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| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/25/2006 10:50:41 AM | The sad part is too little too late.
Explain the blame game to those who died during those four days. People from all walks of life who expected SOME kind of help from somewhere.
Makes you wonder what was the President doing doing those four days...a nice meal, a few beers, some phone calls,
oh yeah....
He was on vacation.  | |
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myoid
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Joined: 7/22/2006
Msg: 102 | |
| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/25/2006 9:18:42 PM | +++Myiod...
Please do not call me a racist...I am not. Your name calling is showing your ignorance in grand style. +++
Look at the title of your posts on August 16, 2006 -- their titles were "Spike Lee is a biased racist" -- and your posts were in support of that proposition. You brought the topic of racism to the table fella -- you threw the skunk in the box. Don't complain that the smell got all over you.
Right now Mr. Goodguy you waddle when you walk, you quack when you talk, you have feathers, webbed feet, and a bill. You claim you're not a duck.
As to my ignorance, I would submit that everything I have posted on this issue has proven to be true, unlike you, as you continue to post apocryphal trash. | |
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| Spike Lee's a Biased Racist
Posted: 8/25/2006 10:04:08 PM | | Ok. I could'nt let this one get by. The police prey upon the poor? Hell, I grew up with cops. Old time cops mostly. Sure they protect the rich. But thats usually because of politics more than anything else. But on the street, in real life, cops solve moreproblems, save more babies, save more lives, take care of more people, in middle class, and poor neighborhoods, than rich areas, day in, and day out. Been there. Seen it. Now, the justice system, after the cops are done, theres truth in that. The more money, the better representation you get. And one of the truths in life, that noone wants to hear, is, cops cantdo anything, the politicians wont let them do | |
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dmotz
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Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 104 | |
| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/25/2006 11:09:48 PM | Yupp......I did call spike a racist and I stand by the statement.
Lets look at it this way...when he implies that we"Blew up the levees"...thats all i need to know about him. To think the "White man Government" would intentionally kill it`s own people regardless of color is stupid! And the ignorance of the people who believe this dribble never ceases to amaze me! | |
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| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/26/2006 4:43:05 PM | | The goverment blew the levees once in 1965. Why not now? If you don't believe a government would kill it's own people than you need to look at history a little closer. | |
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| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/26/2006 4:48:45 PM | I know the indian nations would have quite a lot to say on the subject of Government killing their ancestors.
Present day, just ask the guy from Ruby Ridge. The FBI shot and killed his wife and family.
I would never rule out skullduggery on the Government's part. But I do question spokespeople like Farakan or Al Sharpton. Hard to believe them.
The Documentary is excellent. Spike Lee did us an awesome service by producing this film.
Toon | |
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| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/26/2006 7:41:39 PM | friends. try being 55 and widowed and all the older divorced men want to do is to play mind games.
Where did the government blow the levees in 1965? That was 16 years before you were born, so you can't possibly know this first hand. Surely this was not in New Orleans during Hurricane Betsy, in which a whole bunch of people in N.O. East drowned in their attics.(same area as during Katrina). Why do people keep building back in an area that used to be pristine marshland and how can they expect that it won't happen again? There were people in houses right next to the levees when they collapsed and surely nobody would be stupid enough to try to blow up a levee right behind a house that people were in. I had cousins who lived very close to the 17th Street Canal, and they know what actually happened. The pilings in the levee were not deep enough and the type soil they were in was not the proper type to anchor them. The levees gave way because of faulty design and construction by the Corps of Engineers, and that is a fact.  | |
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| Spike Lee's a Biased Racist
Posted: 8/26/2006 8:09:01 PM | Hurricane Katrina was a national disaster(as are most cat.5 hurricanes) and Spike Lee pointing fingers at Pres.Bush and the federal government isn't helping any,if anybody is to blame it's the local government for not evacuating the poor and elderly.Let's not forget that the city of N.O. had hundreds of buses that the mayor could of used to get many people out.
I was 5 miles from the epicenter of the 1994 Northridge earthquake and FEMA was there within two days to help get people housing,I didn't need their help but it was nice that they were there.
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myoid
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Joined: 7/22/2006
Msg: 109 | |
| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 1:36:52 AM | +++The levees gave way because of faulty design and construction by the Corps of Engineers, and that is a fact+++
Skydad -- don't be citing facts to this group. They have all kind of apocryphal tales about rapists and looters running wild and that bunch of "lawless negroes" running New Orleans. Why would they be interested in facts?
