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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/27/2006 6:42:34 PM | | The car lot was using comedy, not terror to sell cars. People watching the ad weren't going to rush out and buy a car because they were terrorized into it. they would have been watching the telly, seen the ad, and it would have made an impression on them. Some might have thought it was funny, some might have thought it was in poor taste, whatever the viewer's reaction, I can guarantee you that it would have stuck in their minds. Thats what advertising is all about. It's not like the car lot was using terror as a scare tactic to compel people into buying cars. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/27/2006 11:10:52 PM | | well just screw every one who needs a good laugh, i have been wondering where the laugh police would come from ,never thought it would be montreal. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/28/2006 12:09:01 AM | Well if its offensive to readily offended people, then we shouldn't doo it. Its Important to be PC even if it means loss of a..a..a..freedom of repression, um.. expression..
The funny part of all of this is the Paranoia of exciting a "Religious" Faction to do Violence?
Crikey! Does Anyone see a Problem Here? offensive is catering to the maddness, and I'm Sick of petting the Sicko's. | |
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yna6
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Joined: 5/2/2004
Msg: 30 | |
| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/29/2006 10:40:57 AM | Great idea for a commercial...it gets people there, which is what it is all about. Excellent.
If Moslims are frigging worked up about it, maybe they have a bit more work to do on becoming "americanized". North Americans poke fun at anything and everything. Can't take it? Go away then. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/29/2006 11:31:43 AM | Again, spoken from a perspective of someone who isn't "under attack", while refusing to see the others can (quite justifiably) have that perception.
Going back to my hypothetical Muslim, if he picks up a paper and sees and article on the Pope (a major leader of the Christian religion) using some very noxious comments (and not clearly defining that he does not agree with them) about lslam, turns on the TV and sees President Bush (leader of the only superpower in the world) use the word Crusade, and sees a general suspicion directed against his religion in the name of security - can you blame him ?
He sees two Arab nations attacked and invaded, and in Iraq great injustices committed. Resources are plundered, money stolen, and Iraqis left out of the economic picture. He sees pictures of people naked, and being forced to do sexual things, from Abu Gahrib.
He sees the image of Mohammed used in cartoons. For many Muslims ( but not all) that's blasphemy of the highest order.
In passing, one can buy pictures of Mohamed in Iran, so one has to take into account the Wahabi/Sunni version of Islam.
Here's a link to some images from Persian history, that clearly show that Mohammed was portrayed in Persian art, with both his face shown, and not shown.
http://www.zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/islamic_mo_full/
Also, links to other examples from Turkey and Afghanistan.
http://www.retecool.com/mirrordir/Mohammed%20Image%20Archive.htm
In fact, there are some other interesting facts that show how extremist Muslims are using the fear many Muslims feel to increase their power over them. In that regard, those extremists are following the same pattern our extremists use.
Do you know some Muslims actually destroy copies of the Bible AND the Koran ?
As a matter of official policy, the government either incinerates or dumps bibles, crosses and other Christian paraphernalia.
Hundreds of Christian worshipers are arrested every year by Saudi police in raids on their private gatherings. Bibles, crosses and printed materials are confiscated and later burnt or dumped into trash. Bibles and other Christian paraphernalia found with travelers into the country are confiscated and destroyed.
Although considered as holy in Islam and mentioned in the Koran dozens of times, the Bible is banned in Saudi Arabia, and is confiscated and destroyed by government officials.
Recently, there has been a crackdown on symbols of Christianity in Saudi Arabia. On April 21st Saudi authorities raided a make-shift church in Riyadh and arrested 40 Christians. Many Christian religious symbols, such as crucifixes and bibles were later destroyed by Saudi security forces.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1410190/posts
When it comes to destruction of the Koran, there's no question who the world champion is--the government of Saudi Arabia.
The Saudi state religion is the primitive and austere Wahhabi version of Islam, which defines many traditional Islamic practices as idolatrous.
Notably, the state bans the importation of Korans published elsewhere. When foreign pilgrims arrive at the Saudi border by the millions for the annual journey to Mecca, what happens to the non-Saudi Korans they are carrying? The border guards confiscate them, to be shredded, pulped, or burned. Beautiful bindings and fine paper are viewed as a particular provocation--all are destroyed. (This on top of the spiritual vandalism the Saudis perpetrate, by inserting anti-Jewish and anti-Christian squibs into the Korans they publish in foreign languages, as Stephen Schwartz documented in our issue of September 27, 2004.)
