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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 8:18:19 AM | THANK YOU,
as he said so many things about me behind my back talking on this stupid internet to ladies and his friends all about what I did to him!!by talking bad about his family, when I only responded to his constant rantings about his out of control, greedy, heartless kids and ex's always asking him to help them out even with money.
Then he just couldnt spend any money on a life or to do anything with me because he didnt like to spend money. Example: to go out to eat was at Wendys on the $1.00 menu. Then the last ex came to his door to threaten me and try to get him to leave with her. When that didnt work, she quit eating, called him, saying she was going to kill herself, got on her knees, sobbing and pleading with him to come back and leave me, she would do all the work and pay all the bills, as she knew that was what he was looking for. While I thought I was being good to him he was doing all this crap. Then I put a profile on myself which he answered and telling "me" all about how he was mistreated by "me" and saying he was never committed to anyone.
So, yes, I am very leary about anyone's "sob" story now. | |
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mefein
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Joined: 7/7/2006
Msg: 202 | |
| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 8:29:08 AM | | i said it before and il say it again. all liars are COWARDS and all cowards are shit people. brutally honest but true and simple nonetheless. get away from them. reality scares the hell out of them so they live in a fantasy world. and the damage they do. forget it. get outa there. they damage everbody around them. mefein. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 8:47:38 AM | | HOLY CRAP...I dated one for 15 months scary thing is I met him off this site....no names it dont matter anymore...but I thought the person who wrote this posting was referring to him because the comments were so accurate and fit his personality to a complete TEE!!! But sociaopath also fits the same discription..the difference between a sociaopath and pshycopath is a psycopath will kill (scary huh). Look up the definations....you will see I'm right... Yes these people will lie about the most riduclious things. Small, large and everything inbetween...He ripped my heart out threw it on the floor and walked away with no feeling as though I and our relationship never existed...but then lied even about that...Scary girls and guys...the complete discription on the first posting in this forum is the most accurate discription of these people...they do things with Malis, they have an ultimate goal of decete, and distruction preplanned. Almost as though that is their purpose in life...They will take you for Money, love, sex, or anything that is possible to take from another human being..Well all I can say is this should you do come across anyone like this beware they are very very good at what they do..Dont try to win or save them because I know from personal experience unfortunatly you cant.. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 9:10:06 AM | It's unfortunate that these things happen. I met a gentleman, maybe here, maybe not that created an entirely different personality based on his brother's life, from his career to his tour of duty in Irag. None of it was true. You will find during conversations or correspondance, as Crystal stated, that something won't sit well with you and that should prompt you to investigate. The internet has afforded us the ability to meet people we may not have ever encountered otherwise, however, it has also given manipulative people a tool to create a new life for themselves. So, if I were to share any advice, which I rarely do  , I would encourage everyone to listen carefully for discrepancies, if you feel like something isn't quite right, it may not be. Someone who lies for absolutely no reason is only going to cause you heartache in the long run. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 11:18:43 AM | Good advice, Badkitty, and it is seldom that a "pathological liar" doesn't have other personality disorders. there is a free forum called thepsychopath dot freeforums dot org. the focus of that forum is for narcissists and psychopaths/sociopaths which are now called anti-social personality disorder.
There is NO CURE for these people, they don't want to be cured, the world is out of step, not them, the rules of society do not apply to them. There is some differences between the narcissist personality disorder and the AsPD, but pathological lying is a SYMPTOM of either or both. It is ONLY ONE symptom, and there are many others.
My advise as a retired psychological professional and a personal survivor of interactions with these people, is to LEARN ALL YOU CAN about how to spot them. Some of them are as crude as Charlie Manson, some as smooth and cunning as Ted Bundy. Not all are killers, some are cops; not all are physical abusers, some are lawyers, doctors, nurses, etc. every profession you can name.
