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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 11/27/2006 8:23:36 AM | "Civil War in America? Very likely. I have been able to see it ever since the US has been taking preparations for martial law and I know for a fact that the Southerner's are itching for another one."
I live in the South, junior. Take my word for it. Noone is "itching" for another Civil War. We got our asses kicked the first time. We may not like some Northeners, but we're not going to war. Now if you're talking class warfare, that's another story. But if you think we are still hung up on the Union/Confederacy thing, you really don't know much about what's going on down here. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/15/2008 2:44:43 PM | I don't know if I agree fully with the OP, because I don't think Americas foreign or domestic enemies have ever been in the shadows. I also don't see a civil war being north vs south. Anyway my concern is if Obama gets into office, he could directly or indirectly inspire a 2nd revolution.
This of course would result in a 2nd civil war. Now I'm hoping he will be another toothless president like Jimmy Carter, who I might add was the most liberal president ever. Jimmy Carter and Obama make JFK look like a right winger. In fact, if the current political climate was the same in Jimmy Carters day, he would have been far more dangorus.
I can't say I like any of the canadates, but Obama worries me the most. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/16/2008 6:03:41 AM | It's interesting, I see this red/blue state divide, too. It seems to have come about with Bush's election ...........all the wedge issues.......but the divisions were already there, just exploited rather than bridged.
I am biased as a Democrat, but it puzzles me how Republicans seem to bite their noses off to spite their face. Republican administrations typically screw the worker and the middle class, they always result in rich getting richer and poor getting poorer .......it happened under Reagan and Bush 1 as well as Bush 2.
And they fly under the banner of ideologies that divide .........welfare reform, abortion issues, crime policy, etc. "No free handouts!", "Protect our country!" "Get criminals off the street!", "Abortion is bad!" ..... all of which are good, if simple-minded ideals.
Those wedge issues, though ........of course, people should work if they can....of course, we need to protect our country ....of course, abortion is a bad thing.....of course, criminals should be in jail .........who doesnt believe these things?
The problem is that these are often code words.... "defending our country" can mean bloating our military budget with popular support, too, beyond anything that is reasonably necessary for defense. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/17/2008 4:18:38 AM | Jay152 quote
"Note: Both Bush and Kerry belonged to the skull and crossbones...perhaps this is a very big clue. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/10/02/60minutes/main576332.shtml"
Indeed Jay152 you have out of all your comments hit the nail on the head with this one.
Skull and bones who are they. The skull and bones are the western arm of the Jesuit order and most of its members convine once a year at The Bohemian Grove.
I was extremely skeptic about most things years ago but the more I uncovered and researched looking for answers the faster I started leaning towards the improbable(according to public opinion) answers and now mostly fact to be sure.
Our lovely world leaders and Elite members of society (not all of them being directly related to the government) seem to have a fascination with Bohemian Grove (and related society’s) as it happens.
This research is what led me into deeper realms of the strange and hard to believe facts and opinion alike.
I went to Wikipedia last night and edited the grove page to add some more facts that had been overlooked, I even sourced the facts only to have the information removed almost immediately (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_Grove) as if someone has been charged with watching this particular page 24/7 ,(this happend all 3 times i edited the page at different intervals) very odd indeed but I guess regarding the Grove's secretive nature it would make sense that they wouldn’t want a public page with so much information concerning the place being right out there for everyone to see.
Following almost a year's research later I ended up in the Realm of the Jesuit order (im sure just posting there name would get some attention somewhere lol) who in the face of the public seem to be out there for the common good but when you look into there past and ceremonial activities things start to become rather strange indeed.
I think the first thing that really shocked me was when I came across the Jesuit oath (this oath is the pledge a person takes and paperwork they sign when becoming a Jesuit priest). After reading this document (http://www.thenazareneway.com/society_of_jesus_jesuits.htm) I was shocked and started digging deeper and farther into there past than you can imagine.
Being directly related to Freemason's , The Jesuit order/Skull and bones/Knights templar. among many other names are shrouded in secrecy.
History of Freemasonry
(this is crucial documentation on how our new world order works and how it was started and by who, the film was made by a 33rd degree mason who had decided it was not what he signed up for and left the order.
He decided to show the public exactly what Freemasons are about and how even lower freemasons don’t even themselves know what the heck is really happening in the Upper Elite of the order)
http://video.google.com.au/url?vidurl=http%3A%2F%2Fvideo.google.com.au%2
Fvideoplay%3Fdocid%3D-3923632392892449905%26q%3DHistory%2Bof%2
Bfreemasonry&docid=-3923632392892449905&ev=v&esrc=sr1&usg=AL29H23rR3
SThQsgtSmE3-KjbEijJ0wIeQ
I dont like theorys just facts but the deeper you go in research the harder it gets to uncover the Truth.
