| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/20/2007 1:29:39 PM | Hey everybody, get a life (lives).
Are you telling me people don't lie on their profiles? Age? Weight? Are you kidding me?
Everybody lies; it's not the major failing you people make it out to be. It's called "human nature," for God'sake.
And if one can't tell a 35 y.o. from a 26 y.o., she should get glasses. | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/20/2007 1:30:32 PM | MSG 75 Ok,,has your boyfriend told you he picks his nose or are you just assuming he does,,^^^^^  Just thought I would add something funny!!! | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/20/2007 2:23:13 PM | msg 75 not everyone lies ontheir profile.
It is like I have said many times
I would rather be loved for who I am
Then loved for who I am not. | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/20/2007 3:07:52 PM |
He asked me if i was listening to what they were talking about and i said no even though i did
You lied to him too! So in my books this realationship is already doomed! | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/20/2007 5:04:45 PM | | OP, you've been seeing this guy for 9 months, he said he's lied about 'small things', and you haven't met his daughter yet? what he considers small things, you may not...and if he lied about his age, that's not a small thing, IMO. If you've been dating this long, you should be able to talk about anything with him, and the fact that he's not as open with you would be ahuge red flag in my book. | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 6:06:59 AM | carrela: You are not being attacked and the OP should not be attacked either. She is asking for help and advice. She lied..he lied...why are you defending lies? She should come clean and give him the same opportunity. Just because one person lies it does not mean everyone else does. Just because someone is mature enough or had life experiences to understand and realize the damage that lies do...doesn't mean they think they are perfect, feel they are higher and mightier than anyone else..(that is just in YOUR mind, not mine). No where in my statement did I ever say or infer that, nor do I feel it. I can't control how you feel about yourself but I can control how I conduct my life and how I feel about myself. Just because I choose to live my life a certain way does not give you the right to sling insults and names at me. Name calling is never nice (liar, schmuck). I am sorry I am not going to say that I lie just to make you feel better about yourself.
I have seen first hand how those so called "little lies" destroyed a relationship. I see it when my little grandson tells me "little lies" and now most everything he says to me and others is not believed. When he gets frustrated and asks why we don't believe him we tell him because you lie. We are trying to teach him by example that lies are not acceptable. Is that wrong?
I reiterate...if one tells small lies how can you trust them with anything they say at all...therefore all lies are equal..they are all lies...and you can call me a liar to my face anytime you want but that does not make it true...does it? Does name calling make you feel better? It shouldn't.
You can use all of the examples you want to justify lies...but bottom line is a lie is a lie..by the way in your example excusing the need to lie have you ever heard of a thing called being "tactful" which eliminates the need to lie...i.e...why would the boyfriend feel the need to comment on how the woman looks after a bad day...why not just hug her and say honey things will get better,there will be better days ahead or, I am here for you. IF she asks how she looks...how do you know whether in his eyes no matter what, she does look beautiful. Are you saying he is a liar because he feels something other than what you expect him to feel?
Here is another clue for you....half of the divorces are not all caused by the husbands...women lie, cheat, etc. also and are often times just as much at fault and if you think anything different you are deluding yourself as you are deluding yourself that lies are ok.
Also by the way...it also bugs the hell out of me when people try to justify their need to lie by name calling and diversion.  | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 7:10:43 AM | Blondeandhappy: I think you missed the point I was trying to make. My point was just because there are some minor lies it doesn't mean that the relationship is based on lies and deceipt. Are you going to end your relationship with your grandson because he has lied to you? Of course you're not. And yes, by all means teach him that lying is bad but you still have to keep in mind that he is human and no one is perfect. I think everyone lies at some point whether it's minor or major (for lack of a better term). I still don't share the same view as you that all lies are equal. Tell me, do/did you tell your children (when they were younger)/grandson all about Santa? How about the tooth fairy?
You missed another point I was making. I was saying half of the divorces were made by women, the other half by men. Please re-read my previous post.
As for calling you a schmuck, I was calling us all schmucks. As for calling you a liar, if everyone lies, then we're all liars just to different degrees.
Please don't try to make it sound like I condone lying. I do not. Also you're not the only one who has been affected by people lying. I have experience in that area as well (they were big lies too).