This behavior isn't a recent innovation, by the way. Here's an account of how the Saudis carried on when they seized the city of Taif in 1802. It's taken from an unimpeachable Islamic source, the compilation Advice for the Muslim, edited by the Turkish scholar Hilmi Isik and published by Hakikat Kitabevi in Istanbul:
The Wahhabis tore up the copies of the Koran . . . and other Islamic books they took from libraries, mosques and houses, and threw them down on the ground. They made sandals from the gold-gilded leather covers of the Koran and other books and wore them on their filthy feet. There were verses of the Koran and other sacred writings on those leather covers. The pages of those valuable books thrown around were so numerous that there was no space to step in the streets of Taif. . . . The Wahhabi bandits, who were gathered from the deserts for looting and who did not know the Koran, tore up all the copies they found and stamped on them. Only three copies of the Koran were saved from the plunder of a major town, Taif.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/642eforh.asp
So we can easily see that the recent focus on the "desecration" of the Koran is a political tool , since the most hardline Islam country in the world ( indeed, the spiritual home of Islam) is destroying Korans regularly - and has a history of doing that in the past.
Stunningly, during that entire "Koran desecration" period of Islamic outrage - no one pointed this out, on their side, nor ours.
Against this type of backdrop, where both sides are playing a propoganda war, those in the middle becomes pawns in their game. Our own leaders use the situation to scare us, to increase their control over us - and so do theirs.
In regards to Mozart's opera, it was shown in the past without any problem. What makes things different today is the general climate that we are now in, and the increased sensitivity it has created.
With that in mind, things like this commercial are merely "another brick in the wall" that divides us. Any benefit is destroyed by it's contribution to a climate of fear and mistrust. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/30/2006 9:29:34 AM | ^^^^RFLMAO
As far as "Again, spoken from a perspective of someone who isn't "under attack", while refusing to see the others can (quite justifiably) have that perception."
Frickin spare me already. My real name is just plain wierd, and I hear jokes about it all the time. (Talk about something that is actually a PERSONAL attack.) My reaction, if you want to impress me come up with one I haven't already heard, not to get mad. I am also of an ethnic group that is constantly stereotyped, belittled and discriminated against, but I sure don't go pitching a fit about it or start protesting. It is getting to the point where the muslims are just getting to be a bunch of knee jerk snivelers who will complain about any little thing, and LOUDLY. Probably why so many are getting to be so UNsympathetic to their whining. And the double standards they keep using are just plain too pathetic. Not like they care who all they insult, routinely. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 9/30/2006 12:51:28 PM | Nice try, but it's all a lie.
OK...I cop a plea of nolo contendre to the " hate Bush" part.
I'm very pro-America, and pro-military. Read my history here, and you will see that expressed very clearly. I am just against neo-con extremism, and that has been my main focus of attack. I don't feel those values are in any way American, nor are they working.
If you can't attack the message, attack the messenger - neo-con rule # 1. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 8:15:39 AM | Sorry, but no matter how long winded your posts get about how muslims get so bent out of shape over some little thing like a cartoon or commercial, especially those in the US, just make them look even more stupid, irrational, and completely out of place being here. If they want to stick to such strict standards regarding Mohommad, let them stay in the countries that live that way, not here.
This remark
"If you can't attack the message, attack the messenger - neo-con rule # 1."
Makes you sound like you want to portray yourself as some kind of martyr just as much as they want to, when in neither case is it in any way applicable. I suppose if you were a non drinker, and went in to a bar, and were subjected to the smell of alcohol, you would have the right to start a bunch of protests and go murder someone over it? | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 8:20:58 AM | <<<<
he would but he would first refer to his "Handbook of Polically Correct Words and Actions".
It does seem PC to go around rioting in violence when you don't like something.... I need to find a cause... let off some steam... hmmmmm lol | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 8:34:19 AM |
I suppose if you were a non drinker, and went in to a bar, and were subjected to the smell of alcohol, you would have the right to start a bunch of protests and go murder someone over it?
I can avoid bars by choice, when I don't want to drink.
You can't avoid being portrayed as something you are not, by people that make presumptions, because they are unable to see how the last hundred years of oppression created a mentality in the general Muslim population (for some good reasons) of suspicion of our motives in the West. That's increased in the last five years due to the reactions of Western society, over the actions of a very small group of Islamic extremists. Some very powerful people have used language to scare us, as much as their extremists use fear to scare them. Both things are done for political reasons, by both sides.
Nor, it seems, can you avoid being portrayed as something you are not on internet forums, by others making presumptions. | |
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od1
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Joined: 8/20/2006
Msg: 38 | |
| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 9:09:13 AM | | A-man countryslim: The more we cower from the islam-o-fascists the more power we give them. This is America, and everyone's religion is open for ridicule, even islam and scientology. I say Jihad on all religion,Who cares. Stop takeing everything so seriously, and being so darned PC. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 3:37:24 PM | Again, that's your perception of me. That perception doesn't take into account other things, that you are not aware of. Because you don't know all the history, you draw an improper conclusion. That's applicable to the problem of perception I'm trying to address here with Muslims.
