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| the civil war
Posted: 1/14/2008 10:52:04 AM |
Your so correct but the fault lays blame far outside of the South. How long is the North going to hold the blame for the issue of slavery at the doorstep of the South? Slavery begin in the North, the foundations of New York and Boston were all built upon the Slave trade. How long is the North going to portray the South as a land full of country bumkins, hicks, crackers, etc? Why is it only the South is judged by it's simplictiy and not it's achivements? When one reads about the Egptians, Romans, or Greeks we hear nothing but praise about their accomplishments but each of them had slavery as their supporting structure but that it is regulated to a paragraph or footnote... Obviously if people want to change attitutdes then they need to stop ridiculing the southern population, it's that simple...
As a side note, I would be interested in what Native Americans think about all of this debate.
They did not have the commercial inclinations or technical sophistication of their culturally arrogant , superior-minded usurpers.
Perhaps all is fair in love and war is an acceptable rationalization.
The North I was raised in taught me that we are The United States of America.. 13 colonies took on Great Britain in a fight for Independence. The catalyst issue being taxation without representation. From there our Proclamation of Independence was issued, and those colonists earned respect and recognition on the world stage for beating incredible odds.
We the people stood united.
Nationhood was won. All is fair in love and war.
It's that simple.
The Declaration of Independence our nation's most cherished symbol of liberty. Jefferson articulated the highest ideals of the Revolution, beliefs in liberty, equality, and the right to self-determination. Americans embraced the idea that a person's position is determined, not by birth, rank, or title, but by talent, ability, and enterprise. The words he penned summarized an existing philosophy and listed of grievances against the King in order to justify before the world the breaking of ties between the colonies and the mother country.
The most well known line from the document is: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
The North I was raised in taught me that:
Establishment of a Nation dictated the necessity of a constitution.
By issuance of that proclamation, or rather upon winning the war, we had to establish a unity formally which was the propelling force to bring about ultimately, The Constitution of the United States.
Constitution- noun;
system of fundamental principles according to which a nation, state, corporation, or the like, is governed. Definition includes also: the document embodying these principles.
The preamble to our constitution:
"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
At stake in the Civil War was the survival of the United States of America as a single nation.
I was taught that the Confederacy lost to the Union. And we are still, today, the USofA.
All is fair in love and war.
It's that simple.
That's exactly what were talking about... The issue of automony was never settled and all those issues left unresolved from the dismantling of the Constitution play a very import role in our times.
54 men composed the First Continental Congress representing different interests, religions, and regions; theie opinions conflicted as to how best restore their rights. Most did not know each other; some did not like each other. With no history of successful cooperation, they struggled to overcome their differences and, without any way of knowing if the future held success or nooses for them all, they started down a long and perilous road toward independence.
The Constitution is the work of many minds, and stands as a model of cooperative statesmanship and the art of compromise.
It has not been dismantled...to the contrary--
The Framers knew they had not created a perfect plan, but it could be revised. The Constitution has been amended twenty-seven times and stands today as the longest-lasting written constitution in the world.
Traveling outside of the North taught me that blacks can be as bigoted as whites, southerners can as prejudiced as their counterparts. In a changing of attitudes, there has to be some sort of truce for dialogue and an opening of one's mind to accept/hear a different point of view.
What is good for one is good for all.
United we stand, divided we fall.
America--love it or leave it.
It's that simple. | |
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Posted: 1/14/2008 12:44:14 PM | Who are you telling to love america or leave it?
No it is not that simple..you don;t have the "answer"..
And..this thread IS about the "War Between the States"..we are not discussing Native americans as the primary thread topic here,thanks. | |
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Posted: 1/14/2008 2:56:41 PM | Who are you telling to love america or leave it?
No it is not that simple..you don;t have the "answer"..
And..this thread IS about the "War Between the States"..we are not discussing Native americans as the primary thread topic here,thanks.
It was directed at those who refuse to accept, like it or not, that the Constitution IS our FORMAL unifying document as a Nation. One nation, under God.
