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 steelerfan1
Joined: 5/7/2006
Msg: 26
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our GrandchildrenPage 2 of 2    (1, 2)

The think tanks go on saying that the baby boomers could work until they are 70; cut back benefits; and of course raise taxes.

These are all possible options to solve the projected deficits in entitlement programs. I believe a fairly small increase in US taxes could significantly alleviate shortfalls.


#2 - live within our means. We don't need to support the advertisers or the malls. Do we really need a new car every year just to feel good?

This one has always worked for me. It's amazing how "rich" one's life can be while being thrifty.

I would add that, whenever possible, embrace simplicity, downsize, etc. Relocating to an area of the country with a lower cost of living has helped in my case.
 EddyJ
Joined: 2/12/2006
Msg: 27
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/11/2007 5:04:13 PM
''Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grand Children"" ???

Its The National Debt Don't Forget It

Watch it tick away by the second ''with interest'' @

www.uwsa.com/uwsa-usdebt.html

At 7:43 PM EST.

single person - 28,800.59
family of 2 - 57,601.18
family of 3 - 86,401.77
family of 4 - 115,202.35
family of 5 - 144,002.93
family of 6 - 172,803.50

''Who will pay this debt?

Rightfully it should be paid by those who have incurred it !

The Boomers & Their parents

Not an innocent yet unborn generation........Grandchildren & their children
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/11/2007 5:12:55 PM
Tink,

Sorry to hear that - a close friend of mine lives in Calgary and says that employers are having great difficulty finding people to fill jobs. I guess the question is - are those low paying unskilled jobs? Keep looking and I'm sure you'll succeed.

As for national debt. Canada is in a better position than the U.S. as we have been "paying down' the debt - Mind you, it seems like we've been doing that forever and a day - and our tax rates reflect that. Wonder what other plans Harper has for the "surplus" . Harper did eliminate one tax dodge that is probably pissing off some boomers though. ha ha.
 buckethand56
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 29
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/11/2007 6:28:54 PM
I probably will never retire, for one I can't afford to, the line of work I am in , very few companies offer retirement plans, but I knew this when I entered the field 32 yrs ago. I also have 5 children, oldest 30, youngest is 16, and by george I have paid for everthing for them, I have never been on welfare, foodstamps etc.
I have a 19 yr old daughter and a grandson, living with me right now, I take care of mine, by mine I mean my family. I don't care if it's 1st, 2nd, or 3rd generation, they are still my family.
I have paid taxes and social security since I was 14, if I decide to quit working at 65 I believe I have earned that right, and Have dang sure paid in enough ssi for that purpose. My children will never see what I have paid in, so I don't see where they get off saying we are robbing from our grandchildren. I will leave plenty of money in our governments pocket when I am gone.
 canyunflyer
Joined: 2/6/2006
Msg: 30
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/11/2007 8:23:21 PM
You childless working women. While I feel for your plight, the truth is...yer barkin up a dead tree. the world really does revolve around marriage, families, children...and all the institutions that go with it. Every country needs a minimal sustained birthrate or it will utrify and wither away. You can't change, or argue with the universe. Life isn't fair.

I'm no one to make any other contributions to this topic. I am guilty of the worst kind of planning (non planning) that can be imagined. that, along with a couple of decades of horrific partner choices... have insured that I will have to eek out some kind of a living until I become so inform I collapse. sometimes, I beat the hell outta myself for having done this. Sometimes I just resolutely accept that thats how it is...and try to see whatever good things there are in it. The next generation? they'll figure it out. I have faith.
 SOBEIT19
Joined: 10/15/2006
Msg: 31
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/12/2007 3:16:36 AM
A lot of valid points in all these posts. I think consumerism has been the down fall of boomers. They did not save because they had to have the best of everything. NOW!

They did not save money, they spent. Unlike their parents who spent little, they spent it all.
My mother had five dresses and three pair of shoes, not the same ones but all her life that's what was in her closet. My parents drove their cars for twenty years or more, most of the time the only shopping they did was for groceries. Boomers have a sense of entitlement, I wonder where that came from? Our poor hard working parents sure didn't promote that.

The companies our parents worked for went with the flow, why pay and older experienced employee sixty grand a year when they can get a hungry college grad to do the job for half that.

I was never taught anything about money, it was expected I would get married, have children, and stay at home letting my 'prince' take care of me.

Like the OP, loss of lifestyle hit me hard too. But I am fortunate to make enough to keep the roof, pay the bills, and if I save most of the money left at the end of the month I can have a bit of fun now and then. I opened an ira but at this time in my life I'm not sure how much that will help once I retire.

I have thought about selling my house and moving out of the country, keeping my citizenship, getting dual citizenship in another country. Argentina, Mexico.. If forced to live on SS every month I think it's an option worth exploring.