I continue to laugh at the post about the City of New Orleans not using school buses to evacuate the nursing homes and hospitals. Can anything be more ludicrous. We have a bunch of school bus drivers that we pay 350 dollars per month to carry school children to class and we're going to call them as the greatest natural disaster to strike the North American continent since Columbus landed bears down upon them and get them to abandon their wives, their children, their loved ones and use their school buses to evacuate people from hospitals with their life support systems and oxygen tanks -- take on the responsibility for the safety of people who are only a power outage from death -- oh yeah -- I can see all those bus drivers running down and taking care of that. The whole thing is so silly I question the reality base of anyone who would suggest such nonsense. And don't lose sight of the fact that many who stayed and tried to help these desperate individuals were rewarded for their efforts with being arrested and charged with murder when the 80 and 90 year old people in their care died after being without food, water, electricity for 5 days in 100 to 120 degree heat. Yep, I can imagine those bus drivers would have come running.
Following September 11, an event that was in no way the responsibility of the USA, our government gave grants of 300 thousand dollars to as much as a million and a half each to the rich stock brokers, doctors, and lawyers who were the victims of this atrocity. In Katrina the entire event is the acknowledged fault of the USA, and yet zero is given to the people (please, I do not consider 250 million to Northrupp Grummond and 25 million to Hancock Bank to be legitimate Hurricane relief).
So here is the barebones
September 11 -- no fault of USA -- massive relief to the rich, predominantly white doctors, lawyers, and stock brokers who were the victims.
Katrina -- levee failure and damage resulting therefrom the complete fault of the USA -- no relief to the predominantly black population who were the victims.
Please, someone, give me a non-racist explanation. The only non-racial explanation that I have seen is, "they shouldn't have believed the lies the USA told them about the safety of the levees. They shouldn't have allowed the USA to fool them so easily. They should have never built where the USA said it was safe to build -- surely they knew the USA was lieing." I'll admit -- that is a better answer than the outright racism. | |
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myoid
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Joined: 7/22/2006
Msg: 110 | |
| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 1:52:40 AM | +++Lets look at it this way...when he implies that we"Blew up the levees"...+++
No he didn't. He used quotes from three individuals who claimed to hear explosions and believed the levees had been blown. Many, perhaps thousands, claim to have heard explosions. The intensity of the heightened senses, the adrenalyn rush, the panic from this storm created a fog of war situation. The sounds could have been the sound created by the break in the levees themselves. Houses were burning -- stored gasoline was exploding, transformers may have been blowing, even though power was out to the individual houses. Mr. Lee would have been derelict in his journalistic duties to silence these people. It is even possible that saboteurs blew the levees. I do not believe the levees were blown (what purpose would have been accomplished), but ignoring the statements of hundreds, perhaps thousands, who heard the explosions, would do nothing to quiet these rumors and would have probably caused the concerns to mushroom.
I thought the film addressed the issue very subtlely and effectively. | |
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| Spike Lee's When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 7:39:04 AM | I'm tired of holding my tounge.
The U.S. goverment let it's people down. Plain and simple. There is no other explaination for it. F**k everything else. When a foreign country has trouble the U.S. goverment always sends millions of dollars abroad. Charity begins at home.
Blame whoever you want but s**t rolls down hill. We have a chain of command type Goverment the lower you are on that chain the less power you have.
Bush has to take the hit for this failure then he has to fix the link in the chain. So the head of FEMA was fired in the aftermath.
The bottom line is Katrina happened and if this was an underdeveloped nation the late rescues could have been understandable. This is a Mighty nation has been for years.
So how can a group of citizens sworn to protect this nation let it die.
Bottom line is poor people are treated like garbage and it will continue until whenever. | |
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myoid
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Joined: 7/22/2006
Msg: 112 | |
| Spike Lee's a Biased Racist
Posted: 8/27/2006 10:33:18 AM | Newintown
Somehow missed this -- so I thought I'd answer a few of your points:
Who's a racist?
