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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/10/2008 8:48:51 PM |
I can't go to indoor concerts, movies. I gave up my subscription to our local ballet company. Dining out is very iffy. Even private parties can be trying. I have to get up at 4 am to get into a space, before the place becomes intolerable to work in. So much I enjoy is now out of my reach. Thank you 'One blend' for your clear and informative post. I cannot even speak about this issue, without getting angry. I have lost so much of what I enjoy, and I want it back, but I would also like people to understand what they are doing to themselves.
I have to confess that you've lost me here. I accept that people have sensitivity to various smells, but on your profile you indicate that you're a smoker. This comment isn't so much directed to you personally, but to the many people I've encountered at work that complain that they can't stand perfume, yet they duck out at various times during the workday to pollute themselves using an alternative, more noxious method.
Myself, I don't comprehend why something as volatile as smoking apparently does not bother smokers, (even thought it certainly bothers a lot of others) while perfume does. The bans STARTED with smoking, because it is the primary cause of indoor air pollution. It ranks ahead of animal dander, mould/bacteria, cooking odours, and even formaldehyde fumes.
I don't wear much perfume myself out of sensitivity to others in a rather confined workspace, but I have to admit that when I hear smokers complain about perfume, I just don't take them seriously.
Be well...... | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 2:38:29 AM | | I guess the difference in our attitudes is that I never inflict my second hand smoke on others in public or in their private spaces. I do not feel I have that right. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 2:57:22 AM | I've never smoked and i'm extremely sensitive to scents. I'm lucky if I manage to come home from school without headaches and dry/sore eyes. I've taken medication in the past for it but nothing fixed the problem, just temporary relief.
There's really no need for strong perfumes. There are unscented alternatives.. or even mild scented alternatives. I'm all for banning this stuff from public places. Maybe to those that aren't affected it seems ridiculous and some form of government control, but for those is does affect, it's a serious issue that's never been addressed. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 4:59:25 AM |
There's really no need for strong perfumes. There are unscented alternatives.. or even mild scented alternatives. I'm all for banning this stuff from public places. Maybe to those that aren't affected it seems ridiculous and some form of government control, but for those is does affect, it's a serious issue that's never been addressed.
What, exactly, is an "unscented perfume?"
Also...you're an adult and you're in the minority as far as your "discomfort" w/ strong odors and smells.
Why should there be extensive (and legally expensive) legislation enacted for your personal comfort?
What benefits would this provide others and how, exactly, could something this be enforced? | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 11:17:24 AM |
Also...you're an adult and you're in the minority as far as your "discomfort" w/ strong odors and smells.
Why should there be extensive (and legally expensive) legislation enacted for your personal comfort?
What benefits would this provide others and how, exactly, could something this be enforced?
I really hate to say this, but the "minority" is quickly becoming more than just the minority. It's not just discomfort. It can be lethal to some. Yes as in causing death but hey, that's just a discomfort isn't it. Why should there be extensive ( and legally expensive) legislation? Because people put themselves and their right to stink before everyone else. If people won't use common sense and think, someone's going to do it for them. What benefits would this provide others? A decent breath of air for one. Also a clear conscious knowing that they were not responsible for someone else's death. I know, you think I'm being extreme here, I'm not. Read all the posts in the thread. There are people with severe reactions. Severe enough to kill them. I would think that their families would be screaming for justice for their loved one if they were to die because someone used "EXCESSIVE" amounts of perfume. I would be thinking that would be a clear disregard for another's life. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 11:29:00 AM | Who would decide what's "excessive?"
How would this be legislated?
What would the penalties for potential "lawbreakers?"
How people have died from perfume allergies?
In the past five years?
And where they aware of the allergies?
Did they make others aware of this allergy if knew?
The expense would come the lawsuits that would be filed by companies manufacturing scented products and from people who would be prosecuted or cited by this law.
Not sure about your municipality, but mine barely has the funding to operate much less fight numerous and lengthy legal battles that they would likely lose.
If you have a "severe reaction" then you should consider how YOU should respond to it, not attempt to legislate something, that by definition isn't possible to legislate. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 1:06:15 PM |
Workplaces are inforcing "fragrance free" policies
That is their right - an employer has the right to say whether or not employees can wear perfumes, if the employees don't like it, they can seek employment elsewhere. It is NOT something that the govt should be involved in, IMO. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/11/2008 2:32:44 PM |
it can be lethal to some
I tried to find some stats or references to anaphylaxis as a result of inhaled allergens, and came up empty-handed - this is true not only for perfumes but for any particulate matter that could be inhaled. Not much is out there I suppose since lethal reactions usually occur after ingestion. So I'm not sure what makes the exposure to perfume lethal; if there is somebody out there who has references I wouldn't mind seeing them for my own benefit.
