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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/11/2006 11:16:26 AM | How's that reading coming along?  Like you'll ever pick up a one of them......
Here's an excerpt from the Terrorism Research Center's website that the rambling machine mentioned two posts above:
The TRC maintains a network of terrorism and information warfare specialists drawn from industry, government, and academia in the United States, the United Kingdom, Sweden, Argentina, India, the Middle East, France, and Australia. By convening an international network of experts as required for customer projects, the TRC represents the next generation of collaborative research and analysis sharing. Similarly, the TRC is managed by a Board of Directors who represent the next generation of terrorism and information warfare experts. The TRC has produced a number of independent studies, including a comprehensive overview of US policy, strategy, programs, and budget to combat terrorism, produced for a US industry customer.
Sooooo.....they profit from the existence of terrorism. Yeah, there's an objective viewpoint if I ever saw one..... Hmmm, I wonder who that "US industry customer" is they mention at the end of that quote???
Who funds this site and organization? I searched everywhere and could not find a single source indicating who comprises this organization. I emailed them to find out, but I doubt I'll get a response. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/11/2006 2:55:03 PM | they profit from terrorism so that US citizen can send their children to school and have a healthcare system
Really....can you show me where that is on their website....I missed that one. I didn't realize people who research terrorism are the lynchpins of our healthcare system. Man ur schmart....
but I know all this is hard to understand when your a product of home-made-education....especially when your parents didnt go to shool!
It's "you're" not "your," and "homemade" is not hyphenated. Finally, what's a shool?
Now, What did you say about education?  | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/11/2006 9:23:02 PM | Good god................I just can't argue with you anymore. I'm getting dumber for doing so......
Will someone else please take up the torch of explaining elementary concepts to him. I just can't anymore....... | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/11/2006 10:06:54 PM | | Intercooler ,Your wasting your time. It seems like mencer is either brainwashed into no believing the truth or his boss wont let him believe it loooooooooooool. I suggest a class on the history of governments from the romans till now. This money goes into the hands of the elite. It will never see our pockets. We have the resources to feed the world homeless if our governments wanted to but i think they have other goals. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/12/2006 7:54:43 AM | The Presidents since Kennedy have just been doing what they are told. They use their hand to sign the laws as they are told.
If they don't do what they are told, they fear they will be shot like Kennedy, JFK, was.
The Stalinists running the USA have made sure no bright President gets into power.
Ralph Nader can debate any contender and win. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/12/2006 9:58:14 AM | As much as this back and forth converstaion with Mencer, reminds me of repeated attempts to point things out to my mother's cat ... he does have a point.
Cats don't understand the concept of pointing ... when I try to point out where he left his mouse, it doesn't regsiter with him what I'm trying to draw his attention to ... he just looks at my hand.
Beyond all that ... Mencer has a point.
It is not a morally ambiguous point ... it is morally vacant point ... which reduces to unconditional support for an Imperial system.
If you benefit from being an Imperial subject ... well then why should you argue with the imperial method?
All this talk about social justice and human rights is just blowing so much smoke at the mechanisms of a Manifest Destiny that will continue despite any change in leadership to the American political landscape. His thinking in this regard is unfortunately correct.
He takes it a step further and stipulates it is not just an American campaign of conquest ... but the forces of Modernity itself that is on the march.
It is cells phones, credit cards, internet access, Burger King, new cars, the Magic Bullet, designer jeans, CocaCola, stripper bars, Las Vegas, jet skis, Hollywood movies, satellite dishes, cable TV, Texas Hold 'em, ice cream, shopping malls, jet travel, industrial advances, globalisation.
Mencer's position is if you enjoy the benefit of these things ... you have no right to complain ... and why should you ... would you prefer living in the Stone Age?
If differing groups come into the mix and complain ... well who the hell are they to us ... just a bunch of backward thinking folks who wish stop the forward march of progress; and if the US doesn't confront them ... well then China or the EU or somebdy else will ... and the US will have surrendered it's global position as the world's sole hyper power.
