| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/23/2007 5:53:42 PM | Depends what age she is. When I was 12-14 and before I really started getting to know boys, I had sexual acts with girlfriends of mine. I was not lesbian nor was I bi. I felt safe with them and we agreed to experiment on each other's bodies. It felt good, our parents never caught us and we moved on to boys and all was well.
Sexual experiences do not equate sexual preference. Often, we are just having an experience and allowing ourselves to do so. Society judges it, but while we're having it, we could give a crap what society thinks...we're enjoying the feelings.
I can only imagine the shame being put on her for what should have been a private experience which, I think, is really not a parent's business to intervene with. Counseling for what? To make sure she doesn't turn bi? That isn't something you counsel out of a person, that's something you are by nature...
The less attention you give to this, the more likely it is she'll move forward from this experience but I have a feeling the reaction she's getting from what probably felt innocent and good for her will scar her more than the behaviour did.
Good luck. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/23/2007 6:06:19 PM | | It's a normal thing for teenager girls to do. Didn't you? The difference is that it has now become a public TREND. Thank you Madonna and Britney. Sigh. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/23/2007 6:19:26 PM | | OP: counselling is a good thing no matter what.....she can explore her feeling around her sexuality with someone who is not going to be biased.........my opinion....just support her in what ever lives throws at her.....may just a thing but it may be more....just don't make her feel bad......... | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/23/2007 7:25:17 PM | i agree counselling is a good thing, provided it's for the intent of helping your daughter come to terms with her own identity...and not to "fix" her. having read the OP it's obvious that that the latter isn't an issue here.
i don't know if bisexuality is on the rise...or if people are just more at ease openly expressing and exploring something that was previously supressed or hidden due to social stigmas which have relaxed considerably in recent decades. i've kissed girls, fondled and been fondled a little, but my interest is predominantly with men...i don't identify as bi, but i am open-minded. it's that "open-minded" catagory which i think more and more people find themselves in. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/23/2007 11:36:20 PM | Your daughter doesnt need counseling she needs a good friend that she can trust, someone that feels close to her and appriciates her..... and that is exactly what she has. GOOD FOR HER>You should be happy for her, that its not just some random guy trying to get into her panties and use her.
Being 16 is a very rough age. Was definatly the roughest for me and probably will be true for my life. That is when your trying to figure out who you are.. and for most girls they have no clue yet. The things I thought about, wanted, and did when I was 16 were pretty crazy as for most 16 year old girls. Tell your ex you are both very lucky because she could be going to counceling for drugs or some other extreme problems. My mom also forced me into counceling when I was that age, and I hated myself and her for it. Me and my mom have alot of regrets about that time in my life. We realized we both said and did things that were wrong back then. But everyone makes mistakes and it only brought us closer together for forgiving one another and trying to understand each other. Moms are alot smarter than we realize and they dont always tell you things they let you figure it out on our own.. your daughter might hate her for it now... but your ex probably has good reason for sending her to counceling.. maybe she remembers what its like to be that age too and that she probably isnt only dealing with weather or not she is a lesbian or bisexual.
I had a bisexual friend in highschool and she didnt tell us for a couple years that she was interested more in girls. Finally she told us she had a crush on our other close friend... she begged us not to tell her as it was just a crush and she knew she would be freaked out. So we told her and she was freaked out. She didnt like girls at all.. until that is they started talking again eventually. My friend realized how much my other friend really cared for her and it wasnt just a physical attraction. They were both very pretty girls. The non-bisexual one more so blonde. Eventually they started dating and everyone in highschool made a hudge deal out of it, including their parents. So much drama! We never herd the end of it. They fought off and on and got back together for must have been a couple years. Sooner or later the one that was non-bisexual had enough and she went back to dating guys... and still is. My other friend still likes girls to this day and she now has a new girlfriend. She still likes guys but is more satisfied emotionally by other females.
I see nothing wrong with it. I myself am not attracted to girls. There is a slight number of women in my life I have even found attractive because of behaviour and personalities. I have only had once experience with another girl and we have been good friends off and on since.