I am a full-fledged citizen of the USA with granted birthrights guaranteed by the Contitution; I am first generation american and a veteran. THAT's WHO I am, thanks.
If, cottonblossom, you had looked closer, I was returning a volley. I chose to use their words "it's that simple" in my response. The irony was lost on you
The thread is titled, simply, civil war. The first page of posts on this thread is missing the orginal thread starting post by liveordiefordixie and are lean and largely unfocused.
My consideration of our Native Americans, was stated as a side note.
Who are you to exclude Native Americans from history?
have you ever heard of the Seminole-Negroes?
There was a time in our history that the animosity and conflictive pronouncements were valid and relevant.
Can we fast forward to this new millenium?
Today we are faced with issues (the economy, immigration, war)on a global scale that have to be confronted as a UNITED States of America.
Practical realities:
--Our geographical size is impressive . We have oceans separating us from most of the rest of the world.
--We have, from the days as only 13 colonial Revolutionists, emerged as a shining star, fighting many a war, transforming us into a major world player, most of us are proud to be, American.
--At the time the Constitution was written, slavery existed, subsequent events now has serious presidential candidacy run by a man of color AND a woman along with the usual cadre of white men. (They are both americans, they both claim Christianity as their personal spiritualpreference... just to mention for the sake of MY argument, commonalities. As sure as we are divided by differences, we are bound by commonalities)
--Muskets and pony express to sophisticated weaponry and technology
Americans who paint each other negatively, hurtfully and loudly do nothing to unite us. The reality is, we can't go back in time...it was a different time. Sniping at one another or presenting historical facts supporting either "side"s view does nothing for our national security. Our national security was a concept vague to most Americans until they watched, for days, the twin tower collapse. We have to be forward thinking.
I ask again, what purpose does harboring civil war animosities do for "we the people"?
To seriously entertain ideas of sessession at this day in time is treasonous ideation and disrespectful to our veterans...those whose sacrifice protect and defend us all the right to opine to our heart's content, in the open for all to see.
As a northerner, I see myself and others, first and foremost, as human beings.
As a veteran, I am appalled by the Rebel-Yankee mentality.
As an American, I can respect your constitutional rights and expect the same tolerance.
As a woman, I am thankful that the constitution was amended to include me as a full participant in our democratic process.
As a Christian, I thank God. God Bless America!
THAT's WHO I am. It's that simple. | |
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Posted: 1/14/2008 3:43:16 PM | What is disrespectful & treasonous is an american that comes on a internet forum and spouts a lot of propaganda and accusations to americans that understand the cost of freedom..AND attempting to control freedom of Speech..you will not dissuade me..and it gives me satisfaction to know you can't stop this discussion..much satisfaction.
Dont come at me about veterans sweetie..check yourself on the personal attack..dont go there with me about veterans & their sacrifices..and remember about volleys..one can hit right in the darn face when you least expect it..your attempting to make this a political thread all in the name of copying & pasting info & giving your viewpoint on everything from current news to the usual "history"..got any facts?
Is it true Lincoln did not believe Whites & Blacks could live together in peace & planned to relocate the whole black population of the U.S. to Central america?
Were there more than 10,000 Union soldiers serving under the age of 18?
Why does this thread bother a few select group of people..even generates hate mail..maybe some should learn that history does repeat itself..the past can help societys future..and I juts like talking & learning about the true history ignorant folks don't know..thats me..
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Posted: 1/14/2008 8:12:33 PM |
PrimeWomen
America--love it or leave it.
That's an interesting statement since 11 states already tried that and were promptly invaded.... 1860
I recommend you review the "Hartford convention"
http://civilwar.bluegrass.net/secessioncrisis/hartfordconvention.html
I would be interested in what Native Americans think about all of this debate.
Well, I can't speak for them but I can tell you that they fought for both sides during the War Between the States. Just like they fought for both sides during the American Revolution... Let me just mention that at one point it was the Northern States that wanted to invade and conqure Canada
The North I was raised in taught me that we are The United States of America.. 13 colonies took on Great Britain in a fight for Independence. The catalyst issue being taxation without representation. From there our Proclamation of Independence was issued, and those colonists earned respect and recognition on the world stage for beating incredible odds.