This is the language and rationalisation of a global Manifest Destinty and justifies forceful supression of disruptive elements as being just a necessary casualty in the march of Modernity.
If Africans, or Hawians, or Haitians, or Native Americans, or Palestinians, or Persians, or Muslims get mown down in the process ... well so what ... do you really care ... and if you do ... you are a naive fool who stands on the 'wrong side' of progress.
Mencer agrees with the concept that 'might makes right'.
We will do what we want, and take what we want from who we want ... simply because we can.
Its just the way the world works ... and Mencer knows which side he wishes to be on ... the side of the 'winners'.
darjeeling | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/12/2006 11:09:47 AM |
Mencer's position is if you enjoy the benefit of these things ... you have no right to complain ... and why should you ... would you prefer living in the Stone Age?
Dar, you make a good point. However, I completely disagree with the notion that I have no right to complain, and that things are of a predetermined destiny.
I do agree that we have it better in this country than most others, but in order to maintain that, there is a high level of responsibility and stewardship that must be assumed by our leaders, and frankly, they are doing an incredibly shitty job of that.
Assuming for a moment we still live in a democracy (evidence would suggest that's a dubious assumption at best), I have voted for politicians to represent my views. When they completely ignore me and citizens like me, only serving their own self-interests with my tax dollars, I have every right to complain and work for change. I have every right to work to bring together others who agree with me and try to take the country in another direction.
Needless to say, I'm simplifying the argument for the sake of brevity.
"Might makes right" is not the only form of global leadership that works, although it is practiced by so many other countries as to make it certainly seem that way.
No, I don't advocate a communist form or gov't or any of that crazy crap that right-wing nuts would like you to believe of non-Bush Supporters. I do think, though, our current government's fiscal, military, and diplomatic incompetence and utter lack of actual leadership (Hello, Congress? Work much?) is a horrible waste of my, and my neighbor's hard-earned tax dollars. Thus, I want it to change.
Mencer agrees with the concept that 'might makes right'.
I agree, which essentially makes him a neo-con. Ick. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/12/2006 1:00:17 PM | Intercooler, I think Darjeeling is trying to say that debating with Mencer is like a
LESSON IN FUTILITY.
It is akin to wrestling with a pig in the mud.
Before you know it, you realize the pig likes to wrestle in the mud.
Perhaps Mencer sees the world through a particluar mindset. You may have all the data to prove him wrong and the websites to strengthen your arguement, but he might be of the type that might be HELL BENT on sticking to his interpretation of reality despite evidense otherwise.
I do not think he is trolling, unlike the clowns that pop in and blindly/foolishly support the Neocon Doctrine & Dogma. The aforementioned clowns either belong to a greedy upper class family and like to impose there supposed "dine right" philospohy, or are simply ignorant joe blue color types that think "they know it all".
Mencer just needs to do some big time getting to know the world through a different set of eyes. Become a more objective human being.
My fave politcal observer was Hunter S. Thompson.
He told things as they were. You should read his frank and very honest view of Geo W. Bu$h.
It was honest candid and hilarious.
I for one hate polite brown nosers who paint cute clean official and sanctioned bios.
NO! I want to here all he truth, WARTS AND ALL. THE PLAIN SIMPLE TRUTH.
In America there should not be sacred cows or prized white elephants. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 7:52:33 AM | Mencer,
We are much more unsafe by overstaying in Iraq. We should have declared victory, AND as per Dr. Juan Cole of University of Michigan, we should have let the arab countries broker a peace and have them do the detail with the insurgents. It would deflate the Al Qaeda instigating since they would not want to be accused of killing fellow arabs.
The money would have been better spent just letting the Speacial Forces capture an kill Osama Been Forgotten. But I think elements within the Bush Admin. allowed Osama to get a away. Reason? Milk the war, the Cheneys, the Bushes, and Rumsefeld have money inbvested in the war. Please note, it is well known the Bush family is known to profit from build uop and war: ie. eg. Prescott Bush financing and profiting from Nazi Germany's rise and fighting with the allies.