I'm a white guy born in the deep south in 1950. I was raised in a totally racist society -- I'm sure I harbor some of the teachings -- I hope I have overcome most of them. But being white and being raised when and where I was I have a good education in spotting racism. It is more rampant now in the Post-Katrina episodes than at anytime since the summer of 1964. That's a pretty sad statement to have to make. I was 14 that summer. To now be 56 and have to witness what I have witnessed over the past year saddens me greatly. I will tell you, that little 14 year old boy would never have dreamed that he would have to be witnessing what he is now witnessing as an old man.
Regarding the volunteers:
No, I am not out of my mind. I am on the scene. The damage that was done is biblical in proportions. We are talking about 400,000 homes being destroyed. How many do you think have been replaced in the past year -- one thousand? two? What we need is a comprehensive program at the federal level with realistic goals. The infamous 8x28 ft FEMA trailer is commited to the people living in them for only 6 more months. That means 200,000 families are six months from homelessness again -- and there is absolutely no plan even in mind as to what to do with them.
The volunteers hearts are in the right place, but they are being used. There is no way they can overcome the devastation that this storm brought. The only thing they are truly doing is providing cover for the ineptness of our officials. When the public officials are questioned as to what is being done they point to the volunteers and start a cheerleading session. But the volunteers have no way of getting these people in homes. If the volunteers could produce 5000 homes per year it would take 80 years to restore the housing. And 5000 homes per year is not a realistic number for a volunteer effort.
And the volunteers are being used in other ways. I personally know of instances where volunteer church groups have repaired rental units after reaching agreements with landlords to allow the tenants to stay in the rental unit for set periods of time -- two years seems to be the standard -- then as soon as the repairs are made the landlord raises the rent double or even triple. The landlords response? "But they can stay, they just have to pay the rent."
The fraud in the zone is massive. And the volunteers are being horribly used.
If all the volunteers pulled out tomorrow it would force our officials to face the problem. Right now the volunteers are merely providing cover. It would be better for the zone if they left. So, I will reiterate my previous statement: Volunteers, please stay home. You are being used. You are truly only hurting the recovery effort. The residents need a comprehensive redevelopment plan along the lines of the Marshall plan at the end of WWII. By staying here you are only delaying the inevitable. Please go home.
Those who doubt me, I invite you to the zone. Don't talk to the mayor and the preachers and the talking heads on tv -- go to the FEMA trailer parks -- where hundreds of thousands now reside -- the victims. Ask them what they think of the volunteers. The answers will not be pretty. I am sorry that I have to provide such truth. But truth is often not pretty.
Spike Lee's credentials:
Spike Lee's credientials are of impeccable nature. He has established himself as one of the greatest filmmakers of our era. He has solidified that position with the perfectly wonderful movie he produced for the City of New Orleans and its residents. He has established that he is even more brilliant than I had previously believed.
As for me, I'm just a little white guy who happens to live right on the edge of the zone. I was unscathed by it all so I have the luxury of peering in from just outside the edge. It is as if I am looking into the fishbowl with a full view, but unaffected by it all from a physical and financial standpoint.
This morning on the national news (I think it was CNN) it was reported that the expenditures for Katrina had reached 72 thousand dollars per person in the zone. The problem is, the money didn't go to the people. It went to defense contractors like Northrupp Grummond. It went to Bechtel, it went to banks, it went to contractors with political connections and their no-bid contracts. It didn't go to the people. If you pay someone $10,000.00 to sweep my driveway, you didn't give me $10,000.00. We still have no plan. Fraud remains pervasive.
I call on everyone -- contact your senators, your congressman -- ask for a comprehensive federal effort. Less waste. More true aid to the victims. It's not happening now. It will not happen with our present system. | |
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dmotz
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Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 113 | |
| Spike Lee's documentary - When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 10:50:20 AM | http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/viewpoints/articles/0827mittelstaedt0827.html
The Arizona Republic
August 27, 2006
Robert E. Mittelstaedt Jr.
the republic
Aug. 27, 2006 12:00 AM
Life in the 21st century is about changing pace, technology, high-tech connections and the unexpected. But the most stunning example of speed and change that no one expected is the fall of a major U.S. city to the status of an irrelevant historical footnote in one year.
Aug. 29 will be a year since Hurricane Katrina made landfall in southern Louisiana and put New Orleans and its problems on center stage around the world. Two disasters struck that week: nature's and ours.
