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bobby7
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Joined: 3/22/2006
Msg: 101 | |
| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/2/2006 12:55:55 AM | I am on a fixed income,,Ergo: Not much money..But; I would never ask, or expect, a lady to pay for any date I asked her out on. I would make sure we could have a good time,; Dinner, a movie, the zoo, a lake side stroll, a drink, etc., and stay within my budget.. There is a lot a couple can do that does not cost a lot, and still have fun.. I never like to see a lady reach for her purse, unless she has to use the powder room. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/2/2006 9:29:36 AM | Okay, since I'm the OP here's the deal. From all that I've read, I'd might as well break it down because this is starting to get too repetitive for my taste.
- First date, guy pays. Or, if you want to be more liberal with that interpretation, the person who invited the other person out must pay but really, I still think to make a good impression, the guy should pay for the first outing.
- If it goes well, ladies, you invite the dude out the next time and pay. Tell him that when he's paying for the first date that you got next time to avoid the awkwardness of just sitting there as he pays. If you do other activities aside from the meal e.g. shooting pool, the non-paying person pay for that. C'mon, it's only fair.
- (none of this picking an inexpensive hole-in-the-wall place unless it's really up your alley; I for one like good food and beer/chicken wings/nachos is not my thing so preferably go for lunch or coffee if you're looking to save the guy money).
* If paying is that much an issue, you should be working on your career, not dating.
- In relationships, it should be a give and take. Sometimes you pay for this, others he/she should pay for that. There is none of this "I can find other guys who will pay for everything" BS. If there is a salary differential between the two people, I don't see a problem with the one making more springing a few more bucks every now and then--but that should be no excuse for the person making less to make an effort to contribute. Nobody in the relationship should be a burden on the other. My parents would differ with me on this because of their belief that women, by societal standards, stand to lose more in a relationship. But that is an entirely different thread and new can of worms I'd rather not get into.
That being said, although this seems like a stupid question as some may have pointed out or that I am making it more complicated than it really is, if that were true, I wouldn't have gotten this mass response. =) | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/2/2006 10:18:12 AM | | I think that if he asked you out... he should pay. If you asked him out.... you should at least pay for yourself. Asking a guy out and expecting him to pay for it all makes you no better then a guy who asks a girl out and only having the intention of sleeping with her. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/2/2006 1:37:45 PM | | I'll eat a bucket of Sh___it before I'll pay for a woman to eat, she can be independent and buy her own.......if that is too much for some of you, that's tuff shit....It apparently is, because I have no offers, or few to take me to lunch............it's mostly about women supplementing their income at the expense of a man..............you can shove that too...you are not gonna get away with that with me | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/2/2006 6:14:23 PM | Bravo Tigerwoods, couldn't have said it better.
If paying is that much an issue, you should be working on your career, not dating.
To me it's not the money but the principle of the whole thing. Women wanted to be equal, now they are and have the same jobs as men, yet they want to keep the advantages that they had before they were equal. You have to take the bad with the good. Right now we are in a transition stage where women have their cake and are eating it too, eventually it will become equal for everyone. Hopefully sooner than later. Your friends say they judge a man by the money he invests in a date, well I judge my date to see if she has integrity or an outdated belief that her mommy told her about. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/3/2006 3:38:13 AM | You unfortunately misinterpreted my quote. I meant this to apply to BOTH men and women. Nothing in life is deserved; if you think you're good enough to seek companionship in another, you should at least be able to hold your own. But on the other hand, there's the blah blah that has made this seemingly simple thread much more complicated; if it was all black and white as you say, we wouldn't have gotten this far in the forum. This is still a contested issue.
If paying is that much an issue, you should be working on your career, not dating.
As for Tigerwoods... there were other posts aside from the initial one that clarify what the first one meant to convey. I had a circumstance I applied it to, which would make more sense than if you took it out of context from having only read the first entry. Most pf the people who responded to the initial post have long moved on and no longer contribute because I think at this point it's just beating a dead horse. But if you insist that I revisit the issue given your ad hominems at my character for asking this question in the first place, here goes:
Any woman that equates a man's emotional willingness to commit with how much he pays on the date is a woman I can do without
The thought he puts into where to take you, trying to find someplace you'll have fun yet feel comfortable, a place that has the right ambiance, a place that will make a great first memory is the measure of how much the man is willing to emotionally invest
The final $ and cents on the tab isn't
How is it that our supposedly-egalitarian society has yet to move beyond this outdated and ridiculous concept?