We the people stood united.
Nationhood was won.
The most well known line from the document is: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
The North I was raised in taught me that:
Establishment of a Nation dictated the necessity of a constitution.
By issuance of that proclamation, or rather upon winning the war, we had to establish a unity formally which was the propelling force to bring about ultimately, The Constitution of the United States.
Constitution- noun;
system of fundamental principles according to which a nation, state, corporation, or the like, is governed. Definition includes also: the document embodying these principles.
The preamble to our constitution:
"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
At stake in the Civil War was the survival of the United States of America as a single nation.
I was taught that the Confederacy lost to the Union. And we are still, today, the USofA.
All is fair in love and war.
It's that simple.
And, so you just took that to be the truth without question? If that's all you know about history its better that you leave it to those who know the reality and learn something... Where did you get that garbage an 8th grade history book? Even the most Northern promoting view of historcial professors wouldn't agree with your analysis... | |
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Posted: 1/15/2008 6:33:40 PM |
Where did you get that garbage an 8th grade history book?
K.I.S.S. The END RESULT is where we are on this day.
We cannot change history, and in order not to relive it, there must be an end to the antagonistic attitude towards one another. I'll admit to being a little glib, but I wish nobody ill, and in my heart, am not bigoted or prejudiced. If I offended, my apologies.
To those who insist on taking a bellicose stance, war on.
Choose your battles wisely.
This American woman bids you all adieu. | |
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Posted: 1/15/2008 8:59:42 PM |
PrimeWoman
The END RESULT is where we are on this day.
I'm in agreement with you on that point and this thread is mostly about that very subject.
I wish nobody ill, and in my heart, am not bigoted or prejudiced. If I offended, my apologies.
I've never seen anything in your post that would reflect that you was either. You have spoken from the heart and have shown respect. The only point I ever tried to get across to posters was don't take my word for it and don't assume what you was taught is necessarily the truth, go research for yourself.
For example when you stated in a previous post:
13 colonies took on Great Britain in a fight for Independence.~ We the people stood united.
Not true, It was very much a divided issue among Colonist you had the "Rebels" and the "Loyalist"... the American Revolution, in which thirteen British colonies successfully fought for independence from the British Crown, was a secession, as opposed to a revolution. Revolutions seek to replace current governments, while secession movements merely seek separation from current governments.
The Declaration of Independence our nation's most cherished symbol of liberty. Jefferson articulated the highest ideals of the Revolution, beliefs in liberty, equality, and the right to self-determination.
Yet, Jefferson disapproved the adoption of the Constitution...
The most well known line from the document is: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
That document also goes on to say:
"Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
The Southern States didn't want secession but chose to do so out of necessity. They also saw within the same document causes for their seperation, being as valid as those that had lead the Orginal 13 colonies to break their alligence with England. They where being threatened by absolute Despotism...
Establishment of a Nation dictated the necessity of a constitution.
By issuance of that proclamation, or rather upon winning the war, we had to establish a unity formally which was the propelling force to bring about ultimately, The Constitution of the United States.
The Articles of Confederation was the first government of the United States and it operated that way for 7 years. The Constitution came later but didn't require the unanimous consent of the States as had the adoption of the Articles of Confederation. That trival point actually is a vert important point in the totalitity of things. Since the Constitution could be approved with only a majority that clearly cast out those States who didn't sign on. Also the fact that the Articles of Confederation was a perpetual Union. Lets compare the two meanings with the Articles of Confederation and The U. S. Constitution...
Perpetual Union- : continuing forever : valid for all time :
a more perfect Union-: being entirely without fault or defect :legally valid
Obviously the move to switch from one form of government to another was in effect a secession... The Constitution wasn't a more binding Union as had been with the Articles. Nevertheless, some of the States had no issue with it's move of sucession and leaving behind a Nation they were bound by contract to remain in forever... A States sovereignty takes precedence over nationality is the underlying theme...
