| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 12:47:47 AM | The Federal debt is up, personal debt is up, the interest rate on personal debt is up, the minimum wage is flat (unadjusted for inflation), the median wage is going down, Ford & General Motors are on the verge of filing for bankruptcy, Delphi & Visteon have filed for bankruptcy as have a couple of airlines, fewer people have anything in a pension plan and a record number of companies are turning to the federal Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation, more people are temporary or contingent workers, fewer people have a collectively bargained-for contract at work, the infrastructure is crumbling, the official unemployment rate is up and there are more ways than ever to be unemployed but not counted in the official rate, and a billion dollars a day is being pissed away on overseas military adventures that only worsen our national security ...
But I hear****Cheney and Haliburton are making some pretty good money. Not much trickles down, though.
Yup, the economy's doing good, all right. I hate to see what's going to happen after the election, after there's no need to artificially prop it up to make incumbents look good. | |
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vivid
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Joined: 6/30/2006
Msg: 27 | |
| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 1:42:32 AM | a billion dollars a day is being pissed away on overseas military adventures that only worsen our national security
Now the war drums are beating for Iran. Could you imagine a more creative way
to destroy America than having them piss another billion a day at another front?
Could it be that the Iranian president is cunning in this way....if you can't beat
America militarily, beat them into economic submission? Could this be the reason why he's
starting a nuclear project KNOWING full well that he couldn't possibly win under
a conventional war against the USA?
If the United States is crippled economically and the other nations, like the Arabs, are
buying ports, infrastructures, financial institutions....what will be left for the
average American to hold on to? Better brush up on your Arabic. | |
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| Conductor:
Posted: 9/14/2006 4:58:19 AM | I would also suggest, in their last budget, they actually increased spending on social issues.(ex; the money being given to parents with children under six for daycare
oh yes I see these benefits.. big deal.. most of the daycares are being cut to privatized daycares because the funds to keep them open aren't there. These day cares are cheaper and better. Better in the sense that they are educational environments. the private daycares are more expensive because they are NOT being subsidized and for the most part the providers have not gone threw the education for this position that the subsidized daycares require. $100 a month is what we are being given for one child. Subsidized daycares are about $50 a week. private daycare are usually $20 to $25 a day if you are lucky. You do the math and see how much this helps. It is a sugar-coated kick to the behind. It is a band-aid solution. It isn’t helping the daycare problem.
Its better then zero dollars, isn't it? I hear that argument allot, and I agree, its not much.
But people are being given a handout, they shouldn't b.itch about it.
Who wants a handout that doesn't really solve the problem. A solution to the problem would help instead of handouts. No one is bitching about the handout.. they are complaining that we are being taken for fools. It isn't Harper trying to help it is him trying to shut us up. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 7:25:30 AM |
If the United States is crippled economically and the other nations, like the Arabs, are
buying ports, infrastructures, financial institutions....what will be left for the
average American to hold on to? Better brush up on your Arabic.
In this way, the republicans are kind of like "The Manchurian Candidates". They're spending us down the economic toilet.
If republican administrations keep overspending their budgets with "tax cuts"... basically paying voters...(rich ones who actually save billiions, down to stupid ones who get an extra bag of groceries a year) to get elected; soon over half our tax burden will be interest on debt borrowed through bond sales to nations like China, Saudi Arabia, etc...
If you don't think that's political leverage, think again.
WHY on earth do you think the Saudi family didn't get investigated for financial ties to Al Qaida? ...
and look who defended them from a lawsuit to do just that by the survivors of 911 victims:
James Baker... and Bush gave him an office in the White House to do it in.
If you think you're safer with the republicans in office, you're just flat out WRONG. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 8:15:24 AM | | It would be nice to see a troll with a command of grammar because the American economy is not doing well. The ranks of the working poor, those toiling for minimum wage, are growing. These are not lazy people, many work two and three jobs to support their families so if they have a decent car or home to show for it it is because they have made huge sacrifices to have them. Retaining tax cuts, particularly those structured as anti noted that supply an additional bag of groceries for most citizens, in an era of dramatically increased military spending is fiscally stupid. Citibank holds a frightening amount of the debt in this country along with a few other huge lending institutions that have discovered South Dakota. Congress took measures to address the debt situation but the short term will result in a deluge of bankruptcies. Trickle down economics failed in the 1980s and it is failing now. | |
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peon
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Joined: 7/4/2006
Msg: 31 | |
| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 8:38:38 AM | You wrote that when you were high right?
