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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 2:45:12 AM | Alright, so we're dealing with a heavy hitter of a topic. So its only fitting that my reply will be a bit...serious, and uncomfortable. But I think NPD is simply a nicer way of saying "sociopath". To say that a sociopath has a mental/personality disorder is to invalidate the experience with a sociopath, and only serves to give them an "excuse" for there behavior. Anyone else agree here?
Charity | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 4:48:37 AM | I have dated a true Narcissist. I never want to again. He was so full of himself that when I would touch his arm he would flex his his bicep muscle to show off. Yes he did go to the gym frequently and was in great shape. He really didn't need to flex. He was also always preening himself and fixing his generous head of hair.
In reality I think he really had a self esteem issue. It was almost like he was trying way to hard to be full of himself. He didn't need to worry, the guy was in great shape, very good looking, well read, well written and seemed to have his act together. Turns out he is an alchoholic and does nothing to help himself with this disease.
Conditions have created his narcissitic personality. What a shame. He ain't pretty he just looks that way!!! | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 6:36:57 AM |
Alright, so we're dealing with a heavy hitter of a topic. So its only fitting that my reply will be a bit...serious, and uncomfortable. But I think NPD is simply a nicer way of saying "sociopath". To say that a sociopath has a mental/personality disorder is to invalidate the experience with a sociopath, and only serves to give them an "excuse" for there behavior. Anyone else agree here?
Charity
I sure am tired of this attitude. I address it from two perspectives. The NPD doesn't agree with the diagnosis, therefore does not use it as an excuse for his behavior. He gives no reasons or excuses, he is perfect, ask him, he will tell you. Disorders are real, not always fixable, but real reasons for sociopaths behavior. An excuse, no. Invalidation? I don't know, the experiences I have had and read about on this forum and other places, the "diagnosis" seems to help the victims get out of the situation. They realize the problem is not them, for one and not fixable, two. Therefore they can leave the sociopath without the guilt he/she has put on them. I am not a professional, this is just my opinion based on my own experience.
Many say that folks use a mental/personality disorder to excuse behavior. Whether that is true or not, I don't know. To give a correlation, does a diabetic use their condition to excuse their behavior, does a cripple do the same. The answer is yes and no, some do, some don't. The diabetic can take insulin, regulate diet and live a fairly normal life. The cripple can use aids to get around, concentrate on what they CAN do and live a fairly normal life. The person with a mental (which is physiological) disorder can seek help to live a fairly normal life. Many that are truly trying still have bad days, who can blame them for feeling sorry for themselves every once in a while. I have seen all three above examples also use their conditions to manipulate, guilt trip, abuse the ones to love them and try to help. The types who don't take personal responsibility take whatever the situation is and use it to excuse their behavior. I don't feel sorry for them, they disgust me. Whenever I act like that I disgust myself. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 9:01:52 AM |
To say that a sociopath has a mental/personality disorder is to invalidate the experience with a sociopath, and only serves to give them an "excuse" for there behavior. Anyone else agree here?
I suppose that’s true. I find they usually use other people’s conduct as an excuse for their behavior. “You/they/the world did this to me so I’m justified in doing what I do. It’s your fault not mine.” | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 9:53:27 AM | Here's my take....
I "have" Borderline Personality Disorder. When I was first diagnosed (this Dr. was head of Psychiatry at a very good hospital), I jumped through hoops to keep anyone from knowing. I have always felt "different" and went to great lengths to hide it. My great lengths didn't always work, and people had known for a long time, that I was different (by my "odd" behaviour). It got to a point where I said to myself, people know something's up anyway, I'm gonna "come out" and get better. And I have.....
Again with the label thing......labels are needed to group symptoms accordingly, so that medical professionals can diagnose, "problems" and patients can have a clue where to start to work, if they want to recover. Most think the medical professional has a "problem".
I have more than one "problem" and I am the last person to "excuse" ANYONE for bad behaviour. I took some fairly heavy consequences for my behaviour, but they were well worth it. I am actually enjoying my life, rather than hiding from people AND MYSELF, that I'm DIFFERENT.
Narcissists have grandiose behaviour....they have a LACK of empathy....everything is for me....they are never wrong....they are manipulative to get what they want. They need approval from others to feel good about themselves. If they don't get approval, they take it out on someone......usually a SO.....BECAUSE THE GENERAL PUBLIC CANNOT SEE THEM AT ANYTHING BUT THEIR BEST.