The preamble to our constitution:
"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
Also with that document is:
Amendment X- The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
In other words: each state retains its sovereignty, freedom, and independence, and every power, jurisdiction, and right, which is not by this Confederation expressly delegated to the United States, in Congress assembled. The Tenth Amendment, which makes explicit the idea that the federal government is limited only to the powers granted in the Constitution.
That means in referance to the War between the States, as the Supreme Court said: Congress had no power delegated to it to make war upon a State, and that the President had no authority to make war...
The North wasn't protecting itself from a foregin invader but rather seeking to subjugate a people wishing to rule their own destiny.
Also of interest is the fact that the Constitution was able to function with only two additions to the document in 70+years. However, over a 120+ period after the War Between the States we have seen the addition of 14 more admentments...
At stake in the Civil War was the survival of the United States of America as a single nation. I was taught that the Confederacy lost to the Union. And we are still, today, the USofA.
All is fair in love and war.
It's that simple.
The United States survival was never at threat! The loss of Southern revenue was what the North feared the most because losing it meant losing the taxation that financed the U. S. Government. The North didn't contribute to the finacing of the U. S. government on an equal status as was impossed on the Southern States. Reason being was beacuse it was the Victoria era when the industries of Europe ruled the global market. Despite the great industry in the North no one wanted American made goods outside of the States. The only products that the global powers seeked from the U. S. was that of Cotton, Tobacco, and Grains all of which was predominately grown in the South. This made the South very wealthy despite being over taxed. It also contributed to great jealousy and contempt among Northerns for their Southern brothern...
The only thing the North accomplished was empting the coffers of the Southern States. And furthering their agenda to dismantle the Constitution and substitue a Federlistic form of Government that would rule over the States. They also created an animosity between the races that hadn't exsisted previously in the South prior to the conflict. The North was also able to struggle long enough to overcome open hostilities amoung armed resistance in the South. But that isn't the same as saying they won the war because they didn't defeat the symbolic anchor of "Dixie"... Eventually the unsettled buisness of that conflict will rise again and I suspect it will come from the Western States next time... We may be less than 25 years away from another secession movement, it really depends on how this illegal alien thing is handled in the near future.. | |
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Posted: 1/16/2008 4:36:51 AM | The notion of sessesion still exists and movements in process.
From wikipedia:
****************Recent efforts in the United States
Examples of both local and state secession movements can be cited over the last 25 years. Some secessionist movements to create new states have failed, others are ongoing.
There was an attempt by Staten Island to break away from New York City in the late 1980s and early 1990s (See: City of Greater New York). Around the same time, there was a similar movement to separate Northeast Philadelphia from the rest of the city of Philadelphia. San Fernando Valley lost a vote to separate from Los Angeles in 2002 but has seen increased attention to its infrastructure needs (See: San Fernando Valley secession movement). Several towns in Vermont including Killington recently explored a secession request to allow them to join New Hampshire over claims that they are not getting adequate return of state resources from their state tax contributions. The mock 1982 secessionist protest by the Conch Republic in the Florida Keys resulted in an ongoing source of local pride and tourist amusement.
Advocates in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, with off and on intensity, have called for it to become a separate 51st state (sometimes with northern Wisconsin) called "Superior". Similarly some in the Little Egypt region of Illinois want to separate due to what they consider Chicagoan control over the legislature and economy.
On July 13, 1977, the City Council of Kinney, Minnesota, lead by Mayor Mary Anderson wrote a "tongue in cheek" letter to Secretary of State Cyrus Vance informing him of the city's secession from the Union to form the Republic of Kinney. Vance never acknowledged the letter.
In November 2006, the Supreme Court of Alaska held that secession was illegal, Kohlhaas vs. State, and refused to permit an otherwise proper Initiative to be presented to the people of Alaska for a vote.
The Republic of Texas has been quite fractious and one faction generated national publicity for its illegal antics in the late 1990s. There have been repeated attempts to form a Republic of Cascadia in the Pacific Northwest. The Hawaiian sovereignty movement has a number of active groupings which have won some concessions from the State of Hawaii. Founded in the 1983, The Creator's Rights Party seeks to have one or more states secede in order to implement "God’s plan for government" and is fielding political candidates in 2007 around the United States.
