|
|
|
|
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 7:04:30 PM | No matter what society is about, it's just as wonderful as it ever has been to share a loving relationship. If a woman can't do the things to make a man feel loved and wanted, then is it really society to blame? We certainly don't teach how to love in schools, nor should we. Most learn about love at home and from childhood. Even those who didn't grow up in a loving home can grow to have a loving relationship.
And I can go out in the world and do and achieve whatever goals I set for myself, personally, none of that detracts from my desire to have a loving man in my life. And I'm so blessed and thankful every day for him. He wants to love me, and enjoys spoiling me a bit and I don't think there's anything wrong with letting him do that, and me loving and spoiling him, too. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 7:27:19 PM | My point is I don't think men know where they fit in a woman's life anymore. I don't dispute this, but it's a vague comment; my reply is I would know where I would fit in the life of a woman who I am dating because I'd be asking the right questions. It would be readily apparent.
Women (not all) want to open their own doors, kill their own spiders, open their own jars, carry their own guns, etc. Great, but these actions are pretty vague for the most part. Hint on opening a tough jar: if hot water doesn't work, take a spoon you don't mind bending, and try to "burb" the jar by gently prying the lid up a bit with the spoon.
The men seem to have had their "role" as protector taken away and they don't know how to communicate with us anymore. Can't speak for all men, but this doesn't ring true to me. I ask questions, and if I think my partner needs help with something, I offer help, if she doesn't accept it, she does the task by herself. I expect my partner to ask for help when she wants it. These things seem to be no-brainers to me.
Women put women where we are today!? Where is that exactly? I'll go there to meet one.  | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 7:52:01 PM | | Why is everyone always trying to dominate one another? The world would be a better place if there were'nt so many jaded people out there.Honestly,the people(men and women) who feel the world has wronged them to point where constantly feel like they have to prove their role in society as a "powerful" human then you might as well just cut your wrists right now because your wasting precious oxygen for the rest of us.Whats the point of existing as a man or a woman in society if you are constantly on the defesive about everything...including members of the opposite sex.People are people.I just wish the vast majority would stop being shady....but then again its just the "role" of the sexes now isnt it? I mean men are ***holes because they keep women down in the work force and women are total ****es because they just sit on their pretty little asses and wait for the men to do all the dirty work.You just cant win can you.Everyday the world seems to get more and more watered down. No one can think for themselves.They just have society do it for them.I think thats the ultimate root of any of these issues.The fact that alot of people cannot think for themselves.Just let the media and television tell you how to act or feel.Who to date,hate or love. A vast majority of people have become nothing more than just manufactured machines made just to just eat,sleep and procreate so we can keep things fresh and always have new people to hate and argue with..What a shame..Looks like alot of people kind of suck at life.I surely dont and the woman Im involved with doesnt.We split everything 50/50 and both put 150% of ourselves into the relationship.Its really kind of sad how pathetic humanity has become.Eh...Im happy with my own life.Are you? | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 9:42:59 PM | While I understand the OP's position I would have to agree ... to disagree. We can only speak from our personal experiance. How we were raised speaks volumes as to how we respond in our life. If you were raised in a household where the man did these things ..then you would think it a manly duty. If you weren't, you wouldn't.
I open doors and jars and fix things for women and if they can do it themselves...kudoes. I kinda prefer it that way. I have no problem knowing my place in the world because of it. As for spiders ..... ick ... 
I'll catch and release only ....or crush. I might be the first with my feet on the couch if I see one! | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 10:21:43 PM | It really just comes down to finding the one that is right for you. You and I could find common ground, for sure. Although I certainly have the latitude to give space to someone who is independent just as well.
Having an open mind and listening to your other half alleviates differences. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 10:46:36 PM | I do things on my own, I like doing things on my own, but I would like a very traditional situation one day.
The big problem I see with everyone these days is that they are just ungrateful. I see it everyday at work. Men and women.