Amid unbelievable devastation and unparalleled incompetence at nearly all levels of government, hope for recovery emerged. All the hope was hype spewed by cowardly politicians incapable of telling the truth about real disasters. The rhetoric was designed to reassure the tourists who support the city and hundreds of thousands of people whose hearts and homes were broken that there was a future in New Orleans.
advertisement
Unfortunately, New Orleans was doomed from the beginning. Some of us saw what was coming, not because the plans were too grandiose but because they were too small-minded.
Three weeks after Katrina, a colleague and I floated a bold idea for a revitalized New Orleans, naive in our certainty that bold plans would advance rapidly and capture world attention as leaders seized a rare opportunity to design around the weaknesses of a great city.
Bold means having the guts to forbid rebuilding on below-sea-level ground. Bold means relocating large numbers of people and providing homes at pre-Katrina market values to the north and northwest.
Bold means building a city with portions that are physically separate to accommodate the topography. Bold means ultra-high-speed train links to produce a new model for a world-class city where proximity is provided by transportation and communication rather than adjacency.
Those of us with New Orleans ties but living elsewhere cried daily as the suffering unfolded, but we eventually got on with our lives. The reality show that continues out of the public eye is the mind-numbing pain that many endure every day as they try to make a life in the Big Easy without any plan, much less a bold one. The lyrics to Sonny and Cher's '60s hit describe it best:
The beat goes on, the beat goes on.
Drums keep pounding a rhythm to the brain.
The beat goes on for all of us, if we are astute enough to think about it, as we realize that government at all levels failed its citizens during the emergency and its short and long-term aftermath. "Plans" are little more than the political rhetoric some people want to hear: "We'll rebuild and make it the same again."
The beat goes on, but it is not the happy ending of roll up your sleeves, fix it and get on with life. Instead, returning has produced a drum pounding in people's heads, deep pain gnawing at exposed nerves and unrelenting depression as those who had little before Katrina contend with having nothing now.
The beat goes on as flood-insured homeowners fight to get what is owed under their policies to pay off mortgages and avoid bankruptcy. Those who can afford it are buying houses on slightly higher ground in a depressed daze and wonder if they will ever be able to retire.
The beat goes on as those who found jobs elsewhere agonize over staying in their new communities or returning. Those lucky enough to have jobs and be back in minimally damaged homes cry with the pain of their family, friends and neighbors.
The beat goes on as small-business owners struggle to survive. Even those who were previously successful must take desperate measures, like Galatoire's, a century-old restaurant that announced it must open in Baton Rouge to stay alive in New Orleans.
What was New Orleans before Katrina? It was a city with history, culture, food, entertainment and attraction to visitors. It was a major seaport. It was a support area for the oil and gas industry. But it was and still is largely below sea level. The business base has eroded for years because of anti-business attitudes, poor investment in infrastructure, poor public education, high crime rates and corruption.
What is New Orleans after Katrina? A confused place that is rapidly becoming a historical footnote. No one has the guts to tell the truth and do something more than just letting the beat go on.
Local politicians have no ability to accomplish anything significant because they have no money or unified local commitment to a vision. The rest of Louisiana doesn't care. Those outside New Orleans dislike it and resent spending money on it just as most rural folks resent large financially challenged cities in their states.
Federal politicians have fled. President Bush's speech in Jackson Square was equivalent to his landing on an aircraft carrier and declaring victory.
The beat goes on. No federal politician sees any way of winning by supporting New Orleans because the rest of the country just doesn't care enough.
Who wants to be branded a racist by telling the truth and saying that the Lower Ninth Ward should be part of the marsh?
Who wants to be called heartless by returning Lakeview to the lake? Who will take the risk of a bold federally funded plan with significant requirements on how the money is spent? No one so far.
Where does that leave us? Just where we were in the midst of the storm: without senior federal leadership and creativity good enough to tempt the small-thinking locals into accepting lots of federal money with strings attached for an ambitious world-attention grabbing audacious plan.
There is much to be remembered for those of us who have New Orleans in our blood, even if we no longer live there. But that will soon be a distant memory rather than a living culture we can revisit.
Wake up and smell the beignets, New Orleans. Preserve what is worth preserving and make the rest better than it was before Katrina.
