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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 1:52:09 PM | Being a narcissist is not about talking about yourself all the time, its not about hogging the limelight, it is a weird and twisted world that becomes so unreal - even you cannot tell right from lies in the end until you get your freedom and can see it was all so wrong, very wrong.
Narcissistic Personality Disorder - Recognizing the Problem
Recognizing the fact that you have been living with a partner who is affected by NPD, is surely the first step of dealing with the issue.
However, before someone might be classified as being narcissistic, it is important to keep in mind that, like every psychological disorder, narcissistic personality disorder too comes in various degrees. Going to the extreme, we might argue that each of us has somewhere a narcissist in her/himself. It even could be said that a narcissistic tendency is important for survival. However, in the same context it must be emphasized that, while a narcissistic tendency is constructive, a fully elaborated or developed symptomatic of NPD is nothing but destructive.
Psychologically there are several criteria which have been applied to this personality disorder. These are:
* The narcissist can not take perspective, hence situations are blown out of proportion
* The narcissist has little or no empathy. This means that (s)he cannot identify with the feelings or thoughts of another person
* The narcissist is preoccupied with her/his personal distress
* The narcissist cannot accept authority and hence has little concern for morals
* The narcissist feels easily inferior and will try to be seen as superior
* The narcissist is narcissistic hypersensitive, and hence cannot accept any form of critique
* The narcissist is an exhibitionist and needs sexual admiration
* The narcissist is exploitative, vain and not self-sufficient
So the question is whether the man or the woman you are living with are so strongly affected by this disorder that you will have to seriously confront the issue or whether the condition is mild and maybe after some adaptations it is possible to agree on a harmonious life together. However, this page will focus on the first scenario where the disorder poses a serious threat to the relationship as well as to your existence.
There is much one can read about the symptoms of NPD and yet exactly this can be more than confusing, and you might find yourself going through a checklist of symptoms in order to arrive at some conclusion. However, the list above should give you some idea. Still, there is another element which is just as important and this quite possibly the most important item for you to look at:
Just to give an idea, this is not about looks or talking, it is about controlling another persons life to a degree that you are suffocated. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 2:05:01 PM | | I have dated a true narcissist and it was no picnic! It ended quite badly and I studied up on the disorder to stay clear of them. Narcistic personalities are quite prevailent in the working circles I frequent due to working with corporations and banks. I cannot fathom a true narcissist being a good partner. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 4:11:39 PM |
* The narcissist can not take perspective, hence situations are blown out of proportion
i have most definitely seen this. the slightest little thing turns into a crisis. they're the ONLY ones who have to deal with traffic, housecleaning, bosses, bills, and so on. the universe routinely singles them out for 'punishment.'
The narcissist is preoccupied with her/his personal distress
this kind of goes along with the first criterion.
The narcissist feels easily inferior and will try to be seen as superior
if the delusions of grandeur didn't look so pathetic, i could consider it amusing. but fantasies easily become reality for these people. it puts me in mind of tom sawyer play-acting at heroism in situations that turn deadly for those around him.
The narcissist is narcissistic hypersensitive, and hence cannot accept any form of critique
and anything and everything you say, regardless how innocent, becomes construed as criticism. it seems like they go looking for offense in every comment you make.
good luck to anyone who encounters one of these winners. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 6:07:30 PM | | My x-boyfriend is one. We lived together for only 9 months. A psychologist actually was the person who suggested that maybe he was, and I looked it up. All of the traits were pertaining to his personality. It also read that they very very rarely change, even with a lot of therapy. And from what I learned about him, he does not think that he needs help. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 6:12:58 PM |
The narcissist can not take perspective, ... Yah, my x was this way.
The narcissist has little or no empathy. This means that (s)he cannot identify with the feelings or thoughts of another person. He didn't care about my feelings. As far as I can remember, I don't think he even knew I had them.
The narcissist cannot accept authority and hence has little concern for morals. They are criminals sometimes, like my x....in and out of jail, and is now pretty much not changed much.
The narcissist feels easily inferior and will try to be seen as superior. Yep, they love to boss others around.
The narcissist is exploitative, vain and not self-sufficient. My x isn't self sufficient. He is basically living in a homeless shelter, for about 8 years. And thinks it's ok. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 6:18:24 PM | | I was married to one for unfortunately 4 years. It's my fault for staying it in that long. It should have ended after the honeymoon. He got angry at me on the second day and slept in another room. He told me that I was not allowed to question anything he did or express my opinion - he put on a good act for 1 1/2 years that we dated. It was a definite learning experience. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/4/2008 7:00:17 PM | Yes, my last ex was definitely a narcissist. Of course I'm not qualified to diagnosed but if you read up on Narcissistic Personality Disorder and the traits someone w/ NPD has, it was him to the letter.