As BadKitty says, any time anyone lies to you, or tries to blame their lie on you, or someone else, RED FLAG--BIGGGGGG RED FLAG
Many people who are "good people" are almost incapable of realizing that there are people in this world who are simply EVIL who have NO concern for how they hurt others, or actually enjoy hurting others  even if they don't get any benefit out of it that the rest of us can even perceive. The only solution to these people is to RUN RUN RUN and "cut them off like a cancer on the end of your nose." It may be a "painful operation, and it may leave a scar, " but if you don't it will CONSUME you to the core. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:24:32 PM | | You must understand that these people are sometimes hard to spot...believe me they are very very good at what they do and how they do it. They dont usually slip up. Your right they also take credit for many things that others have accomplished. But dont be fooled they are extreamly smart and know exactly what they are doing. The normal person that does not fall into their catagory can not even possible begin to understand what makes them tick. You as a significant other to them will alway be made to feel as though you are to blame for every situation that turns into a drama. You will begin to question your own worth. Their lies usually start with the first time you ever meet them right down to the bitter end. Depending on how long it takes you to catch on is how your heart gets trampled on. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:34:46 PM | | You have become so intregued with trying to figure them out that it is almost an addiction or an obsession of sorts...believe me you will NEVER figure them out...you will just be dragged deeper and deeper into their web of lies and then eventually get so hurt you will never know what the hell hit you...so undetermine yourself...save your strength your gonna need it..as for why he wont go away..because you are serving a purpose for him..what have you bought him? what have you done for him? you are nothing more than a catch net..a safe zone of sorts..believe me he is not only lieing to you...he is CHEATING on you as well...and most likely with more than one person.!!! stay in the relationship and you will eventually see I was right...personal experience is always a ****..!! | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:37:18 PM | just a thought and I am curious to see some answers.... to avoid these lies.....wouldnt it be better for ourselves to ask alot of questions? I know I do... I have learnt the hard way to a few times but not anymore. if they hesitate or beat round the bush with a huge explaination instead of a simplfy answer...then thats a sure sign..watch them get defensive...it happens quite often.  | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:42:40 PM | | Oh my god - Did you meet this guy on a dating site in the UK, sounds like the moron I had the misfortune to feel sorry for from barrow, it took me a while to accept he was extremely manipulative, and a pathological liar, and have the nerve and courage to walk away from him. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:43:07 PM | I am a phathological liar... Or am I?
Everyone on this site is really hot!
rr | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:49:05 PM | Thanks mate.
It's difficult to put down in writing all that I have experienced. I totally turned my life upside down for this girl, spent half my personal life savings supporting her, moved half way around the world for her. The more I look into it, the more I realise that she has a personality disorder - probably Narcissitic PD.
It is comforting to know that I am not the only person going through this or that has been through this. I have found it exceptionally difficult to detach myself from my feelings for her as she continues to randomly try and engage herself in my life - just as it seems as I am getting over her.
Take care all, my heart is warmed by the fact that there are some good people out there, willing to share and help in their experiences. Peace everyone!
I probably sound quite emotional and I feel it right now, I really thought it was me, I was the one losing my sanity, my self esteem and direction in life...
I am so pleased I stumbled upon this post.
Mark | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 1:59:01 PM | | When I said 'thanks mate' in my posting below, I was thanking you for your insightful comments, they are very much appreciated, Mark | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 2:09:59 PM | | I meant to say a personal thanks to INSURGENT 4 YOU - sorry quite lame at internet posts :-) | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 2:16:31 PM | | WOW, thanks for all the info. I thought you were explaining my ex too. To bad he is on here, telling everyone this is new to him. Oh man. Why do people have to be like that.? He saw how vulnerable I was and boy did I get the bad treatment. He would be talking to other women on the phone and some how it was always my fault..To bad I wasted 10 months before I got smart... I just have to believe I am so much better off without him. I just feel badly for the next person. I would have done anything for him. ANYTHING! My motto is "you treat me good, I will treat you BETTER!" I guess I have to big of a heart. I better start hiding it. It feels like it is broken into a million little pieces... BUT LIFE GOES ON!! :) | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 2:47:41 PM | I find it strange that so many people fall for this type of behavior | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 2:58:54 PM | Yeah well James Brown........