My older sister is 70, she prepares taxes, her ss check is $38.47. She will work until she dies. In her prime earning years, wages were much lower for a woman. What she paid in to SS is nothing.. So you sure can't depend on that. If you don't have your own retirement fund you're screwed.

My thinking is the same as buckethand. If you worked all your life, paid your taxes, can afford to live off your measly SS check then why can't you? Why do you have to work until you're 70? My dad died three weeks before he retired, he worked longer than most others for that time period.. It would have been nice to see him get to relax and enjoy himself.
 moraima
Joined: 6/26/2005
Msg: 32
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/12/2007 6:18:31 AM
Plan as we may, life (especially a global financially one) has too many variables with too many things that can happen over decades. I don't believe that baby boomers or any generation cause the variables over their lifetime. Death, sickness, business closures, downsizing etc, energy problems are things that we can't see coming in the future. All we can do is be as financially responsible as possible.

As a childless person, one thing I enjoy very much is that I no longer have to worry about anyone's finances but my own. As far as future generation go, one of the best plans is to be as educated as possible in a field that will be viable in the long term.
 ksue44
Joined: 6/20/2005
Msg: 33
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/12/2007 7:21:34 AM
Tink - it's frustrating when the media says "shortage of skilled workers", it doesn't matter what company we live in. I've been in the SALT Tax field for over 8 years (sales & use tax; excise tax; property tax; and franchise tax). Last time I had to look for a job was in 1998. The downside of my tax experience is I have no corporate income tax.

Fast forward to May 06 and I lost my job. Lived off my IRA for 2 months and landed a consulting gig. The gig ended last week and I'm back to pounding the pavement. Sure, I'm eligible for unemployment which is a help. The jobs in the SALT field are few and far between. In the late 1990's and early 2000 they were plentiful and one could pretty much name their price. It seems it's virtually dried up. Scary? You bet because I don't have a whole lot of $$ socked away.

In the meantime I look for perm & consulting gigs. Also, I've started my part time business, but before I achieve financial freedom in that, it will be about 3-5 years. Meanwhile, I've got to keep the wolves away. Should I land a position, I may be taking quite a salary cut which isn't an ego boost. I just do the best I can each day.

Good luck to you!
 QuinnCA
Joined: 8/29/2006
Msg: 34
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/12/2007 10:40:34 AM
It isn't the baby boomers it is government who does the robbing to fund things they should never be involved with. When was the last time you heard of any elected official who did anything to reduce the size and cost of government. They always want more. I see in the press all the statements about how the oil companies are getting rich off of us. Remember Government makes 5 TIMES the amount of money on a gallon of gas than the oil companies do. Does Government spend it properly, almost never.
 tinkerbellcgy
Joined: 9/17/2005
Msg: 35
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/12/2007 10:53:21 AM
It isn't the baby boomers it is government who does the robbing to fund things they should never be involved with. When was the last time you heard of any elected official who did anything to reduce the size and cost of government.

At the risk of being labelled as suffering from OCD I must respond to this comment. During his tenure, the Premier of our Province, reduced the province's debt, cut the size and the cost of government in an effort that future generations of Albertans not be saddled with an enormous debt. Our Province was debt-free in 2006. What happens after this is entirely up to the future generations.

Tink
 writ7tin
Joined: 1/7/2006
Msg: 36
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/13/2007 4:00:29 PM
Tink & Ksue,
It is not just in Canada & the U/S it is also in the U/K as well,
20 years ago I parted from my first wife being the nice guy that I am I let my wife have the house being that she had the kids, all were living at home but these were her Children and not mine with one grand child and another on the way,, 3 dogs and 3 cats. She told me that for being a nice guy when every thing was sorted out she would sell and give me some money : but that never happen
I went to the local housing hoping that they would help me find some where to live but what they told me was :
A. I was working
B. I was earning anough money to support myself.
C. I was Male.
I did manage to find some where to live but thank goodness we had showers and loo's at work.
I did manage to survive and get myself into another mess but that is another story.
A few years ago many of us were made redundant and alot of the work went to places like Romania (cheap labour) Now that transport cost are going up they want to bring back the work but they have no skilled labour here in the U/K. Very conveniently Romania has join the EU and they do have some of the skilled labour . Which means low wages for alot of people.
Iv been working hard for 45years of my life never asked anything from the state.
Here in the U/K we pay a council tax per house hold so if there is two of you sharing a house you can go 50/50 but if you are a single person you can get a 25% discount which mean's you pay 75% .
I chose to be single and at best enjoy being so but there are time's when I feel like a square peg in a round hole . Society on the whole is very much for familys and couples and I think it will all ways be like this .
Mick
 Ninki
Joined: 4/11/2005
Msg: 37
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/14/2007 8:37:40 AM
"I will probably be working until the day I die. I can only hope that the money does not run out before I do or suicide may be an option."