The money would have been better spent (and saved) having the National Guard troops here protecting our airposrt and infrasturcture. Also sending special ops , or who knows, Vigilante Minute Men to do the liquidation/assassination of these arab terrorist ala Israeli MOSSAD tactics. I like this idea, cancel the cretins off the planet. I think this would have been the John Kerry approach
So NO...The current Bush stratgey makes no sense and some observers prognosticate that we may be in Iraq for MANY MANY years. Osama will have accomplished his goals, the USA will bleed financially and lose many friends and credibility. The buttwipe, Osama, will die of natural causes with a smirk/smile on his corpse. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 8:27:30 AM | So NO...The current Bush stratgey makes no sense and some observers prognosticate that we may be in Iraq for MANY MANY years. Osama will have accomplished his goals, the USA will bleed financially and lose many friends and credibility. The buttwipe, Osama, will die of natural causes with a smirk/smile on his corpse.
_____________________________
The current Bush stratgey makes no sense!!!!!!!!!!!
Your right there. The managment of this country is outrageous. This is what happens with a one party system that hates goverment.
Yahoo! News
Bush staff wanted bomb-detect cash moved
By JOHN SOLOMON, Associated Press WriterFri Aug 11, 7:38 PM ET
While the British terror suspects were hatching their plot, the Bush administration was quietly seeking permission to divert $6 million that was supposed to be spent this year developing new homeland explosives detection technology.
Congressional leaders rejected the idea, the latest in a series of steps by the Homeland Security Department that has left lawmakers and some of the department's own experts questioning the commitment to create better anti-terror technologies.
Homeland Security's research arm, called the Sciences & Technology Directorate, is a "rudderless ship without a clear way to get back on course," Republican and Democratic senators on the Appropriations Committee declared recently.
"The committee is extremely disappointed with the manner in which S&T is being managed within the Department of Homeland Security," the panel wrote June 29 in a bipartisan report accompanying the agency's 2007 budget.
Rep. Martin Sabo, D-Minn., who joined Republicans to block the administration's recent diversion of explosives detection money, said research and development is crucial to thwarting future attacks and there is bipartisan agreement that Homeland Security has fallen short.
"They clearly have been given lots of resources that they haven't been using," Sabo said.
Homeland Security said Friday its research arm has just gotten a new leader, former Navy research chief Rear Adm. Jay Cohen, and there is strong optimism for developing new detection technologies in the future.
"I don't have any criticisms of anyone," said Kip Hawley, the assistant secretary for transportation security. "I have great hope for the future. There is tremendous intensity on this issue among the senior management of this department to make this area a strength."
Lawmakers and recently retired Homeland Security officials say they are concerned the department's research and development effort is bogged down by bureaucracy, lack of strategic planning and failure to use money wisely.
The department failed to spend $200 million in research and development money from past years, forcing lawmakers to rescind the money this summer.
The administration also was slow to start testing a new liquid explosives detector that the Japanese government provided to the United States earlier this year.
The British plot to blow up as many as 10 American airlines on trans-Atlantic flights was to involve liquid explosives.
Hawley said Homeland Security now is going to test the detector in six American airports. "It is very promising technology and we are extremely interested in it to help us operationally in the next several years," he said.
Japan has been using the liquid explosive detectors in its Narita International Airport in Tokyo and demonstrated the technology to U.S. officials at a conference in January, the Japanese Embassy in Washington said.
Homeland Security is spending a total of $732 million this year on various explosives deterrents and has tested several commercial liquid explosive detectors over the past few years but hasn't been satisfied enough with the results to deploy them.
Hawley said current liquid detectors that can scan only individual containers aren't suitable for wide deployment because they would bring security check lines to a crawl.
For more than four years, officials inside Homeland Security also have debated whether to deploy smaller trace explosive detectors — already in most American airports — to foreign airports to help stop any bomb chemicals or devices from making it onto U.S.-destined flights.
