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| DNA database
Posted: 9/5/2007 9:56:36 PM | | It's all very well reading 1984 and other books with their conspiracy theories but get real. This is not fiction but life. Stop assuming the worst all the time. There are as have been pointed out positives in this. The world has moved on a bit since 1948 when Orwell put ink to page and although I'd say people are no brighter now than then, with information available globally now it is much harder to manipulate people like happened in the early mid 2oth century. | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 9/5/2007 10:08:49 PM | Why not assume the worst? , time has proven that tools such as this are abused, remember the anti terror laws?. dangerously steering off topic is it?.
But terrorism in 2005 claimed 60-70 lives, the roads inthe same period claimed 3000 lives about the same in 2006 and increasing in 2007.
By definition cars are 50 times deadlier than terrorists, pro rata this and it is even less of a threat 2005-2007 say 9000 lives vs 60-70.Yet strange how there have been a major change in laws , to deal with the terrorist "threat" and we are made to think it is the most dangerous thing out there when it isn't.
Back ontopic the government has been allowing access to the DNA database for certain companies for "research" but it hasn't said what research that happens to be
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1821676,00.html
Which means it is ALREADY being misused. | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 9/6/2007 1:05:35 AM |
Why not assume the worst?
You carry on assuming the worst and nothing will get done.
By definition cars are 50 times deadlier than terrorists,
You could say Pennecillin is more dangerous than terrorists as many people are allergic. It helps though a lot more than it hurts.
Also cars aren't dangerous (although some people in them are) by definition, terrorists are.
Think your glass is always half empty | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 9/6/2007 2:03:29 AM | Assuming a worst case scenario is always a good idea when weighing up the costs and benefits of any idea, just as is a best case scenario.
It is only by examining the best and worst can you make an informed decision.
My decision is that no, a universal DNA database is not a good idea because of the liklihood of abuse by Government and others.
I don't believe that we should allow the state too much power over us (and I notice that some of the people that are agreeing with the DNA database are those that shout about the 'nanny-state'), I believe that we should question and examine at every stage (and yet, I'm as guilty as any for not doing that).
I think the current (apparent) system, where DNA can be taken once you come to the attention of law enforcement is a much better system. Serial criminals tend to start small and work up to the bigger crimes. Bad boys and (less often) girls have usually crossed the path of the law.
Don't forget, that the majority of rapes and murders are committed not by raving psychopaths who are unknown to the victim, but by partners, family, friends.
Children are abused not by wandering paedophiles but mainly by people who are supposed to love and care for them, again, family and friends.
It's not the DNA of some stranger that the police will be looking for but the DNA of the people closest to you. That's not going to be hard to obtain is it? It will be hard to use as evidence though. Killed by your partner, his/her DNA will be all over you anyway would it not?
Why should I allow my DNA to be held on file (as a generally law-abiding citizen) for the sake of the few who may be caught by such a database?
EDIT: I've just read the thing about fingerprinting in school, from the link that slowhandbunny left, I am horrified to think that my daughter's fingerprints could be held by a private company just so she can get library books out at school. Fcuk that. I shall be investigating further! | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 9/8/2007 5:01:59 AM | | You could also argue that doctors are more dangerous than terrorists. But is still doesn't make DNA and fingerprinting acceptable. | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 10/23/2007 4:13:29 AM | http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/DNA-match-linked-defendant-to.3403996.jp
THE man accused of the sex murder of Lesley Molseed more than 30 years ago was linked to the crime by his DNA, a court heard today.
Ronald Castree's DNA profile was an exact match to semen evidence found on the 11 year-old girl who was abducted from Rochdale, Greater Manchester, as she ran an errand for her mum and later stabbed to death. Lesley, who was aged 11 when she was murdered, had been stabbed twelve times; she had been left by her killer clothed, but with her skirt up and showing her red knickers and with her face down onto that moorland grass.
"Inside her knickers was the semen of the man who had abducted Lesley from Rochdale and who had driven her to that isolated moorland scene, some 30 to 40 yards from the A672 Oldham to Ripponden road, not far from the M62 motorway.
"At that lonely scene, Lesley Molseed was murdered. In 1975 it was not possible to extract and compare a DNA profile to identify the true killer of Lesley - but technological advances now allowed that to be done.
He added: "The DNA from the spermatozoa, or sperm heads, recovered from the semen inside Lesley's knickers, were an exact match with the defendant's own DNA profile."
Castree, denies the murder of Lesley between 4th and 9th October, 1975.
The trial continues.
Goes to show, you cannot hide forever if you commit heinous crimes. | |
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Posted: 10/23/2007 4:27:37 AM | I'm completely against it.
Many people seem to want to sanitize their world at the epense of freedoms they do not even realise they enjoy.
One of the main mechanisms for state control is being able to say who is where and doing what.
The state exists to serve the individual. The individual does not exist to serve the state.
Whilst the crimes which would be solved are indeed heinous...........the alternative of allowing the government complete control over it's people should it choose to do so in a different political climate is too big a price (and if you think im being over the top....look to history, things do change..........maybe there will never be any kind of fascist state in the uk, maybe there will but many many years from now, but i would rather not hand over the control. I was born a free person and will always do my best to remain one.
The government is trying to take away control of almost everything we do. There are debates going on about whether i and people like me will be able to make the choice to be freelance workers in the future........indeed, i have had to change how i am paid twice in 6 years to 'get around' legislation designed exactly for the purpose of trying to make me a direct employee..................on the pretense that is it 'better for me and industry'
I have never given my consent to having these rights to free will removed and never will. | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 10/23/2007 4:29:08 AM | My personal opinion is that a national DNA database would be a good thing. Whilst I agree it would take us a step closer to a 'police state', I firmly believe the benefits would outnumber the pitfalls.
The benefits in helping solve even a petty crime would be immense, if every ones DNA was taken at birth, a criminal no matter what their age, could be identified. Also with a national DNA database, it would make identity & blood type recognition easier & faster at accidents, as well as helping with paternity suits.
Unlike a comment above states, not all sexual crimes are committed by people known to their victims. With a national DNA database, the victim would be saved a lot of emotional damage & trauma. I can only assume that those against this move have never been the victim of a violent attack, where it is your word against theirs, the doubt that is cast upon your person by not only the police but also the by friends & family.
Personally whatever is needed to protect women & men, & most importantly children form the evil that is in this world, then I'm afraid we are going to have to accept these kinds of measures. | |
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| DNA database
Posted: 10/23/2007 4:33:55 AM |
The government is trying to take away control of almost everything we do. There are debates going on about whether i and people like me will be able to make the choice to be freelance workers in the future........indeed, i have had to change how i am paid twice in 6 years to 'get around' legislation designed exactly for the purpose of trying to make me a direct employee..................on the pretense that is it 'better for me and industry' I have never given my consent to having these rights to free will removed and never will
I do not see the problem?????????If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear. | |
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Posted: 10/23/2007 4:42:03 AM |
I do not see the problem?????????If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear
You're missing the argument. Firstly, I have nothing to fear, I'm not wanted for anything and I have no intention of committing any crimes.
Not the point. The point is that once you relinquish a freedom, it is difficult in the extreme to get it back. ID card, DNA tagging have good uses which I would agree with, were it not for the POTENTIAL bad uses. I am not saying I think the world is going to come crashing around our ears this minute. I am saying that throughout history, nation states have changed from democracies to dictatorships to fascist regimes and back. We think we are 'stable' because we live in the timeframe of one lifetime. looked at over decades or centuries..........things can change radically. Even in good old England.
I'm sure the Romans thought THEIR ascendency would last forever too. | |
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