I would like to have someone give me some flowers on a date. Or open the door to the car for me. But all it really takes is one angry person to snap at someone for doing those things to make that person just not want to do them anymore.
I have to admit, I don't really have many friends who are other women. I find most of them to be catty and selfish and manipulative. Far too often I go on dates to see the guy become very guarded because of what was done to him in the past. The many always ruin it for the few. I feel most of the women out there have screwed it up big time for the rest of us girls.
If you spend all your time telling anyone you don't need them, after a while, none of them will want you anymore. | |
|
| |
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/3/2007 11:01:01 PM | | I have been a single parent many years and supported my sons pretty much alone......I have also taught my sons to open the door for women, walk on the outside of the curb......walk his date to the door.....pull the chair out for a woman when shes sitting........These are also things I appreciate men doing for me.... | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 12:38:23 AM |
I do things on my own, I like doing things on my own, but I would like a very traditional situation one day.
As in, stay at home mother and wife?
Good luck on that one! Not many men welcome it anymore. Many families need that second income these days, just to make ends meet.
If you meant traditional *trivial* aspects, like opening jars, and killing spiders (sorry, opening doors is pure social courtesy custom - not the same thing at all), sure, you can find those - but they hardly typify 'traditional' gender role expectations. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 12:50:59 AM | I can always respect a womans' desire to want to be the homemaker for a while, especially when there are younger kids in the house, but I would expect her to eventually get out there again. It's a psychological fact that work is of central interest for humans, that is, they enjoy life more when they are working; and that work outside in an employment situation provides necessary support structures that are extremely fulfilling. Friends, co workers, assignments, getting tasks done, enjoying the fresh air, not to mention growth in all the intellectual capacitiies as well.
A person is meant to work more than just in the domenstic domain!
And besides, let's say God Forbid something happens to the marriage, would'nt the woman feel much better about herself if she knew she could get a job or maintain her lifestyle with the income that is already coming in?
 | |
|
| |
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 2:11:15 AM | I still want to be needed in some ways.
I dont want to have to look after the woman I marry financially, it really does take two incomes nowadays, and I dont like lazy people. I have no problem with her having her own bank account and bills. I would like us to have an equal say in important financial matters though.
But I do want to open doors for her, look after her when she's sick, hold her when she's scared. Some girls love these things, some are independant and arent used to it.. Its not a big deal, its not the end of the world. As long as theres honesty and communication, those little things can be overlooked. But every guy likes to feel like their girl needs them once in a while, it does make us feel special.
Anyway, its been a long night, and I spent way, way too much time on this website today for some reason, so im going to bed. Wow, im tired. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 9:00:58 AM | | why does it take two incomes? i guess it depends on what you're happy with, but when push comes to shove, it's possible to survive on much less than what some people take for granted. | |
|
sabh
|
Joined: 1/30/2007
Msg: 64 | |
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 9:16:07 AM | | I think we are all missing the point, we get the treatment we ask for. I like my doors opened for me, I like a man to be A MAN.. but even men at times need a little sweetness. Yes, I live alone, yes, I earn my own living, yes, I even kill my own spiders, ( i dont, as I am superstitious) I dont need superman! I amd most women here in England, want or need a man to be himself. Some men are big, strong and brave, so are some women. Some men are kind, gentle and considerate. Some women are not. Its all down to the indiviual. Nothing more. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 9:28:18 AM |
why does it take two incomes? i guess it depends on what you're happy with, but when push comes to shove, it's possible to survive on much less than what some people take for granted.
Thats the thing, I dont want push to come to shove... I dont need to be rich, but I do like to travel, I like nice cars, toys, etc etc...
I dont want children either...
I dont ever want to just 'scrape by' | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 9:31:14 AM | YES!! AGREE!
Too bad women want to wear da BALLS these days... but like you said... WOMEN put themselves there now...