I still maintain that no one is perfect and you're like everyone else. At some point you lie whether you want to admit it or not even if it's only a "white lie". Also I never felt like I was being attacked, you were the one that said I could attack you. I wasn't attacking anyone. Comments that people made saying that the OP was as bad as he was were a form of attack. I don't think she should have lied either but the fact of the matter is that she did and we don't know what reasons she had for it. At least I'm willing to accept that she's human and don't sit on a thrown to judge her for it. | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 8:02:23 AM | | carrela: I believe those who protest the loudest are the biggest offenders...and you my dear are protesting awful loudly...your profile makes mention of honesty more than once..but yet you defend "white lies" . I am not trying to make it sound like you condone lying...you are doing that yourself. Re-read your own post there was no misunderstanding and no points missed....I think the answer is obvious with my grandson(grandchildren)...he is being taught that lying is bad and wrong...no one is teaching him to be perfect as no one is perfect. Why would you consider if a person doesn't lie that they feel they are perfect? ....We all make mistakes..we are teaching him to admit when he lies...to face the consequences..not to lie...that things are better when he does not lie...is that so bad? Is it wrong? By eliminating lies from ones life it eliminates a lot of potential problems...again...there is that word "tact" ...which entails no need for white lies...does it? The tooth fairy, Santa....again life experience. I learned that it was not good to tell those white lies...and ...no I don't tell my grandchildren about Santa or the tooth fairy. If their parents choose to do so then that is up to them not me. They live by their own beliefs. Did I say I have never lied in my younger days...we all have in the past..(key words here, in the past)...it is what we do with it ..the knowledge of what those little white lies do to others and ourselves..it breeds mistrust. I am saying I learned from those indiscretions and I make it a point to conduct my life by not lying at all and if I am lied to in the beginning of a new relationship I am strong enough to take myself out of the relationship...end of story..Where do you get that I felt I am the only one affected by lies in a relationship? ....I am merely pointing out that those lies destroyed a relationship..sorry that you can't accept that...and there you go again voicing your own insecurities by accusing me of being a liar...sitting on a throne...judging others... where on earth did you read that in my post? No one is being judgmental....no one is sitting upon a so called throne...You are the one not willing to accept everyone is human--you are the one who willing to condone and defend lies and attack others in order to back yourself up by resorting to name calling and reading things into a post that is not there based upon your own insecurities. Why does it scare you so much to find others who don't resort to lies? Read the other posts...there are a lot of people who feel the same way as me. Maybe you should take a good look at yourself. | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 9:20:41 AM | Blondeandhappy: Have whatever opinion of me you want. You don't know me and personally I don't care what you think. You can think I'm protesting all you want, I was just stating in previous posts that people (all of them) lie and while I don't condone lying, I'm capable of getting over it if it's not of much consequence.
no I don't tell my grandchildren about Santa or the tooth fairy. If their parents choose to do so then that is up to them not me.
My guess is that you know that the parents are telling your grandson about Santa or the toothfairy. If you say nothing, you're going along with that lie and in my books that the same thing as actually telling the lie.
I am merely pointing out that those lies destroyed a relationship..sorry that you can't accept that
You are the one not willing to accept everyone is human
I can't accept that? Pfff... I'd ask what the hell you're talking about but I don't care. I said in my previous post that I have experienced being lied to and what it does. I'm not will to accept everyone is human? Ummmm, I do accept everyone is human and telling lies (regardless of frequency or intensity) is part of the equation.
It's funny how you mention "reading things into a post that is not there" since you seem to be doing that a lot with my posts. You have no idea what my insecurities are. Calling you a liar? I was saying that everyone is a liar at some point (yourself included). At this point I think you read what you want to read and interpret it in a way that it was not intended. Those who know me know that I don't condone lying, but because I say that it happens (people do lie), the people who know me don't blow it out of proportion and make it sound like I'm defending lies. I think some people saw an opportunity to jump on the OP like a pack of wolves and just because I jumped in to stick up for her, you took it upon yourself to try to put me in my place. Sorry, but it didn't work. You can think whatever you want of me, but be aware that I have the right to think of you or anyone else as I see fit.