-lack of empathy
-lack of conscience
-overinflated opinion of himself
-feeling he was superior to everyone
-constant lies and embellishments; either to cover his arse or to make himself look more important
-all about having his needs met, constantly - but no consideration whatsoever for the needs of others
-no remorse whatsover. could say or do the most nasty and cruel of things - then 2 days later want to take me for dinner like nothing had happened. It was surreal. I used to wonder if he just 'blocked out' his evil-ness but then I started reading up on NPD and it then began to make sense. Narcissists just don't have a conscience so when they do or say something that's vile and awful, to them it's totally justified and they have no remorse
-total inability to ever say "thanks" or "i'm sorry"
-couldn't stand to be criticized but he lived to pick at me constantly. In all our time together I'm not sure I ever received a compliment (maybe a couple of back-handed ones) but not a day went by that he didn't have something negative to say about me, something sarcastic
-very manipulative
I wished I'd learned about it all much sooner because I would have spent much less time trying to get through to someone who was far too disordered to ever 'get it.' | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/9/2008 3:28:00 PM | | This has been an amazing post quadmom...it awful what NPD people get away with and how much they hurt others doing it without conscience. They devastate a family, and think nothing of it. When called out on it, they turn it on you like a mirror, so they can deflect their bad behavior. They NEVER GET IT! Thank God we do. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/13/2008 6:15:03 AM |
This has been an amazing post quadmom...it awful what NPD people get away with and how much they hurt others doing it without conscience. They devastate a family, and think nothing of it. When called out on it, they turn it on you like a mirror, so they can deflect their bad behavior. They NEVER GET IT! Thank God we do.
I think you should consider that having such a disorder isn't a choice and likely results from genetic predisposition, early trauma and other external factors.
You're right that they devastate others and think little or nothing of it... they will even show contempt for the people they hurt... they never get it. What if that was you? What if you couldn't feel love?
I've never been more devastated in my life then after a seven year relationship with a narcissist. I felt utterly abused, but the way it all shook out it looked like I was the one at fault. Like with all breakups I had my part but this destroyed every ounce of self confidence I had, I was questioning everything I knew about relationships and communication. It was the worst thing that ever happened to me, I truly believed I had a soulmate and that ideal was shattered... I've felt plenty of anger.
But now that I've been clear of it for over a year now, I feel nothing but pity for her. I couldn't imagine living that life. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/13/2008 7:31:54 AM | Date? Hell no, that would have been easy, I could have at least gotten away - my mom is one and my dad wasn't around growing up...now THAT's torture. I was raised by one.
I read up on it and if you have a family member that is the only recommendation that I can find for it professionally is distance. I mean, it's not like they'll ever admit they are and want to work on it in therapy (tho they are quick to recommend it to you anytime you point something out).
My mom moved about 1200 miles away coincidentally...with my younger sister, who lives there. The phone calls are constant from my sister - I was the child who got the brunt of it, but now there's no leverage to me at such a distance, so my poor sister's learning first hand what she's about, and it's sad to relive it thru her.
Oh well...I do feel for those who have anything to do with these people, however. So I never dated one, but my mom ruined me for dating for most of the years following... | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 10:32:50 AM | | Tree I too have found the quiet place and pity him. However I endured this for 22 years and didn't know as you didn't what was going on. I do feel pity for his disorder however I also know that pity feeds his need to manipulate his children. I have to do what is best for them. He used up his dance card with me and being divorced from him no longer means I have to understand him or feel sorry for him. He got this way from childhood abuse, and was predisposed from a bi polar mom and an NPD/Alkie dad. I feel pity he had to endure that. But don't assume I need to feel or be a certain way, or the way you do, because what I endured was different than yours ,but similar. I was in it 3 times longer than you were. It doesn't lessen either of our pain. However my exposure time to him was devastating. I went to therapy for several years with someone who specializes in post tramatic stress...they said what he caused his family was severe. I also sought the help of an NPD specialist to learn coping skills for having to deal with someone with NPD. My children need coping skills...someone has to teach them so they don't grow up feeling like I did ,when we lived with him. They have one hour of supervised visitation with him a week, I don't want that to become normal to them.They have to learn how to deal with their mentally ill father. The work I have done and the research and studying has been exponential. We are lucky to be alive and to be survivors of such a horrible ordeal. I have to take care of my children and not concern myself any longer with my ex_NPD. That would be codependant on my part. I feel no anguish or anger any longer...Take care and good luck to you...you have survived something most will never understand. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 10:51:43 AM | Heavens, your explanation is perfect. Yes, I dated one for ten long months. All he ever talked about was himself and how important, successful, handsome (although he was bald, skinny, and quite- average looking , which was fine to me). I was not a person to him; I was merely an extension of his greatness. He preferred I dressed up and wore make-up always, as my appearance was only significant if it made him shine. When I needed a friend, he was worthless, yet he cried for weeks when I finally left him.
