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 Author Thread: A hidden truth.. Depression...
 abulous

Joined: 5/5/2006
Msg: 251
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/18/2006 5:26:13 PM
that's the problem gmaberick, I've read your posts, and I know what I see, a person that is dismissive of people with depressive problems.

I can't see what your motive is for doing so.
 Gmaverick

Joined: 12/31/2005
Msg: 252
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/18/2006 5:44:06 PM
Different people have different level of perception, so, if that's what you see, that's what will be right for you.

You can't see the motives, because what you see doesn't exist; simple.


To be able to measure the speed of flying horses, first we need to find a flying horse, and of course if there is none, then it'll be impossible to accomplish it; despite of the fact that someone could say that there is one.
 stevelfun

Joined: 10/23/2005
Msg: 253
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/18/2006 6:08:24 PM
Princess.... just for you and anyone out there that has been through something similar.

 sunnyday74

Joined: 6/19/2006
Msg: 254
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/18/2006 9:12:51 PM
That's a tough one. Someone with depression that is being treated and is having no problems may not want to drop that bomb on someone they just met, fearing judgement and ignorence. I think personally i would understand if that came out a bit later on in the relationship, just as long as it came out before things got too serious. As for feeling better and going off the meds...well, i have a friend who does this consistantly. The last time she told me she was going off her meds I asked her if she was sure this was a good idea...she got mad at me, told me her depression was situational and not chemical. Needless to say she crashed. The disease of depression is just that, a disease. It's like a diebetic that need to take medication to stay healthy, but also has to modify behaviour like eating habits. A depressed person has to learn coping mechanisms too. Ok enough of my lesson on depression. Have a good one guys.
 ~SpiffyKat~

Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 255
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/18/2006 9:39:21 PM
~"Say if you were dating someone and they hid the fact that they suffered from
depression and were taking medication for it..

Would you continue to see them?
or
Would you run for the hills?"

I myself have never had a problem with depression,but I have never run from someone who does.Throughout the course of my life,Ive had the pleasure of getting to know so many amazing people.A few of them have been diagnosed with depression over the years.One of the closest people in the world to me sufers from it,and I love him to the ends of the earth:)I believe that when it comes to depression and anxiety,most of the people who suffer from it are just sensitive caring souls that have internalized a lot of their pain and problems over the years,so as not to burden anyone else with them .In a sense,these problems come from a loving place with good intentions.When a persons pain and sadness becomes internalized,over time,it can lead to problems like anxiety or depression if a person has a predisposition for it.Most of the people I know with depression are such creative,talented,empathetic,beautiful people.Its a shame that anyone would label or look down upon another person because they have that cross to carry in life.We all have our own personal trials and tribulations we deal with on a daily basis,and none of us are perfect and without any of our own issues.One of the things I have had to learn over time,is that when someone I love is in a depressed phase,it goes much deeper than just needing to be "cheered up" I used to feel like if I cared about someone ,and they were depressed,I should do everything I could to make them laugh and feel better.Ive found it isnt that simple and that depression goes far beyond that.Sometimes,the best thing to do is just to be there for the person and realize that though it may take time,the black cloud will pass eventually.Anyway,before I type a "war and peace" length novel,LOL I just wanted to add that we all know what its like to feel pain and sadness,so why judge someone else based soley on the fact that they feel that way more often than those of us without depression do?JMHO

 Far_King_Romeo

Joined: 6/15/2006
Msg: 256
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 3:34:15 AM
Sorry Maverick, but depression does exist and it is real..
There is no doubt about it.. Just because a few opinionists say it does not exist
is not going to tell me that it does not exist.. They themselves have never experienced it
other than seeing people with it, and even if they did, common sense will tell them
otherwise.. Scientific Evidence is not always conclusive, and they still don't know
alot of things about the human brain.. So getting back to your theory about flying horses..
If they don't know how the brain works conclusively, it is that Flying Horse, and
furthermore there is always someone that says it exists, like these websites..
You and they are entitled to their opinions as I am, and I have had depression and survived
and seen countless people with it and die from it.. (Suicide).. No one can dismiss it
in my eyes.. Not no one..
 Country Girl 22