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/17/2008 4:40:37 PM | I'm working on a history of the Second American Civil War for a story I'm writing.
The same people win that one as won the Yugoslavian Civil War. No one.
There were cases of ethnic cleansing; although it was more often political cleansing than ethnic. One side's forces took a town or city, decided every one in it was 'red' or 'blue' and punished them for it.
There were places where tactical nukes were used.
In the end, much of the country was in ruins. Roads destroyed, farm fields full of mines and unexploded munitions, factories wrecked. Starvation and disease rampant.
I don't want it to happen, but more and more I fear it will.
Sad.  | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/17/2008 8:15:33 PM |
If we don't get these things done, this country will continue to erode from within, we will lose credibility and financial influence in the world, and the people will start rising up against their government.
I hope it doesn't come to that, but I don't see any other way around it. One look at how individual senators and representatives actually vote on the bills put before them will tell you that they only care about enriching themselves, pandering to big business, and keeping themselves in office. It should make people angry........very angry.
I hope it doesn't come to that as well but, if we continue the direction we're headed, I belivee it'll be inevitable if people want to remain free and America is to remain sovereign. Seems too many people still haven't realized the momentum towards globalism and what the actual implications are. Why the light bulb isn't even flickering for some people is beyond me. The sinister plans of the elite are destined to succeed — while we're sleeping. Time to wake up before it gets downright dirty. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/17/2008 8:54:59 PM |
I hope it doesn't come to that as well but, if we continue the direction we're headed, I belivee it'll be inevitable if people want to remain free and America is to remain sovereign. Seems too many people still haven't realized the momentum towards globalism and what the actual implications are. Why the light bulb isn't even flickering for some people is beyond me. The sinister plans of the elite are destined to succeed — while we're sleeping. Time to wake up before it gets downright dirty.
I couldn't agree more, very well stated OneBlend. Our so called representatives represent their controllers the industrial military complex and the ruling elite plain and clear as day. It appears CIA psyops have done a superb job dumbing down America and it would appear at this point revolution and civil war are inevitable as more and more families join the ranks of the homeless. Close to the breaking point now I believe America will soon rise up against the tyranny and there could even be a great cleansing of the nation depending on how many people really do love this country. Well, so much for my view, bring on the attacks sheeple! | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/18/2008 12:36:46 AM | Hey mon, why have a war when things are going so well? Populations are controlled by their stomach, end of story, Keep the food flowing, Not that I read anything past the childish names you posted, but do you have a better solution? Last I knew we could only vote for the people who are actually running...or as I've said before, Gumby would have been my choice long ago. some beer, something left on the credit card for your lady to do some shopping and aint NO ONE gonna lift a finger, Change? That what elections are for !!   | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/18/2008 12:40:52 AM | And just an FYI we have a civil war, actually a race war going on here in So Cal between the blacks and the new mexican immigrants and chicanos. Only the call it a
" gang war" so as to not scare the masses....
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/17/us/17race.html?ei=5090&en=a34ac77e3d9a409f&ex=1326690000&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=print
http://www.law.ucla.edu/home/apps/crs/pdf/Harv.%20J.%20Afr%20Am%20Pub%20Pol%20op%20ed.pdf | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/19/2008 8:22:50 AM | For Jay152,
On the subject of identifying polarized factions in the U.S., I just heard a very interesting interview with an author who has chronicled the development of the conservative movement in this country in a new book entitled "Upstream". The author is Alfred Regnery and it's available on Amazon.
Not only does he describe how three loosely organized groups came together around the late '40s because they had common ideals, he also describes the thread of liberal opposition. In my understanding, this will probably reveal a lot of what is behind the national vs. global concern, and may also account for the forces in each of the big parties that seem the same. There are liberals in each, but I think harder to find conservative Dems anymore, although I think these are who the "Blue Dogs" might be. (Sorry, I don't follow it THAT closely)
A couple years ago, I read an interesting book entitled "None Dare Call it Conspiracy", written in the early '70s, co-authored by a university history professor and a former congressman, whose names I can't verify, because I lent it to someone from whom I can't now retrieve it! Basically the authors were trying to expose communism, NOT as a movement of the downtrodden masses, but as a scheme by (Bilderbergers?) and powerful banking entities to essentially control (world finances) governments by holding them monetarily accountable. The more socialized the government, the more control.
