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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 8/27/2006 4:24:46 PM | I think I don't have to be brainwashed to believe that inhaling burning ash into my lungs is not healthy. Feel free to smoke though, you can do what you want... don't cry to me when you get cancer.
In fact ... don't sue the tabacco industry either. They lied, they are crooks, but anyone in todays time has enough information to know better.
Be a man and suck it up when you get Cancer, just like you sucked down those cigs. :P | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 8/28/2006 10:16:27 PM | | Smoking is disgusting, makes your cloths, hair and breath smell horrible and is awful for your health and anyone around you.......there is no debate! | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/4/2006 2:42:46 PM | As an ex smoker of some 40 years, I have to say that for a complete non-smoker you seem very knowledgable. I stopped smoking 9weeks ago and really have been appalled at the lack of incentive given by the NHS. This for me was a massive step and I attended the smoking cessation clinic at my surgery. Mainly to obtain the substitute lozenges at prescription cost rather than over the counter costs.
My GP was very understanding and actually said it was going to be the hardest thing I had ever done and obviously appreciated that smoking was an addiction. I had been a 40+ a day smoker and decided enough was enough.
I underwent a few odd feelings for the 1st 48hrs, but what amazed me the most, was that on my first trip to bed I had stopped wheezing!! Yes that soon. The following morning, on waking, instead of reaching for my cigs, I couldn't believe how absolutely well I felt. This was something I had forgotten. My first hour normally was spent feeling lousy, heavy headed, coughing and just plain ropey.
Also, and you may think I'm sad, when I undress at night, my clothes still smell as good as they did when I put them on in the morning.
I am told that as far as the NHS are concerned I am considered a non smoker after 4 weeks. I find this a little short sighted of them as similar to alcoholism ex smokers are only ever 1 cigarette away from being a smoker. Plus, I'm not arrogant enough to presume that I have 'got away with it' at this early stage-maybe in a few years I might breathe a sigh of relief. Still I'm more than happy to be regarded as a non smoker.
The point I think I am trying to make is that there must be hundreds more like me out there, who need a little help and after 4 weeks it just isn't there.
You are spot on with your 'triggers' - and the only way I have learned to cope with them is just to say to myself (yes sometimes outloud) you've come this far, why would you want to undo all that? I've been doing that from day one, and so far it's worked. If the craving gets really bad, I go get a drink or just do something that undoes that trigger.
Yes you are right, it is mental. | |
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Banji
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Joined: 8/28/2006
Msg: 29 | |
| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/4/2006 4:13:13 PM |
If the damaging effects of smoking happened at more of a younger age, we would see less ppl smoking.
People won't quit bc they are addicted to nicotine and are trying to hide in another state of mind(same goes for alcohol too).
so true...addicts will come up with ANYTHING that will justify their addiction...
don't care what the stats say...or if aunt bunny died at 134 smoking all her life like a chimney...good for her...lol....i also had a couple of uncles die of lung cancer in their early 50...so why take the chance? | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/4/2006 7:47:10 PM | Wow, everyone strayed right off topic there. The article I presented didn't claim that smoking is good for you. Breathing the air on this planet isn't good for you for that matter. The article stated that most facts which are being used to deter people from smoking are fudged.
So now that everyone has claimed that smoking is bad,bad,bad,bad,bad,bad,bad... and bad. Would anyone like to state whether or not they are brainwashed into believing the facts that are being presented about smoking? | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/4/2006 8:54:33 PM | Smoking is bad for your health...end of story.
Simple but very true. The thread should have ended at your post.
Edit: While the facts may be fudged to make smoking seem worse than it is, it's only beneficial to quit from these supposed lies.
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/4/2006 9:42:20 PM | Hi,
I am not a smoker and I don't like the stench of cigarettes, also I get
a sinus infection when I am around lots of smoke, but I have to
say in defense of smokers, it is a very hard to quit habit,
hard like losing weight is.
It is also a habit people have had for many years. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/5/2006 9:51:17 AM |
The article stated that most facts which are being used to deter people from smoking are fudged.
As are the facts you presented. First up, I think pretty much everyone could come up with annecdotes of a friend or relative who have lived a long life (although often not a healthy one) despite smoking as well as those who got cancer while not smoking. A handful of stories don't provide any concrete evidence.
In terms of not being able to find how the government comes up with its estimates, I was able to find a paper outlining it in one google search. So I wonder how hard those alt.smokers people searched (not including calling up a co-op student working in some government department).
Next up we have the word of an engineer who claims to have done 1500 autopsies (I've been unable to find any information on this person other than this one document) claiming that the black lungs from smoking is a myth despite the claim of pretty much the entire medical community. Without providing some sort of evidence to the contrary, I'll go with the evidence I've seen from the community.
