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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 6:46:06 AM |
fixitfred wrote: I don't know where you live but
unless you moved into the Unabomber's old place
Money can buy you power.
ItsMargo wrote: I was speaking within the context of
a relationship, Fred. Previous posters made the point
that the one with less income is in a one-down position
and has less power within a relationship. Given how
materialistic many people are these days, it certainly
can be that way...
Wealth confers status but it's not the only factor.
Some poor people have high social status, and some rich
people have low status, but in any case I think a wife is happiest
when her husband's social status is higher than hers. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 8:23:05 AM | It is so funny how this thread has gone to so many different areas regarding the word "OBEY"....from the financial status, to a major religious rhetorical, to dominance, to social status...the OP basically said he thought the words were like marrying to a dog.........."obey" 1 : to follow the commands or guidance of
2 : to conform to or comply with <obey an order> <falling objects obey the laws of physics> ............in our times guidance is needed in both the man and woman of a relationship..we are not in the happy homemaker, barefoot and pregnant world anymore.........what would happen if the man (that was actually THE MAN) of the house suddenly was in an accident and crippled, the woman would have to make all the decisions basically regarding medical, financial and emotional needs...that word obey would be thrown out the window or turned around to fit her needs and where would that put the man who has always expected the woman to obey!!!.....would not be a good scenario as I see it............so for me again I believe the word obey should be left out of the so called religious format of marriage. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 12:07:36 PM |
I only obey when having sex. Sometimes. :)
LMAO  I LOVE IT!!! Thank you for making my day even brighter!! 
Namasté | |
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sled08
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Joined: 4/20/2008
Msg: 329 | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 7:35:51 PM | ^^^^ Someone is going to be the one in control
because when he decides to press the point,
the less powerful one must obey or hit the road.
It's unavoidable. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 8:29:53 PM | | ^ Outside of BDSM, do you really think control is that significant of a factor in relationships? | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/5/2008 9:14:45 PM | "^^^^ Someone is going to be the one in control
because when he decides to press the point,
the less powerful one must obey or hit the road.
It's unavoidable."
OMG - Listen gals - WE MUST OBEY!!!! WE HAVE NO OPTIONS lol
A girl should make sure she can hit the road anytime. An exit strategy is important. If foolish enough to marry a control freak there is always divorce - like over 70% are filed by women I hear. I wonder why.
Nowadays, she hit the road in HER car back to HER house rolling her eyes all the way muttering "next" under her breath.
Although that's not likely to happen once she's wise because she'd see the domineering control freak coming a mile off and never got near his bedroom in the first place. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 6:17:02 AM | | Yes I agree with you Tiny, and that person that keeps saying we must obey will be the one that ends up telling the voices in his head "shut up and obey me".....cause thats the only friends he will have....my ex thought he was God, oops he still does and now has 2 friends, umm one is a pacifist and says ok Dave and the other laughs and walks away..oh and my ex has not had a gf in several years, gee wonder why. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 9:26:17 AM | i thought it was love honor and respect lmao if the vicor said to me love honor and obey all ya would see is dust lmao
"sit"
"stand"
"feck off" lmao obey is such a demanding word lmao
good luck "here shep sssiiiit good boy" lol | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 9:31:14 AM | It is interesting that they still use this wording in this day and age.
Saying it to the woman AS WELL AS the man isn't realistic in today's world.
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 2:12:39 PM | | Oops ^^^^^^ scratch that and reverse it ( in other words, most men have to obey the woman nowadays = hahahahaha ). | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 3:22:28 PM | In respnse to tinydancer123, I could not agree with you more! The bible, and religious-fundamentalism in general, has contributed to the mistreatment, and even down-right oppression of women throughout the history of the world. The witch-hunt that had spread across mideval Europe is a very good example of this systemic abuse of women in the name of religion. I believe that it is derived from the concept of "original sin," and the blaming of women as the down-fall of humanity. I continue to hear this narrative be played out even today, as people continue to blame women for everything that goes wrong with society. This distorted belief, I think is what forms the basis for many of the denigration, and even abuse, that occurs throughout the world. I see this played out alot in Islamic fundamentalist countries, where women cannot drive,vote,or travel without their father's/husband's/brother's/son's permission. Nor can they even seek medical attention without consent.
I do not think that there is not much of a difference between islamic-fundamentalism and christian-fundamentalism. If there were no wall of separation between church and state, the U.S. would be another theocracy. In religious theocracies, the freedom and rights of women are curtailed. In western-democracies, women have equal status. They flourish, or atleast have the opportunity to do so. In a thecracy, their opportunities are limited, and their fates are in the hands of their masters.
In a modern, western democracy, everyone is considered equal in the eyes of the law. Everyone has the right to choose their own destiny in life, including women. Societies do not benefit or thrive when half the human-race does not participate. It is like a car operating on only half it's cyllinders. It will never reach it's potential. | |
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TLC_
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Joined: 1/26/2008
Msg: 338 | |
| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 10:46:48 PM | | well, if some people dont want to use the traditional vows they dont have to, they can use diferent ones. | |
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D_lily
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Joined: 11/25/2007
Msg: 339 | |
| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/6/2008 10:53:27 PM | Love, Honor and obey, your marriage and marriage vows. That is why marriage gets such a bad rap. People want respect , just not respect for the vows they have taken. Go figure.