Yes, I agree. I thought I was the only one having thoughts like this. And we thought, growing up, that we'd have it at least as good or better than our parents.


Ninki
 MacKevinized
Joined: 2/15/2006
Msg: 38
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/14/2007 9:35:08 AM

It isn't the baby boomers it is government who does the robbing to fund things they should never be involved with. When was the last time you heard of any elected official who did anything to reduce the size and cost of government.


Clinton ended his tenure with a surplus of cash and the next guy spent it all.
 BGSU
Joined: 10/18/2006
Msg: 39
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/27/2007 7:32:35 PM
I’m 52 and hopefully I will be able to work until I drop.

I have a question:

If a person starts working at age 18 and retires at age 65, this means he/she worked for approximately 47 years.

Now, from what I understand, our life expectancy is now 90.

Now correct me if I am wrong. What I am hearing is, some able body people who have worked 47 years are expecting to sit on their tale end in Florida for 25 years without working and still enjoy a comfortable lifestyle. This means, for every two years they worked, they expect to sit on their duff for a year.

My question is: What are these able body people expect to be doing for the 25 years that they are retired and not working? I would go nuts!


Now, my grandfather worked until he was 75 years old.

Again, please correct me if I am wrong, but from what I understand, in previous generations before WWII, it was common for the elderly to work until they dropped or until they became so disable that they could not work anymore. Most elderly people, when they became disabled, moved into another family members home and the family took care of them until they died. Back then, there were no nursing homes where kids could put their parents in and forget them like there are now.

After WWII, fewer and fewer people would allow their elderly disabled parents to move into their home so they could take care of them. So, the government started Social Security so these elderly disabled people would have enough money to take care of themselves (because their kids wouldn’t). Again, correct me if I am wrong, but wasn’t the life expectancy some place in the 70’s.

Also, correct me if I am wrong, but I never heard that Social Security was a savings program or a retirement program. I always thought that Social Security was like a Welfare System for the disabled and those who were too old to work (which at the time the Social Security System was started it was determined that people 62 years old and older were too old to work). What the government is taking out of my pay check for Social Security is going to my parents, who are totally disable and unable to work, to ensure that they have enough money to live on.

So, to answer the original question, “Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren?”

I would say: As far as Social Security goes, yes, some Baby Boomers are, because some of them are receiving Government Support when they are still able to work.

I say, get rid of the Social Security Program and have a National Disability Insurance Program. So, no matter what age one becomes totally disable and unable to punch a key on a keyboard, one would receive benefits. To me, if one is able to use a computer and be on this site, (or is able to drive his camper to Florida and back) he/she is able to perform some type of work and should not be receiving government support. I also would make a requirement that, one must have three doctors agree that he/she is disable to a point that they cannot be retrained and work, before he\she is qualified to receive the government support.
 raredawn
Joined: 1/10/2007
Msg: 40
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/27/2007 7:47:09 PM
WEll you have certainly said mouthfull!!

See Socail Security as an entitlement? Heck yes! We were told we were building it for our future! Trouble is the govenemtn saw this this large body of money just growing, so it had to put it to use for things it was never meant to be used for!

Jobs! Yes we grew up expecting to get a job someplace and work there till we retired with a pension! Employees have become disposable. It is cheaper to get rid of long term employess who know a job but have worked at a place long enough to get paid vacation and raises. Invest our own money. Yah how's that working out for everyone? My borther-in-law got in on Intell when it was still reasonable to buy. Too bad he held on to it just a litte too long, he lost $300,000. Has it occured to anyone that this investing thing is just another way of placing the economy squarely on the shoulders of the middle class?

Retire? Nope I for one know I will have to work till I drop then I will loose everything to Medicaid.
 raredawn
Joined: 1/10/2007
Msg: 41
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/27/2007 7:51:22 PM
Sory I forgot to add that I don't believe we, the Baby Boomers, are robbing our grandchildren. I believe our children are robbing us and our grandchildren. Our children have been taking charge for a while now. You have no idea how many of them are fighting, actually fighting, to get on SSI or get their children on SSI. It really is amazing!
 rejectingall
Joined: 1/24/2007
Msg: 42
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/27/2007 9:15:49 PM

#1 - educate our children about money. Begin in junior high school. They should know the basics about credit, buying a home, balancing their accounts, and different types of investments.

#2 - live within our means. We don't need to support the advertisers or the malls. Do we really need a new car every year just to feel good?

#3 - don't rely on a job to earn a living with. The world of employment is changing and not for the better. Instill in our children that they should look into their own businesses

#4 - learn all you can about finances. If you're in a relationship, have that monthly talk about money, investments, etc.