Joined: 7/16/2006
Msg: 257
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 6:00:00 AM
FIRSTdepression is not a disease its a illness that in blance of the brain. it has lows and ups . all depend on ILLNESS . exp, Bipolar is a type of depression ( manic depression) .

so before you call this illness a disease read upon your facts.

people like make me
 starbaby1958

Joined: 7/18/2006
Msg: 258
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 8:06:55 AM
There are a lot of people out there who have been diagnosed or not with depression. Being diagnosed and accepting the fact that you have a problem is the first step to treatment. Depression is like alcoholism in the way that if not treated can lead to more serious problems. Alcoholics in recovery go through stages where they do not need to be alone because the mind trys to make them think that they can't be without alcohol. People who suffer from depression also have these stages and unless they seek help, they sink deeper into the disease. I think that you should be up front with whatever disease you suffer from, not right when you start dating, but when you feel comfortable with the person. There are people out there willing to help you in your time of need and if they care about you, what's the harm in them knowing?
 winniepoo

Joined: 7/5/2006
Msg: 259
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 10:55:30 AM
i would try and stay with who evevr it was.my partner has got bad depression and i have got it to but we are together
 redneckcountrygirl

Joined: 6/15/2006
Msg: 260
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 11:05:02 AM
I can't believe how ill informed some people can be. Depression is real. Depression can be fixed. However, one sure way not to fix it is to have people tell you to pull yourself up by your bootstraps. That would be like saying, 'Just get over your insulin.' Depression can be an ongoing challange to keep the chemicals in you brain stable. Learning good self care and having a good diet and excercise can do so much. Talking with friends and family also helps. Please people don't be scared by an illness. Read and be a little more informed. gmaverick :I don't know where you are finding your info, but what little I have read of your post I disagree with most of it. To all.
 Gmaverick

Joined: 12/31/2005
Msg: 261
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 11:39:40 AM
Far_King_Romeo;

It seems that you didn't get a word of what I said in my post (answering you) I started by saying that "I never said that depression doesn't exist".

Now you tell me: "Sorry Maverick, but depression does exist and it is real..."

Like if I ever said the opposite........¿¿¿???

The fact that a person has a disease, illness, or condition doesn't make him/her an expert regarding the knowledge of the cause/s of it.

That’s like saying that because you are able to drive a car that makes you and expert on engines, aerodynamics, and/or physics.

The "opinionates" happen to be Scientifics that STUDY the field, if you want "opinions" I invite you to go and ask ANY psychiatrist to SHOW you ANY evidence of their "illnesses/diseases" and where are the evidence (discovery/confirmation/validation) of ONE, ONLY ONE of their "chemical imbalances", then you'll get "opinions".

Just to clear it up for you, I'm going to repeat: I NEVER said that DEPRESSION DOESN'T EXIST.
What I said is that; is NOT an illness/disease, since there is NOT SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE ANYWHERE THAT VALIDATES THOSE "DISEASE/ILLNESS", AND THAT IT IS PSYCHIATRY WHO CAME UP WITH THAT.

NOT PSYSICIANS; WHOM ARE THE ONES THAT STUDY THE ORGANISM.

But like you said, people see what they want to see; yesterday someone saw that I was "dismissing" people with this CONDITION, when what I said is that it is already bad to have this condition to let psychiatrists put the person on drugs that only damage their brains, so that now they have ANOTHER PROBLEM, ON TOP OF IT.

And for those who got "improvement" with those drugs, please go and see the studies that have been done in "placebo", get some data, you'll find something very interesting.

Besides, like I already said: Don't believe a word of what I wrote here, go and ask your own physicians for info.

BTW there was someone comparing diabetes with depression...¿¿¿???