It only brings friends closer I think. I dont have any desire to be with another female again as they are not physically satisfying for me. I wouldnt ever have a threesome either. I really love the idea of being the one and only for a man... now if only I could figure out where he is....  | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 5:20:26 AM | | Kids experiment with their sexuality, especially at 16. Putting her in counseling is telling her that her emotions/feelings were wrong, and that not being 'straight' is wrong as well. I think as her father you need to support what she has/is doing, and tell your ex that this is f.cking pathetic ... Let her be a kid and find out who she is. | |
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mar814
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Joined: 11/16/2006
Msg: 33 | |
| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 5:48:00 AM | | I don't know, I've never had a bisexual experience but I wasn't raised up in this culture where hetero pop star women kiss each other on TV. Just talk to your daughter I guess, and ask her how she feels. Depending on who she is and how old she is, it may be a curiosity thing or it may be the real deal. She may not even know herself yet. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 6:02:51 AM | Depends what age she is. When I was 12-14 and before I really started getting to know boys, I had sexual acts with girlfriends of mine. I was not lesbian nor was I bi. I felt safe with them and we agreed to experiment on each other's bodies. It felt good, our parents never caught us and we moved on to boys and all was well.
Exactly That !!
When I was a young boy 12 or so I did the same things. I didn’t grow up to be bi.
My wife experienced the same things with some of her girl friends at the same age.
She later discovered ( at 28) that she did enjoy the touch of a woman, and returning the same. This never turned out to be the driving force in her sex life it didn’t make her all of a sudden start wanting women over men. She just enjoyed it as part of her sex life. As for therapy I am a bit jaded on that topic. As with all professions there are good and bad. Just because a carpenter has a paper saying that they passed the exam to give them a license does not mean that they are good at there trade.
Your support is what maters most now and for ever! In what ever she does!
Pedub | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 6:10:44 AM | | OP - Everything you've told us about you still loving her, that she's still your baby girl? Be sure that she hears all of that, too. The first time someone mentioned to my parents that I was interested in girls, I would have loved to have heard those things from either of my parents. I knew that my mom was supportive of my choices, but she didn't really vocalize it (she's a wonderful mother, but not the type to be overly affectionate physically or verbally), and with my father's reaction (he's a lot like what your ex sounds like), I could have really used hearing that. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 6:33:43 AM | Judy - I'm trying to recall if I ever did kiss anyone in my parents' house at 16. I can't remember. I'm sure I must have. But, it would have been uncommon. Even at 32 I still would feel uncomfortable having sexual escapades/groping/kissing/being mushy in front of my parents, and in particular, in their home. But, that's just me I guess. My parents weren't very strict - the only thing I ever got in trouble for was my mouth, i.e. talking back and being disrespectful. If I ever did make-out with someone in their house when I was younger, I definitely would have been very embarrased if my parents caught me. I think it would make them very uncomfortable, and I would feel like I was being quite rude and disrespectful. But, again, that's just me. I'm not a big fan of PDA either, and I wouldn't even want to make a roommate feel uncomfortable in their own home by getting busy, whether it be them walking in on me in a common room or hearing me in my bedroom.
But, no, I don't think kissing in her mom's home is grounds for therapy. But, with all the hubbub about her getting counseling because of the fact that it happened to be with another girl, and the differing opinions of the OP and his ex, and the OP wanting to be there for his daughter and not turn his back on her for whatever her sexual preference becomes, . . I could just picture a lot of overcompensation to make her feel like she did absolutely NOTHING wrong. So, I'm just suggesting that it's OK to acknowledge that getting busy in her mom's home was inappropriate. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 7:37:20 AM | | Wow. To stick the girl in counseling is a shame. Obviously your ex is not accepting of the changing world. When I found out my oldest was gay, I was happy she told me instead of hiding it....she was 16 years at the time. She's still the same today. Who cares if it is normal or not......and if anyone thinks normal is really out there in our world, then that is delusional thinking. Support her. Get her out of counseling. It seems the ex is more in need of therapy. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 7:44:56 AM | Oh my, what a mess! Your poor daughter! She's been going through hell. All the confusion about how to become a woman - straight, gay or bi, is hard enough at that age but obviously, your daughter has some questions about her sexuality and that makes the confusion all the worse. Then, she -finally- begins to take steps on figuring out what's right for her and she gets caught the first time she tries anything? Ack. Then Mom goes nuts apparently and puts her in counselling. I would think your daughter is possibly feeling very depressed, confused and jumped on right now. And whatever happened to the other girl in the scenario? Are they still allowed to be friends? Or is your daughter being forbidden to hang out with her anymore? Is your ex going to make an issue of this in the future with any other female friends your daughter has over? You know, checking up on her to make sure she isn't doing "anything" with them. This could become a problem for your daughter.
I don't know if this statistic is still current or not, but the number one reason for teenage suicides is feelings of shame and denial over being gay or bi.
I'm just worried if your daughter does turn out to be gay or bi, that your ex may make her feel so ashamed of herself, that she never recovers from it.