When u think u meet the woman / man of your dreams and they reciprocate you feel that u are at the end of your journey.........add that to extreme physical attraction and sexual attraction and............perhaps you have not experienced that? | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 3:15:42 PM | The following techniques are quite good in watching for lies. If the person is also a psychopath, however, even a lie detector may not actually pick up their lies, because they are so "unemotional" about them and "feel no guilt"-- One poster asked if you should ask a lot of questions. that is a good question. I wouldn't "cross examine them" per se, but anytime I am talking to someone I don't know well, I kind of make a mental "check list" and watch--the pathological liar will lie about "anything' even unimportant stuff, so if you catch them in ANY lie, in MHO, that is IT-out the door.
Introduction to Detecting Lies:
The following techniques to telling if someone is lying are often used by police, and security experts. This knowledge is also useful for managers, employers, and for anyone to use in everyday situations where telling the truth from a lie can help prevent you from being a victim of fraud/scams and other deceptions.
Warning: Sometimes Ignorance is bliss; after gaining this knowledge, you may be hurt when it is obvious that someone is lying to you.
Signs of Deception:
Body Language of Lies:
• A person who is lying to you will avoid making eye contact.
• Physical expression will be limited and stiff, with few arm and hand movements. Hand, arm and leg movement are toward their own body the liar takes up less space.
• Hands touching their face, throat & mouth. Touching or scratching the nose or behind their ear. Not likely to touch his chest/heart with an open hand.
Emotional Gestures & Contradiction
• Timing and duration of emotional gestures and emotions are off a normal pace. The display of emotion is delayed, stays longer it would naturally, then stops suddenly.
• Timing is off between emotions gestures/expressions and words. Example: Someone says "I love it!" when receiving a gift, and then smile after making that statement, rather then at the same time the statement is made.
• Gestures/expressions don’t match the verbal statement, such as frowning when saying “I love you.”
• Expressions are limited to mouth movements when someone is faking emotions (like happy, surprised, sad, awe, )instead of the whole face. For example; when someone smiles naturally their whole face is involved: jaw/cheek movement, eyes and forehead push down, etc.
Interactions and Reactions
• A guilty person gets defensive. An innocent person will often go on the offensive.
• A liar is uncomfortable facing his questioner/accuser and may turn his head or body away.
• A liar might unconsciously place objects (book, coffee cup, etc.) between themselves and you.
Verbal Context and Content
• A liar will use your words to make answer a question. When asked, “Did you eat the last cookie?” The liar answers, “No, I did not eat the last cookie.”
•A statement with a contraction is more likely to be truthful: “ I didn't do it” instead of “I did not do it”
• Liars sometimes avoid "lying" by not making direct statements. They imply answers instead of denying something directly.
• The guilty may speak more than natural, adding unnecessary details to convince you... they are not comfortable with silence or pauses in the conversation.
• A liar may leave out pronouns and speak in a monotonous tone. When a truthful statement, is made the pronoun is emphasized as much or more than the rest of the words in a statement.
• Words may be garbled and spoken softly, and syntax and grammar may be off. In other words, his sentences will likely be muddled rather than emphasized.
Other signs of a lie:
• If you believe someone is lying, then change subject of a conversation quickly, a liar follows along willingly and becomes more relaxed. The guilty wants the subject changed; an innocent person may be confused by the sudden change in topics and will want to back to the previous subject.
• Using humor or sarcasm to avoid a subject. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 3:42:35 PM | | sounds like me......wait......it doesnt.lol. yeah....i have met folks like that....ie. "i was in the gulf coast and my ship sank.....so a dolphin gave me a ride to shore" ....seriously! just know....the people you describe are a rare bunch. dont close your heart.....and if you do....well...you just might as well board yourself alone in your bedrooom.........the ends will be the same. good luck......lots of hugs............charles | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 3:52:15 PM | To bee-atch (msg #68):
Don't give up.