Unlike depression; Diabetes IS an illness and there is scientific evidence of it, and ANY physician will diagnosed by doing the appropriate procedures.

Go and ask a Psychiatrist how he diagnoses: "chemical imbalances" and more important, WHERE is the evidence that IT IS an illness/disease.

So, like I said on the previous answer to you, if you already know everything about it, don't even bother in looking for information, what for..??? That would mean that there are still things that you don't know and it doesn't seem to be the case.
 mencer25

Joined: 6/7/2006
Msg: 262
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/19/2006 12:10:58 PM
lies, cheating and hateful behaviors are the only reason why we should not date someone....if you could not date someone because of a illness (unless he or she is a serial killer) you would certainly wind up as lonely as Waldo.
 AdamantEthos

Joined: 11/11/2003
Msg: 263
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/22/2006 7:33:38 AM
I agree with Mencer. And for Maverick, depression is a real illness that I have known many people to suffer from including family. It's the darkest place in the world to exist when compared relative to normal functioning. It's a combination of genetic predisposition and environmental experience of trauma, severe ambiguity, or significant/prevalent changes. To argue anyway otherwise is to present a point of debate that is refuted by personal experience.
 designingwoman

Joined: 9/4/2005
Msg: 264
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/22/2006 9:52:26 PM
Thank you AdamantEthos. Well said!
 roadspur

Joined: 5/17/2006
Msg: 265
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/22/2006 10:26:10 PM
and I know when a guy is down with depression the world can sure kick you hard
 GO ROCK GO

Joined: 9/23/2005
Msg: 266
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/27/2006 9:32:26 AM
I was e-mailed on here about a month ago by a very rude woman who told me that I was weird because I have issues with depression. I did the the correct thing by just reading and deleting the e-mail. No matter how callous people can be, just keep living one day at a time (as cliche' as that sounds), and don't let comments, etc. get you down.

*YOU CONTROL DEPRESSION, DON'T LET IT CONTROL YOU*
 AdamantEthos

Joined: 11/11/2003
Msg: 267
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/30/2006 7:21:54 AM
Sorry to hear of your experience Go Rock Go. it seems that both sexes can be overly judgemental on an individual's personal issues in life.

It would be interesting to see whether a guy or girl would have the same problem if the person they dated had a physical ailment such as MS rather than a mental health issue. It seems that discrimination takes the forefront with mental health.
 princess leigh

Joined: 4/20/2006
Msg: 268
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/30/2006 7:26:19 AM
you have heard my story on here so wont go on again,but please,anyone who does not believe in depression,please I beg you,it is real so real please learn about this ILLNESS before you judge people,we are normal people who have to take a wee red tablet once a day,is that so bad???
 Gmaverick

Joined: 12/31/2005
Msg: 269
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/30/2006 11:02:41 PM
And for Maverick, depression is a real illness that I have known many people to suffer from including family.


AdamantEthos;

It seems that you didn't get what I said either, what I said is that depression is NOT an illness and that there are SCIENTISTS WHO STUDY THE FIELD SAYING SO AND REQUESTING THAT EVIDENCE THAT NO ONE HAS SHOWN YET.
There is an "organic disease/illness" been "treated" with drugs that alters the natural behavior of the brain, with terrible consequences, for which there is NOT SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE.
So, let's see if you get it this time, the people who are saying this, are NOT carpenters, or electricians, or accountants, or waiters, they are SCIENTISTS, NEUROLOGIST, MDs, EVEN
PSYCHIATRISTS THEMSELVES.

And this has absolutely nothing to do with what I think about a person who is depressed.
I'm going to put some references here, this places have links where you can see even more scientists addressing the subject and you can take a look and see whether you consider that you know better than these doctors and scientists:


FRED A. BAUGHMAN JR., MD RESPONDS TO PRODUCER OF FRONTLINE (PBS) DOCUMENTARY "MEDICATING KIDS"

WHAT I AM, MS. GAVIRIA, IS A SCIENTIFIC PHYSICIAN, A NEUROLOGIST/CHILD NEUROLOGIST,.....