All I could find was a reference on wiki for anaphylactic shock:
Anaphylaxis may occur after ingestion, skin contact, injection of an allergen or, in rare cases, inhalation......
Sorry, you missed my point.
I guess the difference in our attitudes is that I never inflict my second hand smoke on others in public or in their private spaces. I do not feel I have that right
What I did not understand why how your sensibilities could not be affected by breathing the fumes of burning organic material, but you are bothered by perfume? The quantity of smoke particules is obviously so significant that you can SEE the pollution quite visibily in the air, but no one can actually see perfume manifested in the atmosphere.
Be well...... | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/12/2008 5:45:48 PM | | I am not bothered by 'perfumes', but by artificial scent, which is a relatively new product. It is in most soap, detergents, air 'purifiers'(there's a joke),lotions etc etc. This is not only about me or others like me. These things are poisons, period, just as tobacco is. The only difference is, it is just becoming known. And you do have a point. If I reacted as instantly and as badly to cigarettes, I would not smoke, and I would not be endangering my health. But at least I am doing it , with my eyes wide open, by choice. Many are unaware of the long term health risks of these products. They are accepted as part of our everyday existence, just as paint solvents, carbon monoxide and herbicides were. That does not mean that we should remain ignorant of their dangers or endanger others unnecessarily. After all, how important is it, that our laundry smell like fake lavender, our hair smell like (not) fresh herbs and we smell like goodness knows what, with a fancy name, that chokes up some of our neighbours. How attractive is that? Personally, I rather like a man who smells like a man. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/13/2008 4:30:07 PM |
What I did not understand why how your sensibilities could not be affected by breathing the fumes of burning organic material, but you are bothered by perfume? That is a known phenomena. If you are used to something, your olfactory senses stop making an issue of it. It's why regular eaters of garlic cannot smell garlic on themselves. The same goes for perfume. If you are used to using a specific perfume on yourself, you cannot smell it in the air. But other people, who don't use it, can. The number of women who wear enough perfume to be smelt 10 feet away is amazing. You can't breathe when they are around.
The quantity of smoke particules is obviously so significant that you can SEE the pollution quite visibily in the air, Actually, you can't see smoke particles. You can see the smoke, because smoke is hotter than the air, and it heats up the air, and that is what you see. If you could see the smoke particles, then you would still see them 10 minutes later in the air, because if you smoke in an enclosed place, the smoke will hang in the air, but will cool down. Once it cools down, you cannot see them. But they are still there. You know that because other people can smell the smoke, but cannot see it.
but no one can actually see perfume manifested in the atmosphere. However, if you spray it out of a perfume spray, you CAN see it. And you can still smell it in a room, when someone wearing a lot of perfume has already left the room. And there are a LOT of women who wear that much.
By the way, consider that alcohol is used in all perfumes. Alcohol is a POISON. Because it is in the air, it is inhaled and goes straight into your lungs. Consider if someone poured whiskey into your lungs. How would you feel? Now imagine that people are pouring whiskey, bourbon, vodka, peach schnapps, apple schnapps, and all sorts of other alcohol-based products into your lungs. How would you feel? Would you want it banned? | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/16/2008 7:17:27 PM | Well I worked in a place where B.O. was acceptable, and I couldn't crack a window, and having a stomach problem I was running to the bathroom alot and throwing up. But of course when I mentioned it to my employers I was being difficult, and the clients of course had problems so therefore their medical conditions of being to lazy to bathe or not bathing on purpose far outweighed sensitive stomach employee. It wasn't even a nursing home, just a cafe. Gawd and no matter how many times I begged for them to not have me working on French Onion soup day, there it was all steamy hot in the crockpot with it's noxious fumes just waiting to torment me. Oh GAG, lol.
Also in placse like pubs or the bus, people feel free to FARTor poop their pants, and I am there tyring to hold back a hurl and gagging and getting funny looks, so perhaps poopypants people should have some kind of BAN for the love of gawd.
Yeah so it works both ways, people have medical problems when it comes to perfumes, and others have medical problems when it comes to Fecal smells and B.O.
Btw I have allergies and perfume doesn't bother me. Sometimes I sneeze oh wahh. I still wear it too. Well pick your poisons, I would rather sneeze then PUKE thank you very mucho.