And as for those stats, I'm not sure where they got those numbers from but just from a quick glance I can see flaws in their logic. First, they are looking at people between 50 and 60 for cases of cancer. Then in comparison they are taking the percentage of the entire population who are smokers. It's pretty clear that you can't use those two stats to determine any sort of hypothesis. Heck, just the world population changes will throw you off when you're using those percentages. You would need to determine the percentages of people still smoking in the 50 to 60 age range that you are comparing it to. You would also need to keep a listing of people who are in that age range and stopped smoking (or if you wanted to also consider taking out the "second hand smoke" stuff you should include people who have spent long periods of time with smokers). I could go on but to me, it's clear this doctor is being a little fudgy with their results, possibly to reach a conclusion that is beneficial to their own goal of defaming the medical community (in order to get more money from people who sign up for their newsletter and their own therapy).
Am I brainwashed? I definitely don't think so. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/5/2006 10:19:46 AM |
In terms of not being able to find how the government comes up with its estimates, I was able to find a paper outlining it in one google search. So I wonder how hard those alt.smokers people searched (not including calling up a co-op student working in some government department).
SO post the site then. It might be a little more convincing that the self-serving braggin that is repeated by non-smokers like yourself in this thread.
Next up we have the word of an engineer who claims to have done 1500 autopsies (I've been unable to find any information on this person other than this one document) claiming that the black lungs from smoking is a myth despite the claim of pretty much the entire medical community. Without providing some sort of evidence to the contrary, I'll go with the evidence I've seen from the community.
So what you're saying is you'll allow people to brainwash you
And as for those stats, I'm not sure where they got those numbers from but just from a quick glance I can see flaws in their logic. First, they are looking at people between 50 and 60 for cases of cancer
I don't know what you are talking about.
could go on but to me, it's clear this doctor is being a little fudgy with their results, possibly to reach a conclusion that is beneficial to their own goal of defaming the medical community (in order to get more money from people who sign up for their newsletter and their own therapy).
Perhaps the government is looking to defame cigarettes to make a profit.
Like really if you want to debate something don't go just saying i'm right your wrong. Actually bring something to the table. It's fairly obvious to me that you didn't visit the website listed as you clearly don't have the patience to read the whole article. I highly doubt that someone as narrow minded as yourself could actually come to accept that the beliefs you have, which you did not think of yourself, may be wrong.
But whatever, you loss for being brainwashed.
Am I brainwashed? I definitely don't think so.
You wouldn't know you were brainwashed if you were. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/5/2006 10:33:42 AM | Wow, what an antagonistic response. Do you actually want people to respond with their opinions or just yours?
For the document describing how they got their estimates:
http://www.cdc.gov/MMWR/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5114a2.htm
I won't allow people to brainwash me but I won't take the claim that one anonymous "engineer" who has supposedly watched over 1500 as evidence of anything until someone can provide a little more evidence to the fact (whereas evidence of autopsy showing the effects of smoking is everywhere and even acknowledged by many people in the "smoking doesn't cause cancer" group). I've tried to find more information on this source yet the only information I could find is linked to the above article and a couple posts on some newsgroups.
And I never said I'm right and you're wrong. I've outlined some of the problems with the stats presented and why they should not be seen as leading to the conclusion in that paper. And you've chosen to reply with "I don't know what your talking about". And I'm being called "narrow minded"? | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/5/2006 2:28:09 PM | New Guy 106 you are of course quite right regarding everyone digressing.
Don't you think though that in this world of media and advertising we are all a little brainwashed daily.
You don't even have to watch tv, listen to the radio, or move from your house. Junk mail will take care of those who avoid these media outlets.
I think to be completely un-brainwashed you must have to be an incredibly strong minded person and as such should take great care not to become a bigot. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/5/2006 4:43:41 PM | KATH: There is an enormous amount of smoking cessation information, support, motivation etc. at www.whyquit.com and like you said...We are 'only a cigarette away' from relapse and resuming nicotine addiction....whether we have been off it for a week or years....N T A P is the rule...Never Take Another Puff (dip or chew) .......Freedom is only one of the many benefits we gain......
