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 OhBuggerThis
Joined: 10/14/2007
Msg: 76
I watched the Israeli / US Media videoPage 4 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
the video can be found here:

http://quicksilverscreen.com/watch?video=17355

I came across it purely by accident and boy did it open my eyes, can't believe i was so biased beforehand...
 eliza-jane
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 77
I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 1/24/2008 11:48:32 AM
Probably the most comprehensive political history lesson I have ever received. Better smile as probably now on CAMERA.
 OneBlend
Joined: 3/31/2007
Msg: 78
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 1/25/2008 10:29:36 PM

Probably the most comprehensive political history lesson I have ever received. Better smile as probably now on CAMERA.


Yes indeed .. you can be sure of it.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 79
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 3/7/2009 3:27:31 PM
From the original post ...
Very interesting stuff. I am converting it to AVI so that I can share it with some friends. Its a lot of information and I am not entirely sure what to make of it. Also, I need to check references of the people that made the video in order to see it along side its makers political persuation. That will help me to keep things in perspective. Anyways it very provocative and gets you thinking.

So, thanks for the link, whichever of you gave me it. Here is the link for those that haven't seen it:


I hope we stop sending money to Israel though. Not just because it really is a terror state, but because it's also a 1st world nation. They don't need our money, and frankly, I don't think anybody should be given money because of their race. The holocaust ended 62 goddamned years ago. End of story. Apparently not for us Jews, not for Germany and not for the Palestinians - who had helped some of the Jews escape at that point in time.
Ya ... I agree. They are a terror state and we need to stop sending them money


Where'd the video go? I tried to watch it but said it was unavailiable.
Apparently the link in the original post longer works, so I found a different link that takes you to the same video ...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6604775898578139565
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 80
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 8/24/2009 5:50:04 AM
This article is written by Neve Gordon whos is the author of Israel's Occupation and teaches politics at Ben-Gurion University in Beersheba, Israel.

It's very interesting indeed.

Titled: A boycott would save Israel from itself

"It is indeed not a simple matter for me as an Israeli citizen to call on foreign governments, regional authorities, international social movements, faith-based organisations, unions and citizens to suspend cooperation with Israel. But today, I am convinced that it is the only way that Israel can be saved from itself.

I say this because Israel has reached a historic crossroads, and times of crisis call for dramatic measures.

The most accurate way to describe Israel today is as an apartheid state. For more than 42 years, Israel has controlled the land between the Jordan Valley and the Mediterranean Sea. Within this region about six million Jews and close to five million Palestinians reside. Out of this population, 3.5 million Palestinians and almost half a million Jews live in the areas Israel occupied in 1967, and yet while these two groups live in the same area, they are subjected to totally different legal systems. The Palestinians are stateless and lack many of the most basic human rights. By sharp contrast, all Jews - whether they live in the Occupied Territories or in Israel - are citizens of the state of Israel.

The question that keeps me up at night, is how to ensure that my two children - as well as the children of my Palestinian neighbours do not grow up in an apartheid regime.

There are only two moral ways of achieving this goal.

The first is the one-state solution: offering citizenship to all Palestinians and thus establishing a bi-national democracy within the entire area controlled by Israel. Given the demographics, this would amount to the demise of Israel as a Jewish state; for most Israeli Jews, it is anathema.

The second means of ending our apartheid is through the two-state solution, which entails Israel's withdrawal to the pre-1967 borders (with possible one-for-one land swaps), the division of Occupied Jerusalem, and a recognition of the Palestinian right of return with the stipulation that only a limited number of the 4.5 million Palestinian refugees would be allowed to return to Israel, while the rest can return to the new Palestinian state.

Geographically, the one-state solution appears much more feasible because Jews and Palestinians are already totally enmeshed; indeed, 'on the ground', the one-state solution (in an apartheid manifestation) is a reality.

Ideologically, the two-state solution is more realistic because fewer than one per cent of Jews support binationalism.