This banning stuff is getting ridiculous. How about start banning whats really important? And are the trees they make perfume from going to be cut down?
On that note if you see Dogs tied up outside of a store or something, could you not park your car (where it's not even suppossed to be) and leave it idling and blow the exhaust fumes in the dog's face? Of course where's the ban on that? Of course dogs aren't allowed inside so they have to stay outside. So where's the BAN on that? Oh yeah people more important, oops sorry I forgot.
Did I already post in this thread? Oops sorry. Uh Oh please no banning. LOL | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/16/2008 9:21:05 PM | Well here's a solution, if the perfume can kill or make the person so sick they are so ill they are having migraines that lead to min-strokes and other deadly stuff according to this thread then here's a solution:
See a surgeon and get your SENSE of SMELL removed. Now grant you you will lose some or all of your SENSE of TASTE, but if your immune system is that compromised that walking out the door and smelling perfume makes you deathly ill, wouldn't this be a better and easier solution?
And blaming everything on cigarettes and perfume is asinine. Hey guess what I smoke. Guess what I had asthma and real bad allergies as a child, and was around smokers. Hey guess what my asthma hardly ever bothers me now, except when I get a cold. I use my puffer like once a week. IMAGINE that?
Now I know it's completly retarded for me to smoke and doesn't help other things and I really wish I didn't but it's an addiction and for me to completely stop would mean avoiding all HUMANS until MOODY stage is over. I would much prefer if they stopped making them altogether. Course then everyone will be moody at first, hmmm. Maybe they don't want a withdrawal war and that's why they are still being made.
Now why B.O. and people smelling like pee or poop and farting is not on the same agenda as this perfume ban is beyond me. Perhaps this idea seems silly to some but if the fecal, urine and B.O. stench is so bad it makes someone vomit well just remember there's ACID in vomit.
And anyone who drowns themselves in perfume, that bad that people are hacking and gagging then yeah they should be reprimanded. But if a busdriver is going to kick someone off the bus for wearing perfume, I would sure as hell like to see the person who crapped their pants, or didn't bathe for a week thrown off the bus. Yet no one seems to upset with these people for some reason. These smells are more lovely then perfume?
Oh and has anyone seen any documentaries on the OIL industry lately? There is oil in everything we use, pills, food, and basically almost every product out there. Hmm perhaps another reason for some chemical sensitivity? | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/16/2008 11:09:18 PM |
Well here's a solution, if the perfume can kill or make the person so sick they are so ill they are having migraines that lead to min-strokes and other deadly stuff according to this thread then here's a solution:
See a surgeon and get your SENSE of SMELL removed.
You want somebody to have surgury because you wear too much perfume? How bout you stay home instead? | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/17/2008 12:29:35 PM | No I was saying it's just an idea, and when I go out I don't douse myself with perfume thanks, and I don't wear it everyday either.
I got that idea from a documentary on tv. And yeah sometimes it seems like a good idea to my situation sometimes. Of course my situation isn't life threatening. Just an idea for those who lives are so drastically altered the smell of chemicals or perfume or cow manure can kill.
Just an idea oh sorry for having one.
So if having some ideas on a topic means someone should stay at home then, looks like your a FAN of BANNING everything. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/25/2008 12:59:30 PM | i wouldn't say follow the smoking ban cause i don't even agree with that....but lots seem to bath in perfume and they reek...i also get migraines from those people... 
but perhaps allow people who are allergic/sensitive to the scents to speck up to security or supervisors/bosses that would be allowed to tell the one wearing the scent to go home and change or wash of the perfume right that second...
i went to a school where the teachers would tell students not to wear strong scents to school...if they did there were sent home for the day because of the ones allergic/sensitive to the scents...it was a good thing for anyone who suffered with the scents and the ones who loved wearing them...well they learned to wear it away from school after being sent home cause they reeked and made other students sick...
i remember many times before that came into play i use to get migraines all the time and go home sick because people reeked... | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/25/2008 1:04:25 PM | ^^^^
Workplaces aren't schools.
If you have a legitimate medical need, then maybe they could move YOU into an area where the scent(s) won't bother you.
But asking another employee to "go and wash off a perfume/cologne" would certainly invite lawsuits and affect productivity.
And this, to satisfy the needs of a single employee.
It's also rude....but I'm not sure that telling you something so obvious as that will register if it hasn't already.
Bad idea.