A 2002 Homeland report recommended "immediate deployment" of the trace units to key European airports, highlighting their low cost, $40,000 per unit, and their detection capabilities. The report said one such unit was able, 25 days later, to detect explosives residue inside the airplane where convicted shoe bomber Richard Reid was foiled in his attack in December 2001.
A 2005 report to Congress similarly urged that the trace detectors be used more aggressively, and strongly warned the continuing failure to distribute such detectors to foreign airports "may be an invitation to terrorist to ply their trade, using techniques that they have already used on a number of occasions."
Tony Fainberg, who formerly oversaw Homeland Security's explosive and radiation detection research with the national labs, said he strongly urged deployment of the detectors overseas but was rebuffed.
"It is not that expensive," said Fainberg, who retired recently. "There was no resistance from any country that I was aware of, and yet we didn't deploy it."
Fainberg said research efforts were often frustrated inside Homeland Security by "bureaucratic games," a lack of strategic goals and months-long delays in distributing money Congress had already approved.
"There has not been a focused and coherent strategic plan for defining what we need ... and then matching the research and development plans to that overall strategy," he said.
Rep. Peter DeFazio (news, bio, voting record) of Oregon, a senior Democrat on the Homeland Security Committee, said he urged the administration three years ago to buy electron scanners, like the ones used at London's airport to detect plastics that might be hidden beneath passenger clothes.
"It's been an ongoing frustration about their resistance to purchase off-the-shelf, state-of-the-art equipment that can meet these threats," he said.
The administration's most recent budget request also mystified lawmakers. It asked to take $6 million from Homeland S&T's 2006 budget that was supposed to be used to develop explosives detection technology and instead divert it to cover a budget shortfall in the Federal Protective Service, which provides security around government buildings.
Sens. Judd Gregg, R-N.H., and Robert Byrd, D-W.Va., the top two lawmakers for Senate homeland appropriations, rejected the idea shortly after it arrived late last month, Senate leadership officials said.
Their House counterparts, Reps. Hal Rogers, R-Ky., and Sabo, likewise rejected the request in recent days, Appropriations Committee spokeswoman Kirsten Brost said. Homeland said Friday it won't divert the money.
___
Associated Press writer Leslie Miller contributed to this story.
Copyright © 2006 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 8:56:57 AM | | If you pick a fight with a smaller weeker kid in a school yard, he has only the options of taking the hammering from you or picking up something and fighting back. Right or wrong many in the Islamic world see the United States as that bully in the school yard. They will continue to pick up bigger and bigger sticks to fight back with until we leave them alone. This terrorism has spread to unrelated forces who intend to fight back with every means at their diposal. They will inflict bigger and bigger pain until we cease our aggression. It does not matter the right or wrong of it, that is the outcome we are now dealing with. The origional question before you guys starting pig wrestling in the mud was how is our President doing? My answer is terrible. For what ever reasons, he has made that world see us as an aggressor nation and that has started something that will be almost impossible to stop. If we had not invaded Iraq and stayed in Afghanistan we would not have been fuel for the fire of anti-American feelings. Bush's unqualified support of Israel's war in Lebanon has thrown another cord of wood on the fire. Dubya knows as much about diplomacy as a pig knows about sunday. He is the wrong man at the wrong time in the wrong place. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 10:50:06 AM | Mencer - I understand that you might be dealing with a language problem. However if you worked real hard on it for a very long time, you could not possibly come up with a greater misunderstanding of my posting. The United States is THE superpower in the world. No one has our firepower. My point was that we look like the bully to the Islamic world and they will fight back with everything necessary. Safe, hell no. We are creating more terrorism daily by Dubya's actions. If they can't hit targets they want to hit, they will start hitting targets that they can.
Bush is throwing fuel on a fire that grows bigger daily. If it continues, the results will be more than one disaster.