Now, wouldn't that make you SUSPICIOUS of nationalized health care, for instance??!!! I believe it should.
The book also refers to the "fifth column", which some might say is that "secret party" behind it all.
I regret I don't have it on hand to refer to, because it doesn't make my case very well without being able to footnote it, but I gave as much reference as I can remember.
As a child, I heard talk about the Bilderbergers.........also referred to as the Illuminati?, and I'm now thinking that they are one-and-the-same as this fifth column I refer too.
Anyhow, I'm looking forward to obtaining a copy of "Upstream", as I think it will be highly informative for anyone wanting to get to the roots of current political/economic/idealogical thought. I mean, how can you have an intelligent conversation otherwise?
If we, as citizens don't immerse ourselves like this, how will we be able to root out ideological inconsistencies in our politicians? Or, for that matter, sift through what the media report?
Consider this: what would our government/leaders/politicians be like if we paid similar ROUTINE attention to it/them. as we do to professional sports/American Idol/the Sopranos, let's say? Not as glamorous, but what affects you or your kids' life more??
Enough of my soapboxing...........I've got homework to do! Hope that sheds some light.
J | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 4/19/2008 10:45:16 AM | | I do believe there will be another civil war. just dont know when and how it will be fought. I believe that eventually, the citizens of the U.S will grow tired of current and future governments not paying attention to waht the people say. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/17/2008 8:04:00 PM |
The only reason it doesnt happen here yet is because our government still protects us. protects you from what ? The only people you need to fear are those in your own government.
As a child, I heard talk about the Bilderbergers
In the last five years or so I've been reseraching the group and now I really wished I'd stayed blissfully ignorant. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/17/2008 8:51:12 PM |
I have stated in some threads that I think another civil war will happen in the United States sometime in the next ten years, a couple have agreed, and to my knowledge, no one disagreed with that statment.
Its clear the right and the left have become very polarized, yet I'm thinking both sides want much of the same things. That became clear from my thread that asked why is socialism popular in the threads. That was a good thread, and believe it or not many of you have gained my respect. Yet many still look at the other side as if they are the Nazi Party of America, myself incuded...this has to change.
Let me give you a foreigners take on all this.
You Americans live in one of the best countries on Earth, one of the richest countries, and one with one of the best political systems ever created.
This glass isn't half-full, or half-empty - it's overflowing.
Your Founders made it very clear that the power belongs to YOU - not your government. That's what you've forgotten.
After Reagan, the aristocracy took off. There was a snowball effect with money and power, and both took control of the political landscape. America started to split in two, not along color lines - but along class lines.
During that time period people , the majority, seemed content to let this all occur. You turned into a wasteful nation, as I've mentioned in the threads on gas. You've let them convince you that you no longer have control, and when you do that you don't need chains anymore - you are already slaves.
Instead of sitting there watching American Idol on that 100 inch plasma screen, go over to your window and open it.
I don't have to tell you things are bad. Everybody knows things are bad. It's a depression. Everybody's out of work or scared of losing their job. The dollar buys a nickel's work, banks are going bust, shopkeepers keep a gun under the counter. Punks are running wild in the street and there's nobody anywhere who seems to know what to do, and there's no end to it. We know the air is unfit to breathe and our food is unfit to eat, and we sit watching our TV's while some local newscaster tells us that today we had fifteen homicides and sixty-three violent crimes, as if that's the way it's supposed to be. We know things are bad - worse than bad. They're crazy. It's like everything everywhere is going crazy, so we don't go out anymore. We sit in the house, and slowly the world we are living in is getting smaller, and all we say is, 'Please, at least leave us alone in our living rooms. Let me have my toaster and my TV and my steel-belted radials and I won't say anything. Just leave us alone.' Well, I'm not gonna leave you alone. I want you to get mad! I don't want you to protest. I don't want you to riot - I don't want you to write to your congressman because I wouldn't know what to tell you to write. I don't know what to do about the depression and the inflation and the Russians and the crime in the street. All I know is that first you've got to get mad.
Howard Beale: [shouting] You've got to say, 'I'm a HUMAN BEING, Goddamnit! My life has VALUE!' So I want you to get up now. I want all of you to get up out of your chairs. I want you to get up right now and go to the window. Open it, and stick your head out, and yell,
[shouting]
Howard Beale: 'I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!' I want you to get up right now, sit up, go to your windows, open them and stick your head out and yell - 'I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take this anymore!' Things have got to change. But first, you've gotta get mad!... You've got to say, 'I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore!' Then we'll figure out what to do about the depression and the inflation and the oil crisis. But first get up out of your chairs, open the window, stick your head out, and yell, and say it:
Howard Beale: [screaming at the top of his lungs] "I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!"