I've spoken positively about the USA many times, and I've bashed some Canadian politicians (particularly Harper) pretty well, in our election period up here. My "terrible posts" about the USA concern one element - your neo-con administration, it's actions, and it's effect on your country and the world. I'd probably bash Canada more, if we talked about it more. If we did that, most Americans couldn't participate in the discussion, because they are not exposed to the details.
A lot of the reasons American topics come up here so frequently, is due to your media and the fact that those events frequently have an effect on all of us ourside the USA.
I've written posts here about how deeply affected I was by people like JFK and RFK, written about some positive things American troops have done in Iraq, and written about how impressed I was about the USA when I lived in Duarte, Calif (suburb of LA) for a month in 1966. I've also written how I toured both coasts, and always felt welcome.
I've written about my affection for America many times here, and the reason for my current stance is based on that affection - and not any hatred or jealousy. If I hated the USA, I'd microwave some popcorn and enjoy the show.
I'm not doing that...
In fact, your perception of me is not unlike the perceptions some Muslims have of the West. You see various events, and react negatively because of a built in political viewpoint. That filtering of the real overall picture is the problem for both sides. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 4:20:43 PM |
If you can't attack the message, attack the messenger - neo-con rule # 1.
Seems that is the rule for plenty of posters who don't have a conservative position. It's starting to sound like neo-cons are going to have to change their tactics to rioting in the streets so that the liberals will respect their causes. We are so misunderstood, you know. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 4:33:31 PM | Personally, I think rioting over cartoons and a vague quote from a doddering old Pope, is a bit too much. (But that's just my humble opinion)
But.... I shudder to think of the reaction when certain muslim fanatics find out that our national chain of Denny's restaurants serve....
Apple Pie "Allah" Mode.
Then it will be one huge Dirka Dirka Mohammad Jihad.... off with Denny's head!
Toon | |
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xamo
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Joined: 3/24/2006
Msg: 42 | |
| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/1/2006 5:07:30 PM | | I think tis is the first wave of Borat advertising, a revolutionary new relatinship between global politics and the consumer.....or maybe not...andy Warhol doing chairman Mao ? | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 6:48:34 AM | Montreal
“by people that make presumptions, because they are unable to see how the last hundred years of oppression created a mentality in the general Muslim population (for some good reasons) of suspicion of our motives in the West.”
Just as we have seen the horrid things they do, for just as long, and have some very suspicious feelings toward them, for some VERY good reasons. Their history isn’t all that rosy and peaceful now is it? For all your flowery words and attempts to be so PC, all I see are double standards.
“You see various events, and react negatively because of a built in political viewpoint.”
Nope, I react negatively because of the acts themselves. I also don’t just go by what is shown in the news. I also go by personal experience. I realize you would like to believe that everyone is brainwashed by the press, but it just isn’t true | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 3:25:13 PM |
I realize you would like to believe that everyone is brainwashed by the press, but it just isn’t true
Well, we disagree then. Perhaps not everyone, but large numbers are. If you control the media, and you control the language, you control the debate - and a large percentage of the population.
Want to try a little test ?
"Cut and run" - That's a Democrat , right ?
Heinz fortune - You mean Kerry , right ( even though the guys he ran against were millionaires)
See what I mean ? | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 7:18:04 PM | brat777: What ethnic group are you talking about?
lady us: I'm lead to believe that, in your view, one must be a conservative in order to be sincere...yes?
Maybe they should try an ad with guys on horseback, in full metal armor, wielding broadswords, with a large, red crucifix on their chests...trotting around screaming "Crusade!!!...Crusade!!!"
I'd bet Pat Robertson and Jerry Fallwell would be the first in line! | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 7:28:04 PM | Paul,
Your entire political spectrum isn't even left, much less your media. If your most "liberal" Democrat came to Canada ( and didn't change his policies) he'd be a Conservative here.
If our Prime Minister (who many consider a Canadian neo-con) kept his same policies and went down there and ran for office he'd be a democrat. 
Any of your politicans, taken outside your borders, would be conservatives in most countries in the rest of the world.
When I sit here and read the comments of some of the most right wing posters here directed at liberals, I just wind up doing this ----->
The USA is without a doubt the most right wing country in the group of industrialized nations of the West. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 7:35:23 PM | Compare US politicians versus Western industrialized nation leaders in modern times, perhaps after the post war period - and you'll find the US has always been far more to the right - even it's liberals.
Why do you think you never had any chance at national health care, or gun control ? Those are both things that almost every other Western industrialized nation has had for years. They are two things, because of various factors, that even your liberal politicians cannot fully address in the same way done anywhere else. | |
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| Jihad’ car commercial upsets U.S. Muslims
Posted: 10/2/2006 7:46:14 PM | One doesn't have to be extreme in order to be dangerous. The danger is in believing your side is correct all of the time, and the other side is always wrong.
From your profile:
About Me: Only sincere need apply. WHERE ARE ALL THE CONSERVATIVES ON THIS SITE? Liberals stick to your own kind. | |
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