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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/4/2007 9:11:40 PM | MaxxRonin: "If there wasn't any more racism, then you would see AL Sharpton on unemployment. There is big money to be earned in keeping racism going."
Jordan: What a mess of f_ _king ignorance.
Who benefits from racism?!
Wealthy elite whites benefit by keeping the rest of us at each others' throats.
In America most whites think they have more in common with these wealthy elites than they do with Blacks, Latinos, Asians, etc.
But to tell the truth...they have very little in common with people who can afford to "sail around the world with a crew of 50 people for 6 months out of the year.
And why they're sailing around the world, they are making more money than any one particular white middle class person could make in 100 life times.
Al Sharpton does NOT need to take on racism to survive, but that's the mantra we often hear from under-informed whites who have never read Sharpton's biography, etc.
If a person is NOT into a particular group of people, then that is indeed racism.
Where and why did the person learn to hate another group?
The definition of being a racist is "To hold the belief that there are both inferior and superior groups of humans, and that physical characteristics are indicators of one's innate capacities, such as control of emotions, intelligence, and /or temperament."
In other words, a racist believes that he/she can simply look at another person and ascertain her/his level of intelligence.
Substitute "sexist" for racist and the meaning is the same.
Stereotyping means to "judge an entire group of people based on the actions of a few."
Prejudice means exactly how it's spelled: to prejudge.
Prejudice often precedes stereotyping, which leads to racism or discrimination.
So which (or a combination) of the three terms (racist, stereotyping, prejudging) above fits the women "who don't date Black men?" | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/4/2007 9:15:50 PM | pbmac3: "Never once thought the person was racist, just a personal preference."
Jordan: racism is NOT a personal preference.
People develop racist preferences through the teachings of their parents, their church/religion, movies, textbooks/schools, newspapers, etc.
What may seem to be a personal preference is an idea that has been planted in one's head by one's culture, which includes all the items in the preceding sentence and others. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 12:04:13 AM |
If a person is NOT into a particular group of people, then that is indeed racism.
Then please explain to me why it isn't called racism if I am East Indian or Asian or any other culture which might forbid inter-cultural marriages?
Where and why did the person learn to hate another group?
Not being attracted to someone doesn't mean you hate them. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 4:23:03 AM | (((If a person is NOT into a particular group of people, then that is indeed racism.
Where and why did the person learn to hate another group?)))
How is simply not being attracted to those outside of your own race racism ??
(((The definition of being a racist is "To hold the belief that there are both inferior and superior groups of humans, and that physical characteristics are indicators of one's innate capacities, such as control of emotions, intelligence, and /or temperament.")))
By your own definition that you put down racism has nothing to do with not being physically attracted to people of another race . I don't date outside my race , but i am not racist . I have no problem with people who do date outside their race and i don't think there is anything wrong with it .
Racism is to hate another group of people based on their race alone. You would look down on them as less then you and inferior if you were racist. It has nothing to do with attraction. Of course you are entitled to your beliefs no matter how wrong they are . | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 1:33:50 PM | | A lot of people don't see it that way. As a woman who's been exclusively with black men since 1993--until just recently--a lot of black men still seem insecure about race. I got IM'ed not too long ago by a black man. He wasn't subtle in telling me how interested he was in me. That was a "turn off". When I told him that I wasn't interested, he asked me THE QUESTION: "It's because I'm black!" I had to reassure him that wasn't the case. It was his approach. How could I be racist if I have a child with a black man? Heck my other child was with a man who is a secular Jew. Race, religious affiliation, national origin...those things I find interesting... not a turn off. I like people who are different from me. They interest me. Not that I'm not interested in white men. I'm attracted to men...period. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:05:48 PM | daydreamer: Then please explain to me why it isn't called racism if I am East Indian or Asian or any other culture which might forbid inter-cultural marriages?"
Jordan: Who told you that "it wasn't racism?"
daydreamer: "Not being attracted to someone doesn't mean you hate them."