In the late-1960s the disparity between workers and CEOs was 1:40... now it's 1:525. Fyi 1:40 is still higher then close to half of western countries.
Median household income since the late-1960s have SLIGHTLY increased.. but in the 1960s the average household had only 1 income earner, now a houshold has (more than) 2... for people in the bottom 40% they're not working fulltime, they're working 1.18+ jobs each, more then fulltime :/
Since the late-1970s the average income earned by people with highschool education has dropped over 20%. Fortunately for college grads, the decline didn't started until 1982 (..yay..) :(
The decline in worker wages and decline in Union jobs is currently running at almost exactly 1:1.. meaning a decline in Union jobs, equals a direct decline in middle class incomes
I could go on but it's so sickening people aren't riotting about this.. it's mind-boggling in fact. My favourite were moanings from oil executives about how profits were surging so astronomically high, yet they had actually sacked employees and reduced wages in areas:
[from CNN Money, Jan 2006] "Our earnings reflect our ability to capture the strong industry condition. More importantly they highlight the things we do exceptionally well," Hubble [Exxon VP] said
Wages were described as "lacklustre" as management bemoaned how unfortunate it was this was happening. That management pays themselves from company profits while undermining worker wages never gets mentionned. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 12:10:14 PM | To the OP:
WTF? Where do youi work and are you getting your gas, food and other needs cheaper than the rest of us? because I sure as hell am paying way too much for everything and not making a crapper load of money. Good luck to you then. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 12:59:06 PM | It is said that video and movies stimulate the same feelings and emotions as the real thing. People that win playing videos games feel success in real life, even though they are not.
Perhaps the OP has been playing too many video games and watching too much American news?
From Ron Paul: What the Price of Gold is Telling Us;
“Since 2001 the dollar [US] has been devalued by 60%.”
(http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2006/cr042506.htm)
You’ve had 60% of you wealth stolen and you feel your economy is doing well? And you have a good president?
The rest of the world is laughing at you.
See also Ron Paul, The End of Dollar Hegemony.
See also: It’s the Fiat Dollar Stupid. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 9/14/2006 1:59:59 PM | On the note of the American Economy, it is not doing so well as Bush and others would suggest. The economy is under-performing when considering the potential, and the state of the economy when Bush took over the office. The recent "growth" and performance has not been able to get back to the point to where the economy was and should be. People got to remember that the U.S. economy has went from a record surplus from the Clinton years to a record deficit, Bush squandered the opportunity coast through his terms in office. However, he will try to tell you that the events of 9/11 is the cause of all the problems in the economy and the recession that took place during/after it. That recession was a minor one, especially when compared to the recession of the 90's.
A common ploy and bragging point of the current government is job "growth". Yes the number of jobs have grown, but mostly low-paying part-time employment. All that manages to do is create more people who are working but poor. While the minimun wage has not been increased to match the rate of inflation, so someone who makes the minimum wage today is worse off than someone who was earning minimum wage 5, 10 even 20 years ago. | |
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favs
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Joined: 3/13/2006
Msg: 36 | |
| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/10/2007 5:30:04 PM |
WTF? Where do you work and are you getting your gas, food and other needs cheaper than the rest of us? because I sure as hell am paying way too much for everything and not making a crapper load of money. Good luck to you then. , buddy is probably ceo of a really big cie., hes making around a million a month, going to the million-dolard store and dont pay gas cuz he got a limo driver!! the ecomnomie in both country aint the best, if the states pull out the troops in iraq and use that money on a good situation they could get rid of lots of problem, same thing in canada if we were not spending million in afgan. figthing for the american cause  | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/10/2007 8:59:47 PM | Here in Miami .. there are 40,000 forclosures being filed each month .. the average worker is working longer hours for a the same amount of compensation .. while his salary hasn't kept up with inflation .. Gas is higher .. insurance is almost unaffordable .. food costs are out of sight .. EVERYTHING cost more ..!
That doesn't count the loss of Health coverage .. the huge increases in premiums or the loss of covered services .. (you're paying more for LESS) ...
Yess people are buying houses .. (but just because creative financing can get you in .. doesn't mean you can pay the mortgage) The day's of making it in America on one income are out the door .. latch key kids are the norm .. divorces are up .. and the "good economy" Wall Street news sur isn't reducing the stress for the little guys ...