For now, despite the concrete difficulties, it makes more sense to alter the geographic realities than the ideological ones. If at some future date the two peoples decide to share a state, they can do so, but currently this is not something they want.

So if the two-state solution is the way to stop the apartheid state, then how does one achieve this goal?

I am convinced that outside pressure is the only answer. Over the last three decades, Jewish colonists in the Occupied Territories have dramatically increased their numbers. The myth of a united Occupied Jerusalem has led to the creation of an apartheid city where Palestinians aren't citizens and lack basic services. The Israeli peace camp has gradually dwindled so that today it is almost nonexistent, and Israeli politics are moving more and more to the extreme right.

It is therefore clear to me that the only way to counter the apartheid trend in Israel is through massive international pressure. The words and condemnations from the Obama administration and the European Union have yielded no results, not even a colony freeze, let alone a decision to withdraw from the Occupied Territories.

I have consequently decided to support the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions movement that was launched by Palestinian activists in July 2005 and has since garnered widespread support around the globe. The objective is to ensure that Israel respects its obligations under international law and that Palestinians are granted the right to self-determination.

In Bilbao, Spain, in 2008, a coalition of organisations from all over the world formulated the 10-point Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions campaign meant to pressure Israel in a 'gradual, sustainable manner that is sensitive to context and capacity'. For example, the effort begins with sanctions on and divestment from Israeli companies operating in the Occupied Territories, followed by actions against those that help sustain and reinforce the occupation in a visible manner. Along similar lines, artists who come to Israel in order to draw attention to the occupation are welcome, while those who just want to perform are not.

Nothing else has worked. Putting massive international pressure on Israel is the only way to guarantee that the next generation of Israelis and Palestinians - my two boys included - does not grow up in an apartheid regime."

I always have a profound respect for men who owned up and then try to change the course. Salute
 OnGreenDolphinStreet
Joined: 6/26/2007
Msg: 81
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 8/24/2009 12:16:44 PM
I was going to ask you how you think a boycott would affect your life, but then i realized you actually live in newzealand. I guess it's a lot easier to call for sacrifice when you're sacrificing someone else.

"guarantee that the next generation of israelis and palestineans - my two boys included - does not grow up in an apartheid regime"

you're only 26 and you live in newzealand. your boys will grow up playing cricket and raising sheep. i wouldn't worry too much about it.

i'm not sure i've ever heard this apartheid nonsense from an israeli before, but now that i think of it, i still don't think i have.

cheers, mate.
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 82
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 8/24/2009 12:57:00 PM

"guarantee that the next generation of israelis and palestineans - my two boys included - does not grow up in an apartheid regime"

you're only 26 and you live in newzealand. your boys will grow up playing cricket and raising sheep. i wouldn't worry too much about it.

If you had actually read the article you would have known that the line was written by Neve Gordon, not the poster

i'm not sure i've ever heard this apartheid nonsense from an israeli before, but now that i think of it, i still don't think i have.

Again, if you had actually read the article you would be certain that you had (heard apartheid references from an Israeli).

After all Neve Gordon is a 3rd generation Israeli and a veteran IDF Paratrooper.
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 83
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 8/24/2009 4:55:30 PM
mungojoe, thanks mate for the accurate clarification. I guess some people just read through the back of thier heads, alas.
ATerribleAspect, my friend, What's the meaning of the quotation marks. Suggest read the article again.


The article is written by Neve Gordon, he teaches politics at Ben-Gurion University in Beersheba, Israel.
 whiskeypapa
Joined: 5/19/2008
Msg: 84
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 8/24/2009 8:29:14 PM
Yes, a single state is the best solution. Get rid of the apartheid wall, get a constiution--one that gaurantees equal rights for all. Perhaps, after a truth and rconciliation period as in South Africa the Muslims and Jews can work together as they did in Spain before they were expelled and maybe, just maybe, isreal could become a "Light Unto The Nations.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 85
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 4:44:58 PM
Just an update ... it's important to note the link in the original post no longer works, but I have found a different link that takes you to the same video ... which is the topic of this thread.