Jordan: Something within one's culture had to plant the idea in one's mind that "one group is preferable to another."
People don't exist in a vacuum. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:09:34 PM | ((( Something within one's culture had to plant the idea in one's mind that "one group is preferable to another."))) No actually it just means that when you look at another race or races you simply don't find them attractive . What is preferable is not one race as being better then another , but in some peoples eyes simply more attractive to them .
I find my own race far more attractive then other races . I don't think my own race is better then any other race , just in my eyes at least more attractive . | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:11:08 PM | | Jordan if a persons preference is not hate based then it is not racism. Argue and whine about it all you want but you are not goin to change the facts. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:52:01 PM | Janice: "How is simply not being attracted to those outside of your own race racism ??"
Jordan: Look at the definition I provided for a racist above.
One's culture can teach one to "prefer one group over another based on physical characteristics."
(((The definition of being a racist is "To hold the belief that there are both inferior and superior groups of humans, and that physical characteristics are indicators of one's innate capacities, such as control of emotions, intelligence, and /or temperament.")))
Janice: By your own definition that you put down racism has nothing to do with not being physically attracted to people of another race .
Jordan: Cute....but I'm not amused.
The definition does apply to "only dating/marrying within one's own group (if there is such a thing...since all humans can be genetically linked to one African woman who lived several thousand years ago....so we ALL have a common ancestor...also see my thread "Race: The Power of An Illusion").
Obviously, to choose to date/marry within one's "own" group is an indication that "one believes that her/his group is superior to all others, whether it's intelligence, external traits, etc.
In the definition I initially gave, the key terms are "inferior and superior groups."
For example, if no Women of Color were able to participate, let alone win, the Miss World Beauty pageants decades ago, was that racism? Yes...in that "the organizers believed that some women are physically superior to other women."
Janice: Racism is to hate another group of people based on their race alone. You would look down on them as less then you and inferior if you were racist. It has nothing to do with attraction. Of course you are entitled to your beliefs no matter how wrong they are .
Jordan: I've been conducting diversity workshops for about 8 years, and know the meaning of a number of terms.
I've also conducted testing for the local and state Human Rights Commissions, and thus know that the definitions I gave are the definitions used to determine racism, etc.
The definitions I posted are accepted/embraced by a majority of researchers and other academics.
"Attraction" is the RESULT of being taught that "one group is superior to other groups in beauty/handsomeness, intelligence, etc., etc., etc.
Learn how to apply the definitions rather than simply interpreting them literally.
Going by your words, for example, "if a teacher had lower expectations for some students," then her/his beliefs would NOT be an example of being a racist.....because "low expectations is not part of the definition for racist."
Again, based on your words, "if an employer refused to hire members of a certain group," then her/his actions would not be racist because "employment is not part of the definition of racism ."
Again, the key terms in my definiton of racism is "belief in superior and inferior groups."
Once a racist has determined who is superior and who is inferior, he/she bases her/his treatment of groups on those perceptions, whether it's for employment, attraction for dating/marrying, disenfranchisement, appointment to boards of directors, police profiling, prison sentences (can this person be rehabilitated or "her race will prevent from from being rehabilitated?"....which is the argument of "The Bell Curve," by Murray and Herrnstein.
Further applying the definition:
If a racist believes women in group A are superior to women in group B, he will only hire women from group A to be models for his clothing line.
If a racist coach believes members of group A are athletically superior to members of group B, she will most likely recruit only from group A, without giving members of group B an opportunity to prove themselves.
And on and on and on. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:59:31 PM | luke: "This decision will sent the pendulem back the the cnter wherepeople will advance based on qualifications and not the color of your skin."
Jordan: Affirmative action has nothing to do with "advancement."
Affirmativer action only opens the door to being hired.
If you're doing a poor job, aff. action cannot save you from being fired.
If white people are supposed (self-nominated) to be sooooo much smarter, how come the overwhelming majority cannot define affirmative action?