Sociopaths are narssists, and grandiose.....but they have no CONSCIENCE. Other humans are accomplices to help them get what they want. While the human is useful, they play the "game" the purpose of which is ALWAYS to further themselves, or obtain something they value.
Think of the scene in the "Silence of the Lambs" when the killer had the young girl in the "pit"....Clarisse was on her way.....the killer's dog jumped into the pit with the girl. The killer got VERY agitated, and begged the girl not to hurt his dog.......he was going to kill the girl, and use her skin to make a lampshade........but he got beside himself when he thought the girl might hurt his dog.......THAT'S A SOCIOPATH.
My personal narcissist has been told to get over himself, and man up, get some balls, and stop tormenting people who don't deserve it! | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/25/2009 6:10:13 PM |
Alright, so we're dealing with a heavy hitter of a topic. So its only fitting that my reply will be a bit...serious, and uncomfortable. But I think NPD is simply a nicer way of saying "sociopath". To say that a sociopath has a mental/personality disorder is to invalidate the experience with a sociopath, and only serves to give them an "excuse" for there behavior. Anyone else agree here?
Charity
Interesting that this topic was resurrected
I prefer this train of thought
[Narcissists have grandiose behaviour....they have a LACK of empathy....everything is for me....they are never wrong....they are manipulative to get what they want. They need approval from others to feel good about themselves. If they don't get approval, they take it out on someone......usually a SO.....BECAUSE THE GENERAL PUBLIC CANNOT SEE THEM AT ANYTHING BUT THEIR BEST.
Sociopaths are narssists, and grandiose.....but they have no CONSCIENCE. Other humans are accomplices to help them get what they want. While the human is useful, they play the "game" the purpose of which is ALWAYS to further themselves, or obtain something they value
I was married to Narcissist with a scorching case of Histrionic PD (formerly hysterical PD). This is NOT a pretty sight!! (keyword WAS!!)
Maybe I'm like a magnet for these types of PD's. The thing of it is, these people blend into society very well. They can otherwise exhibit extremely personable, outgoing personailites, but I agree with the above poster that they are usually unconscionable. They act without regard for others feelings, yet somehow, they have very high regard for the wellbeing of their animals. Go figure that one!
I suppose we often "excuse" these peoples behaviors by giving them labels. I do not, but social norms often do, and we are supposed to feel sympathy while they do their deeds.
Would't it be great if everyone had their own label, and we would "know" what to expect W-H-E-N we meet them? You know, like....color schemes.....Narcissist wear red sleeve badges, while Schizo's wear blue...or maybe just sleeve labels, kinda like the Jews during WWII. NaPD, PAPD, ScPD..... this way we might not waste such precious time in life and we could avoid the troubling people altogether.
In all honesty, not all people with such diagnosis "act" on their impulses so I find it difficult to "excuse" those who act so destructively and hatefully. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/27/2009 7:00:11 AM | And another thing....
Violent psychotics are rarely sane enough to be held responsible for their actions; sociopaths, however, are fully aware of thier actions and simply don't care. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/29/2009 7:31:56 AM |
I suppose we often "excuse" these peoples behaviors by giving them labels. I do not, but social norms often do, and we are supposed to feel sympathy while they do their deeds.
I have said it before, sympathy will get you into trouble with these people. Furthermore, they don't want sympathy really, they want unconditional adoration. And there isn't enought adoration in the world for them. Their insecurity is a bottomless pit. Sympathy will cause you to fall into it. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/29/2009 9:39:44 AM |
I suppose we often "excuse" these peoples behaviors by giving them labels. I do not, but social norms often do, and we are supposed to feel sympathy while they do their deeds.
I don't believe that "labels" provide an "excuse" for anything. What it does provide is an explanation for why certain behaviour is happening.
Unless one is educated in mental illness issues, they don't often understand the "explanation" of why the behaviour is happening, which creates judgment and fear, and "stigma".
I believe that sympathy would be created through manipulation, rather than a "label". | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 9/29/2009 9:59:32 AM | What I noticed from dating one is that they are only fairly happy when they have the upper hand emoitionally. they thrive on keeping you down so they have emotional rule. Keeping you on the egde of emotional failure seems to feed them tremendously.
Its part of feeding the need... | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/2/2009 12:12:11 PM | I agree TOTALLY with CURLYGIRL! I am still licking my wounds from dating a True Narcissist - My God! I would never have believed that I could've been sucked into such an insane relationship with this Monster..the DEVIL himself!