Not a single, solitary, psychiatricdisorder/condition/diagnosis has been validated as an organic disease,having a confirming/validating, objective, physical or chemical abnormality (genetic, biochemical, within the brain or body).......

There is no demonstrable physical abnormality in ADHD or schizophrenia to validate either as diseases. The physical abnormality, Ms. Gaviria, is the disease. Psychiatry cannot have its own definition of "disease,"but that doesn't stop them from trying, nor does it stop them from
inventing illusions of diseases, with which to deceive the public and push drugs.


http://www.adhdfraud.com/commentary/8-8-01-3.htm ^^^^^


Academy
for the Study of the
Psychoanalytic Arts

There Are No "Chemical Imbalances"
Eaton T. Fores

Various sorts of brain imaging techniques are currently very much in vogue: a PET scan (positron emission tomography, which visualizes regional energy utilization in the brain) of a depressed person is different from the same scan of a "normal" person. A SPECT (single photon emission computed tomography) scan is even more impressive, since it has the ability to visualize particular kinds of receptors. But this line of argument is entirely fallacious. If the argument is: mental state x can be shown to have a physiological substrate, therefore it is pathological, the response is obvious. All mental states, without exception, have neurochemical substrates. This proves exactly nothing.
No doubt there are neurochemical differences between conservatives and liberals, too.

Who, however, is to decide which state is pathological? Brain imaging techniques are currently the favorite tool used by biopsychiatrists to argue for a purported physiological cause for the various phenomena called "mental illnesses," largely because the scans yield brightly colored pictures of the brain – almost like coloring book drawings – which can be shown to the public and which appear to offer highly dramatic demonstrations of something "wrong" with the brain that has fewer bright colors in it. The public generally knows little about either scientific method or logical inference, and even less about the interpretation of brain scans, and so is likely to be mightily impressed by this "scientific evidence."

So PET and SPECT scans of people called schizophrenic, or depressed, or obsessive-compulsive, are compared to those of people called "normal", and differences between the images are taken as evidence of a biochemical original for mental illness. Do the varieties of consciousness called mental illnesses have a biochemical substrate? Of course they do, but, as noted above, this is only because every kind of mental state has such a substrate.


http://psychrights.org/Research/Digest/TheBrain/NoChemicalImbalances.htm ^^^^^

Famous PSYCHIATRIST L.R. MOSHER resigns from the American Psychiatric Association in disgust...



Now, to begin with, anything that has an anatomically defined specific brain pathology becomes the province of neurology (syphilis is an excellent example). So, to be consistent with this "brain disease" view all the major psychiatric disorders would become the territory of our neurologic colleagues.......

Finally, why must the APA pretend to know more than it does? DSM IV is the fabrication upon which psychiatry seeks acceptance by medicine in general. Insiders know it is more a political than scientific document.......

Diagnostic reliability is easy to attain for research projects. The issue is what do the categories tell us? Do they in fact accurately represent the person with a problem? They don't, and can't, because there are no external validating criteria for psychiatric diagnoses. There is neither a blood test nor specific anatomic lesions for any major psychiatric disorder. So, where are we? APA as an organization has implicitly (sometimes explicitly as well) bought into a theoretical hoax. Is psychiatry a hoax, as practiced today?...........


http://www.oikos.org/mosher.htm ^^^^^


Washington (March 24) - Rep. Joe Barton (R-TX), Chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee, and Rep. James Greenwood (R-PA), Chairman of the Oversight and Investigations Subcommittee, today sent a letter to the Food and Drug Administration Commissioner Mark McClellan, requesting information on the use of antidepressants by children and the possibility of increased suicidal behavior from that usage, as well as details on the FDA's handling of this information.


http://energycommerce.house.gov/108/News/03242004_1243.htm ^^^^^

FDA Responds to Barton, Greenwood Inquiry on Antidepressant Use;

