| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/17/2006 8:53:26 PM | | can you please tell me where to find the information you speak of or share it with me because my exboyfriend is schizophrenic and has epilepsy. these are part of why he is my ex he does not wan tto help himself but nutrition is important to him so i thought maybe i could email the diet to him | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/17/2006 9:46:30 PM | Lets get one thing straight.
Drugs dont cause schizophrenia. If, however, there is the genetic tendency toward it, then smoking pot definitely makes it worse. The evidence on this is pretty clear.
Schizophrenia usually develops between the ages of 18-25. Schizo affective personality disorder is not a psychosis but resembles schizophrenia in some respects.
She must get a referral to a psychiatrist. I wouldnt assume this is schizophrenia before you get a differential diagnosis. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/18/2006 7:03:20 PM | Just a 'thankyou' to everyone who has donated thier time and information and sympathy to me over this thread. It's been a bit of a roller coaster ride hearing different views, just as an update I still have not been in touch with my sister, but family members are trying to make it happen, i just need to find the right time to ask her to get some help before it is too late. Once again thanx, it's very very informative. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 10:22:10 AM | | Marijuana can make you paranoid. This is where her problem lies. You should get some literature for her. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 5:55:48 PM | | The Clarke Institute of Psychiatry in Toronto Ont. Their site has excellent credentials... | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 7:43:20 PM | I doubt that pot or alcohol makes you schizophrenic, but if one has mental illness, "self medicating" certainly can make it much worse.
OP: Remember: You are not responsible for your sister's behaviour. Don't take it personally, and definitely protect your children. Never criticize her in front of them, especially if they have been close to her. It is frightening for everyone, including your sister who's behaviour could also be affected by her denial there is a problem. No one want to think they are losing their mind. Its self preservation.
Do what you can do, but do not feel guilty that you cannot do more for her. There are professionals that are trained to understand and treat diseases. You might want to check out any support groups as well as seek information. The more you know, the better you can deal with it. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 7:51:42 PM | I did not yet read all 3 pages, but to answer the question of how to tell someone they have schizophrenia? You don't. Not until you have M.D, D.O, or PhD behind your name.
About all you can do is lovingly tell her that you are worried about her life and the choices she is making. And hope that she takes your intentions for what they are. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 8:00:25 PM | There are 2 forms of Schizophrenia.1. Reactive schizo 2. Process schizo.
1. Reactive Schizophrenia is when a person develops schizophrenia as a reaction to a stressful situation. This type of schizophrenia WILL go away over time and patients can recover 100%.
2. Process Schizophrenia is a chronic disorder with a gradual onset, and patients do not recover from it...It can be biological, environmental or both.
There are 4 classifications of schizophrenia. 1.Catatonic- characterized by various motor disturbances, including catatonic postures and waxy flexibility (think the exorcist of emily rose) 2. Paranoid-person suffers from delusions of grandeur, persecution or control 3. Disorganized-Characterized by disturbances of thought and a flattened or silly effect (they ramble incoherently) 4. undifferentiated- a mix of all types of schizo
The problem is that when schizophrenia appears in adulthood, very rarely do they volunteer for treatment. They usually have to be forced and this is also why you see so many adult patients who refuse to take their medication or take it irresponsibly, as opposed to patients who have had the onset during childhood where the parents usualy bring them in, and taking their meds just becomes a way of life.
All you can do is try to talk to her if there is ever a time when she seems to be in a "normal" mood and DON'T DO IT ALONE. Have other family members there with you. As well you may want to ask your family doctor for pointers on approaching her. it's really hard to say how to approach this problem without knowing particulars. But i wish you luck and hang in there. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 8:07:52 PM | Just a note from reading your original post OP, schizophrenic's ARE NOT more violent then the common population (just are reported more in the news). If she does have this mental disorder, I hope that's not the only reason you're chosing to stay away from her, because more then likely she really needs some loving support right now.
Also, average onset for men is 18-25, but for women it is 25 to mid thirties, with another peak after 40. Ruling out the disease because of age isn't the best idea.
Good luck to you and your family, I hope that she agrees soon to get some professional help. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 8:17:49 PM | Juliet.................................