He was my Prince Charming when we first me...built me up to knock me down. I did everything for him - spent time and money on him and he wanted more and more from me ..he drained me of my self esteem and I finally woke up to his constant and subtle abuse which manifested it self more and more. I noticed once I was totally "in love" with him I saw his traits worsen, to become a horrible monster! He started to distance and devalue me even more when he knew that he had my heart.
And YES! they become a drug to you.. I have NEVER taken any form of drug in my life but I find myself in a drug like state after I finally read and learned of this sociopathic Narcissistic Disorder. It is as if they have had a chip installed in their brain to use/abuse/manipulate/ hurt/destroy other humans.
XN b/f LOVES his 8 year old to the point of obsession.. I now know looking back that its HIMSELF that he loves and I have to wonder about covert incest ( based on what I now know and what I witnessed while dating him)..he was NOT the doting father .. she was "himself" that he treated with reverence.
I could go on and on about his abusive ways that would turn anyones hair gray.
On the outside he was the pillar of society..great job, house, intelligent, good looks, witty appeared generous (to some) if it meant he would get something from it. In reality he was a weak insecure creep. They are constantly in fear that they will be discovered for being the worthless @ssholes that they really are.
I can honestly say this was the worst experience of my life and I would not wish this again on anyone other that another Narcissist!!
AND - he does not care what I or anyone else thinks because he has NO CONSCIENCE what so ever - he will victimize all that cross his path.
ps: sorry Quazi ( I do respect your thoughts) but I DONT think they know the meaning of love because when you read the text books it states that they hate themselves first and foremost but turn it round to look like "love" just like they love supply (women ) but are mysoginists (sp) | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/2/2009 2:27:45 PM |
ps: sorry Quazi ( I do respect your thoughts) but I DONT think they know the meaning of love because when you read the text books it states that they hate themselves first and foremost but turn it round to look like "love" just like they love supply (women ) but are mysoginists (sp)
Let me try to give you an analogy, forumsgee.....
My Mom was an alcoholic....a bad one.
When she was drunk, she would have sold me to the nearest bartender for a double "rusty nail".
When she quit drinking (took responsibility for her illness, and dealt with it), I had a Mom....(with BPD never got to that) but still a Mom.
When she was drunk, did she not love me? Did she have a conscience?
Apparently she did, but until she "gave up" her drug of choice, she tortured me.
The reason Narcissists, BPD, etc. don't want to get help....and if they do, they make it look as if everyone else is the problem (I did this for a long time) is, especially for a narcissist, because they don't want to admit ESPECIALLY TO THEMSELF, that they aren't as "WONDERFUL" as they portray themself to be.
Most will fight to the death, before they let that become known....will they do ANYTHING to ANYONE to avoid the truth....pretty much.
It doesn't have that much to do with love, really.....it's a matter of keeping the denial intact for the sake of self preservation.
It's too painful for anyone to know the truth....including them. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/2/2009 8:30:15 PM |
What I noticed from dating one is that they are only fairly happy when they have the upper hand emoitionally. they thrive on keeping you down so they have emotional rule. Keeping you on the egde of emotional failure seems to feed them tremendously.
Its part of feeding the need.
I believe this is very true.
..He was my Prince Charming when we first me...built me up to knock me down. I did everything for him - spent time and money on him and he wanted more and more from me ..he drained me of my self esteem and I finally woke up to his constant and subtle abuse which manifested it self more and more. I noticed once I was totally "in love" with him I saw his traits worsen, to become a horrible monster! He started to distance and devalue me even more when he knew that he had my heart.
You wrote that as if you were in my house with us the whole time. It started out...she pursued me heavily.... and it continued until I finally let myself go and saw something about her I really liked....then EVERYTHING TURNED...south... and then I'm stuck havign feelings for someone who turns their back on you whenever you want to talk to them.
And YES! they become a drug to you.. I have NEVER taken any form of drug in my life but I find myself in a drug like state after I finally read and learned of this sociopathic Narcissistic Disorder.
On the outside he was the pillar of society..great job, house, intelligent, good looks, witty appeared generous (to some) if it meant he would get something from it. In reality he was a weak insecure creep. They are constantly in fear that they will be discovered for being the worthless @ssholes that they really are.
Wow... I'm glad I jumped in this thread. I need to read this because...i thought it was ME... making mistakes. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/2/2009 9:19:39 PM | Manerider,
Take a look at the link Ive attached - it is a site that has helped me a LOT to overcome the hurt and pain this Monster put me through.