In any case, we can go back and forth like this for the rest of our lives and never get any further. Personally I'm tired of it and I have better things to do. I stated my point of view, you stated yours. You don't like it? Tough. Enough said. | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 11:22:10 AM | carrela: I do have my opinion of you dear and sadly it is not a very good one...it seems that while proclaiming not to condone lies...you also express that it is ok to tell white lies...is that not a contradiction? In my (yes my) opinion when you are backed into the corner you start back stepping making claims about things that don't exist then putting blame elsewhere...dear your insecurities are very obvious to all with your remarks about being high and mighty, sitting on a throne...etc. again ...where did those remarks come from? and yes ....please feel free to have whatever opinion of me that you want..unlike you, I do care what others think of me...that is being honest...it does bother me that you are trying to browbeat me into being a liar and trying to defend yourself by being cruel (name calling). I am not perfect and I am the first person to admit that but I will not be bullied into being labeled a liar because you or anyone else has a problem with my strong beliefs about lying. As for friends..my friends will tell you that I don't lie..and I don't condone so called white lies for any reason whatsoever and if they ask my opinion about whether they should lie to get out of a situation, etc. I will tell them that I feel it is wrong....but only because they asked my opinion...not because I feel it is my place in the world to insert my opinions on them. Everyone has the right to choose how they conduct their own lives.
"I'm capable of getting over it if it's not of much consequence."
Everyone is capable of "getting over lies" and every lie has a consequence whether small or large...every lie...leads to distrust...If you were my friend and you lied to me...I would find it hard to believe anything you said in the future or to trust you. That does not mean I would not remain friends with you because I would remain friends and that is my choice. In a relationship...I also have a choice whether to live with a liar (and spend my life trying to decipher what are lies and what are not) or to cut the liar lose..In a relationship I choose to cut the liar lose...thus my life...yes...my life...will be the better for it. I don't care what the liar's life is like..he made his bed by lying...he has to deal with it not me. Harsh yes, but honest.
"My guess is that you know that the parents are telling your grandson about Santa or the toothfairy. If you say nothing, you're going along with that lie and in my books that the same thing as actually telling the lie"
Obviously your guess is correct I do know the parents are telling the grands about Santa, etc.....and your guess would be correct that millions of others in the world are also doing the same thing....am I a liar because I don't go to all of those people and tell them they shouldn't do this.... what goes on in others homes (whether it be my sons home or not) is their right...do you understand that concept or are you just grasping at anything to prove yourself to others?
"Calling you a liar? I was saying that everyone is a liar at some point (yourself included)."
There you go again, just can't help yourself can you.....calling others a liar....please do yourself a favor...and take a good look in the mirror before you resort to the detrimental art of calling others names. It just isn't very kind or mature at all. I have chosen NOT to lie and that is my right....You have obviously chosen the opposite path and have chosen to call others a liar because you can't deal and that is your right.
BTW-- no one took it upon themselves to put you in your place. If you felt that, it is all in your mind. I stated my opinion...you became offended because I believed otherwise ...and you made it personal by your name calling, being a bully and attacking.
You are correct....enough of this...you live your life as you are and hey if you don't feel good about yourself..that is your problem..and it is up to you to do something about it..not up to me...and I will live my life as I am...and as you said.. if you don't like it tough....we have gotten off of the beaten path but perhaps the OP will glean some information that is of use to her. have a great day...smile. | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 11:58:06 AM |
The tooth fairy, Santa....again life experience. I learned that it was not good to tell those white lies...and ...no I don't tell my grandchildren about Santa or the tooth fairy
I can personally attest to the fact that Santa is real (maybe not how he is depicted on television) but real none the less........I have never seen the tooth fairy yet, but nor have I seen the wind. But I have seen the evidence of both.
I've never seen a lie either, but I've seen the evidence of them as well | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 12:20:51 PM |
I was just stating in previous posts that people (all of them) lie
I think it's pretty presumptuous to assume that *all* people lie, even if it's a 'little white lie'...some of don't even do that - especially as we were taught that if one can't say anything good then they shouldn't say anything at all...So, go ahead, let someone ask me what I think of their new haircut or outfit...they'll get the truth, not a little white lie...People shouldn't ask questions if they can't handle the honest answers ;) | |
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fuzzle
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Joined: 4/27/2006
Msg: 89 | |
| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/21/2007 3:42:32 PM |
"maybe small things but nothing that matters why?"
hmm. It sounds that he's kind of a guy who distorts the facts for the sake of convenience. Not a good character trait.
Like msg 9 says, not a good character trait. So it's okay for him to lie about small things? Small things in whose opinion, his or yours? So if he sleeps with one of your friends and lies about it because he considers it a small thing, will that make it okay with you?