"To all problems there is a solution."
(Corollary of Godel's Incompleteness Theorems)
8 years is a long time to go without "cuggles".
P.S. I'm not going to do my usual 3-page article unless someone wants it all.
But I will post 2 pointers, based on all the lies I've been told:
How to tell if your man/woman/friend/alien from another planet is cheating?
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1. LISTEN NOW, BELIEVE (AND COMMIT) LATER.
You cannot believe the number of times someone told me a lie that sounded really, REALLY believable at the time. It was impossible to do anything but believe it, then. I'd agree to what he wanted, and then leave his, and then 2 hours later, realised it made no sense at all and was full of holes.
This may happen to you. You find out only after you are with the guy that he lied.
You may go back anyway, because he calls you up, picks you up, takes you out, etc.
The key is not that he lies. It's that he won't give you any piece of mind.
He's keeping you off-balance, by watching your body language, and your tone of voice.
But he's like a drug, you're all high when you're with him, but a couple of hours later and you're coming down.
If he sounds like manna from heaven, that's usually where you'll find him. Up there, in the clouds, 3 miles up. Leave him there for a bit and come down to earth.
Everything is a lot clearer from down here.
For starters, you aren't standing on clouds.
So, if you are listening to some piece of truth, like some guy tells you "he loves you", or "this is a really great deal for a car", or some such. Listen to what he says. Remember everything, every word, every gesture, like a video recorder. But don't do anything else. Do NOT under any circumstances agree to whatever is being suggested then. Simply say "I'll get back to you in 2 hours".
Then, when you leave his place, BEFORE he gets what he wants, go where he cannot see, hear or find you. Can be around the corner. Only he cannot find you. If you have a mobile, SWITCH IF OFF!
Why? If he can find you, your mind is still expecting the lie to continue, so you aren't able to re-evaluate it. It's still attached to your previous mood, so you can't change it.
Take a few breaths, smoke a ciggy, eat a sweet, dance a jig, do whatever you want, but do something to take yourself into a different mood, like coming down from a high.
Now, only once you are fully in a different mood, can be any mood, but there must be NO TRACE OF THE ORIGINAL MOOD WHATSOEVER. Good or bad, must be a totally different mood. Now, replay everything he said and did, from start to finish, but IN THE NEW MOOD. If it's garbage, this is a good time to spot it.
Why? A mood is like good lighting. Good lighting can make a really unattractive person seem like a stunner. All you have to do is set the lighting to the person. Same thing with the mood. If a lie is complimented by an appropriate mood, or a mood by an appropriate lie, it's always believable. Because IT'S BEING SHOWN IN IT'S BEST LIGHT! That's why you have to change the mood! Because the minute the mood is inconsistent with a lie, the lie is NO LONGER IN ITS BEST LIGHT! So it becomes really easy to spot.
Then, if it is a lie, prepare what you are going to say, and write it down.
Switch your phone back on.
Ring, read your writing, and hang up.
Do not listen, as that is set to this mood.
Do not argue for the same reason.
So remember:
1. LISTEN AND NOTHING ELSE
2. SAY YOU'LL DECIDE IN 2 HOURS
3. GO SOMEWHERE HE CANNOT FIND YOU
4.SWITCH OFF ALL THE PHONES
5. CHANGE YOUR MOOD
6. REPLAY AND NOTHING ELSE
7. DECIDE IF HE'S TELLING THE TRUTH
8. WRITE DOWN YOUR RESPONSE
9, RING AND GIVE HIM YOUR RESPONSE AND NOTHING ELSE
Summary:
LISTEN, CHANGE YOUR MOOD, REPLAY, THEN RESPOND
2. ASK A FRIEND.
Again, before you make any decision, ring your friend and ask her.
She is not in love with him, so she is not mesmerised by his beautiful lies.
Nor can she be swayed by him.
Make sure it is a friend that has your best interests at heart, though, and not a friend who is jealous of you.