I think you need to be really assertive about this with your ex and your daughter. Try to arrange a meeting with your daughter's counsellor for yourself. Of course, the counsellor cannot tell you what your daughter discusses, but discussing these issues yourself with the counsellor will give you a chance to evaluate the kind of message the counsellor is going to give to your daughter and she/he could also give you tips on how to handle your ex's attitudes more constructively in the future. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 8:54:57 AM | | im my opion what ur ex did is wrong...shes eploein at any age mabey she hasnt been involed with any 1 yet an doesnt kno what she likes an her friends some 1 she feel comfterbale with an they decided to mess around an even if she does like gurls whats wrong with that.not to offend you since your her father but who doesnt honestly injoy watchni or bein apart of a relaionshit like that ?adds a lil spice to it an adventure | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 9:16:54 AM | Read Msg 2. OldSchoolQueen is correct (she is very astute, as usual).
Does it require counseling? Nope.
Is counseling a bad thing? Yes/No. Depends on the counselor and what they say..most likely, they will discuss what prompted the experimenting and probe gently to determine the perceptions. They might explain why it causes anger or anxiety in a parent. And maybe, they will help the girl understand her (probably) mixed feelings over trying it.
Developing close friendship, coupled with rampant hormones and burgeoning sexual interest PLUS peer and social role model influence sets the stage for this occurrence.
I know very few women in my age group openly experimented with same gender sexual experiences. But, they may have done so quietly and not discussed it. It was not socially typical (as a sexual experience) and it was not condoned/accepted.
Its become faddish to try it, among teenagers. Does this constitute 'normal' behavior?
I suggest that it does, but 'normal' is a generationally-dependent definition. What was not normal for you and I, is 'normal' - a typical fad, among today's youth.
It might be possible that the girls were practicing kissing - passionate kissing is an art. | |
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aame
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Joined: 1/30/2007
Msg: 41 | |
| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 2:51:46 PM | If we could stick to his question, only oldschoolqueen tried that and the rest of you jumped on his wife, hello???? The rest of you in typical fashion started berating his wife for having the backbone to stand up and be a parent and say I'm not sure this is were my child needs to go. Kids have enough friends, they need parents. Archaic as it may seem, sometimes parents have to be the moral compass for their children. So cut "evil" mom some slack and quit stroking "good" dad. Yes, good dad sometimes girls experiment with other girls. But seeing as I was not in attendance on the couch, I will reserve my judgement of the his version, her version and the "but, we weren't only doing this- daddy's little girl's version.
Let's just answer the question and leave the wife bashing out of it. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 4:40:48 PM | I could just picture a lot of overcompensation to make her feel like she did absolutely NOTHING wrong. So, I'm just suggesting that it's OK to acknowledge that getting busy in her mom's home was inappropriate
Ah well I will admit it when I was 16..I not only kissed in the house and more when the house was empty.. I consider "getting busy" to be ,ahem you know...not kissing,
Jmo it is embarassing to get caught doing anything at all but most teens will or have kissed someone under these circumstances.
We all know why the Mom freaked and it wasn't cause of where...but who ..she kissed..
Not a fan of the pda myself..either. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 4:52:29 PM | | Putting your daughter in counselling was wrong, it is totally normal to experiment at that age. Shes trying to figure out who she is and your treating her like she should already know. She's growing up mom and it's only natural to experiment. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 5:29:05 PM | | OP, depends possibly on how old she is...most younger kids have some curiosity about sexuality, even before they hit their teens; some realize that certain things may feel good but aren't really sure why, and they'll experiement with one of their friends. That doesn't mean they're bisexual; it also doesn't mean they're not. Did your ex even ask her why she was doing something? Or just throw her into counseling? I'm more concerned that the counseling will mess her up. Keep an eye on the counselor and talk with your child. If something doesn't sound right, then get her away from the counselor. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/24/2007 6:33:37 PM | i think homosexuality and bisexuality are just as prevalent as ever, no more, no less. it's more socially acceptable to be honest about it, and there is also the element of curiosity/experimentation and a few cases of women experimenting more for the benefit of the men who have a lesbian fetish.
what ever it is, personally.. i wouldn't make a big deal out of it. if she's gay, great. if not, great. maybe she's just experimenting, maybe not - it's her thing to deal with, all you can do is support her. | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/25/2007 5:39:11 AM | This has to be the best thread I have read yet and how true. Its about time there were no jokes about this . The girl does not belong in counselling.