Women are now men... and men... are getting closer to women... shoot.. have you been to the MALL??? they are carrying their women's PURSES!
EEKS! | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 9:48:29 AM | Some of us have no choice but to kill our own spiders..(I don't..I happen to let them live, and escort them gently to the outdoors), open our own jars, change our own flat tires and just take care of ourselves the best we can.
I can't imagine anyone helping me out (without condition) in any way. I've been alone for 24 years and am proud of it. Do I want a mate? no, not now..no one can meet my standards and they really aren't that high..I require someone with the strength, discipline, and the ability to handle any situation that arises with a mature resolution to solve the problem at hand as I do..I'm still looking. lol
oh..and they 'must love cats, dogs, fish, alligators, snakes, Egrets, otters, bears, dolphins, manatees, and wild hogs'. Think that covers it. Hoo Yah!!!!!
Sans | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 11:38:41 AM |
Good luck on that one! Not many men welcome it anymore. Many families need that second income these days, just to make ends meet.
It's as if we are all slaves to the system. Things will change for the better when enough women are willing to make the necessary sacrifices. It's like the situation with home schooling. More people are keeping their kids out of the government schools and support networks for homeschoolers have popped up everywhere. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 11:44:56 AM | I can't imagine anyone helping me out (without condition) in any way.
Sans, perhaps it's this type of thinking that prevents todays women from accepting assistance (of any kind) from a mate ... that there is some hidden agenda of condition. Maybe a man wants to open the door, kill that spider, open that jar. etc. just to be loving. The men vs women antagonistic mentality has wrecked a lot of relationships, IMO.
Some of us have no choice but to kill our own spiders .. , open our own jars, change our own flat tires and just take care of ourselves the best we can.
I would have to disagree with the "no choice" part. You did have a choice and that choice is not needing a man to help you. Not a wrong choice, but just a choice. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 12:35:54 PM | Maybe part of the problem is that we have put such a high premium on having someone in our lives because we want them instead of needing them. This is great, it means two independent people have come together and there is give and take in the relationship. The only problem is that we all need to be needed. If that word bothers you, substitute another one but it's not what people do for each other, it is the spirit behind what they have done that matters. In a previous post, because someone had mentioned cooking, I asked what a woman was supposed to do to receive gentlemanly treatment. My take was just to be appreciative but I wanted to hear what others thought.
So, the bottom line is that both men and women need to let their SO or date do things for them and not focus so much on the motivation behind it because if you allow them to do something nice, it makes them feel good and should make you feel good as well because they care enough or are courteous enough to do it. Accept things graciously and if there are ulterior motives, you have the option to leave, no need to indict all men or women based on the behavior of one or even multiple individuals.
Looking at it this way, maybe part of the problem is that people do not take the time to figure out the things that the other person would like them to do, kind of like giving a gift because you like it without considering whether the other person really wants it. Common courtesies should be accepted graciously and if someone does not, this tells you something of their character and the walls they have built up.
I think when you give of yourself it should be thoughtful from the standpoint that while flowers are nice, I might rather you fix my refrigerator. On the woman's side, maybe she wants flowers but she should also recognize that her SO filled up her gas tank because he cares about her and that is his way of showing it instead of the flowers.
I think people should just continue to be the way they are and not change their behavior because of one experience, or blame either gender for the deterioration of common forms of courtesy. It is an individual choice--whether you will give it or appreciate receiving it. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 12:41:35 PM | Totally agree! I've asserted myself as a woman strong and independant all of my life. My soul craves for the protector, the leader,. I want to express myself, my fears, my passions and to love to the degree there is no definition. I think its more difficult to love fully without men questioning if they can be 'good enough'.
 | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 12:48:21 PM | Pad..I agree with you to a certain extent..I LOVE having men open doors for me, letting spiders live (and disposing of them without harm to the spider), and just basically stepping up to the plate to be a man, etc..we've been over this before. (hugs)..my EXPERIENCES have shown me that men will do this at the beginning of a relationship and soon, 'conditions' apply if they continue to treat us well.
