| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/20/2006 7:29:54 PM | I think I wear a flashing neon sign over my head...plus I just know how to pick 'em..
 | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 8:06:07 AM |
If a man had no choice or responsibility for the end of a relationship, you would not consider dating him?
MacK, I'm sorry if any man has not found closure. It is my understanding that it takes 2 to make a marriage and both contribute in some way, (by what they have done/said or what they have failed to do/say)to the downfall. In order for ppl to move on, learn from the past and not bring 'baggage' into their next relationship, they must understand how they contributed to the downfall of the last one. If you do not take ownership, still don't have a clue then perhaps that person needs to ask someone who is a close friend and willing to tell him the truth.
I was originally going to put 'what would your ex say was the reason for your seperation?', but decided against it.
I thank you for your honesty, because I really do think that a lot of men have no idea even though the ex probably felt that it was obvious, had made it clear in numerous ways that something was wrong and because there was no response, hit the road.
Men, pls don't start flaming me, there are relationships that due to some kind of disorder that develops after the marriage then a man has no part in taking responsibility other than to seek help for the partner and themselves. Some disorders can be disguised really well and ignored when you are in the 'honeymoon phase', others may develop after the birth of children. < no problem dating someone who has been in this unfortunate situation.
 | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 9:48:32 AM | Hemmmm... still a lot of saints out here
I failed him by being blind to what he was, content being, to what I thought he could be..I think a part of him thought so too..But... yeah there is the "but." The     was to much, and had been a part of his life for so long he just didn't want to let it go... I think he gave it a good try tho..Takes a while to see where you may have gone wrong, so focused on feeling hurt and betrayed, and blah, blah, blah..but none are ever without any contribution...sometimes ya may have to go all the way back to your first few dates to see it... | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 10:40:34 AM | | ehemmm....yup, it seems like there are a lot of St. Charlie tuna's out there. Could it be that men most times really don't get it? Do all you male fishies really think that it was the other's fault? Come on, I double dawg dared ya, if you can, just admit to one thing that was a topic of discussion that kept appearing as an argument...what would it be? Have you changed in that respect or do you think it was just her opinion? | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 12:54:17 PM |
MacK, I'm sorry if any man has not found closure.
So, how would you know if some man has not found closure? You know nothing about me or a lot of men here and you have no reason to think I haven't found closure.
It is my understanding that it takes 2 to make a marriage and both contribute in some way, (by what they have done/said or what they have failed to do/say)to the downfall..
For better or worse
For richer or poorer
For sickness and in health
It takes 2 to make this commitment, only 1 to break it! If my part was to get sick, poorer and things got worse because of it, how does this make me a contributor the the failure of that relationship?
In order for ppl to move on, learn from the past and not bring 'baggage' into their next relationship, they must understand how they contributed to the downfall of the last one..
OK, I will never get sick again!
Really, no baggage? Why do you ask a person to explain their baggage before entering a relationship with no baggage?
If you do not take ownership, still don't have a clue then perhaps that person needs to ask someone who is a close friend and willing to tell him the truth..
Pshcho-babble is a real neat way to inject illusion into the equation and 'find' some blame to take ownership of and truth is not necessarily what comes from friends. Your friends will support your illusions though.
I was originally going to put 'what would your ex say was the reason for your seperation?', but decided against it..
It's what you intended to find out. My x would say I was fat, lazy and wouldn't get a job.
I thank you for your honesty, because I really do think that a lot of men have no idea even though the ex probably felt that it was obvious, had made it clear in numerous ways that something was wrong and because there was no response, hit the road. .
Do you do surveys??
My responses slowed down over the years, along with the functioning of my thyroid, until I was barely capable of delivering responses.
Anybody that understands low thyroid can tell you what a TSH level of 186 means!
Baggage, no. she took that too! I had no desire to keep it. Why would I want someone that cared so little? | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 12:57:55 PM | My last LTR ended in a very common way, but rarely spoken of. We both took it apart piece by piece, little by little. No arguing. No infidelity. Nothing really wrong. We just didn't belong together and after a year, we both knew it and still said nothing. We both genuinely loved each other but we did not inhabit the same planet.