Stupid is as stupid does......Forrest Gump | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 12:12:54 PM | ^^^ You have it right, Rev.....most people with skulls that aren't made of uranium yellowcake see it that way as well.
but I dont see much aproval on your side either...you guys keep spitting the same old conspiracy stories all the time.....there are only pigs in this mud..
The facts about the evidence for going to war in Iraq are not in dispute--The Bu$h Administration lied repeatedly, fed false information to the people and it's own cabinet members (Colin Powell), began meeting about invading Iraq long before 9/11, lied to the UN, and had zero evidence of anyone from Iraq having anything to do with 9/11. Dik Cheney personally oversaw some of the "white papers" being drawn up under impossible deadlines and with false information to support his case for going to war, and they put on an organized campaign to discredit a CIA operative after her husband disputed Bu$hCo's claims about yellowcake being obtained by Iraqi operatives in Niger.
I'm sorry facts have no meaning to you, and that you're so incredibly misinformed. Please go on name-calling and labeling everything a conspiracy which doesn't agree with your inability to be informed. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 12:47:28 PM | As for the Bush strategy well the US army's war will pay off because reconstruction in occupied countrys will produce countless of lucrative contracts for businesses that were worried about economic stagnation, imagine building entire enfrastructures, telecommunication networks, not to talk about retail stores or food chain....its a gold mine for business.
=========
Dude,
It is paying off for the very few.
If you have read Confessions of anEconomic Hit Man, you will know thatitis these privately owned companies (also public) that stand to make billions. How about D.ick Cheney's company Haliburton? Hmmmm. These companies will make billions. But who will pay the crushing tab: the American Tax Payer. The tax payer will not get any payoff or dividend.
Who loses in the short run and left holding the "bag": our beloved sons/daughters/moms/dads who are are pathetic pawns fighting a grotesque elitist game of global chess. They will die helping make billions for a relative handful. We should have stuck to our goal and capture and kill Osama. We did not and so we have a You Break It, You Buy It policy in action/
We busted Iraq, now we are stuck and paying for it. If John Hoag is right, thie will be a karmic lesson that USA has not learned. A Texan governor (LBJ) gets us in Vietnam, A Texas governor (GWB) gets us in IRAQ. We may be there for a long time (just listen to the Republicans and Neocons).
We should have taken Egypt's offer to let the Arab world broker a peace and let THEM be the multinational peace keeping force. Due to GWB's arrogance we will surely pay a big price.
Then there is the nonsense about invading/bombing IRAN.
Ok so the Arabs and Persians hate each other. If we are perceived as the bully, by gones will be bygones and then you will have muslim brother siding with muslim brother against an invading "infidel".
The US body bags are approaching 3000.
Again, heads they win (the coporate giants), tales you lose (the American Tax payer). | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/14/2006 1:09:27 PM |
I think we should focus on destroying the terrorist menace and make sure the US stays as a superpower.
Effect, ....meet cause.
and you know Ironicaly, we have a very good forecast of what was to come if Saddam had fallen even without the US intervention..Irak may have become a fundamentalist state.
???
Effect, .....meet cause.
Irony? .....yup. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 5:05:22 AM | Oh Stryker, it seems you've added two and two to come up with five.
I can understand your frustration, brother. The death toll of 911 was staggering and horrific. Why do these people have a beef with the US? You weren't looking for trouble but it found you.
Let me explain: Most intelligence experts estimated that, in 2000, there were only 800- 1000 Al Qaeda operatives worldwide. A bunch of nutballs decided that the West (specifically its spokes-nation, the US for whom Israel is supposedly a stooge) was the reason for all their problems. Defying the odds, they got their act together enough to inflict heavy damage. Now I am pretty certain, Stryker, that you or anyone lost on 911 had very little to do with the partitioning of the Ottoman Empire, the creation of Israel, the subsequent loss of Palestinian living standards, the Suez Crisis, etc. But these are nutballs and every country has them (KKK anyone?).