You will find this very helpful and it will open your eyes to the "why" they do what they do..
http://thepsychopath.freeforums.org
Hope it helps you.
Quazi: Towards the end before I went No Contact (NC) I think he knew I was onto him..( I had told him that I believed he was a narcissist and a mysoganist..)
He would often say that I SCARED him. I did not know what he meant at the time and to this day I cant figure out why I scared him... I can only assume that he knew that I saw through his false self because he stepped up the distancing and devalueing. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/3/2009 9:11:55 AM |
He would often say that I SCARED him. I did not know what he meant at the time and to this day I cant figure out why I scared him... I can only assume that he knew that I saw through his false self because he stepped up the distancing and devalueing.
Forumsgee
You scared him, because he knew that you could potentially destroy his "image" with anyone you cared to talk to...INCLUDING HIM. (Denial is huge here)
The stepped up devaluation was an attempt to make you believe that you were wrong, crazy, making things up, lying, delusional, out of your f*cking mind....however you want to put it. Depending on how badly he took it when you told him he was a narcissist, he may have wanted to get away, before you could get any closer to his "image", and he potentially started doubting himself. | |
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| Anyone Ever Dated A TRUE Narcissist?
Posted: 10/3/2009 4:33:30 PM | Wow... I'm glad I jumped in this thread. I need to read this because...i thought it was ME... making mistakes.
YOU did nothing. You were just supply.
Hopefully she dumped you - then you can almost be sure she will not
bother you. She has exhausted her supply with you. On the other hand
there is always the possibility she will be back because the next person
will either find out what she is or she will not be getting the supply she
needs.
The best thing for you to do is NO contact with her - ever ever ever.
Thier lies, manipulations, promises and mind control is like a drug.
They play on the good feeling part of the brain - I mentioned it in a
latter post here. The page before here maybe.
The person you love is pretend. She does not exists. What exist is
a sub human who is only there to mirror you - to feed off of you all the
good things about you - thats why they pick the smartest, brightest and
most compassionate people - they are not this. They have no feelings -
they LEARN how to react from YOU.
Stay away. They will destroy your life. There is no getting better for them.
This is the way they are - always and forever.
Do not feel bad for them. They are well aware of what they are and what they
do.
It is pathological. | |
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| Trophy gf no more
Posted: 10/4/2009 6:49:34 AM | People with Narcissistic traits have some hope.....People with Narcissistic Personality Disorder are permanently disordered....No hope.....The problem is that they would have a pretty hard time admitting they even need the help, because they are damn near perfection....and you are the problem, anyway....
Soul shattering for me in my experience. I'd be there for him- had he have let me. | |
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/4/2009 7:41:27 AM | God the more I read, the more it rings true. My recent experience was only short-term (approx. 8 wks dating). I've only been recently 'dismissed' (quite literally). I had begun to catch him out on the lies and knowing him was sending me broke. Amongst other numerous strange happenings but perhaps the best was the long-winded written running-account he forwarded me informing me of all MY personality flaws, errors and the subsequent disappointment I had caused him. Always ill too - 90% of our get-togethers his malingering ways were passed off due to apparent illness.
My adoration was waining and I feel you would all fill in the dots as to what happened from that point fwd. with regards to the quick demise of the relationship. I'm seeing now that I more than likely experienced - not a broken heart Eg; 'What might have been..' ..but more of a lucky escape. I originally dubbed him the Master of Sex but now have changed that to the Master of Manipulation. Reading all your posts has helped me immensely- Thx.
My question.. I'm only a few days into the split. Can I expect that when it 'suits' him he may attempt to lure me back?? Or am I expired of my worth in his eyes?
What to do? He is back on this (& every other dating site known to man) site, which worries me. Can I expect repurcussions if he tracks this msg?
Suz | |
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/4/2009 6:05:26 PM | Suzette:
ABSOLUTELY NO CONTACT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..because HE WILL CONTACT YOU AGAIN!!
He will sucker you in so that he can still manipulate and control you... the only way is NO CONTACT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I cannot stress this enough to you. Dont acknowledge ANYTHING from him EVER! | |
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/5/2009 6:40:13 AM | Thanks for responding happinessok ..
Since I was the one who terminated this disastrous whirl-wind (short-term thank god) charade , as result I am blocked/ deleted/ slandered, etc. etc, by him (How dare I).