The first date doesn't have to be dutch as he presumably asked you out, so at that point he's trying to make an impression. But by the second date, if you agreed to go out with him again, shouldn't that be a reflection that you are equally interested in him? Otherwise why the heck are you going out again if he didn't amaze you the first time? At that point an offer to split the bill should be forthcoming if you feel uncomfortable letting the man pay for everything... After all, you have your own money too don't you?
Your opinion is valid, but so is everyone else's. Everyone has different views on how to approach dating. The guys who discussed the need to pay for the date meant it in principle and I posted this to see what their views were on this issue. Oddly, as a sidenote, the trend among those who were most inclined to pay for the initial date were of an older demographic so I am thinking it has to do with the generation viewpoint. Money in this paying for dates context was not about the money, but how they (the women and men who have responded) viewed it. The thread has evolved to be more than a general response to my first post so if you are trying to respond to that post without having read the other 4 pages, you're kind of shortchanging the other readers. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/3/2006 6:36:05 AM | Lachicstuckinoc,
I did not misread your original post, my response was never directed at you personally 
You made it quite clear that the expression about "a man's willingness to pay" was something said by a few of your female friends, NOT YOU, and it is that expression I was condemning 
I bear you no grudge whatsoever, your original post sounded liked the words of a proactive and modern independent woman that's trying to be considerate and do the right thing, but felt at odds with the lingering archaic attitudes of society. 
As for reading the rest of the thread, you are quite right that I haven't read the full thread yet, I've only had the time to sneak in a few posts every couple of hours here at the office as it's been a busy couple of days. 
So I hope you now realize we are on the same page, I applaud your efforts to make the spending during courtship equal (or at least less biased), and you sound like a nice person to me 
Take care and happy fishing! 
P.S.: I noticed you have only been a POF member for less than a month now, so as to the mention of "short-changing the other members of the thread by not reading everything posted", I think you will rapidly notice that there are hundreds of threads on here, some YEARS old, in which people are still responding to the original post since that's supposed to be the heart of the topic. Some threads have ballooned up to 70 pages+, and no one is going to read all of that before interjecting their opinion, even if it turns out to be redundant/outdated...
At least my response was on topic, as opposed to some of the hate mongers that just vent on a rant and then disappear | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/3/2006 3:00:57 PM | | Well said, TigerWoods0924. Just making sure we're on the same page =) Kind of odd that no one has presented this topic before; I ran a search and found nothing. *shrug* Happy fishing to you, too. I can't really help you regarding the piling work you have because I suffer from the same plight! hehe | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/15/2006 11:25:11 AM | | Gee how chivalrous of all you guys! I have no problem with paying for a couple of first dates. But if a woman is interested in me she should return the favour to express the fact that she is not just with me to be wined and dined. After dating for a while you should be splitting the bill or treating each other alternately in some reasonable way - it doesn't have to be 50/50 but you should eventually talk about it. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/15/2006 11:38:36 AM | | I don't think that a woman should have to pay for her part of the date, especially if she was asked out. But if she wants to pay that's fine too. I realize that it is the 21st century and some women want to feel independent by paying for their share of the date, that's fine. But I don't like her paying for me bacause it makes me feel like a moocher. It's ok goin 50/50 because it shows on her part that she's not using him for money and it shows on his part that he's not a deadbeat. It's the best way to go in my book. Just not all the time, because chivalry does still exist and there are special occasions. If he gets mad on the first date because you want to pay for your share then he's just hiding insecurities with money. Just my opinion. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/29/2006 7:15:46 AM | My philosophy is if He asks me out, he should pay. Although that being said I usually offer to pay for mine. My experience has been that the men I have dated generally paid for the first few dates then later I would treat them either to a home cooked meal or pick a restaurant/activity within my budget. As a single mum I can't necessarily afford the same as a man with no children can. Also another factor people forget is that as a general rule women tend to earn less than men.
Sazy  | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/29/2006 7:51:33 AM | I have no problem with paying the full tab and leaving a generous tip for good service.
50/50 is cool if you feel the need to
If she offered to pay the whole thing on the first date and I acually had a good time you better bet your gonna have a great second on me.