....Chipits.... | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/6/2006 4:47:13 PM | dido. I'm a dietitian/smoking cessation educator at a hospital. I get consults for smokers/heart patients. I don't know how many times maybe 99/100 i've heard from smokers who smoke at least 2ppd " It's not as bad as I thought. I don't even miss it here." Of course they aren't allowed to smoke at the hospital, but based on my 5 years of experience it's ALL mental. There's a book out by Carr that I recommend to all smokers called Quitting the easy way in which he says there's no physical addiction and that it's all mental. Of course people get irritated and crabby but so does a baby when going from mom's nipple to a bottle or if u take away their pacifier! | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 9/6/2006 5:46:48 PM | | juliet i just finished that book (literally like two days ago) and it was an awesome read....no bullshit, no fantasies, just plain cut and dry from a guy who smoked like 3 packs or so a day....i quit 8 days ago and cravings are few and far between..you just don't think about it after this book....it's incredible....i highly recommend that...another method i recommend is the smoke away kit from a natural health food store...it detoxifies you while you are quitting....you feel like a million bucks after 7 days of these all natural pills.....either way, you have to be ready to quit..... | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/10/2006 4:24:26 AM | I wonder if any of you has actually seen a smokers lung from a cadaver? I have, and it is shriveled, black, and full of holes. Taking in over 100 degrees of heat into your mouth, trachea and lungs does nothing but cook your membranes. They simply cannot heal from the daily abuse.
What is interesting is that within ONE day, your blood pressure will go down and your entire circulatory system improves blood flow. Guys, can you guess WHICH organ on your body can use more BLOOD FLOW? I read a medical article some years ago in regard to men becoming impotent by age 50, because of smoking. And yes, the sense of smell returns, food tastes good again, and you can actually BREATHE deeper, sleep better, have more energy and NOT throw money away on cigarettes.
Health, life and auto insurance cost more for smokers. Smokers in general take more sick days off of work...their bodies are depleted of vitamins and minerals to keep their immune systems healthy. And it is so sad for those family members who live with thoughtless smokers, and are subject to second hand smoke. The danger is very real.
I am allergic to cigarette smoke......and recently vacationed with a friend, sharing a hotel room. They had run out of non-smoking rooms and we had to make do. Within a half hour, I could smell the smoke inside my nostrils and no amount of blowing my nose would remove it. I also developed a chronic headache that ruined my stay there. I was having an allergic reaction to the smoke left behind on the walls, carpet and furniture in the hotel room. When we relocated to another hotel, a non-smoking room, I noticed our luggage and any other belongings left out in the previous room reeked of cigarette stench. It is THAT potent.
I think when we realize that being dependant on nicotine is, in fact, a drug addiction......we have to figure out how to wean the body of it without throwing it into turmoil (nasty withdrawal). I have read that the Vitamin B3, Niacin, is a chemical cousin to Nicotine, and taking enough of it throughout the day will make the body think it is STILL getting the Nicotine. For calming the nerves, a Vitamin B-100 Complex, 2-3 times per day, along with an herbal blend of Valerian, Hops and Passionflower could be helpful. And to address cravings, so that you don't eat yourself into oblivion, the mineral Chromium, and the herb Gymnema Sylvester can calm the cravings. If you begin sliding into depression, try taking Flax Seed Oil along with 5 HTP....instead of getting hooked on the roller coaster rides of Prozac or Paxil. A good overall herbal body cleanse can rid those toxins from your liver, kidneys, muscle tissue and blood stream. Detox Teas are found almost everywhere.
Perhaps to address the psychological need for cigarettes. I wouldn't buy any more cigarettes.....do not stash an emergency pack anywhere in the house, car, or purse. Remove temptation, and ask family and friends who smoke NOT to smoke anywhere NEAR you. Wash or paint your walls, clean your carpet and upholstery, launder your curtains and bedding. Brush your teeth often, and keep your mouth clean. Chew mint gum, which helps curb the urge....perhaps, for a time, put a toothpick or plastic straw in your mouth as a substitute. If you get an urge, immediately get up and CHANGE YOUR CIRCUMSTANCES......go for a walk or call somebody for moral support. Listen to STOP SMOKING tapes every day for 21 days (the experts say it takes this long to change a habit). And finally....If you never make changes, nothing will ever change. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/10/2006 5:10:45 AM | My late wife and I quit and it was easy to do. we spent the first 3 days crying because she had been told she had inoperable Lung Cancer. That was almost 4 years ago this SPring.