Whenever we got even a slight opportunity to back up, we took it. I was not hurt. She was not hurt. Whenever one wanted to make more distance, the other agreed that it would be a good idea. The thing that finally put it away for us both was that her Dad got sick. He really was sick too. She felt she needed to go home and take care of him. I said that she should, by all means go to him. We never discussed when she would return.
We kept in close touch in the beginning. Then as time went by, it sort of tapered off. Soon I didn't expect her back. She told me on the phone that she would try to get a job to help her parents with the bills. I said, "You are the one on the spot. Whatever you think it takes is the right thing." I knew that that was the end. But I didn't feel rejected, I guess I knew all along it would turn out that way.
A year later, I rented a U-Haul and delivered all of the stuff she left with me to her and her new boyfriend. We hugged and kissed when we saw each other. Her boyfriend took that badly, I heard later. We are still in contact. We have even taken three vacations together. I have spent the night at her parent's house several times when traveling. I am still tight with them too. There is still love there. Still, we know where we are and where we have been. Things really are right the way they worked out. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 1:29:35 PM | OP. Most of the posts on here except for Magics in a roundabout way put the blame on the other person. I don't think it is a man or woman thing. I don't think you will find anyone out there taking full responsibility for a breakup. Even if the spouse was cheating, they would somehow blame the SO for their actions, that is just human nature. I see some, myself included saying they take blame for staying too long, etc. That is really not taking responsibility for the downfall, now is it?
 | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 3:21:50 PM | | Msg 28 - while I agree it takes two, sometimes there's absolutely nothing the other person could have done, or not done, to make the relationship work. I've had relationships where I know we were both at fault, mostly my side was putting up with things I shouldn't have and not saying what I should have, so yes, I take responsibility for that, as no one can do to you what you don't let them. But in my last relationship there wasn't a thing I did or or failed to do that would have made a difference...he assumed I was too old to have children, and nothing I was willing to do to have children made a difference...only afterwards did I find out that he has a habit of leaving due to a fear of committment. Now, how is that anyone's issue but his? I'm sure other men and women have gone through something similar, just as I'm sure other men and women have also contributed to their breakups, whether knowingly or unknowingly...and perhaps some aren't answering because of this, or because they still don't realize they may have contributed to the breakup. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 3:34:40 PM | I remember the words my last partner used before she broke it off...."it takes two to make a relationship work, but it only takes ONE to end it!" ...then she walked away.
The most common story we hear is "marriage breakdown". My downfall is that I am too independant and don't talk/communicate much. I hope that has changed. It depends on who I am with. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 3:40:00 PM | AgedWonder, I always like reading your posts. I think staying too long really does add to the pile. I put myself in the situation for so long that even the sound of his voice made my stomach uneasy and I was avoiding him towards the end. Had I been more assertive about how I felt, he might have taken me seriously.. maybe something could have been salvaged and maybe not. He was stunned when I left, thinking I must have found someone else. He couldn't believe or accept the fact that 'we had problems'.
I don't expect anyone to take full responsibility for the downfall, that isn't fair. I just know that I wasn't marriage material when I made the move and therefore I take responsibility for not choosing wisely and not knowing him well enough and not knowing myself at all and therefore had no idea how to handle the 'bumps' along the way. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 5:57:16 PM | lovin, I believe that happens a lot especially if you married young, and then you just go along and don't really think about it until after the fact. Everyone gets married for different reasons, some not being the right ones. Hopefully, now that we are older, our choices will be different.
My ex-husband cheated on me, and I was in denial, does that make me wrong. I think not and it certainly doesn't excuse his actions. My thoughts at the time, I must have done something wrong to make him stray, so I lived with it. It is strange how we can talk ourselves into taking the blame for others actions. I was and am an independent woman and knew I could make it on my own, but I had a hard time letting go. I think like so many my age, I married with the intention that it was to last "til death do us part". In 1997 that almost happened as I almost died, and he wasn't there for me. It was at that time I decided to make the break, and it was the best thing I have done.