We need to spread the word ... encourage people to watch the video. It's important for people to be informed about what is going on over there.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6604775898578139565
 etourdi77
Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 86
I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 6:34:21 PM
I am sure you loved this video with all its bias.............digging up old threads so you can bash the Jews some more eh?
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 87
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 7:18:15 PM

...digging up old threads ...
I've posted in this thread on and off since it started back in August 2006 and it interests me. Am I being stalked here?

Back on topic ...
Message 5 ... this tells it well ... I know him, he's still here ... just with a little bit of a different name, but he's still here and still feels the same as what he posted in that message. I think that post is important and that's why I'm drawing attention to it ...
That video made me completely change my view of the conflict.
It is hard to change core beliefs that have been indoctrinated.
I know all about it, I created two threads previous to seeing that video practically yelling my support for Israel and the USA, all the while making my-self look like a brainwashed tool, lol.

I cannot believe how much we have the wool pulled over our eyes on this matter.
And I do not buy that the Canadian government simply does not under-stand the conflict. I guess its possible, but highly unlikely. That tells me our PM is kissing Bush's ass and that is a big no-no in Canada. The fastest way for Harper to be shown the door is for people here to get that perception. (wether he actually is or not, and yes, GWB is hated that much here, even by our right wing)

Question is now, what do we do about it?
I have already emailed our current government with the link and my disgust at their position.
I doubt it will make a difference. But at least they know they have one red neck really pissed off.
A redneck with a vote.

Any-one else got any ideas?
I would start an online petition with a link to that video if I knew how to build a damn web page.


To the post below ...
If that is your concern then you should find some links that show the situation from the other perspective...
Even my Jewish friends are ashamed of what the regime over there is doing ... friends who live there and despise what the Israelis are doing. They find the behavior despicable. I have Jewish friends in Germany ... where I lived for 10 years who feel the same way. They abhor the Zionist regime.

The websites with the IDF soldiers who are going to jail because they refuse to follow orders to kill the Palestinians ... that's also a hoax? Hardly.

We need to spread the word ... encourage people to watch the video. It's important for people to be informed about what is going on over there.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6604775898578139565
 etourdi77
Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 88
I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 7:24:38 PM
If that is your concern then you should find some links that show the situation from the other perspective, but as we both know for whatever reason certain posters want Israel destroyed....
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 89
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 8:49:44 PM

... but as we both know for whatever reason certain posters want Israel destroyed....
I've certainly never promoted that idea.

Now ... how is that part of the topic here?
 OnGreenDolphinStreet
Joined: 6/26/2007
Msg: 90
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/8/2009 11:19:38 PM
assuming the greater topic here is propoganda and media dissemination of what's actually happening, i have something so share. remember those 1400 innocent civilian women and children who were brutally massacred in gaza earlier this year? turns out over half of those so called "civilians" are publically known militants. that is, they are publically affiliated with militant groups. now how many UN resolutions were enacted based on this list? What does that say about the credibility of the Palestinean Center for Human Rights or the UN for that matter?


While Hamas and other Palestinian political groups were using alleged civilian casualties to bolster their case with international public opinion, they demonstrably knew otherwise. In fact, they publicly bragged about the military activities of those they labeled innocent civilian bystanders.

The basis for many claims about the distribution of casualties was in a March report by the Palestinian Center for Human Rights (PCHR). Widely covered and credulously accepted in the Western media, the report was a seemingly comprehensive, detailed list of every death. The bottom line: the name, gender, age, location, and job of each person is detailed. Most importantly, the PCHR claimed 1180 of the alleged 1414 victims were civilians.