My son's father was diagnosed with Schizophrenia when he was 27 yrs of age..I wouldn't wish that disorder on my worst enemy...he was a great guy and I believe he didn't deserve something that drastic in his life....he was an excessive drug user in his late teen years and all I can do now is preach to my son the effects drugs can have on one person and the rest of their life...I know they say this disease is not brought on by abusing drugs but my ex was into it hard core and eventually I believe it fried his brain cells...he is not the man, I once knew nor will our son have the chance to get to know the real him....it freaks my son out just to talk to him over the phone....so he hasn't talked to him in awhile....my son is now a teenager himself...and is totally against drugs and his friends using them.....it's really sad because my son knows of kids his age that actually sell them.....my ex is living in a home that is monitored, a few years ago, I was contacted by the O.P.P in the area he is now living in because a murder occured and I fit the same description as the victim when I was 19 yrs of age....to my knowledge the case went unresolved because my ex has an illness....they say schizophrenics remember happy times in their lives and live for that moment...my ex remembers the little things of when we were together that I can't even remember even if I think really hard about it.....you really need to get someone to listen and get ur sister the help she needs....before she causes harm to anyone then gets locked up for life.....you have to keep trying until someone listens to you.....EVENTUALLY if you keep on them....someone will listen.....
Good luck | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 8:42:26 PM | Julietjuliet, I want to say first that my heart goes out to you. My very best friend was diagnosed when we were in our early 20s, and now we're in our mid 40s. She's been in and out of hospitals for years, and seems to be doing okay with a combination of different types of therapy, including medical, theraputic, and chemical. She was - IMO - self-medicating with drugs (mostly pot) and alcohol and I really think it pulled her into a vicious cycle where the drugs helped her "deal" with life for brief periods, but in their wake left her less able to cope than she's been previously. So... she did more. It probably made sense at the time. She was very, very lucky to have a sister who really got it that she wasn't well, and was able to convince her to talk to someone - and also very lucky that the doctor whe spoke to was able to convince her to look into treatment. But, it sounds so much like what you are going through - the county health department wouldn't assist unless she was actively showing signs of psychosis - and then their advice was to call the police!
Okay.... so that wasn't useful in terms of advice. It sounds like others have had a lot more to offer in terms of research and experience. I wish I had something truly useful to offer you - this is going to be hard. How do you get someone who refuses to eat to eat well? I wish I knew. I know this: Your sister is very lucky to have you. But please make sure you are taking care of yourself, okay? | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 8:48:34 PM | Hi Just wanted to reply to this post as I often deal with clients that are diagnosed with Mental Illnesses. Schizophrenia is especially difficult to deal with. I am an addictions worker and work in a withdrawal Management Facility. aka detox. It is not uncommon for schizophrenic individual's to self medicate themselves with pot. Seems to calm them down and gives them a bit of piece. This is not necessarily the right answer but is a very hard illness to have. I do not know of the drugs ever causing the disease but can make subtle symptoms much more severe. Hard drugs that is not usually pot.
Be patient and if the opertunity arises offer to help her seek professional advise and testing. Once treated this is often something that can be reasonably controled. Relatively normal lifes can exist with this illness. My heart goes out to you in this situation.
Trish | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 9:19:38 PM | Msg 61....My sister would be in category's 2 and 3 and has been like this for i guess about 3 years now, it's hard to say exactly. I have taken on board what you have said. Thanx
Msg 62....Sorry wrong! There is a reason i stay away from her and keep my children away from her. Her ex house is full of punch holes, and her ex husband to be, was covered in 'bite marks', scratches and bruises inflicted by her. Before she moved out, he had to put a lock on his door he was so petrified of her. My own 6 year old son is terrified of her cause she uses an over the top angry voice at him and her eyes look so evil when she is angry. All in all, i think they can be extremely violent, especially when the 'voices' tell them to do certain things a normal person would not. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 9:36:06 PM | Juliet,
I would never allow my son to be alone with his father.....he will soon be 15.....it freaked my son out when they use to chat over the phone....he has not seen his bio-father since 2000. My son would ask alot of why questions....even while medicated.....they tend to be off topic alot....medication should keep their mood swings in order....the problem is trying to find the right drug.....my ex gained alot of weight, he used to be fit and totally in shape now he is like the good year blimp (pardon the pun)....very bloated......they say it's the side affects from the medication and it means it's working for them....even thou he has gained almost 70 lbs......my son's favourite movie is called "A Beautiful Mind" if you have the chance rent it or buy it.....my son has a copy and has learned alot about the disease | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 9:48:29 PM |
my son's favourite movie is called "A Beautiful Mind" if you have the chance rent it or buy it
wait a second, the main character in "a beautiful mind" has schizophrenia? I thought he was just delusional or something; my friend told me he thought of me when he saw that movie....thi si snot good and i' mbeing totally serious | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/19/2006 9:49:03 PM | Juliet you have been though a lot. Regardless if she has or what particular illness, having been accused, your 'buttons' pushed, been alienated, and/or been betrayed would make anyone feel like shit. Your courage and determination to stick around her is amazing. However, you feel very frustrated because your not able help your sister.