Do I regret all those empty years in the marriage? No, I have no regrets as our 2 sons had both parents growing up and a stable home. Our personal life was hidden from friends as they all thought we had the perfect marriage. At times I wish I had left sooner, but you can't go back, and life goes on!
 | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/21/2006 9:40:01 PM | "I will never get sick again"
Tell that to the spouses of the terminal ill.
Sorry but the rants of those who feel so sorry for themselves gets to be a bit much.
Disclaimer: It is only normal to take time to figure out downfall.
Years of it, shows true character, and issues. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/22/2006 7:35:36 AM | Thank you for all your responses and especially a man that is willing to fess up to the part he played in the downfall. I think it is human nature for all of us to play the 'victim' role when it comes to this question. It is admirable to find someone who admits that he/she has some character flaws that need some work and personally I would find that more attractive and a sign that this person would be an honest and real person with whom to begin a relationship.
MSG 31: Your post speaks volumes < having said that I will leave it as it appears.
If someone cheated on you, in most cases that would be a deal breaker, and has nothing to do with you and says a lot about the other. It is never OK to go outside the marriage to fix a problem in the relationship or just for personal gratification.(JMHO)
To all those who gave until the 'well' ran dry, I hear you. Once that course of behavior has been adopted, the expectation and hope that at some point the other will 'give' in return is ever present. I think the 'disease to please' runs rampant in the beginning until the time comes when your need becomes greater and there isn't anyone there to respond. Although some may not see that as taking responsibility, I do.
I now have a new appreciation for all those who have been in relationships that have failed and have had the courage to respond. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/22/2006 8:50:55 AM | Log out whispersmom and log back in under your own name.. When the page comes up with the daughters name, highlight her name then hit the back space, type in your own, and your password.
Back to the subject. My husband died, but we could have ended our marriage for a variety of reasons. We just weren't on the same page with our children, or with our finances, he liked to shop too much, and had to have a new car all the time. I stressed over things I had no control over. I could be very strident at times, ****y, bull headed. After he died I learned what was important and what wasn't. Other than those small things he was a great guy. I've changed too from dealing with things alone. I can't imagine going thru what some of you have. Right now I'm trying to get back into the dating thing. I had breakfast this morning with a nice guy, did we click? NOPE, no fireworks, he's a nice man just didn't feel anything. Don't think he did either but we will probably be friends and that's ok.
I talked to a man from farmers.com for months, everything was his ex wifes fault when I finally asked what happened to his marriage.. His attitude about women seemed to be that we were a necessary evil.. I agree that there are rare occasions where some people are totally innocent.. But usually there's two people there equally at fault. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/22/2006 8:05:33 PM |
"I will never get sick again"
Tell that to the spouses of the terminal ill.
Sorry but the rants of those who feel so sorry for themselves gets to be a bit much.
I was facetious making that statement and meant to show it from the point of view of someone having no control of the circumstances they find themselves in. My x chose to disbelieve my claims of illness and took it as an excuse to leave. You made an honorable choice to stay.
I may have been ranting but not out of sorrow for myself, but, for those that reject first and ask questions later and assume they know what 'we' are like.
I have respect and appreciation for those that can make vows and follow them.
How one behaved in a prior relationship to be part of the 'cause' of it's demise is not a valid premiss to base the opinion that both parties are guilty or partially guilty of causing the demise. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/22/2006 8:11:05 PM | all work and no play to start with both of us money money money
insecureties on my part was putting presure on the relation
i felt like i was just a part of the furniture it takes 2 to make it work
when hafe the time there is only one there how can it work
you start thinking back and you find out you where not that happy anyways
i did take it hard but then you stand back and look wow i play a big part in this mess
you can blame the other thats esy to do i here it alot so ya i am changin my ways no more working 24 -7 spending more time at home no more powting sulking its a good thin but no one aroud to see the changes i am syaing no more often some dont like it and wonder hoo i am
i was also that yes guy you now to keep the peace i spent most of my childrens life with them
taking kare of then its hard to cut the string but i am trying but they seem to understand more than i do they are seing me change they dont seem to minde
i guess i took it fo gradit that wee would be together for ever boy was i rong
today we are verry good friends and i am at peace with that
so ya look at your self in the mirrow i meen a good look you mite find out your the problem also
well these are my thoughts
POLY forgive the spelling | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/22/2006 8:26:28 PM | Who cares what led to the downfall?