Our team cross-checked the names listed by PCHR with lists of "resisters" compiled by the Al- Mezan Center for Human Rights, lists of "martyrs" published by Hamas, the Popular Resistance Committees (PRC), and other militant groups in Gaza, as well as from the Ma'an News Agency, and other Palestinian sources.

The IDF released its own report on casualties from Operation Cast Lead, saying that there were 1166 killed in Gaza, of whom 709 were known Hamas or Islamic Jihad militants. The IDF did not release their list of casualties, so we could not check specifics against the PCHR claims.

Our results so far show that at least, if all armed police are counted, 428 of the 1180 people who PCHR classifies as "civilians," were, in fact, militants.

That means 662 people were legitimate combatants under IHL and therefor legitimate targets.

PCHR's criteria to determine exactly who is a "militant" are unclear. Sometimes they speak of "active combatants" but at other times they state, accurately, that any members of armed groups, such as the Izz al-Din al-Qassam Brigades, would be considered legitimate targets under international law.

The team has identified members of Hamas, Islamic Jihad, the Popular Resistance Committees, the PFLP and the DFLP considered "civilians" by the PCHR. Examples include Adib Harb (brigade commander for the PRC), 'Eid 'Oda al-Shandi (field commander in the al-Qassam Brigades) and even senior Hamas leader Nizar Rayyan.

The IDF has categorized most or all of the Hamas police force as "Hamas or Islamic Jihad operatives" and therefore as legal targets. The PCHR takes strong exception to this categorization, saying that Hamas policemen are civilians.

Even by the PCHR's own criteria, our research has detailed proof identifying over 74% of the police killed in Operation Cast Lead some 206 of them out of 279, were also members of militant groups, predominantly the al-Qassam Brigades acting as combatants against Israel.

Certainly, the PCHR is aware of the affiliations of many of not all of the victims in Gaza . For example, the PRC al-Nasser Salah Addin Brigades, the most extremist group in Gaza which has been reportedly linked to al-Qaida, published a list of its 18 of its "martyrs" on January 22. Yet nine of them, including two commanders, were classified as "civilian" by the PCHR months later. Similarly, an al-Qassam Brigades' leader famous for developing the Qassam rocket, Amir Yousef Al-Mansy, was also called a "civilian." It strains credulity to think that the PCHR was unaware that they were militants engaged in fighting Israel.

Why, then, did they classify so many known militants as civilians? One can only conclude that the reason is to deceive the media.

Such a high number of Al Qassam members among the police killed indicates that Hamas itself does not distinguish between its so-called civilian and military wings. Effectively, Hamas considers its police to be the same as its military force. If Hamas does not make such a distinction, why shouldn't everyone else conclude that its entire police force is a legitimate target?

We have identified 355 militants in addition to the police, of whom 159 were identified as civilian by PCHR.
None of our findings are inconsistent with the IDF report on Gaza casualties.

While the PCHR misrepresents the facts about Palestinian casualties it makes other statements which reveal the highly politicized nature of the group that show it is not a human rights organization. For example, it consistently uses the phrase "IOF" ("Israel Occupation Forces") instead of Israel Defense Forces, the proper name of Israel's military, in trying to make Israel look as bad as possible.

The PCHR's influence cannot be overstated. UN groups routinely quote PCHR figures and reports. News media around the world rely on organizations like the PCHR to give them accurate information about what happens in Gaza. The PCHR presents itself as an unbiased party and is taken as such in media reports. The truth, however, is quite different.

Israel's war in Gaza was not aimed at causing civilian losses, nor was it a war of "occupation," as the PCHR would have it, but of defense. The fact that the casualty figures are being misrepresented is a demonstration of the fact that charges made against Israel are false. We are confident that as our research continues we will find many more soldiers of Hamas and other groups waging war against Israel disguised as civilians.

http://ptwatch.pt.funpic.de/indexcas.php

as someone once said about this conflict, how ironic is it that to get credible reports you have to go to the aggressor.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 91
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/9/2009 8:34:40 AM

as someone once said about this conflict, how ironic is it that to get credible reports you have to go to the aggressor.
Yes ... the aggressor ... Israel.