As we all know, when we are wiser, there’re just some things we don't have control over. I'm sorry to say there really is nothing you can do to help her. This is the one of most frustrating feelings for friends and family have to deal with. However, you do not have to abandon her. You can choose to remain in her life by being emotionally present. Emotionally present by listening to her without judgment/advice and acknowledge her existence/feelings. This is different from trying to change her reality and getting involved with her battles. This also means saying no to requests to stay in her alternate reality. (i.e. asking for money to support her alternate way of life, asking for validation that she is 'right', etc..) This emotional presents will really test your limits to remain physical uninvolved while she goes though her self-destruction. However, if you can endure these feelings and be emotional present, the payoff is being close to you sister in hopes for a day to come where she asks for help and to be cured. Until that day comes, you can not help people that do not want help.
I'm sorry to say sometimes people never come to this realization and live the rest of their lives in this alternate reality.
Thanks for reading. I hope you find your inner peace.
-Mikey | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/20/2006 12:38:09 AM | julietjuliet...
I'm not wrong..
"a recent survey condected in Quebec found that the majority of respondents thought that people with schizophrenia were dangerous or violent (strip, Caron & Lane, 2001). But statistics show otherwise. A recent Canadian study examined nearly seven hundred cases from a forensic hospital and found that people with a schizophrenia diagnosis were far less likely to commit violent crimes then those without the diagnosis (Noonan, 2003)"
True this is a Canadian study but it has been tested a multitude of times in other westernized countries as well..
There are far too many myths about this disease.. one being violence is a given, another that it has anything to do with multiple personalities.. (that would be called dissociative disorder, which does not have the characteristic delusions and hallucinations present in schizophrenia).
In my original response I said that I hope you arn't afraid of your sister just because you think she may have schizophrenia.. you did not offer any reasons as to why you would be cautious in dealing with her until now.. I was just making the point that schizophrenia and violence are not synonomous.. the bullsh.it. perpetuated in the media needs to end and people need to get educated on the facts.. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/20/2006 10:59:01 AM | I agree fullestbooty, there are a lot of myths in general with mental health issues. Our attitude towards those suffering with any kind of mental afflication is often to drug them or lock them up so we don't have to deal with the problem. We are a fear society. I've watched a good friend go through two years of working with her teenage son with schizophrena. And what she has done with nutrition, homeopathy, tolerance, counselling, etc has been inspiring. She is the most non-judgemental person I know.
If there is a mental issue going on then she needs support, love and non-judgement more than ever. She migth be feeling all sorts of things you don't know about. There is a time for tough love and there is a time for support and unconditional love.
Good luck. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/20/2006 11:13:16 AM | OP - to answer your original posting...
You know she has a problem. You also know you can't fix her. You have a responsibility to protect yourself and your children. Yes, encourage her to get help. But do NOT fall into the trap of "being there" for her. It slides too easily into codependence and enabling. (lovely 1990 buzzwords)
Do what you need to do for you and your kids. Offer her help if she asks, but do not feel responsible for her care!!!
(cyberhugs)
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/21/2006 6:08:33 PM | I've been a clinical therapist for about 16 years in the public mental health system of two counties in Day Treatment programs, which are alternatives to the psychiatric hospital. Due to state and Medicaid cuts, I am not currently working in the field but feel my knowledge could be of help here as my "specialty" was with the more disordered folks in our programs. I worked with a number of bipolar, schizophrenic and head injured clients over the years...