I couldn't disagree with you more .. this economy stinks .. and the overwhelming negative response to your assertions shows a grassroots consensus here on this thread proving that point .. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/12/2007 11:42:58 AM | I've scanned through most of the posts and find that most are down about the economy. If all of you were asked personally "Well how are you doing yourself'? I would bet the majority would say something like "I'm doing ok but I'm worried about the other guy".
Just for example, let's take a look at real estate market in the last 10 years. It's been f****** phenomenal!!!!! And it's been in a downslide that last couple of years. The economy is ALWAYS fluctuating. Housing, stock market or whatever.....there are always highs and lows. The housing has gone down....stocks are on the upwing.
Go to your regular local watering hole and just look at all the people spending money on drinks and food. They're there having a good time, spending money because they're making money. If the economy was so poor there wouldn't be any waiting time at your favorite restaurants. The auto manufacturers wouldn't be selling so many cars.
I won't deny that there are people struggling in this country. Always have been. Always will be. But some of those are struggling because they're living beyond their means.
Yes, some are working for minimum wage. Those who are, are generally servers and bartenders (who also get tips and earn a pretty good living) and entry level workers (that means teenagers). Where I live I saw a sign at McDondalds 'help wanted starting at $8 an hour'. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/12/2007 12:07:49 PM | | Lets look at it in terms of fiscal economics. Both Keynsian and supply side economists will tell you that if you run up deficits you will cause artificial inflation in the economy. Stands to reason - you can live above your means if you're maxing out your credit cards. So when you pay down the debt, you're artificially depressing the economy. Just like when you pull in your horns and start paying off the credit cards. So Clinton was artificially depressing the economy by paying down the debt; Bush is artificially inflating it by running up record deficits. Yet the economy under Bush has never come close to being as good as it was under Clinton. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/12/2007 1:06:19 PM | We have become a society of instant gratification. We are all trying to "keep up with the Joneses"
In the older days, with the exception of a house, when you wanted to buy something... you saved for it and then bought it. When they did buy things, they bought within their means. A small house, an affordable car... clothes were often handmedowns etc.
Now... we finance almost everything. Don't pay for 12 months when you put it on your "insert store name here" card (only 40% interest when you dont pay it off). People buy a half million dollar home when they should really only get a small townhouse. Credit cards are maxed out, lines of credit, you name it!
A great deal of poverty is self induced. Do you really NEED a big screen TV? Do you really NEED the expensive running shoes? Do you really NEED to be eating steak every night?
Most of this economic downturn is our own doing. Everyone thinks they are worth big bucks, even if they arent. I am Jo Schmo... I am a highschool dropout, and I drill holes in these metal pieces all day so I deserve to make 60k/yr with full benefits! COME ON! | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/12/2007 1:30:01 PM | Funny.... It seems even those that make big bucks think they deserve to make big bucks even when they are complete failures and run companies, cities, states, towns, etc into ruin. Who decides that the highschool drop-out who makes holes in metal peices doesn't deserve 60k/yr, but the CEO who ruins a company gets to leave with millions on top of the millions they already had and benifits despite that none of the employees will have anything?
The real problem with the economy is that all of the benifit of it is going to the upper 1 percent and all the burden for it, in creating, sustaining, and eventually paying for all of it is everyone else at rates not seen since the 1920's for you highschool drop outs who think economics are self induced... that didn't end well and this one is looking ALOT worse. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/12/2007 1:43:28 PM |
than having them piss another billion a day at another front
Slight exageration. From congressional budget negotiations the figure reported is that the Iraq war costs nine billion a month.
The Euro is at an all time high today and the Canadian dollar continues to rise against the USD.
The value of currency is set by international currency traders, not by government. Global confidence in the US dollar is diminishing, ipso facto the OP's assertion is false. | |
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/13/2007 7:12:28 PM | Yep someone lives on another planet.
The economy is in the crapper and going to get much worse. What we have is the rich telling the poor everything is fine an dandy. while they take the publics money and line the pockets of their rich buddies. Another let them eat cake moment! Don't fear, when we hit the depression and cannot find food, we will just eat the rich! LOL (now that would be poetic justice!)
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| If George W Bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/15/2007 1:24:33 AM | Slight exageration. From congressional budget negotiations the figure reported is that the Iraq war costs nine billion a month.
__________
No the cost...... a Trillon ++++++++++
Rebuild, replace stuff used. Care or lack of care for the Injured...............long term.