Respect? Pride falleth before the fall. Respect that. | |
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TLC_
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Joined: 1/26/2008
Msg: 340 | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/8/2008 7:14:59 PM |
tinydancer123 wrote: OMG - Listen gals - WE MUST OBEY!!!!
WE HAVE NO OPTIONS lol
If you want a man who will let you lead him around
and tell him what to do, you have plenty of options. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/8/2008 9:04:40 PM | | David, just because we dont want the word OBEY hangin around doesnt mean we want a wuss for a SO either...it still goes that if both people respect each other there is no reason to have the word OBEY around. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/8/2008 9:21:45 PM | | All should remember one thing about vow's no matter what they be. In a church infront of a minster before God. No matter what the words are when manor woman breaks them. They not only broke a vow to the one they married they broke that vow to God himself. And they may not care if they have forgivness from the one they wed. They had better ask it of the one that matter's because you didn't say at the time to God unless this happen's or this or this etc. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/8/2008 11:16:00 PM | David Lewis wrote" If you want a man who will let you lead him around and tell him what to do, you have plenty of options."
Actually, why do those two options have to be the ONLY OPTIONS available? I am most certain that nobody, male or female, desires to be led around and told what to do. And if anyone who is objective would agree that. Lets face it, those men who are proponents of the "submiisive wife," would not be so strongly in favor of it if the roles were reversed.
Most people desire relationships that are based on equality, even though not everyone knows exactly how to acheive that. This is due to the fact that it does require alot more work than relationships that follow the dominance/submission model; but I believe that the benefits are far greater, since you will have a relationship between two ADULTS. Not between father and daughter, or mother and son. But between two mature adults who respect eachother and always reach a conscensus when making decisions.
Perhaps humans need alot more evolving before true equality is acheived and held as the standard model for all marriages. It appears to me that even the Bonobos apes are more enlightened socially than most people are. They are the only primates that have acheived equality among its members, and by far they are the most peaceful, most inteeigent of all the apes.
Obviously, | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/9/2008 12:13:58 AM | Ahhh yes, the traditional, but centuries old marriage vows taken between a man and a woman who were united in marriage.
TO LOVE....to listen and to understand each other with patience and virtue.
TO HONOR.....a man was to honor his wife for bearing his children, cooking, cleaning, for being a good mother and wife and any other skills that she could offer in the marriage.
TO HONOR....a woman was to honor her husband for being a good provider and father and any other skills that he could offer in the marriage.
TO OBEY......before the days of global communication, telephone, television...the man typically was better informed in political issues, possible outbreaks of war, criminal activities, and things that could bring disaster or devastation and could affect his wife and children. It was imperative in those days that a wife obeyed her husband for her own safety and the safety of their children. Women rarely ventured outside their homes, villages or towns and were not well versed in matters of politics or possible dangers.
TO LEAD OR TO BE LEADER.........two completely different things. A man was expected to take the lead in the matters of finances, financial planning for his future, her future and the futures of their children..............he typically consulted with his wife to obtain a harmonious decision. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/10/2008 9:21:52 AM |
tinydancer123 wrote: Nowadays, she hit the road in HER
car back to HER house rolling her eyes all the way muttering
"next" under her breath.
Although that's not likely to happen once she's wise because
she'd see the domineering control freak coming a mile off and
never got near his bedroom in the first place.
I was a little bit attracted to you before you said that.
Way to go, smarty pants. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/13/2008 8:00:38 PM |
likethewind wrote: I am most certain that nobody,
male or female, desires to be led around and told what to do.
Whether men desire it or not, many men let women take charge
or have the final say, so if that's what you want, you shouldn't
have trouble finding it. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:42:34 PM |
Whether men desire it or not, many men let women take charge
or have the final say, so if that's what you want, you shouldn't
have trouble finding it.
imo, the men aren't speaking up because they know that no matter what they say, or how they say it...the perception by most women, is that they are trying to control them...and the enusing argument begins.
...and as a result, you're correct. There are plenty of guys out there willing to be led by a leash. | |
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| To love, honor, and... OBEY?!?
Posted: 5/14/2008 9:56:51 AM | The old marriage vows of centuries ago are not completely applicable to the current way that men and women live together in a marriage or c/l relationship. Both, can bring/offer many skills to a relationship to ensure a successful, happy life for both concerned. In order for someone to take the lead, they need to be knowledgable in that particular area and/or willing to learn/gain more knowledge in order to gain the other persons trust. If someone is a poor money manager......their skills would be inadequate to lead another, which is why we end up consulting with a financial advisor.
Other skills might be:
-good knowledge of nutrition/cooking skills & meal planning
-child care & child development skills
-vehicle, home, yard maintenance
-politics & investments
-skills used in the workforce
-organizational skills, bargain shopping
-family gatherings & events planner | |
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