Two, if Asian American students have the highest GPAs as a group in both high school and college, why aren't more of them in positions as CEOs and other upper-level positions?! Because under-qualified whites who are part of the good ol' boys network have the greatest chance of being chosen for a job. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:27:10 PM | csod: "a lot of black men still seem insecure about race. I got IM'ed not too long ago by a black man. He wasn't subtle in telling me how interested he was in me. That was a "turn off". When I told him that I wasn't interested, he asked me THE QUESTION: "It's because I'm black!" I had to reassure him that wasn't the case. "
Jordan: If we lived in a world or country where members of different groups have always had the freedom to date/marry anyone they wished, your words would have validity. However, that has not been the case historically in the US or some other countries.
In fact, in many states it was illegal for a white person to marry someone of African-, Asian-, Latino-, or "Native"-American ancestry as late as the 1960s.
Such marriages/dating or the production of children was known as miscegenation.
Note, it wasn't illegal for a Chinese man to marry a Black woman or a Latina to marry a "Native"-American man...just for whites marying People of Color.
Hence, if some Black men are motivated to ask, "Is it because I'm Black," it is NOT because they are insecure, but simply because they are cognizant of the historical social taboo among whites in regards to marriage or dating with People of Color.
Even today....inter-ethnic marriages ONLY makeup 7% of all marriages, which suggests the taboo still exists.
This has nothing to do with Black men, but with the fact that a lot of racial beliefs still exist.
And in many cases, white women who dare to date/marry men of another ethnicity may find themselves beaten, loss of a job, rejected by their families, etc., etc., etc.
I know a few white women who were written out of their fathers' wills for marying Black and other Men of Color.
"How could I be racist if I have a child with a black man?"
Did the Black man who asked that question know beforehand that you had a child with a Black man?! I seriously doubt if he did...because if he had known, he wouldn't have asked. That's not a fair example to be posting.
(however, one can still date members of other groups...and still hold racist beliefs, such as "you're NOT like the rest of them") Yeah, right. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:30:49 PM | dreadstalker: "Jordan if a persons preference is not hate based then it is not racism. Argue and whine about it all you want but you are not goin to change the facts."
Jordan: Why do you people always have to inject the term "whining" in your whiny messages?!
Please provide an example of a preference that is not rooted in hate/prejudice/racism. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:07:39 PM | Jordon: You say it's a "taught" thing to prefer one kind of person over another. I can't find supporting material immediately for this (I'll see if I can turn up any over the next week), but I do recall in the past reading something more along the lines of a person being more attracted to that which is similar to what they already grew up around and the strongest pull being towards someone similar to one's parents. Of course, there are plenty of cases that both support and go against that theory. I suspect it's a large combination of factors. The statistics probably support what I read though I think.
Now I can see where you can see that as supporting racism, but I don't see that as really intentional on the family's part. Based on the statement above, parents could teach their children not to be racist, but by the fact that both parents are white, the child shows a preference to whites. I think "superiority" is a touchy word to use here, because it automatically makes one think of KKK and Arian Nations and the like. Mentally I guess I'm relating this to watching the roosters prance around trying to attract a chicken's attention. The chicken chooses what she feels is the best rooster (aka the superior rooster). I don't think humans necessarily choose based on best or superior, because otherwise all the alcoholics, criminals, and wife beaters would be very lonely. Maybe more based on the environment they grew up in? Based on an accident of birth then, being born into same race parents, would make one automatically racist? Again, one starts getting visions of KKK and whatnot. Do you make any distinction at all between the average person, and those that go to the extremes on racism?
I think what can make the difference here in most of these arguments is what really is the end goal?
Back to the original question on page one, I can see where that would be defined as racism. I'm not basing that off of her statement of preference, but in her reaction.
On going through all the definitions of racism though, what is the desired end result?
To completely end every form of racism, wouldn't that mean that eventually there would have to be one world-wide race instead of separate races?