Pick yourself up...dust yourself off and start living as if today is the last. GEEZ!
You can't do anything about yesterday.....and since today is almost over....what next? More rehashing of the past? Or, living for the promise of a future?
Muskoka
 | |
|
| |
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/23/2006 8:30:42 AM | How one behaved in a prior relationship to be part of the 'cause' of it's demise is not a valid premiss to base the opinion that both parties are guilty or partially guilty of causing the demise.
mmm...I guess some people have 'no fault marriage insurance'. That's like saying two ppl hit head on in a car accident, but the police officer just decided to throw up his hands and walk away.(JMHO) Something must have happened that changed the direction of the committed relationship, why else would it end? Just because a person can't see the change/cause, doesn't mean that it wasn't there.< having said that, I acknowledge that there are always situations in which life's circumstances totally alter a situation. To anyone who thinks that I have made 'blanket statements' that don't take into consideration their individual circumstances, it is and was not my intention to offend. I was just merely posing a question for debate based on the premiss that we are here discussing realtionships and there seems to be a lot of 'victims' out there.
I'm not perfect, I have things I have to work on to make myself a better person. I think it is safe to assume that everyone does. Two ppl living together will eventually come across issues that they both do not agree upon, which is normal. How they approach these issues and how they are resolved or left unresolved can have a big impact on the rest of their days together.
Part of life is about taking ownership for what you say and do.
Seriously though, I think that if we don't learn from our past, we will continue to make the same mistakes and life has a way of bringing up the same situations in different ways, until we finally 'get it'. (JMHO)
If you were in a situation that you feel you had no part in the eventual decline, or end then so be it. Obviously situations differ as the people that are in them. This was just a topic that I thought would be 'different' from the 'somebody done me wrong songs' that I have seen numerously posted. If the past is better left unaddressed and you are happy with the choices you are making and the life you are living now...geez...go for it!
Disclaimer: the thoughts expressed are my own, I don't pretend to know you or your situation. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/23/2006 9:55:51 AM | I lied to myself ,,,repeatedly
how else does one make it all their fault
and if it's all my fault ,I still have some control
happy to have found an end to that tunnel | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/23/2006 1:28:03 PM | The ex abused me for 31 years. The thing I feared the most (being alone), I finally did (divorce).....I don't blame myself (when you blame me, you shame me, and keep me silent)........because the abuser CHOSE to abuse....trying not to get on my soap box (I counsel abused people).
What gave me a clue as to what was happening? (Most verbally abused people don't even know what is happening to them), as it is literally brainwashing.
I found the book which saved my life: The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans
I then went on a mission to read and go to counseling, etc., and started preparing to get a divorce.
Hugs, Rossal
In other words, we can't know....what we don't know....and I didn't know! LOL | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/23/2006 1:50:45 PM | I didn't realize that part of the deal was all the old boyfriends coming along also.
Soon I invited her to visit her mother~~PERMANENTLY. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/23/2006 3:59:35 PM |
Something must have happened that changed the direction of the committed relationship, why else would it end?
I think you hit the nail on the head with this one. I think a lot of marriages/relationships fail because one or both of the parties have not committed to the relationship. I was committed and stayed too long because of it, whereas my ex (looking back now) was never committed.
 | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/31/2006 6:58:26 AM | | Am I completely alone on this because I don't think I was betrayed or short changed? There have to be some people who have no regrets and look back fondly. | |
|
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 10/31/2006 2:30:36 PM | Downfalls can come from failure to take responsibility, failure to grow up, failure to learn not to feel sorry for yourself, failure to heal from past experience, failure to relative that others don't owe you anything - especially your own happiness. The list is long, and can cause one downfall after another in a life time of relationships.
The best revenge is to deal with problems, be self honest, learn, and change yourself.
It feels so good once it is done. | |
|
Home
login 