Why then do you feel confident he'll be back?? Please dont say the challege, or to achieve the conquest I'm just not up for it. I imagine him rolling up at my work-place to put on some public & pathetic attention-seeking display (showtime*) Ugh
I'm a strong-willed and forthright type person & assumably I was thrown to the wayside by him because I soon demonstrated that I dont easily conform. (Is this likely to be correct??) Whilst - once committed I'm an extremely giving person- I most definitely wasnt prepared to kiss his arse though ha. Jesus he could have won an Emmy for his award winning performance during that woo'ing period however. What a cameo appearance it was in that initial period when he was starring. And I was so totally smitten Arghhh!@
Next question .. Is it best not to provoke a person with NPD???
Next question.. While I read with interest the symptoms and the behaviours of NPD people I still dont quite understand the closure. As in that point when they move on to the next person/ people. I see a lot of you have had long-term (time-frame) bad experiences. What usually prompts an NPD person to move on? What is a typical driver to make them dismiss u? The adulation gone? Is that enough? Or are they multi -tasking as predators on the next poor **stards? Is it generally the perpetrator or the abused..that get out first?
And last question to Quadmom please .. If possible may I email u in private as I have true confusion & am troubled about specific behaviours on me by him that'r probably best not published in a public forum. Still trying to get my head around all this.
Thanks for listening :)
Suz
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/5/2009 11:22:33 AM | Suzette,
Here is where you will find the answers to some of your questions..
thepsychopath.freeforums.org - the site that helped me tremendously with answers.. Its a narcissistic survivors support group.
If you have problems finding the site email me privately.
Narcisists are very complicated but very dangerous (to your soul) people. Educate yourself and learn from this experience.. | |
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/5/2009 11:56:50 AM | | Suz I am going thru it too, I can answer some of your questions --definately best Not to provoke them....A good book to read is THE SOCIOPATH NEXT DOOR by Martha Stout. If you provoke them, they feel they arent in control, and they get very angry and violent, or else calmly up the ante. Message me, I cant message you cause of your restrictions (female) | |
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| Question to you all
Posted: 10/5/2009 1:44:52 PM | | When do they move to the next victim? If its been a couple of days as you said, he already has another victim......unfortunately that wont let you off the hook that easily. These days that you are not seeing him will serve as a Punishment period for you---you dont get to see him because you didnt behave. When things dont work out with the other 5 women he may contact you, or if things are working out VERY well with the other woman he will contact you, because the chase phase for her is over and he has her in his pocket now so can concentrate back on you. The contact is sometimes just a nice call like nothing happened, or a call about returning some stuff or something like that. He may even call just to yell at you for not calling him. They are like****oaches, you just cant get rid of them | |
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| Sex obsession
Posted: 10/6/2009 6:27:28 AM | Alright now please tell me about obsessive compulsion and NPD people. Is it consistent?
My N possesses more sex toys, sex-aids and porn movies than most well-stocked sex warehouses. I have NEVER seen anything like it. I understand the superiority fix to have the biggest and the best and the latest and the greatest but..Omg.
There were bulk-supplies of inanimate objects in amongs this collection that I (still ) have no idea what they were. IN THE BEGINNING he was very much about pleasuring the female and had detailed learnt skill to evidence it. Accompanying that- the books, the videos etc. . And it was evidently all for her enjoyment. How is that self-indulgent? Or is it all part of the cameo appearance when they are starring in their own Mini-Series borne within their psyche? | |
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| Sex obsession
Posted: 10/6/2009 2:24:00 PM | Suzette~ That has been my experience with their disorder too...they suck you in with whatever they can..they listen to what you want to hear and become that person verbage included...NPD's are very compulsive, OCD and are almost always addicts of some sort...its covered up with drug and alcohol use ect...they want you to think they are the sex God, the master of the world and everything in it...they are often Gods gift to women lol..I say this with sarcasm...some have a napoleonic complex...its unreal and it gets worse as they get older...as master manipulators they have such finess in convincing people the problem is not them but the other person..I think my grandpa used to call it the gift of gab(BS). Zero contact or you will wish you had run while you had the chance...anyone can have a good sex partner..who would want to be with a fake sex partner? Scary thought..what else are they hiding..a sexual history perhaps?
Run ..don't walk away...avoid any place you ever went together...
Manerider...I think we all lived at your house...they are pretty much all the same and never change..its so scary | |
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