| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/23/2009 10:51:08 PM | First of all, I was having medical problems, from a spinal cord injury, when we met. The last GF had dumped me several years earlier when the problems first started and I was VERY wary of going into another relationship. However, she promised that she would never leave me and I was stupid enough, or lonely enough, to believe her. Two years after we got together my condition took a major downturn. I spent nearly 3 years confined to bed in severe pain. (The pain never got below an 8 on a scale of 1 to 10) By the end of the first year I was so doped up that you'd have thought I was drunk 24/7. Would fall asleep while eating, sitting on the toilet, talking on the phone, etc. The pain kept getting worse. and somewhere in the 2nd year my body started shutting down. When I started begging the Doctors to put me down, one of them asked to try an experimental surgery. It worked and we were able to start getting the pain under control. Thats at the end of 2005. In 2006 I had a mild stroke caused by one of the medications I was on. I still lost some feeling down the left side, a lot of memory, and some short term memory problems). In 2006 there was an outbreak of Mumps here and, of course, I got it. In 2007 I found out that the mumps had destroyed the testosterone factory. IE, not only was there no sex drive but I wasn't even capable.....not to mention all the other symptoms that go with it. January of 2008 you've finally gotten to where you can take care of yourself again. The next month you notice some things that are odd and listen in on a phone call you were never meant to hear. The main reasons given for wanting to break up is your lack of emotianal availablity and Sex.
Note: 3 months after you move out the testosterone replacement therapy kicks in.....with a vengance. (Puberty was easier)
From her side.....what little I can get anyway. First there's watching someone you love get sicker and sicker until you are afraid to come home from work every day because you expect to find them dead. How he can stand that kind of pain, day after day, and keep from committing suidice is a mystery to everyone including his Doctors. Then there were countless trips to the ER plus the stress of having to deal with and argue with bad Doctors. ** (I have a number of very dim memories of waking up in the hospital and seeing her sitting beside the bed crying or hugging one of the nurses while crying)**. After 6 months of his being confined to bed you began to feel like he was something that you have inherited and had to take care of. Before the surgery, there was one week that he was in really bad shape and the Doctors told me to expect him to pass away. Then there is the surgery and things SLOWLY improve over the next 2 years. I've gotten to the point that I'm terrified of the ER but there are still occasional trips there. The stroke being one of them. As things improve you start to have a sex life again. Then he loses interest. Turns you down multiple times. After 6 months he wants to have sex but can't perform. You try another day and while he can perform his "O" is dry. He says he had an "O" and perhaps all the other signs were there but did he????? That happens a few more times. You start avoiding him at home. He comes out to the living room to see you periodically but he can only stay 10 or 15 minutes before he has to get back in bed. You go with him to his Doctor to discuss the sexual problems. This is when you find out what the mumps did to him and there's no garuntee that it can be fixed. You wait a year and half and there's no improvement. His medical condition improves to the point that he can take care of himself again. You've wanted out for a long time and now and decide to have an affair. He figures it out almost immediately.
What angers me is that the events were completely out of my control. There's nothing I can point to and say "If I had only done this differently"......"This is where I messed up"....."I shouldn't have done that". Although I have issues with the method and timing, I can't fault her for wanting out. She did take care of me when I couldn't take care of myself and in return I put her through an emotional wringer. There are a lot of details I left out because I only remember fragments or there's a paper trail from Doctors/hospitals and she will not discuss them. It took a long time to get what details I did get.
Doyle | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 6:20:39 AM | What led to the downfall? In my marriage and subsequent relationships? "Feminism".
It was a demand for entitlement to "Equality" (of "rights") without consideration of equality of obligations. The political ideal of sustainable, objectively verifiable equality of rights and obligations is an impossible dream, predestined to failure, that has resulted in a sustainably high divorce rate and a steady revenue stream for divorce lawyers.
No Fault Downfall!!  | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 6:53:21 AM | After being, I thought, happily married for 18 years, I found out he was having an affair. It threw me into a depression where suicide was often considered. I couldn't get out of bed for months and lost 20+ lbs. There were red flags for about 6 months prior but I thought it was just another rough patch that all married people go through and get past. Looking back on it, I think I gave up on my identity shortly after marrying and isn't your identity what they're attracted to in the first place. Plenty of friends, social, intelligent, well traveled, professional and great with family. Somehow...I became "his wife" and thought that was good enough. By the end of the marriage, I had zero friends, became homebound, dreaded social business gatherings, hadn't worked in 10 years and didn't speak to my family. Once he left, I was a shell of who I used to be. Moral of the story....take care of YOURSELF first. Go get your hair styled, go to the spa, work out, go to school, better yourself. The better YOU are the more you can contribute to the relationship.