Efforts to organize a continental secession movement have been initiated since 2004 by members of Second Vermont Republic, working with noted decentralist author Kirkpatrick Sale. Their second "radical consultation" in November of 2004 resulted in a statement of intent called The Middlebury Declaration. It also gave rise to the Middlebury Institute, which is dedicated to the "study of separatism, secession, and self-determination" and which engages in secessionist organizing.
In November 2006 the same group sponsored the First North American Secessionist Convention which attracted 40 participants from 16 secessionist organizations and was (erroneously) described as the first gathering of secessionists since the Civil War. Delegates included a broad spectrum from libertarians to socialists to greens to Christian conservatives to indigenous peoples activists. Groups represented included Alaskan Independence Party, Cascadia Independence Project, Hawaiʻi Nation, The Second Maine Militia, The Free State Project, the Republic of New Hampshire, the League of the South, Christian Exodus, the Second Vermont Republic and the United Republic of Texas. Delegates created a statement of principles of secession which they presented as the Burlington Declaration.[4]The Second North American Secessionist Convention in October, 2007, in Chattanooga, Tennessee received local and national media attention.[5]
In the summer of 2007, an advocacy group called Californians for Independence was formed. Its mission is "the eventual secession of California from the United States of America." *******************
So my bothers and sisters, if you are truly serious about your convictions, you can be politically active. Otherwise, if you're not part of the solution (whatever you deem it to be), then you are part of the problem.
Topgear--
nice debate. You have my respect, for what it's worth.
Cottonblossom--
wish I could say the same to you. If my impression of southerners were to be based on the attitude, tone and content of your responses to mine, it wouldn't be positive. But, in that I have lived in 4 southern states (AL,TX,TN,FL)and a couple of my dearest gf's are GRITS (WbyGodVA,MO) my opinion cannot be tainted by your animosity.
There will be a buffet after the debate. Featured item is a can of fancy feast accompanied by a bowl of milk.
Btw, given that a big part of the southern legacy is tied to Christian beliefs, I want to remind you that God tells us to obey the government as He puts nations in power. Rom13:1. In Rom14:10, we are admonished not to criticize our brother or look down upon him.
Ultimately, it's His plan. Divine intervention will determine how it all plays out. We each have to answer for ourselves to Him.
May He continue to shed His grace upon us.
Keep the faith.
smiles. | |
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Posted: 1/16/2008 2:51:32 PM | You get what you give..I dont need you harking about veterans & their sacrifices to me..and since you have knowledge of "grits"..kiss mine..get it now?
I doubt seriously you have lived in alabama..makes it convenient for you to do what you did..might fly over the others & some may have more eloquent responses but I meant what I said..you meant it as an insult & you know it..no matter how many different ways you put it on here..that is what you said..its not rain your trying to put down MY back..
Make sure your not lactose intolerance lapping that curdled cream sweetie...now here you go about southerners & Christian Beliefs..no where does my God tell me to obey my Government just because they have the power..
Let me remind you...your interpretation of the Bible is exactly that..yours..not mine..nor any other christians.
Still no facts about the topic??..you know so much..where are my answers?..not opinions..facts.. | |
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Posted: 1/16/2008 7:20:10 PM | Cottonblossom--
You are either too lazy or illiterate, or pridefully arrogant to check the bible verses referenced, because indeed it says we are to obey the law of the land if it does not oppose God's law. And, in fact, it says so in several places.
My apologies.
It's unfair of me to engage in a battle of wits with you in that you are an unarmed. | |
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Posted: 1/16/2008 9:45:20 PM | Okay then..if I am unarmed..stop attacking..darn it..
Once again though..there is nothing you can teach me about the bible..and not why I am on this thread..just so you know..I recognize your slur toward my Southern Heritage..call me ignorant all day..but the other names you chose to post this go round..do you think I haven't heard a person like you spout them before..that is what Southerners are renowned for right??..get original with the insults..expected better from you really..