He also had the rage issue about which you mentioned. I should have known from the first date, as he talked/bragged about himself for hours. His initials (really) are B.D. I began referring to him as "Been there. Done That." If you climbed Mount Everest to Base Camp 1, he climbed to Base Camp 5.
Run like the Devil himself is chasing you, because he is! | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 10:55:01 AM | | hey ,i know just what you went through ,well maybe not to such a extent .i met this man on pof and we hit it off .everything was good .but it seemed that as soon as i was out of his site he'd call and bam it was all downhill from there ..the thing is that i really liked him and wanted it to work ....but he'd call and i'd run and then within hours i was nothing but sh-- in his eyes .everything was my fault .i think i might have breathed the wrong way....so i decided to write him off ..oh no that was to easy ..he had to write and call me once again and even mentioned marriage ...so again i tried and the next night i called and listen to him call me names and say things to me i wouldn't say to my worst enemy...so i again walked away and he wrote me again ...i think i'm a kind person and patient , but i really liked him and i thought he was confused ,,,but needless to say i had to walk away ....any amount of understanding you give them doesn't mean a thing..lesson learned i hope for mysake ..... | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 11:10:43 AM | Yes, Ive dated a narcissist...he used to stand in front of the mirror in the morning, after staying the night and say...
'whose handsome'? and then disappear to see his other friends/ladies and leave
me feeling like shit. He doesnt care for anyone apart from himself.
I now know after reading the links what he is. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 11:20:51 AM | I had an abnormal psych class in college. My teacher was a retired psychologist. She said one day, that if we got nothing else from the class, learn this: NEVER date a narcissist or a sociopath, or you will be assured a life of misery.
People with these disorders:
1) Cannot be fixed
2) Do not want to be fixed
3) Avoid detection of their condition by the general public
4) Have no compassion for others
5) Are found strangely attractive by some people (you know who you are)
Run away now!! | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 5:16:13 PM | Yes, I have, unfortunately, and men with other personality disorders. This is one of the personality disorders that the professionals state that there is no cure . . . . I've walked away from numerous marriage opportunities because of these issues.
The relationship will not be worth it at all. You are better off alone. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 5:22:37 PM |
I had a short term with one a couple of years ago. I count it as a lucky escape now.
Me too, a couple years ago, for a couple month, I actually escaped also. Really I escaped in the middle of the night, when he was out with another woman.
Your last sentence sums it up,quadmom. These people have lots of short relationships and never stay in one for very long. They blame the world for all their woes.
True.
And this particular thread triggered the memories bad memories. I mailed him some literature on the Narcissistic Personality Disorder. And I hope he liked it.
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 7:10:58 PM | I've had a number of dating experiences with them. One was a couple of years ago, and it was extremely painful. I didn't pay attention to a big red flag. On our first date he told me he had never had a relationship with a woman last longer than six months, and he was 40 years old at the time! It was totally my fault for not running then, but he was good looking and had that typical narcissistic charm that they cultivate to suck people into their lives, then distastefully spit you out when you begin to bore them and they want fresh blood. I admit I can be easily attracted to them at first. But many people are.
They truly are real vampires, completely dead and empty inside. I still see this guy cruising all the internet social groups, going to bars and parties to constantly pick up new women. He has very little other interests. Alienated, bored much of the time, with a few very superficial friendships based on playing volleyball together. That's it. And they never change. They're the same, year after year, stuck in their prison of lack of a sense of "self." Very dangerous and devastating people to become involved with. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 7:18:41 PM | They thrive on zapping the "life" out of you.
They are toxic and poisonous.
They are too "superior" (delusional) and self-absorbed to ever realize just how disordered they are. Everyone around them "has the problem."