To me spending money is fun I work for the fun I have when I'm not working | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/29/2006 12:42:55 PM | | If I have asked someone out then I expect to pay for the date. This has never been an issue for me, perhaps that makes me old fashioned? I have had girls try to pay on the first date and have always insisted that I pay. If they are insistant on paying I tell them that they can pay the next time if they want to which has happened. I don't really think it should become a big issue. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/29/2006 6:54:35 PM | This is a difficult one. Last time I went out with someone (not from POF) on a blind sorta date - we each paid for our own stuff as when they took our order, I asked for separate bills.
But that was "lupper" (since it was between lunch and supper).
The time before that when I went out with a young man who'd asked me, he paid for my tea and whatever snack I ordered when I was in the ladies room so I left the tip.
I never expect the man to pay, but because of this - I warn people that I am going out with that I need to keep places I go within a budget I can swing.
Now when I go out with my friends, sometimes we do the turn taking on picking up the tab. But it's easier to do things like that with people you know well than with someone you are just meeting and getting to know. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 8/29/2006 7:11:16 PM | egalitarian?
Nice, a girl says that me, I want to marry her, lol.. some guys get jaded when they ask for seperate checks, it's a sign - "you're nice, but I'm not interested" or "I'm broke"...
a girl paying for the meal sends most guys "ego alert" into meltdown mode, I've seen it, I've done it, most guys, if they have an ounce of self worth, have this whole manly shtick about em. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/25/2006 6:12:05 PM | I heard an interesting response to a similar post recently.
To the ladies...if your girlfriends asked you out for an evening of dinner and dancing, would you expect them to pay for you?
These are people you know and you wouldn't....yet you expect a man you really don't know to pay your way?
Help me figure that logic out please..... | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/25/2006 6:58:17 PM | I take my cue from how seriously she takes the date. If she shows up in track pants and sweatshirt, let's split the bill. If she's made the effort to show up pretty, I'm flattered and I'm definitely paying.
Women's clothes, shoes, cosmetics, hair and all the crazy things they do to make themselves more attractive don't come free. Men can get through life with $10 haircuts and a few good suits. So when the man pays it's more 50/50 than it first appears.
If you girls still want to split the bill, ask for separate checks at the beginning. If he objects, just say "maybe next time". If you wait to the end, it implies that you don't want a 2nd date IMHO. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/25/2006 7:10:59 PM |
That sounds like a good idea to make the arrangement ahead of time, but if a guy was asking me on a date and told me ahead of time that he wanted me to pay for half, he wouldn't get that date lol. For example, if he said something like " how about dinner and a movie?" and I said " sure sounds great"....whats he sapposed to say? "okay great...but I'm only paying for my half :P" lol.... That would be tough to bring up, wouldn't it?
Hah, I'd never be able to say that, it just sounds so rude. If I asked a girl on a date, I'd be expected to pay, period. I mean, it's like basically asking someone out and expecting them to pay even half.
Although, I bet if you really wanted the date with the guy in the first place, you wouldn't care if he said that!  | |
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apms
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Joined: 9/20/2006
Msg: 120 | |
| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/27/2006 9:07:41 PM | It all depends on the guy.
This is the 21st Century and not the cave man days. As for me, I’m strong on Men’s rights in the family and in a relationship.
If I have to compete with a woman for a job and if a woman can be my boss and make more money than me, then things should be financially equal in the family and in a relationship. Women should not expect a man to pay for everything. For the guys who are living back in the caveman days and want to support their woman, then that’s their problem. As for me, I believe things should be equal as far as finances goes.
A basic date is going to cost me at least $50 bucks. If she dumps me afterwards, it’s my loss. I’d rather spend the $50 bucks on my son or pay the phone bill.
If it’s a blind date, just going out for coffee and a snack, I don’t mind paying.
If it has developed into a healthy relationship, and I ask her out to dinner, then I’m paying. However, if she never takes the initiative to ask me out and pay, then in my opinion, she is just going out for the ride and I’ll smartly dump her.
I use to ask women out and go all out (that was the thing to do back in the 70’s). I learned from my mistakes and a lot of money that I lost. Anymore, if I have to spend a lot of money to impress a woman, she’s not worth it. The time during dating should be spent getting to know each other and enjoying the company of each other. If a woman is looking for a guy (fool) to spend a lot of money on her on a date, she can go someplace else.