9 billion..........lol........ | |
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babs3
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Joined: 7/30/2006
Msg: 45 | |
| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/15/2007 2:36:45 AM | I totally agree with you irOn,
If you have a half way decent job...the banks will give you enough rope to hang yourself with! Keeping up with the Jones is what it is all about for most people....how many of those fancy cars on the road are a 2 yr lease?....Our parents wouldn't have dreamed of living in the debt we do today...and I don't think they would have gotten any bank to finance a lifestyle with little or no assets 30 years ago.
Living within your means is a term lost on most people these days....the future is too far away to worry about saving for reitrement! | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/15/2007 3:15:57 AM | Our parents wouldn't have dreamed of living in the debt we do today
__________________________
GB said we should go shopping to kick Al Quida ass.
We have.............So not shop???????
The economy is so screwed.........I remember forecloser when Neil Bush helped Colo.
I am proud to say Colo is leading the nation with Forecloser.
Dam the economy is great......Give Paris Hilton and the Waltons a tax cut......
Death Tax or lazy sleeze tax cut.
Lease???? | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/16/2007 10:47:03 AM |
Just about all of us are driving nice cars and living in expensive houses so whats all the fuss about our president not doing his part to keep the economy in tac.
Damn, you're retarded. Who is this "Just about all of us" you invoke here? Typical of the yuppie "mind." Everyone else is a servant so they are beneath notice, eh? Invisible as they should be.
Sure, there is a lot more wealth in the country, only fewer and fewer people have it. Not to mention that working people are being starved into crushing poverty because YOUR KIND is trying to resurect slavery through the back door we call the Mexican boarder.
People like you should be killed. Keep it up and one day you all will be. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/16/2007 6:46:24 PM |
Damn, you're retarded.
What an intelligent use of words for a debate.
Sure, there is a lot more wealth in the country, only fewer and fewer people have it.
Do you favor socialism over a free enterprise society?
People like you should be killed. Keep it up and one day you all will be.
This is what you determined after reading one sentence the OP wrote?
Starvartist, I think you're probably just p*ssed off because you see a lot of others doing better than you. Maybe those 'yuppies' went through several years of college to get where they are today. They may have been in debt up to their eyeballs when they graduated. Some may have come from very humble beginnings (like Oprah Winfrey and Ronald Reagan). Ever thought that maybe they worked their asses off to get where they are? There are complainers and there are doers. Guess which ones are the most successful? | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/17/2007 12:12:38 AM |
Do you favor socialism over a free enterprise society?
Or maybe a healthy free enterprise society isn't neccesarily at it's best when only 20% of the population has seen any gains in the last decade?
It's not just the never do wells that are suffering out there, the middle class has lost ground too. | |
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| If George W bush is doing so bad why is the economy doing so good?
Posted: 4/17/2007 4:27:24 AM | The problem .. as I see it .. is that the American Dream of owning home and having enough left over AFTER the mortgage is paid to someday "get ahead" .. is being lost ...
There are two sides to the housing boom ...
Yes .. more people than ever are owning a home .. (record numbers) .. but .. at what price?
Single income family wage earners have been left in the dust .. prices have been so high (coming down a bit now ..) that they couldn't take advantage of the boom .. because they couldn't income qualify for a $350K loan ...
And .. two income families have "stretched" their top line budgets to just get into a home .. and are now up to their eyeballs trying to meet that huge mortgage payment each month .. "cash poor" is a common complaint ..
Some have resorted to ARM's or 50 year mortgages (50 years?) .. or worse yet ..exotic hybrids that promise to get you into a home .. but are failing to protect you as inflation and interest rates begin to rise ...
Here in Miami .. there are 40,000 Foreclosures a month ... with that number predicted to rise at an alarming rate ..
Not everybody is hurting though .. a few ..are doing quite well .. and that is fueling the illusion that this economy is more that what it is ...
for example: luxury homes are are on the upswing ... and Wall Street is showing record profits .. the problem is that the portion of the market recording these gains is very small ... it's not trickling down to the middle class (what's left of them) and it's certainly not helping those nowhere near middle class status ...
So to those saying that the economy is doing well? I heartily disagree .. most of America is walking on eggshells .. one lost job or sickness away from disaster ...
IMO ... if this "good economy" takes a nose dive for any extended period of time .. Americans will be forced to reckon with this economy for the false illusion it really is ... | |
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