3 Years of Chemotherapy illnesses, Porta Cath, and radiation Have not added it all up from insurance Company
3 Years out of pocket expenses for treatments and drugs 10,000$ MY POCKET!!
3 years of Living Priceless
She was 49 when she passed away smoked a pack a day for 30 years. I am only 6 years behind her
I also belong to a Support group of 2600 members worldwide. i know a lot of Non smokers who have died since then. Some with completely healthy lifestyles | |
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vhdc
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Joined: 7/18/2006
Msg: 42 | |
| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/10/2006 6:57:28 AM | | Why so angry newguy? Even if you live in the *here-and-now* you have to take into consideration the other problems nicotine causes i.e., for some, #1 erectile dysfunction, #2 asthma, #3 sedentary life style due to reduced stamina after prolonged tobacco use. I would think #1 would be enough to put most of the male population off smoking. Besides, who wants to be on such a short leash? | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/10/2006 10:02:27 AM | | I so agree with you! I started to agree when I read the paper and it said that this man was 117 years old and smoked until he was 92 years old. Also my co-workers husband died of lung cancer and he was not a smoker. So yeas I agree its nice to hear...but on a second note smoking is expensive, and their is no need for it, I doubt very much its beneficial to anyones health, and it stinks. | |
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d1000
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Joined: 10/15/2006
Msg: 44 | |
| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/11/2006 8:34:45 AM | | Smokers are pathetic, addicted little creatures and they stink. If people want to poison themselves then that's their prerogative I suppose. I just don't think they should be allowed any part of our failing government medicare system. The business and politics of tobacco is also an interesting subject. When it comes right down to it smokers are just victims of someone else's marketing and profit margin. Crack addict, cigarette smoker, meth-head... I fail to see any difference aside from the fact smokers can maintain a reasonably "normal" life as far as addicts are concerned due to the fact that for some reason it's still "socially acceptable". I work with a guy that will literally go haywire Mr. Hyde if he doesn't get to frequently suck on a smoke. Sad... | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 11/11/2006 10:11:13 PM | I am a recent "reformed smoker"....just past the 3 week stage.
The desire to stop was not based on the health risks, they were of course an infulence, but ~ smelling like cigarettes and being a slave to having to have them with me at ALL times or panic, and needing to know where I could smoke everywhere I went drove me crazy. It was beginning to feel like an extreme case of obsessive compulsive disorder ~ and I smoked less than half a pack a day.
I know they say nicotine is one of the most addictive substances ~ and it is ~ but honestly, the physical effects are out of your system after 3 days, the rest is all mental ~ our minds are the biggest enemy.
It takes 30 days to create a new habit by repeating it daily. I have no idea on what the statistics are one breaking one though?
PS ~ for anyone else who is trying to stop smoking I have 2 tips.
1) Do not think of it as quitting. You are stopping. We are conditioned to think of quitting as a negative thing. You need to make this a positive association in your mind.
2) Green Tea. I don't know what it is, but for me at least, this has killed off every craving I have had. It is a great anti-oxident and detoxifier so maybe clearing out all the chemicals is the "magic" That, and if you are like me and coffee and cigs go together ~ you gotta replace that coffee with other caffine lacking the association. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 1/5/2007 12:48:15 PM | | couldn't agree more with you. I 'm a tobacco cessation counselor as well as a dietitian and in my experience 99% is mental except the first few days and that's if they smoke 1 or more packs a day. Read the book quitting smoking the easy way where author Carr suggests that it's 100% mental. The reason I agree with him is because I see patients every day after heart attacks or before they even know they've had one, not smoke in the hospital where it's banned. Why does it not bother them to abstain where it's not allowed for days or sometimes weeks at a time but they immediately have to light one up after they get out the door? | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 1/6/2007 2:08:50 PM | When it comes to smoking, I wouldn't say it's just an addiction to many people. I think it's just a habit that you're used to. You sit down after a hard's day at work, what do you do, smoke a cigarette. You're at the computer, you smoke a cig, after awesome sex, yup, a cig between your lips.  | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 1/6/2007 7:28:39 PM | | I'm not brainwashed about smoking being bad for you. I see it everyday. I witness it. I know it stinks because I smell it. I know the smoking causes your fingertips to chance color because I seen it happen. So no, I'm not brainwashed. If there are facts, then so be it, I just don't care for it because I like to smell like the cologne that I"m wearing, not a smokey cigarette that makes me smell like I was in a fire. | |
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| Smoking, how brainwashed are you?
Posted: 1/6/2007 11:14:57 PM |
Perhaps the government is looking to defame cigarettes to make a profit.
Ya because they make a profit that way? Do you realize how much tax the government collects on cigarrettes? Thats a ridiculous statement if I've ever seen one.
Also because it is claimed cigarrettes cause cancer does not mean that everyone will get it. We know for a fact there are carcinogens and mutogens in it. Cancer is sort of like rolling the dice for lack of a better analogy, when you are a smoker your body enters a state of rolling the dice and one day you may get your number.
The opening line is playing on the not so intelligent, it is using poor logic to prove a invalid point. another analogy, It can be said playing russian roullette kills people but hey not everyone who plays dies so it must not be the game right.... Maybe I misunderstood it it is late but it seems like that was an underlying point that was made to be unobvious.
Nevertheless this is a ridiculous arguement. go sit around sniffing formaldehyde and polonium particles if you think cancer is not being caused by cigarrettes. | |
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