BTW.... I still don't excuse him for braking our vows. Just wish he'd done it BEFORE I was too old to have children.  Creep. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 6:59:26 AM | I never thought of putting it in that perspective before, that of what am I to blame for? It's not a bad idea, learning wise, to try to analyze it. hmmm...
With the last guy, we were on again/off again for about a year. I can honestly say I was to blame for that relationship not working out. I just never felt about him as he did about me. I tried to fake it for a long time, thinking it was better to be with someone dispite that fact, than to be single. When he started talking about moving in, and marriage I couldn't bare the thought of once again staying with someone for all the wrong reasons as I did for 19 years in my first LTR. I ended it and as it turns out I'm much happier now single.
The second LTR I had I truly loved him, but his excessive drinking and abusive nature when drunk was too much. It was hard to end that one, but it had to be done. I can't find fault with myself in that relationship.
My first LTR of 19 years? I did my fair share of argument starting, and I think I was just to young when we first got together (I was 18 he was 20) to know what I wanted. I was attracted to him for a time, but after a few years I wasn't. His controlling nature, and then having kids, kept me from leaving. I didn't want my kids coming from a broken home. I know know that staying for the kids is probably the worst thing you can do if the relationship is a mess. I blame myself for not being strong enough or wise enough to move on when I should have. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 8:02:58 AM | | You are missing one that applies to me and, as I already know, some others: I tried to make it work with someone I wanted to be in love with but truly was not. I know 1 became a problem as time passed (I gave up trying to communicate, I admit it). 2 and 3 also. I'm not sure any of those mattered in the long run, however. I don't think I'd have given up if I had been attracted to him; different priorities maybe would have been ok, and I would have wanted what I had. . . | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 8:47:17 AM | My part in my first marriage was my father died and I was to numb to even know what was going on. He took advantage of the situation, even stated to others he knew he had con me. My part was that I realized I never loved him and while I tried to manufacture the love he wasnt someone I could love, so then I tried to just "stay" in the marriage ...after ten years I just couldnt do it anymore. He was a drunk, liar and completely irresponsible in all aspects of his life, including having 9 different jobs in the ten years we were married. Rather than spend time with him being drunk and unkempt, didnt shower, brush his teeth, I worked longer and harder to make the money to support our family which he would then spend on himself. By trying to support his bad habits I ended up missing out on some of the foundations of my kids and so in some ways Im still paying for it. He got us into over 60k of credit card debt before I found out what he had done. He had 9 different jobs in 10 years of marriage. My mistake was reading the book that said if you know your marriage isnt going to work stay until your kids are atleast 8 years old cause that age deals with divorce better.
My second husband, when sane was a remarkable man, unfortunately mental illness and a history of abuse from his family lead him down pathways that were to dark for me to attempt to follow or keep him from traveling into.
This last relationship I was just out and out stupid, to trusting, I thought because I was honest they were also. So in some ways I guess I only saw what I wanted to see. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 5:35:26 PM | | Her sense of entitlement exceeded my take-home pay, I could not give her all that she so richly deserved. So I showed her the door, and how it swings just one way. Her new husband took over that responsiblity a couple years later, and I never looked back. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 7:10:08 PM | 4 all Season CA, get over it! "Feminism" is not to blame for your divorce. REAL feminists absolutely embrace the responsibilities that go with rights. (Damn, I knew I should have done my dissertation on the separation of rights from responsibility in American discourse!) Your ex wasn't not a feminist if she thought she was entitled to rights without responsibilities.
Besides, the OP asked about YOUR contribution to the end of your relationship and specifically said that she (he? can't remember) wasn't interested in spouse-bashing.
Maybe you can take the bitterroot out of your mouth, gargle, and try again later. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 7:49:56 PM | To Louise1359: Msg 83. Read my text!! "NO FAULT DOWNFALL"!!
PS. I'm still searching for a feminist with a sense of humour!! | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/24/2009 8:11:58 PM | | I think Diogenes would put the children of a lot of lamp oil salesmen through college if he had to slog through this thread. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 6:15:42 AM | ....i realised i was just using him for hot sex...
so decided to "do the right thing"
and "set him free"... | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 12:39:31 PM | What's with this latest trend of dragging up 3 year old threads?
Have we seriously run out of newer interesting things to talk about? | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 12:42:26 PM | ^^^^ amen sister ....the worse part is seeing some who still are on the site and how much they have changed in viewpoints...some were quite likeable then and now ya just got to wonder.