Your fight is not with one another, it's with those that control you and divide you.
It's not black and white, but what's wrong and right.
This change starts with you, not the other guy.
It's time to get up, get mad, and start to push for change that makes America the country it used to be. Phone your mayor, get involved with the community, phone your Senator and give him hell.
Put the living fear of God into their hearts, until they can no longer stand the ringing of those phones in their offices, and their office floors are covered with mail.
Everyone wins, or everyone loses. It's your choice.
But do it together.  | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/17/2008 8:54:25 PM | Interesting this thread has come up after what I saw, yesterday. I think there will be. I told this story in the thread about escalating food prices. Seems more appropriate, here:
I was buying gasoline, yesterday. Another customer started raging about the prices. That led him to the price of food and everything else. Soon, all the other customers were with him. The anger was contagious.
About then, some rich guy pulled up in a convertible Mercedes and parked to go into the store. He parked across the pumps, blocking all the cars. He didn't care that he was inconviencing seven other people. To him, all that mattered was his needs.
That lit the fuse. The mob was going to fix all their woes right there. They were going to fix it by dragging the rich guy out of the store and beat him to death. They headed for the store...
The guy had left his young daughter in the car. Seeing the girl sitting in the convertible gave the mob, pause. That stopped them - this time.
The civil war will be between the many poor (along with the middle-class, who will soon be poor), and the few super rich. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/17/2008 9:34:40 PM | Ballots, not bullets, will be your solution.
Non-violence will get you far more progress faster. That's been proved over and over again.
There's enough of that American pie for all to have a slice. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 6:34:10 AM | There's enough of that American pie for all to have a slice.
There is enough for everyone, and then some. Unfortunately, the wealth in America (and word wide) is now so unevenly distributed that is has almost reached a tipping point where the wealthy are now in a position the take it all. They are like children in the "mine" phase, greedily stuffing their face - jelly smeared all over their fat cheeks as they shovel more in.
Ballots, not bullets, will be your solution.
Agreed. We need viable candidates, however. Where are they? Takes money to run for office - who has the money? Well, the rich.
People need to get it out of their heads that the rich are somehow entitled to their wealth. They are not. The wealthy are often wealthy merely by an accident of birth. If you want a truly fair free market system, everyone should start the game at the same point. Also, the rules should be the same for everyone. Currently, the more money you have, the more advantages you get. Born in a wealthy family, you get to go to better schools. Use that better education to get a better job. Parents die, you inherit large sums of money. Get more money and the advantage grows for you. Interest rates drop for you while the poor are straddled with the higher rates and lack of opportunity. The advantages just continue to compound for the wealthy. Here is a radical solution: At death, an individual's accumulated wealth gets redistributed to everyone else. It would never fly, but it would work. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 9:59:44 AM | Some people need a history lesson alomg with a study of human nature"share the wealth " schemes have come and gone,i will work 16 hrs a day to build a business to pass on to my children...i will not do it for someone else's...if forced to i will sit down and stick out ny hand like everybody else and we can all live in third world poverty together.
This nation could face another civil war when the economy collapses and people can't feed their families,they will know who's to blame,a few environmentalist might find a spotted owl shoved up their ass since it is they who stop America from tapping into it's own resources...and then blame her for getting them from others and "raping" the earth...a few lying politicians will have to hide themselves,along with the boot lickers,cowards and all the rest | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 10:19:33 AM |
Some people need a history lesson alomg with a study of human nature"share the wealth " schemes have come and gone
Yeah, like America up to until about 1980. Since then there's been a tremendous shift in wealth inequality, and you can see the results all around you.
Since then, poverty has increased and the middle/working classes have been hammered.
The America I lived in, in 1966, was a wonder to behold. In a little suburb of LA (Duarte) working class people owned their own homes, had pools, and cars - and on one salary. Compared to the Canadian model of society at the time, this was the best advertisement for capitalism that ever could have existed.
That isn't the way it is anymore. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 10:44:58 AM | environmentalist might find a spotted owl shoved up their ass
So it's the environmentalist's fault?
I heard the rich will soon be handing out the nose rings - guess they have already begun distribution.
Actually, I do believe some of our environmental policies are to restrictive. However...