I do hope you keep posting..keeps this thread alive..only now your not even pretending to be interested in facts..your just making it personal..your not one of those posters that have your regular profile & another to post with are you..jealous?..I bother you! ..how was those grits?..lol
I guess no one knows if Lincoln believed we could not all live in peace.. | |
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Posted: 1/17/2008 12:26:54 PM |
...I am gathering facts about the South & trying to answer questions from damn yankees...they will always label us & hate us your post, 162
...perpetuate the divisive mentality...How can we be broadly paint a person based soley on the circumstance of being born in one state or another? One has no control over that event and where it occurs. It's simply ignorant and narrow-minded to believe that any one of us has superior value as a human being over another.
my first post to this thread, msg 171.
...your just making it personal..
Why is it that I know your damn yankees label was not in reference to the baseball team? And, what in my post could have been in any way taken as hateful to "us"(southerners)? Did I claim superiority for any side? How can I not possibly interpret damn yankee, coming from somebody who claims to seek the truth, as having a negative connotation about northerners or not name-calling?
YOU made this personal by jumping me for my reply to Topgear--"Obviously if people want to change attitutdes then they need to stop ridiculing the southern population, it's that simple..."
Given your use of "damn yankees", Topgear's comments put the onus of bigotry and responsibility of changing attitudes in the laps of northeners, your refusal to allow inclusion, despite claiming to want the facts(only the one's you want to acknowledge?),of the Natives' involvement, then accusing me of "attempting to control freedom of speech" coupled with the notion that my comment about being appalled as a veteran for perpetuation of divisive mentality was aimed at you added on top of accusing me of making this a political thread, when it is, in fact, in the politics grouping of forums, made this personal. Basically, you dismissed and disrespected me personally. Check yourself.
You get what you give..I dont need you harking about veterans & their sacrifices to me..and since you have knowledge of "grits"..kiss mine..get it now?
your post, 214.
Harking is defined as listening to, as in "Hark, the herald angels sing..." Makes your comment a non sequitir. YOU chose the word. Fact.
"I don't need..." Your words, your opinion. Fact.
Firsthand experience as a soldier does give me a valid perspective on sacrifice. Have you suffered the losses of comrade-in-arms who died in the line of duty, in the service of their country? Have you seen a uniformed corpse recovered from a dumpster, the victim of uniformed, murderous racist? Quite chilling, I assure you, and very much key to why I find this all distressing.
Seccesionism is key to the Civil War, and given the fact the idea still exists, I did reference the current movements. FACT. I suggested that you or anybody for that matter, can be involved in the political process if your convictions are so strong. Fact.
I chose military service as an action based upon my conviction of patriotic duty.
What do you bring to the table of conviction put into action? Fair question.
kiss my grits...how "original" is that? Can you say hypocrite? Check yourself.
One thing I do know about grits aside from being a product of corn is that instant grits are abominable.
Okay then..if I am unarmed..stop attacking..darn it..
Who attacked whom personally first? Go on the offense, expect your target to react. "You get what you give." Indeed.
Still no facts about the topic??..you know so much..where are my answers?..not opinions..facts..
...there is nothing you can teach me about the bible...
...only now your not even pretending to be interested in facts...
Nothing I said could be construed as teaching you anything about the bible. I assumed (yeah, I know, my bad) that you had enough familiarity with the Good Book, to recognize the reference. The person who harks the preacher, understands these biblical FACTS. Perhaps if the reference came from Topgear, it would not be a bone of contention for you. Yeah, I "get it."
Native American involvement and Christianity ARE inextricable parts of the Southern Heritage, of which the civil war is included. Undeniable, irrefutable FACTS! How can you disregard relevant facts? Hypocritical by any standard.
Check yourself.
A church I was attending in Oregon where the preacher was from AR,curiously,pointed out my northern roots to the congregation on more than one occasion. I asked him the last time he did...Pastor, would you agree that where one is going to is ultimately more important than where one comes from?