That report was produced by an organization called "The Elder of Ziyon ... it's an Israeli run website.

Yes ... I'd say that is the AGGRESSOR.

You got it right this time!!!!
 OnGreenDolphinStreet
Joined: 6/26/2007
Msg: 92
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/9/2009 9:23:39 AM
the report provides a link to both lists, shows the discrepancies and lists names that have been counted twice, as well as an empty line that was counted. it explains that it is standard policy for the PCHR to list police members as cvilians in its reports and indicates that some of those listed as civilians also appear as militant members on other affiliated sources.

over 60% error makes that list a joke. reminds me of the lebanon war in 2006.

now, if you believe this is a bosgus report, you're welcome to prove it wrong.
goodluck.

"organization" - good one.
that would be "blogger". typically not a very good source, but again, the report does provide you the link to the original list so you can verify it for yourself.
if it's verifiable, it holds.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 93
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 10/9/2009 11:01:47 AM
^^^^There is nothing in that article that could possibly discredit the video mentioned here.

Now back to the topic of the thread.

OT ...
We need to spread the word.

We need to encourage people to watch the video. It's important for people to be informed about what is going on over there.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6604775898578139565
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 94
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 5/19/2011 7:43:25 PM
In light of the president's speech today and his mention of the 1967 borders, I think we need to continue to spread the word.

We need to encourage people to watch the video. It's important for people to be informed about what is going on over there.

New link for the video ...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2165626245072381061#
 Imported_labor
Joined: 3/7/2008
Msg: 95
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 5/25/2011 5:56:36 AM
Interesting bit of news today about sanctions imposed by the U.S. State Department against two Israeli companies owned by the richest men in Israel for violating the rules for trading with Iran:


Tue May 24, 4:22 pm ET
U.S. sanctions 7 firms, two Israeli-owned, for violating Iran sanctions
By Laura Rozen

A day after Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu received a hero's welcome from more than 10,000 supporters of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), members of the pro-Israel lobby hit Capitol Hill today to urge lawmakers to support tougher sanctions against Iran, among other measures.

And so it came as no great surprise that the U.S. State Department chose today to roll out a list of seven international firms facing U.S. sanctions for allegedly doing business with Iran.

There is, however, a curious twist in this particular list: two of the seven firms on the State Department list are owned by prominent Israeli businessmen. One is an Israeli shipping company called the Ofer Brothers Group, headed by Yehuda (Yuli) Ofer; the other is a company in Singapore called Tanker Pacific, owned by Sami Ofer (Yehuda Ofer's brother).
The United States accused the two Ofer-owned firms, along with a third company in Monaco called Associated Shipping, of selling an oil tanker to an Iranian-owned shipping line last year.

"The companies are being sanctioned for their respective roles in a September 2010 transaction that provided a tanker valued at $8.65 million to the Islamic Republic of Iran Shipping Lines (IRISL), an entity that has been designated by the United States, and the European Union for its role in supporting Iran's proliferation activities," the State Department said in a fact sheet today.

"We believe that Tanker Pacific and Ofer Brothers Group failed to exercise due diligence and did not heed publicly available and easily obtainable information that would have indicated that they were dealing with IRISL," the fact sheet said.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton "will hold companies accountable, as required by the [Iran Sanctions Act], when they know or 'should have known' they were providing sanctionable goods or services to Iran," the department vowed.

The U.S. fact sheet also pointedly notes that these are the first sanctions the United States has imposed under toughened Iran sanctions legislation targeting Iran's refined petroleum industry that was passed by Congress--with strong support from the pro-Israel lobby--and signed by the President last year.

Asked if the timing of the announcement could in any way be read as a hint of resentment at the Israeli leader coming to Washington to lecture the administration and Congress on toughening sanctions on Iran, a senior U.S. official remained straight-faced as he professed nothing of the sort.