and 'yes'..I DID have a choice in letting a man help me out when I needed him. He chose to disappoint me beyond belief. I chose to never depend on anyone again to help me ,but me. Sad? no. I thank him for giving me a 'wake up call' if you will...NEVER expect anything from anyone, enjoy your life, count your blessings daily, and take care of yourself, and your family with fierce protectiveness. (you happen to fall into my 'circle' of darkness, pad (cough)..I mean friend circle..lol)
Sans
| |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 1:01:19 PM | Hello??
Mean age in the US is over 37 years of age!
Wake up people! The majority of POFers are not coming together with the primary intent of having kids. They either have kids or have chosen not to have them, in their late 30s and 40s. Single parents are THE NORM at some point in their childrens lives. Here on POF, its damn near the rule - very few parents here who are married come to POF simply for the forums.
That said, the reasons people here are coming together to look for mates has very little to do with traditional family mechanics, two adults rearing children as a team for 25 yrs or more.
Thats automatically confers changes in gender roles. And that rapid change in demographics, coupled with the harsh economics of advanced education, housing and living costs, as well as the high costs of child rearing, means that we come together for economic AND emotional reasons. And that requires that both partners work for a living.
That changes role dynamics and shifts expectations away from social conditioning of the past.
The reduced emphasis on two parent child rearing and the added income from working women also changes the duration of partnerships, right?
Few of us will put up with crap in a marriage just because there are children present. When there are no children, we tolerate even less if our expectations are not met.
Bottom line: Being single is stressful. Many do not have the mental, emotional and physical reserves to cope with shitty communication skills and unhealthy expectations in a relationship - because they are in deficit from their last stressful relationship, from the rigors of single parenting, or in deficit from shitty lifestyle choices.
Bad if you're single ---> biological drivers to seek companionship and support - and now, the additional economic driver is present as well.
Bad if you're in an unhealthy relationship ---> too many costs, not enough benefits.
<div class="quote">It's as if we are all slaves to the system. Things will change for the better when enough women are willing to make the necessary sacrifices.
Sorry, we suckered for this line when you made enough money to support us wimmen. You don't any longer - and that has reduced your economic (resource) worth, one of the big motivators behind pair bonding in humans.
Screw your narrow-minded view of prince charming riding in on his white horse to save the poor helpless female!!
Time for men and women to put the cards on the table and understand the true drivers for companionship, to resize their expectations and conform to modern reality of paired life outside of the central diver for reproduction of the species, AND to appreciate instead the important biological benefits of being in a moderately balanced and healthy partnership.
You fricking (1) LIVE LONGER and (2) you have a improved quality of life, and (3) you need a caregiver you can depend on if the worst happens. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 1:40:18 PM | Everyone might as well get used to the fact that being wanted AND needed is what everybody wants.
While financial problems and infidelity rank extremely high on the list of reasons to get divorced we ALL hear of the other one that gets mentioned alot.
Couples grow apart.
Why are they growing apart ? Because they no longer feel needed or wanted by the other partner. Why is that ? Because of the conditioning of todays world saying that you don't need or have to want anyone anymore.
We are all on this site (at least those of us looking for a relationship) because we all want and need to find the one that we want to be with.
If people didn't have those wants and needs then there would not be any singles site.
Note that I am not saying that you need a person in the traditional gender role. | |
|
| Women put women where we are today!?
Posted: 2/4/2007 1:55:15 PM | To be honest, if I met a man who thought his role in life was to kill spiders, open doors and jars, and keep a gun around, I would be running away soooo fast. Who is anyone to say that a man was raised to fulfill someones life by being the "protector".
Men open doors for you whether you are married to them are not.
I personally am glad that I am able to vote. I'm glad that there is a woman running for president. I am happy the women are where we are today. | |
|
|
|
Home
login 