Click, the light went on, my point was made on two levels as politely as possible.
Your quote- "...I challenge most authority when it is being abused..I tend to ask questions...I refuse to be a sheep..and will go to my grave a rebel."
So that makes me, what???? A rude, obnoxious NY'er as we are renowned to be? Is that what you mean by "a person like" me? I "get it now". Hells bells, I got "it" before.
Interesting that my opinion is unacceptable, yet yours are and others escape your personally directed antagonism. Forum rules should be different for me because why?? Isn't that hypocritical? Check yourself.
...I recognize your slur toward my Southern Heritage..call me ignorant all day..but the other names you chose to post this go round..do you think I haven't heard a person like you spout them before..that is what Southerners are renowned for right??..
...myths & lies toward this State & the people here..it is actually funny when in some States..Countries..the accusations..questions..all because one has a Southern accent & lives in the South.
your post, 157.
What slur??
GRITS? Girl raised in the south-- It's ok for a southern woman to use the term to describe herself, but insulting if I do? Isn't that hypocritcal?
My brothers and sisters? I never warmed up to words like hick,cracker,negro, black, etc. and use the words, my (naturally suntanned) brothers and sisters--has yet to be considered insulting by anybody I referred to as such. And, in NO way, shape or form, can any rational person consider brother/sister denigrating. Are we not ALL brothers and sisters in Christ? Not teaching here, asking.
What were the "other names" I chose and what is a "person like" me (would that be a damn yankee, perchance)? The implication reeks of bigotry. Ignorant(which you claim to be by your own admission) and lazy are impressions you gave me about YOU, not southerners collectively. YOU chose to take what I said from my first posts as a personal attack, and, apparently, no other poster deems it worthy of excoriating me for it. You seem to stand alone here. I will grant you this, that we are all ignorant.
My mindset was that southerners are renowned for their hospitality, gentility. I've been shown that to be not necessarily true. A coworker of mine in TN, invaded my personal space (what I mean by that is she stood, literally, toe to toe with me, not 6" from my face) and called me a "DAMN YANKEE" when I politely asked her for some information she had on a child in my caseload which I needed to carry out my duty that was time-sensitive. Gotta tell ya, I was rendered absolutely speechless. My supervisor, a southerner herself, overheard it and my co-worker was counseled for it. Additionally, she valued my ability to establish a rapport with the foster parents(regardless of their origins) I worked with, because they NEVER turned me down when I called upon them to take a child in. That was not the case for my other co-workers, who came to me to ask my help in getting their charges placed in those homes. "A person like" me indeed.
Um, yes, I did live in AL, your doubts(opinion) make it no less so. It was, when I lived there,that I commented to to a gal I worked with...Your accent is charming. She said to me...I don't have an accent, you do... which took me by surprise because I didn't realize until that moment that I had an accent. Neither one of us took offense.
one of those posters that have your regular profile & another to post with are you..jealous?
Jealous? Of what or whom? And, where does that come from? Non sequitir again.
However, FYI--
My "regular" profile is my only profile. When I realized even though it's "hidden", and doesn't show in searches, but still accessible, I added the note at the top of my profile to let people know I am in a relationship so as to be up front and honest. Yikes, must make me worthy of suspician and doubt. "Person like" me, indeed.
I spend more time looking at microfilm than I do google or the net..I like digging for truth..even better when I find it!
Your post, 182.
...and why I am of the mindframe that Maryland is not Southern?..I know about the Mason-Dixie Line lol..just never viewed that as a Southern State....Virginia is as far North as I consider Southern & Missouri is as far West as I consider Southern.
Your post, 198.
Um...I just don't know how to accept that you seek the truth, but didn't know that MD was a southern state. Even that was in my "8th grade history book." Given your revelation about, once again, your ignorance, your mindframe, view and what you consider, can certainly be held suspect as based on fact.
Additionally, you seem to rely heavily on Topgear for information...what, to rely on his authority?
Let me make it clear--No disrespect intended here to Topgear.