What happened to the US was WRONG and more than a little evil. But, just as Al Qaeda decided every white man was a villain, America started to act as though every brown man was out to kill them. Iraq was invaded to stop WMDs (I think they're buried under Saddam's unicorn ranch, alert the NSA). More recently was the bombing of Lebanon by Israel (with American bombs launched by American planes paid for by American taxpayers, as Arab media are quick to point out.)
Believe it or not there are pro-American Arabs. Its just that, after Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo, its getting harder to stick up for your beliefs when sitting in a cafe in Beruit or Tehran.
If a friend of yours beat the crap out of someone because they said he had anger management issues, wouldn't you look like a tool if you defended him? | |
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shinxy
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Joined: 3/5/2006
Msg: 143 | |
| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 7:36:24 AM | Bush cares about no one but himself. He wants to succeed at what his daddy couldn't do. He is using his power to self-destruct our entire nation.
think about it:
The gas prices are up: He is an oil man...
He launched an investigation of gas-gauging and "no gauging" was found...to me that says that it was hidden on his end.
People can't afford a big drive to work due to gas prices so they have to go to unemployment which is soaking that budget and when they can't get anywhere with it, they turn to the welfare budget.
In the meantime, factories are closing. Ford is closing. All car production is being cut because they can't get people to buy this fuel because it is so high and they can't afford it.
We are just looking at another depression. | |
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bobby7
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Joined: 3/22/2006
Msg: 144 | |
| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 8:26:42 AM | "Bush is not a intellectual its obvious, but hes trying I think (with all this bashing Im surprised he hasnt joined Al Qaida by now!"
He Hasn't?? Seems to me he has, or is , at the very least, aiding and abetting.. | |
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bobby7
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Joined: 3/22/2006
Msg: 145 | |
| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 8:30:11 AM | "To Defeat The Enemy, The United States Is Helping Iraqis Rebuild"
Drop them a line...FIX THE OIL METERS......While the are so bent on reconstruction..
And..Umm..how 'bout some fresh water and a little electricity?... | |
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shinxy
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Joined: 3/5/2006
Msg: 147 | |
| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 1:11:41 PM | How about the terrorists that just tried to crash our planes in London? That would not have even been plotted if his guard had not been down...
AND SCOTLAND YARD WAS THE ONE TO CATCH THAT ONE....not Bush. If we left it to him, more dead civilians..
And 11 missing Egyptian students that were headed for California? Where are they now? Does anyone know that the American Embassy is in Monterey California...and the terrorists just caught were from 19-35.
Imagine that? What are we? crazy? | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/16/2006 11:11:28 PM | But be sure to use that genius vernacular of yours, we wouldn't want anyone here believing that this shit should be taken seriously, now would we?
_____________________stryker56
Too bad, No Show George and Shooter dont take this Sh!t serious. This last group was working with Osma, out of Pakistain.
George doesnt think about Osma much anymore. Geo's words.
Maybe he should? Good thing the Brits think about this seriously.
The worst Pres ever. Time will prove it. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/17/2006 8:18:07 AM | | History generally proves out a President to be good, bad, ineffectual, inspirational etc. It usually takes years to figure out all of the effects of his Presidency. Unfortunately, we won't have to wait for history to prove out our current one. Every day he is in office is one more day of 1,000 cuts of death to our country. Dubya is a dangerous combination of arrogance, stupidity, and crudeness. He won't have any competition for the bottom of the heap. | |
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| What do you think about what the US president is doing?
Posted: 8/17/2006 10:14:41 AM | Heres something for the prez I am sure he will enjoy, I know I did...
Judge nixes warrantless surveillance By SARAH KARUSH, Associated Press Writer
6 minutes ago
DETROIT - A federal judge ruled Thursday that the government's warrantless wiretapping program is unconstitutional and ordered an immediate halt to it.
U.S. District Judge Anna Diggs Taylor in Detroit became the first judge to strike down the National Security Agency's program, which she says violates the rights to free speech and privacy as well as the separation of powers enshrined in the Constitution | |
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