VERY bad idea | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/25/2008 1:13:28 PM | ^^^
well maybe where you are it may not be an issue...but most places like this have signs everywhere saying lay off the scents or scent free....if someone sees that sign and still wears it and someone has a reaction the company should get in sh*t for it if its not washed of at least....its not fair to anyone who has issues with scents to have to go to school/work wondering if someone is gonna bath in perfume again....my school has been asking and putting signs around about it so if if someone is stupid enough to come to class/work after reading those signs wearing strongly well its a lesson learned for them to follow the rules...
i don't think anyone should have to change environment just because some choose to wear it....when its very clear its a scent free zone!!!the one who wears it should wash it of and wear it away from that environment from then on out of respect for others... | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/25/2008 11:02:21 PM | Someone made the comment that they could not find any information other than something about anaphylaxis on wiki. Try doing a google on “deaths caused by multiple chemical sensitivity” It does not list or name individuals who have died but it will open your eyes.
Some people seem to think that you have to come into physical contact with a toxin for it to cause death. Really? Then please tell me how anyone could die from inhaling exhaust? Isn’t that a common suicide method? What about families found in their homes having succumb to carbon monoxide poisoning? Another myth? Does that mean that all the scare people have regarding sour gas is also a myth? Just because it doesn’t smell or come in a fancy bottle labeled “fragrance” doesn’t mean it can’t kill.
People seem to think it’s funny that a “smell” can do harm. It’s not really the so called smell. It’s the chemicals that create the smell. These cause MCS. Multiple Chemical Sensitivity. Try googling “Multiple Chemical Sensitivity: Enzyme Related Toxic Overdose.”
Symptoms provoked by fragrances include: watery or dry eyes, double vision, sneezing, nasal congestion, sinusitis, tinnitus, ear pain, dizziness, vertigo, coughing, bronchitis, difficulty breathing, difficulty swallowing, asthma, anaphylaxis, headaches, seizures, fatigue, confusion, disorientation, incoherence, short-term memory loss, inability to concentrate, nausea, lethargy, anxiety, irritability, depression, mood swings, restlessness, rashes, hives, eczema, flushing, muscle and joint pain, muscle weakness, irregular heart beat, hypertension, swollen lymph glands, and more. (Candida Research and Information Foundation, Perfume Survey, Winter 1989-90)
I guess unless it happens to you or your family though it’s no big deal. So some kid has a seizure at school because someone wore too much “Old Spice” or the bus driver who didn’t know he was sensitive to scents; has a passenger board and suddenly has a seizure while driving in busy traffic. Is that driver negligence or self indulgence on the passenger who happens to love the smell of Musk? Just because a death certificate does not state “ Cause of death…SMELL” does not mean that it doesn’t or hasn’t happened.
Chemicals in everyday products are toxic. Toxins are poisons. Why is it so hard to believe that they kill? Or is it that people don’t want to admit that people in general prefer to remain ignorant of the knowledge thus giving themselves the delusion that they are not harming others due to their right to hose themselves down in fragrance? | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/26/2008 7:13:35 AM | ^^^^^
Carbon monoxide is gas.
It causes death by too readily combining w/ cells depriving them of oxygen.
It differs drastically from a death from anaphylaxis-related shock.
The sites you're Googling aren't peer-reviewed making the information in them suspect.
It's doubtful that passive inhalation of perfume would cause all of the effects list, some of which are contraindicative.
Wouldn't it be more likely that user of this chemical would be at greater risk than anybody around them?
I mean if BREATHING in the fumes of this chemical is so "dangerous" wouldn't WEARING the chemical by at least AS lethal?
Like secondhand cigarette smoke, there anecdotes but no real peer-reviewed studies.
To my way understanding this is more of aesthetic complaint than a serious medical issue. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/26/2008 11:19:04 AM | Yes Carbon monoxide is a gas. I was pointing out that it was possible for death to be the result of simply BREATHING in a substance as a previous poster had questioned the validity of death by inhalation.
My basic point is that not everyone is sensitive to chemicals. Some are, some aren't. To those that are (and the numbers are increasing) it is not a mere nuisance. It is a serious medical issue. How many people in general suffer from seizures? How many people have died because of seizures? Regardless of the cause, it is still a serious medical issue. If simply BREATHING in the fumes of a fragrance can trigger this would you not consider that "dangerous"?
A person with asthma does carry their medication with them yet it does not always work. Sometimes they must be rushed into emergency. Sometimes they don't get there in time. Sometimes they die. But that's not dangerous because simply breathing in fumes which caused a reaction is not a serious medical issue according to you.
