just too vague.
I'll say again what I said earlier: rather than say "I'm independent", it's probably better to just say what that means to you. For example, instead of saying, "I'm independent", say, "I have my own career, and a circle of good friends. What I'm looking for is a man who....." etc etc. That way, you avoid a word that is obviously a hot-button. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:15:56 PM | For all the back and forth between the genders, neither has the market cornered on the "darned if you do" "darned if you don't".
I haven't done any scientific research (tongue in cheek!!) but I do think that many women who may have it in their profile do for the purpose of letting a prospective man know that they don't require financial support. There's many other threads that bear out how important an issue this seems to be, so maybe they're just thinking they'd overcome that objection right off.
So just consider that maybe some of the women that have that on their profile just do so to alleviate a concern about being thought of as someone that's after a man's wallet.
It's another "darned if you do""darned if you don't" situation, and yes it does happen to women, too.
As someone said, it was said dozens of pages ago, men DO date independent women, have long term relationships, marriages and long happy lives together. Some don't or won't and do want a woman to support and take care of. It's an individual choice, neither is wrong. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:17:32 PM |
Lass: I feel the same way about you..(hugs) You go, girl!!
Thank you, that's a big compliment, Sans.
Yumpin' Yiminy, there was yet ANOTHER 'Why are men intimidated by independent women?' thread started again today over in "Ask a Guy" forum.
I'm sick of the over abundance of the threads popping up too. Let her have her "independent" thread in Ask a Guy. She's been directed here at least five times in two pages and ignored every reference to this thread so her motives are suspect.
Maybe some of you gents need to click on each others' profiles more. I think a lot of women do it, but it might give you some insight into what I was talking about with how frequently independence is a specified requirement. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:22:14 PM |
Maybe some of you gents need to click on each others' profiles more. I think a lot of women do it, but it might give you some insight into what I was talking about with how frequently independence is a specified requirement.
I would look at other guys' profiles, but it'd kinda feel like when you avoid at all costs even glancing at another man's package after the shower at the gym.
Yikes! | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 4:37:39 PM |
I would look at other guys' profiles, but it'd kinda feel like when you avoid at all costs even glancing at another man's package after the shower at the gym.
lol All guys do though, otherwise they'd forever wonder how they measured up. Consider this similar, without the naughty bits. | |
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CTR916
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Joined: 11/27/2006
Msg: 1867 | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 5:18:25 PM |
All guys do though, otherwise they'd forever wonder how they measured up.
And, you know this because....... ??? Have you been installing those little spy-cams in places you ought not to be? Hmmmmmm....?? | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 5:24:14 PM |
I would look at other guys' profiles, but it'd kinda feel like when you avoid at all costs even glancing at another man's package after the shower at the gym. Yikes!
C'mon guys ... where's your spirit of adventure? | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 5:54:26 PM | Again..."independence", as in looks, are in the eye of the beholder.
I take care of myself and no one foots the bill for my life OR my lifestyle. (I live on a barrier island in Florida and I made that happen myself without a man's opinion, decision, or advice.) Does that make me "independent?" Yes, in my eyes it does. No one is contributing to my life financially or otherwise to make it what it is but me, therefore I'm independent in knowing without a doubt I can take care of myself, my animals, and any other situation that may arise in my life.
Do I NEED a man to take care of me? no.
Do I WANT a man to take of me? no.
Do I want a controlling jerk that is intimidated by me because I can fix the toilet without his help? no.
Do I want an equal partner that respects the fact that I CAN take care of everything and is still willing to "change the oil" in my SUV simply because he "wants to" do this for me, knowing quite well I can do it for myself? yes.
Nuff' said. Sans | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 5:57:21 PM | I happen to be one of those "****es" who make the statement that I am independent.
My statement that I am independent means....I am not looking for someone to pay my way, bail me out or make my life financially better....I am looking for a life partner....period.
My financial independence came from no other source than from my own hard work...not from an inheritance and not from an ex....I got nothing out of my divorce.
I have listened to man after man tell me about "rescuing" a poor helpless woman by paying her bills and buying her things such as cars, only for her to take the money and run......
So if that makes me a ****....so be it.....at least I'm not a blood sucking leech.
B-beautiful
I-intelligent
T-terrific
C-charming
H-hot mama | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 5:59:22 PM | there is a LOT more to being independent than just the financial aspect.
And that is what so many seem to focus on.
Rather pitiful after 70 some pages.
You see, what so many people call being independent is actually just being an adult and doing what you need to do. Sorry, but you don't get a medal for doing what you are supposed to be doing anyway. | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 6:04:23 PM |
LOL I believe this is called selective listening; or, selective reading, in this case. I quoted two examples in msg 1840 of this happening, and they were posted as recently as yesterday. And anybody who cares to can go back through the 70+ pages of this thread and find example after example of women saying "men are just afraid of our independence". So if you have "missed those particular posts", it's because you're not paying attention. "Open-minded", huh....?
Just because I didn't validate your post/opinion or agree with you doesn't necessarily mean I've missed anything. Just like you, I could site many posts from this thread that would/could/might/may devalue your opinion, verbage, ideology, etc. But that would be silly. As for open-mindedness, if I'm not learning something from someone else's perspective ~ I'm wasting my time here. I'm sort of a glass half full kind of gal. Emotional vampires and I don't usually see eye to eye. Stereo-typing, trash talking, gender bashing and the other types of things that are prevelent (here in forums at times) aren't needed noticing/validation by me ~ there are plenty of others taking care of that side of this debate. I can assure you ~ I miss very little. And now, this is where you and I part ways, as this is technically called an "impasse". 
~OT~ As an independent thinker (HA...there's that icky word again) I prefer to see something worthwhile in most things ~ seems to work for me, even if my way doesn't work for someone else. To each their own. 
PS: I am headed over to Sans for dinner with her cats, those dudes are having steak tonight!!!  | |
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| Why men wont date independant women
Posted: 8/27/2007 6:06:02 PM | ^^^Then pray tell, dude ( msg 1876) why are you still posting to these "rather pitiful 70" pages if you have nothing more to add but the fact that the "financial aspect" of this thread bothers you?
Independent women don't have to worry about finances. We make MORE than enough to think we need a 'man' to foot the bill in any way, shape, or form.
Sans..Edit..VGE..dang, girl..you and my cats are gonna be fine dining tonight..I'll just forlornly lay on my hammock and drink my cosmopolitan glancing at you guys pitifully, munching on my pbj..*sigh* | |
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