Years ago, Washington saw this coming. Everyone understood controlling the energy needs of a nation was the key to controlling that nation. Work on economical transportation networks could of begun years ago. Research on alternatives to the dependence on oil also should of begun forty years ago. Was it? Of course not. The opportunity was there for a few individuals to control a single resource that would drive the worlds economy. The average individual is willingly being led down the road to ruin by the rich and by Washington (I guess the two terms are interchangeable).
Turn off talk radio and see the world as it truly is. Nothing will be passed on to your children and grand children because the rich will have it all . The children and grandchild of the future will be forced to live a life of servitude to the rich because their parents so willingly handed everything over to the wealthy - but as long as the population can be pacified with shoddy goods like ipods and cable tv, I guess all is well. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 11:00:22 AM | We have been lucky enough here to have a middle class, but there are plenty of countries in the world where there is NO middle class to speak of except civil servants, it's rich or poor and the poor work in the service of the rich in a service economy and/or try to eke out a living through a small business.
The few rich and masses of poor have been a pattern in many places over many years.
At its height, the population of Rome was somethig like 70% slaves.
Middle classes are a relatively recent phenomenon. What do people think the communist and socialist or most revolutions were about? Exploitation of masses of workers by the rich few.
You'd think that being rich means being satisfied, but that isnt the case. It often means a lust for more power, more influence, more and more........period...
One tool against middle classes is eliminating skilled work. Technology can reduce a lot of things down to simple tasks. Meatcutters used to be skilled, so they had power, for example. Now, each stage of it is broken down along assembly lines so that any idiot can do the work.
I was at a cashier's the other day and my tab was $5.20 ... I had a $10 bill and decided to give them that and 20 cents.........the cashier just couldnt figure out the math, ive seen that a lot, working with computers so much that 3rd grade math skills are gone. Tehnology and propaganda seem to be just dumbing people down.
Look at these boards, the way people think! Here are two guys running for President, one as a war hero who clearly states we will be in Iraq until 2013 and the costs so far have been so enormous and they will only compound as time goes on ..... combine that with the national debt that has to be paid.....look at what is happening with the cost of oil and food.......dont even think about the cost of Medicare and taxes needed for that.......and yet people will vote for this guy who will put us so much deeper in the hole and only increase the rich/poor divide because the other guy has a middle name of Hussein?
Huh? | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 11:05:37 AM | | What is "wealth inequality" do you deserve the same thing as another who works twice as hard...he works 16 hrs a day and you work 8...he builds a business while you are content to be a bit part player for a wage or don't bother to educate yourself in a profession that would reward you well.The reason for the difference between 1980 and now is so called free trade that pits labor against labor and America's insane propensity for giving away any advantages it has...Americans used to make things for other Americans,we have the natural resources and people to do it again but never will because our survival instinct is gone...we are a nation of fat,lazy whinners complaining that life's not fair | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 11:24:34 AM |
What is "wealth inequality" do you deserve the same thing as another who works twice as hard...
Often, the person who works the hardest, makes the least.
don't bother to educate yourself
Educational opportunities are not equal. The rich send their children to Taj Mahal schools while the poor children often must make due with substandard, broken down, soul crushing schools in the center of violent inner city neighborhoods where the latest textbook is forty years old.
The reason for the difference between 1980 and now is so called free trade
Ah, here is part of the problem...at least for the United States. Seems your getting it...
that pits labor against labor and America's insane propensity for giving away any advantages it has...Americans used to make things for other Americans,we have the natural resources and people to do it again but never will because our survival instinct is gone...we are a nation of fat,lazy whinners complaining that life's not fair
...oh, perhaps not, talk radio creeps in, again. It not because the survival instinct is gone. The reason Americans don't make things for other Americans is due to out-sourcing our manufacturing jobs. We have been betrayed and sold out by the rich corporations and by Washington once again. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 5/18/2008 11:54:39 AM | "Soak the rich" is a last gasp of a people who were given a country that was their's to run,to be involved in,to have a part in and they blew it and fell victim to the same psyhcological manipulation tactics that have been used since the beginning of time.
The current state of affairs is just as much the fault of the people as it is the government and the rich,for evidence just look at the three sorry choices we as a nation have for president,an appeaser,a starry eyed dreamer,and a cake and ice cream sales lady...none of them have any idea about anything other than wanting to sit in the oval office...we rejected guys like Ron Paul and anyone else who had good solid ideas in favor of the status quo...collectively we are a nation of fools and will suffer the fate of fools. | |
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