I'll be out for a few days, so it will take some time for me to read a response. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:47:11 PM | | I don't know if not dating people of a difference race makes you a racist. It just means they prefer something else. Some people won't date a fat person, some people won't date people who are mentally handicapped or whatever, and etc. etc. etc. I'm just throwing stuff out there. It's all about preference. But the "ewww" was unwarranted, really! | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:55:22 PM |
I don't know if not dating people of a difference race makes you a racist. It just means they prefer something else. Some people won't date a fat person, some people won't date people who are mentally handicapped or whatever, and etc. etc. etc. I'm just throwing stuff out there. It's all about preference. But the "ewww" was unwarranted, really!
Really? Being (a different race) is just like being fat, eh? Well I guess if a fat man can get on a stair master, then a man of color can get a moon tan and become lighter.
I roll on the ground with laughter at people always going with the "fat/bald" defense as a means of justifying prejudice/stereotyping/racism. | |
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Rhett1
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Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 368 | |
| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/5/2007 11:39:51 PM | Truman:
I cant blame the girls repley. If their were offsping they would be reguarded as raceless mongerals, despiced by most, of both races . Only people with no sense of humanity would "despise" a child.
Ive seen these childress , I rather dip my head in a bucket of snot, that look at such a sight. I'm sure they feel the same way about you.
Some white woman arnt brainwashed and perfer, insist, on full blood children of their race. Darling, there aren't a lot of "races" that haven't been watered down. I hate to tell you this, and I hope you're sitting down, because this may come as a shock...you're probably not pure yourself. I doubt your ancestors only ever got together with other people from only one country. Do you need a tissue? My great grandmother was from Scotland...do I believe for one second that every one of her ancestors was also born in Scotland? Nope. Oh wait, but isn't that okay because they're still white, right? Isn't that the REAL problem?
They dont relish the odds off living in a housing projest, and living off the state. ...and there it is, the most racist statement of this whole load of drivel. Someone get this man a bucket of snot... | |
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late™
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 369 | |
| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/6/2007 3:17:25 AM | Moderator Notice - See above:
DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS Do not respond to racist or other derogatory posts - it's just more to have to clean up
REPORT THEM HERE
Racist comments are NOT tolerated on this site.
- posting racist remarks WILL result in your posting privileges permanently revoked.
- it is also likely that a request will be made to delete your profile and block your comps unique IP.
Do note that; this site is hosted in Canada, where intolerance to hate is probably higher than some are used to.
- If you have a problem with different skin colours, cultures, ethnicities, etc? - "your kind" - aren't welcome here.
FAQ - Freedom of Speech
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:30:46 PM | Every time there is a conversation where peoples preferences is brought up someone is whining about it. Mainly because the person whining about it doesn't happen to fit that persons preference. Big deal! you are not everyones cup of tea.
Deal with it. | |
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Rhett1
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Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 371 | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/8/2007 7:51:10 PM | Call it intuition, but I think when a bunch of guys dressed from head to toe in white, come up to you and shout “You f***ing black c**t”, then proceed to smash you over the head with a baseball bat, is pretty much a conclusive case of racism.
Oh, sorry that was out of context. Dating huh?
No body chooses what they are attracted to (other wise there wouldn't be any paedophiles). So it's not really fair to blame people for not being attracted to you. By the arguement of "don't like blacks" = racist, then:
"Don't like fat people" = Fatist (Pun?)