"The Israeli government was consulted during this process," he said on condition of anonymity. "Israel supports implementing tough sanctions against Iran."

The other companies the United States targeted for sanctions today include PCCI (based in Jersey/Iran); Royal Oyster Group (based in the United Arab Emirates), Speedy Ship (UAE/Iran), and PetrĂ³leos de Venezuela of Venezuela.

The sanctions prohibit the identified firms from securing financing from the U.S. Export-Import Bank, from obtaining loans for over $10 million from U.S. financial institutions--and from receiving U.S. export licenses.

The Ofer brothers reportedly denied the charges in a statement published by IsraelNationalNews.com: "We have never sold ships to Iran, and well-respected Israeli officials will certify this," the statement said.

Forbes magazine ranked Sami Ofer Israel's wealthiest man in 2008, valuing his fortune at $6.7 billion


http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_theenvoy/20110524/ts_yblog_theenvoy/u-s-sanctions-7-firms-two-israeli-owned-for-violating-iran-sanctions

Does anyone knows if the Netanyahu government is commenting on this?
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 96
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 5/25/2011 6:56:57 PM

The sanctions prohibit the identified firms from securing financing from the U.S. Export-Import Bank, from obtaining loans for over $10 million from U.S. financial institutions--and from receiving U.S. export licenses.

The Ofer family owns one of the largest private shipping companies in the world.


Does anyone knows if the Netanyahu government is commenting on this?

I haven't seen that Netanyahu has commented on this. But given their apparent ability financially, I doubt Netanyahu would dare say anything.

Besides, it doesn't matter what the Israeli do ... they're untouchable. Right?
 Imported_labor
Joined: 3/7/2008
Msg: 97
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 5/26/2011 7:12:22 AM
I remember that the Israelis played a very significant role in the transfer of weapons to Iran during the Iran/Contra affair. Of course they were trading with the enemy at the request of the US government, which was also trading with the enemy that had just ended the hostage crisis.

However, unless someone can give us some more insight into what has happened recently, it seems as if the rich capitalists in Israel can trade with the enemy without fear of the power of the Israeli government.

At least this time, unlike what happened during the Reagan administration, the US government officials are not responsible of the act of treason. To have Netanyahu declaring that Iran and its policies intended to become a nuclear power hostile top Israel, and at the same time have the rich Israeli capitalist trading with Iran is the highest absurdity in international politics. Why should America continue to support financially the Israeli government if they can't control the Israeli capitalist from trading with the enemy?
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 98
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 6/7/2011 6:17:49 AM

Why should America continue to support financially the Israeli government if they can't control the Israeli capitalist from trading with the enemy?
Why should the US support the Israeli government in any way ... financially or politically?

Like I said ... what does it matter what the Israeli do ... they're untouchable. Right?

WATCH THE VIDEO ... IT TELLS THE REAL STORY!!!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2165626245072381061#
 4rumninja
Joined: 11/30/2009
Msg: 99
I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 6/15/2011 9:06:29 AM
I don't think one video is proof of anything..interesting as it was....We should support Israel because they are one of our staunchest allies in the Middle East with all of the changes taking place there it is good to know, there is at least one Country that doesn't hate America...Yet...
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 100
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I watched the Israeli / US Media video
Posted: 6/17/2011 8:27:25 PM

... there is at least one Country that doesn't hate America...Yet...
They spy on us, they bomb our warships, they torture our citizens ... and that makes them an ally?

WOW what a strange sense of "ally" some folks have. If that's an ally, what is an enemy?

Israel tolerates us because they want our money and the arms and ammunition we give them to sell to other countries ... so they can make more money.

Israel's greed is nothing new ... at least not new to those of us with our eyes wide open.



OT ...
WATCH THE VIDEO ... IT TELLS THE REAL STORY!!!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2165626245072381061#
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