When you asked him how he knew all this stuff, his reply in msg 128 was "Anyway My Uncle who was a quiet and very reserved man is the one who unshackled my eyes to the truth. He knows far more about this stuff than I could ever hope to attain.". Further, he states "It's nice to see we can each have a unique persepective on subjects" msg 187, and finally, msg 212 "The only point I ever tried to get across to posters was don't take my word for it and don't assume what you was taught is necessarily the truth, go research for yourself."
I can't presume to expect better of you, but YOU could expect better of you, really.
The reality is cottonblossom, that I would prefer to shake hands with you and perhaps agree that somehow our feud took on a life of it's own.
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| the civil war
Posted: 1/17/2008 12:56:40 PM | Primewoman
When you continue to quote only part of my post..its very obvious ok..number 1..I said in my opinion Maryland is not a Southern state..thats my belief & my viewpoint..I didnt quote facts sweetie..my opinion.
I research constantly..but my purpose on this thread was & still is to learn from others..not textbooks,thanks.
Concerning Topgear..I rely on my intuition..I rely on me..I enjoy his post & his respect towards others..that goes a long way with me even on the internet..he has knowledge & should share it..I trust his post..
I would never shake your hand..you are the arrogant one because if you had bothered to read ALL my post..not the select few quotes your so good at you would understand & accept my reason for being here & asking what I did..you would do well about presuming & telling me what to expect..
I cant debate this subject with you..but if you would desire a topic where we can debate..your the smart one right?..start a thread..I will join..leave this one alone & stop with your obvious slurs & disrespectful attacks.
This started between us because you like pointing out your a veteran..and once again you dont speak for all veterans..that was my initial reply to you.
You also referred to being called a damn yankee..well guess what..get used to it..southerners have been called & judged far more than a damn yankee lol..
I have nothing for people like you..pity,contempt yes..but I do better myself by moving on..your hate is your burden not mine..and "sister" you got a lot of hate going on..I could also post many experiences I have had where I was physically threatened just for my accent & looks..so your example of the harshness of life by being called a damn yankee just doesnt get my sympathy or empathy going here for you..
You get this last word on this..I give it to you..just know this..I recognize who you are..and what your doing here..I dont need anyone or any research to tell me that...
You zeroed in on what you thought was the weakest link on this thread to show how superior you are & attempt to destroy my interest in unknown facts about the civil war..know this also..you didnt succeed..and never will..Now you have a good one.
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| the civil war
Posted: 1/17/2008 8:54:10 PM | Alright ladies dat be enough of dat there fussn' LOL
Each of you are entitled to you own opinion and I believe everyone at this point knows how you feel in regards to the other. Now lets take the higher road and try to be civilized about this subject and continue. It's been entertaining up till now and I know many of us would like to continue hearing and learning stuff without all the name calling and personal agenda promoters.
I've never asked anyone to take my word for anything... I'm both liked and disliked but always respected, because I stick to the truth. I've found that those who dislike me the most are those who disapprove the fact of me speaking the truth. They fail to understand that I place truth above my own personal beliefs. Facts are Facts and we should not ever fear truth because it might upset the politically correct, the extreme right wingers, or uneducated...
I never mentioned anything about religion in referance to the Civil War because its not germane to the situation. Both sides felt as if God was on their side and each felt they were in the right. Both sides were very relgious in their own right and were equal in that aspect... It was more about Guns than God!
Now lets get back to the questions and lesser known facts and enjoy ourselves?
1. Did you all know that General Lee never called the Federal army or Northerners in general "The Enemy" he always refered to them as "Those People."
2. Grant lost his first fight in the Civil War at Columbus Kentucky.
3. THE BATTLE OF PICACHO PASS was the western-most "battle" of the American Civil War on April 15, 1862.
4. CSS Florida: While anchored in a Bahia, Brazil port on 7 October 1864, Florida was attacked, captured and towed to sea by USS Wachusett, in violation of Brazilian neutrality. After being taken to the U.S., her return to Brazil was ordered by the courts. However, before this could be done, on 28 November 1864 Florida was accidently or purposely sunk off Newport News, Virginia. | |
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