They have no soul.
Every word and every action of theirs is motivated solely by what they stand to gain from those words and actions.
They feel a great sense of power and satisfaction to make those they're in a relationship, feel crushed and devastated. It gives them a real "high."
They go from one relationship to the next, devaluing and discarding those who love them. To them, people are disposable when they no longer serve a purpose.
The world and everyone around them, in their mind, revolves around them.
They have no moral compass, no conscience, no concept of their being consequences for their words or actions - it's like they can genuinely "block out" the horrible things they do and say, as if they never happened.
To share your life with one, is a surefire road to nowhere. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 8:47:32 PM | Ok wutznot2love, that last post there of yours basically describes my last relationship. I didn't see this pathology coming until it was enveloping me. Relapsed one time after ending it (after discovering the lies upon lies and cheating which he managed to blame all on ME--which was pretty standard in the relationship) and then ran for my life after that. Cut all ties, deleted my email account and left w/ him owing me money--he is still hanging on to that w/ some ransom for me to have to see him (like he can't just mail it)--I will never see or speak to that monster again. Couple months later now I feel like I have been reborn--that sucker was draining the very life force out of me, just being in his presence. I feel so happy and alive now that I extricated myself from that toxic waste dump. I will NEVER fall in to that trap again...warning signs were there from day one.
Not the least of which his OWN MOTHER warning me very sternly about getting involved with him. Within one day of meeting her! Of course I felt sorry for him--his own mother speaking so ill of him-- but now understand that she was seriously giving me a stern warning knowing what the brick wall I was headed for. She made me promise to not make a long term commitment to him until I got to know his "other side". Well, I sure did get to know it. Scary as hell.
Yeah your list there really nails it. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 9:06:19 PM | Wow, her warning to you is kind of eerie, hey? Not too common for a parent to warn their child's partner like that. Guess that says a lot.
The most difficult thing about dealing with a narcissist is that they are so cleverly manipulative; even a very sharp person can be manipulated. They are, truly, the 'masters' of manipulation.
What I found most exasperating was trying to "get through" to him. It was an exercise in futility. I had never before met anyone like him - so cold, so vindictive, so spiteful, so without conscience, so nasty -- then could turn it all around and be sweet and seemingly genuine. A real Jekyll & Hyde. But it was subtle, over time. Once I started reading up on Narcissistic Personality Disorder, the bells started going off -- and finally "it all made sense." Though it was difficult as well - because when you begin to understand how an N thinks, you realize they are incapable of love -- and then you have to face the fact that they never really loved you (though of course you constantly questioned, to yourself, whether they did).
Once you start to learn about this disorder, the things that boggled your mind for so long, finally start to make sense. Their lack of empathy, that look of sheer pleasure in their eyes when they'd make you cry or upset, their complete lack of interest in you/any part of your life, their uncanny and consistent ability to block out their nastiness. It's exasperating dealing with an N - because (thank God), we don't think like them, we don't view the world like them - we have feelings, a heart, the capacity to love and accept/cherish love...........we feel awful if we become aware that we've hurt someone whereas they are silently (or not to silently) gleeful to know they've hurt someone.
They are amazing button pushers. They zero in on a partner's weakness and vulnerabilities and they use them to their advantage. They are bullies, they are passive-aggressive, they are the epitome of self-absorbed.
Lies roll off their tongues with great ease..........so much so that they don't know where the truth ends, and the lie starts. They can't even keep their lies straight because there's so many variations of them.
They are needy and expect their partner to bend over backwards for them; but they give nothing in return, not one iota.
They take great pleasure in witnessing the misfortune of others, it gives them a great laugh and causes them to feel all the more superior.
Even when the relationship is over - because you had enough and left for good -- they will continue to taunt you and try to push your buttons. To them, any kind of attention you can give them - even the most negative - is "narcissistic supply" that they live for.
From what I've read, most of them are the type who can't handle being "alone for long." They jump from relationship to relationship, never learning a thing from the one they previously destroyed (why would they have to? they were 'perfect').
I actually feel sorry for them. On the surface they may give the illusion of being happy and having the world by the tail but they will never know true happiness. They will never know true love. Their lives are nothing but a facade; an act, a farce. It's sad, really. But not as sad as the many good people they crush along the way.