"FDA's primary medical reviewer believed that the available data were sufficient to conclude an association exists between the use of antidepressants and suicidal behavior in children. He also recommended that action occur without further delay, although others at FDA disagreed with his recommendation. There are troubling questions of whether FDA supervisors inappropriately suppressed significant information that would have been of consequence to their own advisory committee, not to mention the public.


http://energycommerce.house.gov/108/News/04152004_1251.htm ^^^^^


The DSM IV (The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, volume 4) is the latest and current version of the standard handbook of "mental illnesses" as determined by the American Psychiatric Association (APA). What comes into question with this manual is the manner and method by which these supposed mental illnesses are determined and by whom.......

PAUL MCHUGH, CHAIRMAN OF PSYCHIATRY AT JOHNS HOPKINS UNIVERSITY, SAID OF THE PROFESSION'S VAUNTED DSM:

"Diagnostic and Statistical Manual" (DSM) has "permitted groups of 'experts' with a bias to propose the existence of conditions without anything more than a definition and a checklist of symptoms. This is just how witches used to be identified." As quoted by John Cloud in Time magazine's annual 2003 health issue.

PSYCHIATRIST RON LEIFER describes the illogical, idiotic life he was forced to lead:

"Everyone is neurotic. I have no trouble giving out diagnoses. In my office I only see abnormal people. Out of my office, I see only normal people. It's up to me. It's just a joke. This is what I mean by this fraud, this arrogant fraud ... To make some kind of pretension that this is a scientific statement is ... damaging to the culture." - Ron Leifer, psychiatrist, quoted in Cloning of the American Mind, by Beverly Eakman, 1997

"Only in psychiatry is the existence of physical disease determined by APA presidential proclamations, by committee decisions, and even, by a vote of the members of APA, not to mention the courts". - PETER BREGGIN, TOXIC PSYCHIATRY


http://www.psychdisorders.org/psych_billing_bible.html ^^^^^


Psychiatric "disorders"
Completely lacking in scientific proof or validity...


http://www.psychdisorders.org/psychiatric_disorders.html ^^^^^
 wantsluv2

Joined: 3/20/2005
Msg: 270
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 7/31/2006 3:24:26 PM
Depression.
Bi-Polar and depression definately different.
A good friend of mine is Bi-Polar, even though she takes her medication on a regular basis she is still up and down the ladder. I love her to death but she has not had a successful relationship in I don't know how long. When she is manic she just runs every one ragged. When she is depressed she is even worse. As a rule I can be straight with her and she will listen to me but anyone in a relationship with her has to really reall work at it.
As a rule those who talk about suicide don't. And the fact that he tried to use it to manipulate you is another indication of a possesive controling personality. Doctors advise NO alcohol with the disease and especially with some of the drugs given for it. It only amplifies the Depreesion and brings it to forefront. The unfortunate circumstance about it is when they feel good they won't take the medication regularly so they create an even worse cycle. This is especially hard on those who try to spend time with them.
 GO ROCK GO

Joined: 9/23/2005
Msg: 271
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 8/1/2006 6:41:44 PM
I stopped drinking over 10 years ago when I went on my meds. I wasn't much of a drinker anyway, so I don't really miss it. I take 40 mg of Celexa daily, and I find that I still have good days and very few bad ones. The bad days, I still have enough willpower to get up and go to work, etc. and try to have in my mindset to keep functioning as normally as possible. If something really upsets me, I vent using words only, and I try to choose them very carefully. Quite often, I do regret what i've said, though. Some people don't realize that meds are not the "cure all" and depend on them too much. Celexa, as i've mentioned before, is my eighth med in 10 years.
 alliecatt

Joined: 7/20/2006
Msg: 272
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 8/1/2006 8:29:00 PM
Keep dating that person. Do you know how common depression is? I have a psychology background, and depression is so common (1 in 3). Most of the time depression is temporary and caused by a certain situation or series of events. Time does heal most wounds and talk therapy (counselling) is often a lifesaver - sometimes a person just needs perspective. It is a chemical imbalance and sometimes needs medication to bring the person back up to par. There is also serious depression - called clinical depression - it can be controlled. Bipolar is another term for manic/depressive phases and needs to be controlled as well.