I don’t play games.
Women have to remember that a lot of guys think that if they pay for the date, they can expect something in return. I here so many women complaining that the guy always expects something. Well put yourself in a guy’s shoe. If you asked a guy out and paid, wouldn’t you expect something in return? How naive are these women.
Some women may call me cheap, but I gladly took the responsibility of raising my son by myself and financially supported him by myself. I didn’t run from child support like most guys do (now those guys are cheap).
As for you cave men, it’s your life and your money. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/27/2006 9:18:50 PM | For the dating session, I always pay. If the woman insists on treating me I won't refuse at it could insult her.
I can't believe some of the horror stories about guys asking girls on dates and then telling the lady they don't have the money. How sad. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/27/2006 9:50:41 PM | I think the man should pay on the first date or at least offer. Usually the girl will offer (which is nice) but the man pays. On other dates, it depends on the person/relationship. You can make an arguement for both.
A guy who pays for all women (even as friends) is a loser IMO. Out as a group of friends for dinner and he is grabbing ever girl's check? I don't get it. Why is he paying for everyone? Money to burn? Buying friendship? | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/27/2006 11:27:54 PM | Lol reading this I am glad it's no longer an issue for me. It's hard to know what is the right thing because everyone will have their own set of rules, sometimes you can feel out the subject beforehand. I always added, "my treat" when asking to alleviate the doubt.
And what ever happened to men opening doors and such?
We still do but I must share an experience. Walking into a mall i noticed a woman coming out with her hands full and I made the mistake of openning and holding the door for this person. What I didn't know before was appearantly she was an Uber-feminist (what I thought were CFM's must have been jackboots). She publicly started screaming at me that she didn't need a man to hold a door for her etc... and asked why I thought I was gods gift. So I looked her square in the eye and told her that unlike some I was raised to have manners and consideration for others, and this is why I held the door, not to belittle anyone or try to "get some" ....... At this point I fell off the high road though and left with a suggestion that she rortate the tires on her home because she seemed a little unbalanced.
The whole attitude that the guy HAS to pay for everything started in a time when women didn't work and were essentially considered chattel to be barterred and traded for. In some cases it can even come off as either gold digging or almost prostitution (think of the drink-hoes that inhabit every bar, watch then flirt with any guy that doesn't seem to be having alot of luck for free drinks). That said I do pay 99.9% of the time 
The he asks he pays, she asks she pays that I've heard several times seems the safest route to go, but always allow for flexibility. If I see that my paying for everything is making someone uncomfortable I will find a way to make her feel that I am in no way trying to "buy" her and am really interested only in her company such as "Okay I'll get dinner and you can get the movie." It is a date afterall, not an exercise to make someone uncomfortable. | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/30/2006 8:50:21 PM | My Thoughts;
Women fought for years for equality, and now (for the most part), they have it. You take the good with the bad, and with that equality comes responsiblity.
A date has nothing to do with an "investment" for either party. If you both want to go on a date, you should both be willing to pay the freight.
This is 2006, correct ? | |
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| Paying on Dates
Posted: 9/30/2006 9:12:08 PM | | Me and an ex made a deal way back when...we dated for five years or so...Whoever's idea it was...paid...lol...it worked. So if it was something he wanted to do or if it was his idea, like let's say a hockey game...he would pay for the tickets. If I wanted to go for dinner at a particular restaurant or go see a show...I would pay. I don't have a problem paying for things sometimes and would never expect a guy to pay for everything...but sometimes neither of us would suggest anything...so we didn't have to pay...hehe... but one of us always caves... ...i thought it was a reasonable arrangement...besides women these days almost make equal pay so it's only fair....to me it's more of an economic issue. If she/he doesn't have any funds then their partner should cover it and it could go either way...I have no problem covering for him if I'm making more...but if they're financial situation is equal then the costs should be shared. As for a first date, I would assume it to be dutch....then you're both on equal ground and nobody owes anybody anything and you can walk away guilt free...but surprisingly there are gentlemen out there who still insist on paying...it's kinda nice :) | |
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Any woman that equates a man's emotional willingness to commit with how much he pays on the date is a woman I can do without 