But when you finally break free, it is like the biggest weight has been lifted off your shoulders. You feel such peace. You take pleasure in the most simple things in life. You thank God to be away from the constant chaos and drama and tension and uncertainty. You feel born again, in a lot of respects. You see the world again in a whole new hopeful and positive way. The "N fog" has lifted. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/16/2008 9:25:26 PM | Your posts are like reading an encyclopedia entry describing my last relationship. He brought another woman in to my house for God's sake, my beautiful Master bathtub and my BED and yet managed to blame it all on me for, get this, being "selfish". I gave and gave and GAVE in to this bottomless pit of needs it's just so unbelievably mind boggling it could all be turned inside out to me being "selfish". I work in a "helping profession" and all my life have been told I OVERgive until this freak came along, taking my vulnerabilities and crucifying me with them (never tell a Narcissist your vulnerability--they may seem like they care but all they are doing is "gathering information" to attack you with later--yeah, that quote is from my Ex--"gathering information").
He did give me "things" but expected I devote all my /our life to his needs, his demanding self imposed schedule, his odd hours/work habits, his sexual oddities,e tc. I had never, once in my entire sexual life been with a man who derived ZERO pleasure from pleasing the woman...it was all about how much I could do for him and any pleasure I would derive had to be sort of incidental--yet his cheating was blamed on how I didn't "give freely". If I even had a thought of "reciprocation" while basically servicing him like an unpaid prostitute, he could pick up on the thought and it would kill his buzz--he truly looked me in the eye and said I could "salvage" our relationship if I learned how to focus on pleasing him 100% of the time, and ONLY that, never as in NEVER wanting or expecting anything back from him sexually. If I ever thought about getting any sexual gratification, EVER, that was indicating how "selfish" I was. He said this to me with a straight face. So many absurdities that you can hardly believe a person like that exists, therefore it's easy to go in to denial. He said these freakish things to me the last night I ever saw him (or will see him) in an attempt to win me back! Unbelievable.
I explained so many of his odd self absorbed behaviors on his sleep apnea, his obvious drinking problem, his exhaustion, his over working, etc. etc. Yet when I started reading (thank God I stumbled upon that info) on NPD, it ALL fit. He had so many women he was juggling on so many burners it wasn't even funny. Yet he's a total loser with nothing really to show for his life in his mid 40's--jumps from apt. to apt., woman to woman, drives a truck his mother gave him, owns nothing of value, has no real job stability and is most of the time negative and depressed and a "sad sack". Yet can win women w/ his charming ways until they run kicking and screaming away from him. He does manage to rope many of them back in which he tried with me--basically stalking me after I ended it with incessant calls (AFTER my one email telling him to never contact me again) until I ignored him so consistently, that he's disengaged..for now. Still holding on to the money he owes me though as I'm sure some hope of contact point. Again, I will NEVER see or speak to this nighmare again, well worth every cent of what he owes me.
The irony though isn't lost on me. I break up w/ the man for lying for MONTHS to me in so many ways (of course about other women), cheating on me , etc. Then he says I can "salvage" our relationship by just learning to be more "giving" to him in the bedroom (when our relationship had fallen to basically me JUST giving him what he wanted sexually getting nothing back). Tells me I'm so "selfish" and don't understand "the joy of giving" (COUGH!) . Yet it ends on the note where HE owes ME money. That's almost funny.
There are people w/ Narcissistic traits then there is the full on disorder. That is about as close to the Devil (if I believed in one) that I ever want to get...EVER.
Yes your last lines there describe exactly as I've been feeling...like reborn. My life force back (it took several weeks though), my innocence returning, my belief in goodness again...I feel like I had a freaking near death experience honestly! | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/17/2008 2:21:50 PM | I guess this thread won't die because it all too common.
My NPD walked away about 6 months ago, moved to another city, with my encouragement.  No contact at all, until.............
Last week he texted me telling me how much he loved me and how we should be together. I should move out to his town. (Also 44 years old, never married, wanderer, no home, no good job, etc.)
I responded with my needs for that to happen and he disappeared! lol. Now he's put up another profile on here. Ha, ha. Says he has a masters degree! He didn't finish high school.
He's very cheap in all ways and wouldn't use a pay dating site ever. Girls beware. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 6/17/2008 7:52:43 PM | | This thread won't die because so many of us have been trashed by people with PD and other issues, such as addiction. That's why I'm single . . . . still looking for "normal" that we can share life in a healthy way. (This is not to say other "baggage issues" such as an extended divorce, etc.) It's very hard to find someone who you are attracted to who is "free" to love, again. | |
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