Continue to let him lie to you and he will - he'll lie to you about anything he wants to lie about - big or small! People treat you the way that you let them! | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 3:46:54 PM | | Seems like you may be even. He lied about his age, you lied to him about hearing about it. And yeah, I'm one of those weird people who considers any lie a lie, never saw them with colors. Even if it's something trivial, you're setting up bad habit patterns. I'd fess up and admit I did hear it and was curious why he lied about his age, and then you'll have to tell him why you lied. Up to you whether you want to go there or not. | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 8:04:44 PM | | hey bogart12 msg76:....I don't lie. Why would you assume everyone does? I agree with what drg1301 says "I would rather be loved for who I am then loved for who I am not." | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 8:44:46 PM |
hey bogart12 msg76:....I don't lie. Why would you assume everyone does?
looking4u2345, bogart12 is saying that to feel better about him/herself. This person obviously lies as easily as breathing air so they don't want to feel alone.
Being dishonest in a relationship is stupid. I mean it is completely and utterly moronic. Your mate should know who you are and what you're about more than any other person on the planet (except maybe your parents). Why lie? | |
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Posted: 2/21/2007 9:20:08 PM | | Blondeandhappy: Yeah, whatever. As for you not having a good opinion of me, I'm heartbroken. That wasn't a lie, it was sarcasm... You don't know me so I just have to consider the source when someone says something like that. | |
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Posted: 2/22/2007 4:20:00 AM | white lie - "yes, hon, the chicken tastes great, cant wait til we have it again" - when in all honesty, it is dry or not to one's taste. this is more like a fib in my book, not meant to hurt someone, just meant to ease thier feelings
big lie - "i'm 26" when in actuality, he is probably 35. now why would a guy lie about something like that? because your profile said you didnt want to meet anyone over 29? If this guy is so closemouthed about things after 9 months, I think he has major things to hide. Maybe he was in jail or prison for 9 years, so he doesnt think he aged during that time? either way, it is a huge warning - or at least should be - all the things you have mentioned. evasiveness has no place in a relationship. while there are certain things i wont discuss early in a relationship, I think that after 9 months one should be a bit more open. and the mere fact that you are having doubts about his honesty, heck, even his life story, should have alarm bells going off all over town | |
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Posted: 2/22/2007 6:03:13 PM | My, my, my.... all of this controversy just because I simply stated, a lie, is a lie, is a lie, big or small, white or black a lie is a lie!!
BTW I still stand behind that statement...I did not say that I don't or have never told a lie in my lifetime, I will however, say that I will never willing tell a lie no matter what...Keeping my mouth shut is called an error of ommission, not a lie...There is also evasion... which is also not a lie...not always the best option but still, not a lie...
Anyway... my statement was not meant to be an attack on anyone, just simply asking a question... If there is lies there is no trust, without trust what do you have? JMHO | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/22/2007 7:14:21 PM | | Seems to me like lying comes easy to him. I don't like this guy. Send him back and pick a different one! | |
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e-wok
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Joined: 9/25/2006
Msg: 97 | |
| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/22/2007 7:22:49 PM | I think he knows she knows he's a liar and vice versa...and neither is
gonna budge and be open with one another.
It kinda makes you want to be single. | |
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Posted: 2/23/2007 4:24:50 PM | I dont know about other people, but I DONT LIE! NOT NOW NOT EVER!!!!
If someone lies to me they are insulting my intelligence and violating my trust and I will let them know it, give them a chance to make good or cut em off! Sorry thats me!
I dont lie because its not worth the time or effort to do so and only fosters more lies... sooner or later people or the person you have lied to will find out and then you will have lost trust, and since trust is earned not given... I'd rather not try recover something I had, I just make sure I dont loose it in the first place.
Some may call me idealistic, some may call me harsh, I call myself real....
And if you accept people lying to you... I think it is you that needs to get a life, an HONEST ONE!!!  | |
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| Do i push the issue????
Posted: 2/23/2007 4:48:02 PM | There is no excuse for a lie,big or little.I should rephrase that,maybe if it is about a surprise party or something like that it is okay.If he has been letting you think he is 26 he is lying to you,if he is letting the other guy think he is 35,he is lying to him.Sounds like the guy is a born liar.He will lie again and again.
I am not an expert,but you deserve better,don't you think?Hope it works out for you,whichever way you decide to go.Good luck. | |
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