Robert E. Mittelstaedt Jr. grew up in Greater New Orleans, received his engineering degree at Tulane and is currently dean of the W.P. Carey School of Business at Arizona State University. | |
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myoid
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Joined: 7/22/2006
Msg: 114 | |
| Spike Lee's documentary - When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 11:26:50 AM | Rightwinggoodguy,
Very nice -- now we're heading in the same direction.
I do not profess to know what the correct plan will be. And I would imagine that what we initially begin as our plan will have to be amended as we proceed. But the beginning of a dialogue is essential. Perhaps the professor is correct -- the Lower Ninth and the Lakefront will have to be abandoned. That does not mean we tell the original residents there that there is plenty of work in California picking fruit (think Steinbeck) and send them on their way.
Anyway, I found your post to be a very positive one. More please. | |
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dmotz
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Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 115 | |
| Spike Lee's documentary - When The Levees Broke
Posted: 8/27/2006 12:33:53 PM | Myoid...
Glad to hear you liked the post...
Look..in all honesty...I am not a racist either...Was raised in Arkansas...I know New Orleans...
I just get a lil ticked when folks start throwing around conspiracy theories..I am not saying you have Myoid...We just have a different perspective on what really needs to be done.
Do I believe the people were Intentionally mistreated...abandoned...no! Do I believe the levees were blown...NO!
What I do believe is the whole government..from the city of N.O to the white house dropped the ball..All the complaining folks do about the poor or the rich is nonsense. We need to rebuild N.O on higher ground or...and this is a puzzle to me with all our technology ect...Rebuild the levees to withhold the water. I do know the crime was rampant after Katrina..But overall..The city has always been full of criminals..of all colors...creeds..Both Rich and poor. So That really is not an issue.
The fed government does need to help these folks get into permanant homes..not just for 6 months...The issue in my eyes is this...how can we tell who really needs the help? It is kind of like our welfare system in America..Full of fraud and deciet...Not everyone is a criminal...not everyone is committing fraud...but how do we weed it out? | |
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| Spike Lee's documentary - When The Levees Broke
Posted: 10/5/2006 12:58:47 PM | Bobby 7 as an outsider looking in you have no allegiance to either political party in the U.S.
So your opinion is greatly appreciated by me.
This is the mighty U.S.A. and pictures don't lie. You saw what you saw and it wasn't right. Those shot's from katrina were sad. It looked like one of those save the children commercials.
My fellow americans we have just sent 23 million dollars to aid Lebanon. One of the saddest things i saw was 1 bulldozer trying to put sand bags at the broken levee.
Sad but true.
.........................
Nashawn,
You are wrong.
I agree with Bobby7...and Ladyofthelake...I am sorry, you read the US press and it is selctively filled with lies. The news the rest of the world reads is objective. We Americans are routinely fed brain rot, please read Confessions of an Economic Hit Man. Even the medical community lies to us since they are bought by the Pharmaceutical companies...try listening to the Debra Ray show.
We have a President that has lied and cheated his fellow Americans.
Heck even the CIA disagrees with the President..oh I see it now,,,they are LIBERALS too...
From my readings and listenings, we will be in IRAQ for at least 10 years some say 20 to 25.
Lady, I think you head is buried in the sand. Please wake up and snap out of it and join the human race. We are a laughingstock because the US elected a moron twice as president.
Heck there was a movie that joked about the fraudulent US Prez. elections: Lord of War.
HeckI am not even a liberal, if anything I suipport moderate Republicans and those Democrats willing to have the industrial giants and the rank and file working together (FDR?), and fiscally responsible Democrats (JFK?).
To get any objective news, you might have to read stuff from foreign countries ie. eg. Canada, Asia, Europe. We are routinely fed lies. By the way, the Family Rothschilde OWNS Reueters, so that guarantees either a muzzled or controlled media...ie, CRAP!!
I love my country (U.S.A.), but despised the monsters who lie, cheat, steal, and manipuilate the citizens of my country.
My philosophy is simple:
People should never fear their own governement,
but the governement must fear its Citizens!
That is what the founding fathers said about the governemnt by, for, and of the people.
You are either part of the solution or the problem.
If the solution, then contribute and coexist peacefully.
If the problem, then shut the HELL up!!! | |
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| Spike Lee's a Biased Racist
Posted: 10/9/2006 6:35:30 AM | | Has anyone noticed that Trip Dave changed the subject of the OP post? See Above Subject. | |
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