You doubt it because it doesn't affect you. If you were one of those that were sensitive to scents, you'd be singing a different tune. I guess we just have to wait for more families to bury their loved ones and "less suspect information" is made available before people realize their ignorance. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/26/2008 12:36:28 PM | canoeGal, I did do a google search and research into MCS (multiple chemical sensitivity) and found that most every reputable medical and psychiatric association does not consider it a "serious medical illness". As a matter of fact, it is generally not recognized as an illness or as a physiological disease at all. That's not to say it won't one day be recognized (fibromylagia and CFS were once rejected as real illnesses too) however until that day we can't propose legislation banning anything based on a medically unrecognized illness or syndrome. On a side note, I also couldn't find any evidence that anyone had ever died of it either. Mostly its defined as an illness or syndrome but not lethal.
The fact is that perfume does irritate some people (yes even those who smoke) and does contain chemicals that can be harmful to our health. There are more reported cases where its an irritant rather than an allergy so arguing that you will die from anaphylactic shock (from inhaling other people's perfumes) is not really realistic unless the allergic person literally bathes in it.
However, at which point do we stop relying on the government to legislate common sense? Are we really going to accept a government ban that will ensure the minority of people (those who wear way too much perfume) are not irritating another minority (those who are irritated or allergic)? Really? I hope not. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 2/26/2008 1:47:37 PM | I can't see the ban succeeding, I'll admit I get a tad woozy sometimes when a senior citizen hops on the bus and it smells like they've dunked themselves in a vat of Elizabeth Taylor perfume/Old Spice...  
However the simplest solution is to simply approach the person and ask them if they're aware of how much they stink, in a polite way of course!
I know some people have a higher sensitivity to it, I have a good female friend that becomes ill from certain perfumes/soaps, hence why I have to remind myself not to spray on some Axe deodorant before I visit her... However even she would not wish for such a fascist law to be passed, we'd really be encroaching on personal freedom at that point.
Second-hand smoke bans was one thing, despite people claiming that no conclusive evidence exists, I've spent many a weekend flat out on my back with ruined sinuses from a night's worth of clubbing in a smoky bar. Usually it took 1-2 days to recover from my allergies and sick feeling. However with perfume all I do is either hold my breath as they pass, breathe through my mouth, or cover my nose until I can get away from them. I've gotten dizzy from perfume, but never anything over a few seconds...  | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 3/2/2008 6:51:26 PM | Steph77
What's next, fines for those with BO?
We can only HOPE 
Kasandroid
See a surgeon and get your SENSE of SMELL removed. Now grant you you will lose some or all of your SENSE of TASTE, but if your immune system is that compromised that walking out the door and smelling perfume makes you deathly ill, wouldn't this be a better and easier solution?
IF someone is truly ALLERGIC then simply removing their sense of smell won't stop the reaction it isn't just the olfactory area that is compromised it is more likely their lungs and histamines.. Inhaling the perfumes affects their entire body whether they smell it or not. | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 3/2/2008 7:20:55 PM | > I've truly read everything now........how can this even be contemplated.....?
Simple. We have complete morons running all levels of government in our country. If this passes, summers should be just awesome in the nation's capital. Hope the smell of B.O. doesn't make you sick as well.... | |
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| Canada ban on Perfumes
Posted: 4/6/2008 4:39:14 AM | | There is a simple invention that counters dirty bodies. It is called soap and water. And the problem is not scent, but artificial scent. Anyone, staying in my home, is given a bar of unscented goat's milk soap, and they do not smell. In fact, they end up with soft skin. My hair is washed in a shampoo of camomile flowers and bark, which I have been using for 30 years, and at almost sixty, it is soft and shinny. And I use gardenia oil, as a scent. I love the smell of gardenias. REAL GARDENIAS. It has never caused a reaction in anyone I know. Before a friend insisted that I transplant my rose tree from my studio, where it had been living happily for 3 years, to my garden, the whole lower floor of my home smelt faintly of roses. And did you know that after some study(no, I cannot footnote it, because I can't remember who it was), the most arousing smells to a man are cinnamon and natural female? Why fill our world with fake smelling, chemical toxins, when we have the real thing? Answer:Money! They are cheaper and some big businesses love to sell ideas, not product, when people don't take the time to think it through. The adds you see on TV, are not of enclosed laboratories, but of wide open fields, filled with real flowers. If we all are so addicted to artificial scents, why don't they advertise their products, by using pictures of the labs where they are created? Call a spade a spade, and then sell it. We have to think, to protect ourselves and our neighbours. | |
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