"Ask and ye shall receive" | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 7:23:11 PM | rick r
you probably are!
and i wasnt the original author. i just find it very interesting to find that so many are telling the same story about so many.
why dont you examine why you havent ever had a relationship that worked and then maybe you will find out if you are one | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 7:28:10 PM | All of the above extreamly exceptional advice thank you very much for all the future advice believe me I will keep all that in mind....However, now here's the but....
Most people are not likely to do this detailed amount of thought process especially if they have no reason to believe they are being lied to. I would think that most women do trust their man..if not whats the sense of the relationship in the first place. But thats what they absolutly count on.
In having an experience in falling in love with one of these people I can tell you its not that simple. These people are very good at what they do infact they are exceptional at it. Why? Because they have had a life long experiences with each episode growing better and better at destroying emotions of so many in their paths.
The lets say "Norm" will not be able to detect their mate is a liar or if they do, not to this degree... Thank god, I had several little birdies to inform me of many past events that had occured which only confirmed what I had suspected for many many months. Jesus I swear I could write a book from going thru this relationship.
But, you cant just walk away from this particular type of person...its not quite that easy..for your own piece of mind..well, at least mine...you almost have to beat them at their own game...by that I mean, when you do find out everything you suspected to be true..not only you want to prove what a liar they are, but you want them to know you know what a piece of Work they really are. Of course you express to them how much they have hurt you etc. but let the truth be know that your feelings do not and will not matter to them. Not even remotely
Funny thing is this: my feelings and love were very real and that is what makes it so hard to swollow. You must never let the Liar in your life ever know that you hurt, still love them or even try so hard not to take their calls after the truth is unfold ..It only gives them power..they thrive off of it. To them they still maintain a control factor, so to them they again succeeded. Not that this is a game but know that to them you are just another meaningless project of sorts...If they fail...they move on to the next victim.. Your dieing inside and they seriously could care less.. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 7:59:53 PM | | This sounds just like my ex hubby,I have never known a guy who can think so many con stories up,I was shocked when I found out after being married to him for 6 years,it was not lies to me,although he probably did,just didn't find him out,and yes he thinks he is right in every thing he does and says,I will be careful who I get to know in future,I only new him 6 months and got married,of course I did not know he was like that. That made me smile about they always say there ill,thats him alright,trouble is he still pesters me,wants me back,but it is not cos he loves me,doubt that,it is for his own benefit,and of course i have daughter with him so I can not completely ignore him,I will certainly be glad when I can see the back of him for good. It is strange though sometimes when he speaks on the phone he seems like a different guy,real nice,but next time completely different. Glad I read your post,I just thought he may be just not all there in the head | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/14/2007 8:33:39 PM | Just think, you have Pathological Liars all around you! I had one for a manager at work! And I KNEW IT!! I would write the HR department all the time about this manager, but in the end I'm the one that got the kick in the A** out the door. Oh well, he was PURE evil.
Next time I see that trait in anyone I will RUN as fast as I can cause I know what they can do to you. And they derive enjoyment from lying, no guilt!
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/15/2007 1:58:30 PM | How well I know, on the phone and when we went out completely different. So nice, so pleasant, so sociable. Nice to talk to, nice to dance with, so much a gentleman.
But otherwise, so withdrawn, moody, morose, just hang around, didnt really do anything, just talk about his trouble and his problems with his kids and his health and how "they" all just want to take his money.
Oh,yea. Its easy to put on a show if you dont have to do it all the time. | |
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| Pathological Liars
Posted: 5/15/2007 2:12:19 PM | I read an excellent book a number of years ago that gave tremendous insight into liars - and people attracted to them. I highly recommend it.
M.Scott Peck, M.D. wrote, "People of the Lie, The Hope For Healing Human Evil", published in 1983 by Simon & Schuster. It’s a study of human evil; “because lying is both a cause and a manifestation of evil. It is partly by their lying that we recognize the evil.” | |
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