"Don't like short/tall people" = Heightest
"Don't like poor people" = Classest
Well you get the idea... | |
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rykon
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Joined: 6/27/2007
Msg: 373 | |
| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:10:25 PM | Part of why what we today call "races" -- and I am thinking mainly here of three (Caucasoid, Black / African, and East Asian) who have the largest "differences" in appearance, etc, -- part of why these "races", these differences, developed over the tens of thousands of years since all of humankind migrated OUT of Africa is (or was rather) SEXUAL selection. Along of course with climate / habitat change, and so forth (as is already well known). At one time the very first modern humans coming out of Africa quite possibly , if not most probably, were what we today would consider black (possibly resembling , so I have read at least, and I stress possibly as who could ever KNOW this beyond a doubt, but, possibly resembling the San! Bushmen of the Kalahari region of Africa). If you look at pics of the latter, they tend to have a look that is almost a sort of "blend", if you will, of all three of the "races" mentioned in the first sentence.
But yes, sexual selection is now believed to have quite possibly been part of what led to specific traits (what we today would call racial , or perhaps ethnic, traits) developing in certain regions and remaining improbable, if not impossible, in others. Though in my opinion it probably had more to do with the climate and habitat changes our human ancestors underwent as they moved from region to region and thousands and thousands of years passed.
But let's talk about the "sexual selection" theory. Red hair (natural red; 'carrot' ) is not found (not very frequently at least) in , say, the Mediterranean regions, where skins tend to get more "olivish" , and will tan well (usually), or sometimes are even naturally a bit "brown" (like Latino-Americans). Red hair like that IS found frequently however in, say, Ireland or Scotland. This means, or it could well mean, that the people in the latter regions (Ireland and Scotland) sexually selected , that is, showed a distinct and ongoing "personal preference" for , over generations and generations, this genetic trait. This is why today, or , I should say in MY opinion it is at least a PART of why, one is not all that likely to find a pale skinned blue eyed redhead feeling her or himself immensely attracted (of course it happens at times, but, I'm just saying) to, say, a blue-black central African. Or, someone with very "black" skin and features who is descended from that part of the world. The Irishman , or Scotsman (or woman as it were) will more likely feel first attracted to someone whom she or he looks more like. Not always, of course, but, I maintain that much of the time this is the case.
Indeed if something like this were not the case, wouldn't we all essentially be one sort of light-brown light coffee-colored "race" by now?? It's the same way that black men and women (usually, again, NOT always) look first to members of the opposite sex who look most like they do, as opposed to picking out , as a first choice for a mate, a tall platinum-blonde blue-eyed Scandinavian (or descendant thereof). It's not racism (unless at the same time they're shouting invective about it, as the OP says he experienced with the female poster who rejected him because he is black). It's human nature, and natural preference(s) that are "hard-wired" (or so I believe at least) into our brains. Yes, there are cases, many many cases, of polar opposites attracting one another, but, again, if this were THAT widespread, if humans were somehow innately inclined towards the opposite of what I'm saying, whites towards blacks, and vice-versa, then by this period of human history , would we even be having this kind of discussion anymore??? Would we not already have "blended" even so much more than we already have??
Why is it that, the majority of the time (ok, I have no numbers or hard proof of this but am just going by personal observation) , one sees , as far as dating and marriage, "like going with like" (so to speak) ?? Now that just CAN'T all be the result of racial "baggage" left over from slavery or Jim Crow (in the case of the Americans here) or ... any other sociological factors one can come up with. There must be SOMEthing which is, if not biological, then damn near biological, behind these (general) aesthetic preferences. | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:24:25 PM | | Question for the OP: Does it really matter? If someone doesn't want to keep talking to you, then the point isn't *why* they don't want to keep talking to you -- it's that they don't. You could spend a lot of angst wondering why people do what they do, or you could go directly on to the next fish. If you've been snubbed because of your race, it's the other person's loss -- not yours. Keep your head up and keep fishing! | |
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| How do you tell if your a victim of Racism?
Posted: 7/11/2007 3:49:41 PM | She said ewww no, nothing else, just ewww no, and you play the racists card, bloody hell-whats wrong with you people?
Since when does ewww no imply anything??
It just implies she doesnt like the look of you, nothing more
And for the love of god-if you try and seek out something in a negative comment that sounds "racist" you will find it, even if its not there (oh, it must be because i am black/whatever) | |
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