If the person you were dating hid the fact that they had depression.......well, there is still a stigma attached to this condition, and they hid it out of fear of rejection. Sad but true. People who admit to depression are often cast as weak and unstable, when in reality, they are usually extremely intelligent and perceptive.

Depression often runs in families.

If you have seen other serious signs of mental instability that are not depression-related, then maybe you should go talk to a professional and see what insights you might gain, if you do care about this person.

Do you care about this person enough to help?
 alliecatt

Joined: 7/20/2006
Msg: 273
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 8/1/2006 8:33:57 PM
Did you know a person should NEVER just go off their meds? A doctor should supervise this if the person wants to go off them. Horrible things can happen. You are right, depression is an illness and needs treatment - there are various forms. Good luck with your friend.
 NelleTx

Joined: 3/22/2006
Msg: 274
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A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 8/1/2006 9:53:42 PM
Maverick,

Unless, and until, you have endured the daily walk through quicksand of living with depression, you know not of what you speak. You can quote phychobabble from now till your own brain cells cook from over use, but the fact is depression is a true physical malaise which is sadly experienced by millions of people. Just because there is no physical measure for this problem doesn’t mean it’s existence can be piffled away with a collection of words. What it tells me is, that currently, the medical professionals have not yet discovered the means my which to measure depression. However, the inablity to measure it does not negate its existance.

I am here to tell you that not only does depression cause the usual cognitive problems, it actually PHYSICALLY HURTS. The entire body aches. It is a sensation that I have yet to be able to describe...but it is a tangible, physical sensation of pain...and it is constant during the entire time the depression is active. I would not wish it on my worst enemy.

I personally prefer more natural methods to keeping my chronic depression at bay. I’ve suffered with it since I was about 7 or 8 years old....which was before it was discovered that children can suffer from it. I have had several very severe bouts with it that brought my entire life to a standstill. During those times, I took medication...and happily so. Medication does work. The medical profession may not know to the fullest extent why it works...but the fact is that it does. Does it work for everyone? Nope. But then aspirin doesn’t help everyone’s headache either. Do some folks have a bad reaction to it? Yep. But then there are those who have a bad reaction to dust.

I know from PERSONAL experience that depression is a discernable physical change which occurs within my physiological existence on this Earth. Someday, I pray in my lifetime, there will be a measure for it which will enable the medical professionals to better treat depression in all its stages.

Oh and by the way...IF by taking the meds to bring the depression under control knocked off a few IQ points...so be it. I happily trade those points for a pain free and joyful life. However, again from personal experience, I’ve not noticed ANY discernable difference in my brain functionality after the ingestion of antidepressants.
 Jlizzy

Joined: 10/10/2004
Msg: 275
A hidden truth.. Depression...
Posted: 8/2/2006 12:32:23 AM
Obviously I can't see myself wading through 12 pages of threads to catch myself up and what's been said but my own take on the original post is as follows:

For anyone who wants to judge someone who has been diagnosed of having depression:
1- What about the fact that there's tonnes and tonnes of people out there who are depressed and haven't been diagnosed?
2- I think anyway sometimes it can be a bit of a fine line. I think anyone is capable of depression. I'm known to be very bubbly, confident, outgoing etc but by gummy have I known times in my life where I felt really really depressed (actually been going through a bit of a bout lately.. female hormones, life in general and perhaps a confusing relationship getting to you, work, etc etc)
3-There is no question in my mind that you can easily wind up dating and having a long term relationship with someone who can playmindgames with you, be controlling etc..anything along these lines. So why judge someone based on a diagnosed depression? Granted it would give me a slight cause for concern -something i would want to kep a bit of an eye to but other than that...take every person on their merit and how the relationship is..NOT based upon the tags they have!
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