#5 - make goals. That's one area I failed at, I never knew about goals. Not just financial goals but career goals.

#6 - be flexible and be ready for change


#1.. should start as soon as they start leaning to count, add, subtract and multiply. Pennies, nickles and dimes are useful in education.

#2 should starts at home (as an extension of #1) with money management through the use of the "allowance" The allowance isn't really meant to just hand kids money... its meant to teach them that moeny buys stuff and if you save up you can buy better stuff. Or if you spend it all... you can't buy anything.

#3 needs to be extended . The reliance on the employer to provide a retirement pension is foolish. That company may fold up and take your retirement fund down with it OVERNIGHT. There's also interresting little tricks companies play occasionally like terminating your employment 6 months before you qualify for a partial retirement pension, or like they pulled on my brother-in-law, selling the division of the company and the new company you suddenly find yourself working for doesn't honor the retirement plan and you have to start over on your 20 years... after having worked the same job for 18.5 years.

#4 Is the downfall of many a relationship. Failure to talk to each other openly and calmly about finances. If you don't want your relationship to work. You MUST work as equals dealing with the monthly bills.

#5 We all make goals... the problem is we all too often don't ACT to attain the goals.

#6 the only constant is that things will change.

Social Security was never intended to provide a comfortable living income. It was intended to keep people from starving because thier savings got wiped out when the banks failed. If you want a comfortable retirement... you MUST put money away for your own future.

Overall... I like the way the OP is thinking.
 Woodstar
Joined: 2/16/2006
Msg: 43
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/28/2007 2:44:56 PM
I am not the greatest financial mind...really a pretty poor one. One thing I've read alot about on this thread is people voicing their dismay at paying so many taxes on children's education. I for one have had only one child. I have always believed every child is everyones responsibility. I hope my tax dollars were spent on raising the child who will some day discover some great medical whatever that will save my life and the life of the ones I love. I do not begrude one penny taken from me for education.
 rejectingall
Joined: 1/24/2007
Msg: 44
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Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/28/2007 4:17:47 PM
I would have no problem paying taxes for education if the schools worked.

Then there's the lies about where the money for education goes.

How can they add all the income from the lottery which was promoted as supporting education and then still need to raise taxes?

Why do they have to keep increasing the assessments on property in order to collect more taxes when there's more and more houses getting built?

Why do schools have to build multimillion dollar football stadiums and then claim they don't have enough money for textbooks and teacher's salaries?

We don't need to throw more money at education. We need to make the school systems quit wasting what they have.

JUST the federal funding that public schools get should allow the schools to provide FREE to each student a brand new laptop computer and new texbooks every year as well as pay the teachers' salaries.

The Christian Schools charge less than 1/4 as much per student as what the federal government gives to the public schools. They get NO public funding, and the average student in a Christian school is 1 year ahead of the public school educated student (in reading math, history and geography... ) by the 6th grade.

Its not the lack of funding. Its the lack of the public schools doing thier job.
 ksue44
Joined: 6/20/2005
Msg: 45
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/28/2007 4:30:44 PM
I have mixed emotions whether or not we as childless/childfree people should pay for education. Part of me says we should because without an education, you can't make it in this world.

On the flip side of the coin when there's so much waste in the school systems, and that education isn't a priority (in Texas - sports is a priority), that tends to chap my ass. Schools are too top heavy in mangement and don't have enough teachers. Too, schools are having to do "baby sitting" instead of educating. Also, when parents don't get involved in the schooling of their children, that chaps me too.

When older people on fixed incomes are having to sell their houses because property taxes have swelled so much, that gives me pause for thought too.

GRRRR, when I get onto topics about having to dole out for other's that do have kids, I can get on a soapbox. I'll quit while I'm ahead, geez, I'd love to have a break in my life too. Now, let me go find my property tax statement
 dhubsith
Joined: 12/22/2005
Msg: 46
Are Baby Boomers Robbing Our Grandchildren
Posted: 1/28/2007 9:23:19 PM

I have mixed emotions whether or not we as childless/childfree people should pay for education. Part of me says we should because without an education, you can't make it in this world.


I am childfree and I don't have a problem with that. I think those sorts of "social costs" need to be carried by everybody.

I have a house and a pension, and very little debt. I am for sure one of the lucky ones, but still it took a lot of work to get here. But I can't get health insurance I can afford ($860/month from my former employer, I can't afford that). That is one area where Canadians have a huge advantage over us Americans.

The generation that fought in WW2 were rewarded by better jobs, benefits, and retirement than any previous generation in history. They paid in blood and earned it. They were also very lucky. We boomers are following them. I just don't believe that we were all a lot of spendthrifts, perhaps some were, but a lot of us paid as we went.

Good topic, ksue, and a lot of good posts on it as well.
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