Your sister is certainly troubled and I can't say from the information you provided if she is truly schizophrenic or not. She is certainly paranoid and has a substance abuse problem. One of the problems with long term use of marijuana is that one of its effects is paranoia and from what I've seen of some folks, I wonder what the long term effects on brain chemistry is. The active ingredient is THC and its a fat-soluble drug, which stores itself in the fatty tissues of the body. SO THC hangs around in a persons body for a real long time.
Your sister is certainly unstable and if she scares you, stay away! Even if you're good at hiding your fear, she will sense it and it will likely feed her paranoia.
You cannot force her into treatment... You cannot even get her to admit she has any problem at all. Even if she gets forced into treatment by the courts, without a supportive mental health system (I think they've all gone away) for her she will likely not get much better.
I've recently witnessed this over the past few weeks with a neighbor. The family approached me and told me what was going on. She was non-compliant with the child welfare authorities and her children were removed from the home with the assistance of the local police. I tried to talk to her, but she ordered me off her property. The sad thing is that if she would have worked with the Protective Services folks, even without necessarily owning up to being ill, sheds still have her kids and the aid she needed to keep them at home. Without the rock her kids provided, I suspect she'll continue to go downhill.. Even a mentally ill person can care for children and sometimes that need to care for others provides the structure for stability.
I wish you well and hope things work out. If you have other questions feel free to message me.
Gregoire | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 8/21/2006 6:17:20 PM | In my years of dealing with mentally ill folks, I have only been hurt by one and he was a crack head (and the authorities didn't tell us when he was sent to the program), all his symptoms were related to substance use.
Most mentally ill folks are mostly a danger to themselves, not others. One person out of the couple thousand I've worked with is pretty darn good! And that is typical for most mental health outpatient settings. Inpatient can be, and is, rougher. And unfortunately the police have the worst experiences of all with the few mentally ill that are violent. And the police are frequently involved with the involuntary, court-ordered hospitalizations.
Unfortunately in Juliet's case, her sister is acting out in a violent fashion and she has a right to be scared. But Juliet, your sister is the exception, not the rule.
Juliet, be safe and do your best to be happy. You aren't responsible for your sister's well being at this point as she doesn't want help. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 2/11/2007 2:22:32 PM | Schizo-affective disorder is caused by psychosis. How do I know? Because I have it...
My thoughts on the board. Get help. The medication used nowadays can really help you get your life back on track. I've been on risperidol and a newer drug called Zyprexa for about a year, and it really works well... without it, you're gambling with your life. | |
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| Dealing with schizophrenia
Posted: 2/11/2007 4:00:43 PM | Maybe the pot isn't working anymore? Or as effectively?
What I am saying is that many people use drugs or alcohol to MASK or SELF MEDICATE certain disorders and mental/emotional conditions. And the disorders don't really show up till that person stops, cuts back or the masking agents become less effective.
Your sister may have had a predilection with these psychological tendencies for a long time, though they went unnoticed because she would have been 'medicated' ie: stoned for the past 20 years.
Think back over the years and see if you can recall any instances whereby she has behaved strangely or out of context. You may be able to trace a point of origin.
Then get some professional help and advice. For yourself and your sister.
It sounds like she is in real trouble, but please remember that it IS an illness (you are dealing with a sick unwell person here) and she is probably not wilfully injurious.
Most important thing is to protect yourself and your immediate family. If you consult with a professional in the medical/psychiatric field and document your sister's behaviour it is possible to have her committed for a time for her own safety. Especially if these psychotic episodes become dangerous to herself or others.
She is not really in a position to listen, or rationalise what you are telling her reasonably.
Unfortunately the poor woman probably doesn't have a clue what is going on with herself. And is probably really desperate and panicky inside.
Her accusations towards yourself and others sounds like a type of paranoia, also an indication of (a type) of schizo-effective disorder.
Anyway, I wish you and your sister and family the very best. This is not an easy situation, but it can be treated.
Get the help for her she needs. Educate yourself and consult with Professionals in the field. | |
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