Btw Daffie, if he still available, you can send him my way :P | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 4:39:03 PM | sapphire...
your request is duly noted...
if he ever travels your way be ready to meet a hot blooded aussie...
especially when i tell him you are from "knockerville" | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 5:01:29 PM | If one has the tenacity to wade through the endless gender bashing, very occasionally a gem of authenticity can be found in these threads. Without presuming to know anything about the author, I think it likely that considerable internal debate took place
before message 3 was posted. Such rare courage can only be commended.
Raised in a house of love, I knew nothing of hatred. Didn't understand it could completely consume a person and choke out all other emotions. After 10 futile years trying to fix the irreperable damage done to a child, I learned that love's antithesis is equally armed. Unfortunately, from a psychological and financial perspective this education was enormously expensive. Regardless of the gospel of conventional wisdom, I will not assume 50% responsibility for the failure of a marriage that was doomed from the outset. Far from perfect, I have erred often and greatly, but had no hand in the horror that ruined what could easily have been a wonderful human being. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 5:44:16 PM | No anger, or bitterness, she just had a different way of looking at the world.
There is always a question of; what could I have done different?
My dilemma is; should I have left earlier?
I wanted to stay for the kids, so they know what a family is.
All I can say, is I was a fool.
Stand up for your life.
Teach your kids that happiness comes first.
Sometimes there is no “part” to admit to.
If you wish to teach your kids the secret of happiness, you have to first of all find it within yourself. | |
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rm.h
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Joined: 9/10/2009
Msg: 95 | |
| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 6:08:21 PM | | He fell in love with a woman 30 years his junior. "It was just sex, no one was meant to get hurt". I could have asked him, and thought to several times, what part I played in the 'end' of the 20 year relationship. I guess I didn't really want to hear the answer. So, instead, I speculate......not tuned in?.....took things for granted?..... | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 10:05:44 PM |
Guys...I'd like to hear from you as well. What do you respond when a woman asks you about this?
Your list of questions are not framed to include a guy's point of view.
1. Is your idea of communication more like nagging to him?
2. Were your priorities to get rid of his?
3. Had you taken everything he had leaving you not knowing what more you want?
4. Did you drive him to cheat just to save what was left of his shredded ego?
5. Did you take his paycheck for granted?
6. Did what you earn at the office become yours but what he earned "ours"? (in my profession, there are very few women in the workplace so the idea of cheating at the office would be quite remote.)
7. Was your special time those times you nagged him into giving up everything special to him?
In most ways, I chose my ex well but when my income took a hit due to the telecom/dotcom bubble, she was not willing to accept the belt tightening and bailed for tall guy with a good pension plan. My siblings said my mother had predicted her behavior but my mother smoked and did not live long enough to see her prediction come true. I suppose, like all the male bashing posts above, my contribution was my choice in the beginning.
Whatever happened in the past is in the past but I am much more careful. Right now, finishing raising my kids is a higher priority than the unknown of an internet date so #2 could be a current issue. It's ironic there are women who demand a man give up even his kids to be faithful to her. If he is so willing to dump his kids, how faithful could he really be? | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/25/2009 10:39:37 PM | | Guess I'd have to say that what he got upset about was that I wouldn't overlook what his family was like -- I had issues with how they did things -- which was totally different than how I was raised. | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/26/2009 1:56:47 AM | What I did wrong in my last LT relationship
1. Always there when he wanted me to be (at the drop of a hat mostly)
2. Always did what he wanted.
3. Typed for hours on msn keeping him company while he worked.
4. Downloaded music to his i-pod for a holiday to get his head together (with another woman).
5. Trusted him - yes that is what I did wrong! | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/26/2009 2:04:41 AM | ahoytheredave - Think you missed the point - WHAT DID YOU DO WRONG ? this was not supposed to be about bashing your ex? but expert bashing you did on her, had me laughing and the bit about the mother-in-law not liking her icing on the cake for me - thank you  | |
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| What led to the downfall...?
Posted: 9/26/2009 7:16:16 AM | confusion of my own esteem, poor comunication and a lack of me understanding the gravity of how the childrearing can cloud your connection with the adultfemales responsibility to herself and than her child...
Lack of ability to communicate threw trama and stay centered in myown awareness..................falk it did the best i could at the time.
now if you can not grasp accepting the consequence of your action(all adultenergy) do you expect others to have to respect for you...closer to reality so closeyou can feel the energy!!!
honesty is finding the truth about your self and not sugar coating your bads and kickin your own sorry azz...IMOofcourse.
i slide, i fall and i get back up.........................what a blast life is when the denial is off the table to..
.equality is easy when you have humility.
equality of error makes for sanity in the human department...
 awareness was my ticket to serenity in my life and it was one hardroad!
I kick my own azz best!!! the circle is in you................find it:winks:
ignition and blastoff.....................poof
toss off flares to mark the trail....
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