None of this bi or straight or gay issues are on the rise today, what is though is the media and what is out there. People have not changed in hundreds of years it is rather what is more accepted and not. there was even a post here about a guy stating when he was 12 years old experimenting as well as his wife when they were young. Since when has this hurt anyone. I have to say if it was a guy, there might be more bad comments from posters taking cracks at a guy when that is not fair.
Most people today in age are starting to realize that gay or bi is not something you choose just like straight you are born that way, yes there are some still in the dark ages that think they can convert some one. There are women out there that play games thinking they are so great they can make a gay guy be straight what a mentality.
The only reason maybe for counselling should come from the girl herself for support if she is having extreme trouble coping with what is going on in her life. Her father should be commended for the support he is giving her and throw her mother into counselling although she is probly beyond that point.
What else can be said about this topic a lot has been said here that has been good advise you accept people for who they are not based on preferences. A male would have ten times the trouble this girl is having if information such as this were to get out . No one really knows what is happening to them in there teen years. That is why I am a big supporter of sex education in all aspects. kids learn at a early age they might not be any different than anyone else and most all of us go through the same phazes. and if your sexual preferense is different it means no less that you are a good person than anyone else. As long as the young person does not grow up to be a child molester or a menice to society live and let live | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/25/2007 5:56:13 AM | I think it depends on the age. I new of girls at school that had relations with one another... one incident I reacall was a huge birthday party where 14 really popular girls were involved in kissing and feeling each other. It was gossip at the time.. but the rumours died off. All went on to date the popular guys at school. I have bumped into a few of them over the years all are married with kids..
It is not uncommon in European or Brithish countries for the young to have same sex relationships. Nor is it anything new....
It's just over here in North America (Can/US) has this weird outlook upon it. It still goes on but very discreetly because of the way society views it here.
For a lot of kids its just Exploring their sexuality. It doesn't mean they are bisexual just experimenting the unknown with a sacred friend.
Your child may grow out of it. Question is Are you prepared if they do not? | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/25/2007 12:15:53 PM | I can't and won't say that her mother is a bad woman. The differences we had started becoming more of a problem as the years came by. She was raised in a situation where being ultra- conservative was the absolute norm and I can't fault her for that. The only thing I fault her for is that she takes her thoughts and opinions to extremes. I honestly think that all of it could be settled with a very easy, long and relaxed talk with my little lady instead of sticking her in a place where she is going to feel offended or hurt by things. I went through alot of counseling as I was growing up and it made me feel more like I was always in the wrong for things. THAT is now and always has been my main concern.
I see things going on today that my great grandmother would have had fits over if she had known it were happening in the world. I do see things that were kept hidden away as the norm more and more. My concerns are for my daughter here. If she is bi, then I am ready to support her in it with no reservations, but I am wondering how well she is going to be able to handle looks and pressures and judgements of people who see it. Is it more socailly acceptable to be able for a woman to walk up to another woman in Wal-Mart and kiss her like a husband kisses a wife? What kind of anxiety is that going to bring about for my daughter if she is Bi?
Does anybody just take their kids out for ice cream and a talk in the park to deal with things anymore or does it have to be a seat on a couch in an office with someone staring at you and writing down everything you say like a judge in court? | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/25/2007 1:06:02 PM | If I were you I wouldn't talk to her about it...
The last person a girl want's to talk to about sex is her dad!
Personally I think whether your straight..Gay...Bi...with all the hate in the world today....
Love is a good thing actually it's the best thing you can hope for in life..in whatever form that makes you happy
I'd say she is very lucky to have a father like you and that she knows you will be there for her when she feels she needs to tell you anything or just to assure her that she is still your lil girl and that you will Always love her
As for if it is prevalent in society..I really don't know
on the other site I go to half the girls say they are Bi I don't know if it's true or if they are just trying to seem more appealing to the guy's on there
As for me..I'm old school.... I'm straight
I hope it all works out for you and your daughter
good luck
Bella | |
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| Question for the ladies here...
Posted: 2/25/2007 1:15:43 PM | Well i have to say, i thought most kids did this.. i know i did. I must have been about 13/14 at the time and she was my best friend, it started innocently enough one night during a sleep over, it got touchy feely under the covers..we were both intrigued and it went from there. It did lead to about 3/4 months worth of full on investigating..if she had'nt moved away maybe it would have continued..who knows..? But having said that it helped me.. i know now that women are not for me..but i would have died if my parents put me in counselling, i believe that if left, they make their own minds up.
Your daughter is lucky she has you around and can talk to you like she does, i think she will be fine..it's just a phase.. and if it is'nt you are there to support her. Either way she is on to a winner. | |
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