|
|
|
|
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 8:19:21 AM |
"Ah yes, the respect for womenkind he has drips from this post. I guess if not wanting to copulate with casual participants means morally superior then sure, I will take that as a compliment."
Who spoke of "casual partners"???
You are using the work "casual" to literally. To the majority of women, and yes I feel comfortable speaking for the majority, casual implies no committment. What is casual sex? It's sex with someone of whom you have no monogomous, committed relationship. I'm okay with generalizing that because for the majority of women it is true. As said in previous posts, there are women who fit outside the norm, but for the majority this is how they think.
"Because Women believe they are giving of themselves at a much higher level than guys do so it would be much better if guys only had sex if they shared that level of commitment, it's not the girl who is wrong it's the leading on of emotions just to 'get sex' that guys need to think about."
Why does this higher level HAVE TO MEAN "LTR"??
You focused on the wrong part of this statement. The poster was commenting on the fact that men often don't understand that women (as the OP asked) DO equate sex with committment. Any hopes, dreams, or wishes on your part to change that DO NOT make it so. Whether you agree with it, does NOT change it either. Whether there are rational reasons for it not based on our own gender's values, ideals, and norms doesn't make one bit of difference. (Just look at your position, it's just as irrational as the next). It's how we are! Emotions aren't always able to be rationalized. When we have sex with someone, our emotions get tied to the RELATIONSHIP behind it, not the actual sexual act. You can argue it until you are blue in the face, but it will still be, has been, and always will be, the way the majority of women think.
"Yes, funny how the spectre of pregnancy makes women a bit nervous when you make your sperm donation and skate off."
Sperm donation? Oh come on, there are many ways to stay away from this type of donation!!!!
Actually there are many ways to LESSEN the chance of pregnancy, but none 100% effective other than abstinence. This is statistically and unequivicably true. I find it funny how you think this shouldn't be a worry...of course you do! You're the man. If the women you are sleeping with finds herself pregnant, GUESS who all the responsibility falls on? HER. Not that you wouldn't support her, cause maybe you would (which is great, but not at all close to the point I am trying to make). But overall, she is faced with all the hard decisions. She gets to decide whether or not to keep a baby, whether she is mature enough, financially stable, and ready to raise a child. She gets to decide if she wants to have her body go through hell in a world where we already place too much emphasis on looks. She is the one faced with all the decisions and worry. The man's hardest decision is how to best deal with the resulting decision of the woman.
Who spoke of quick roll? And why continue to represent all RELATIONSHIPS under the monopolistic notion of "excusive LTRs"???? Commitment easily broken by those who are masters in PROMISES, PROMISES and masters in "bail outs"?????
Of course anyone (including yourself) is human. Usually, when a man strays from the COMMITTMENT of a relationship (and cheats in some form) the relationship ends. It's all about being committed to the person! In all forms.
"....instead of accepting it for what it is, human female nature...."
Have we entered in an era where it is popular to DEFINE monotypes of gender determined human nature? Is this 1907 or 1807 or 807 (AD)?
Oh my!
Cheers to all! Let us break from molds and promote the American Way of life: PLURALISM in behavior and lifestyle choices!!! LTRs are OK, but they are not being best served by calling on non LTR behaviour "abnormal"or "un-natural" for women in 2007 !!! and calling ALL types of non exclusive-so called-LTR hehavior "casual sex" or other demeaning nicks!
Nothing more frustrating than when people try to use our current "day in age" as an excuse for poor behavior. If you want to have sex with multiple partners, that's your perogative. But don't try to defend it, especially with this defense. Our world (morals, values, etc.) are going down the crapper because we are being forced to accept ideas like this where people think they can have both! I say, let's stop being forced to accept things that are inherently wrong. Stand up for ourselves.
Bottom lines:
1. Women DO equate sex with committment.
2. If you are going to have sex with multiple partners, make sure you are informing them of this beforehand. To assume that women would EVER want sex without committment is reckless and dangerous. You will end up seriously hurting someone.
JMO | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 8:28:58 AM | I have not spoken in favor of casual sex.
Some posters here have eulogized LTRs and badmouthed EVERYTHING else.
If MOST women are into EXCLUSIVE AND LTR sex only, then how come the average woman has 1.5 to 2 lovers per year, as was quoted by a poster in another thread.
I see that this issue has become a vendetta issue, and as a gentleman, I yield.
"2. If you are going to have sex with multiple partners, make sure you are informing them of this beforehand. To assume that women would EVER want sex without committment is reckless and dangerous. You will end up seriously hurting someone". I course I do. But let me add that you have no idea what my sexual practices are and as such you are in no position to OFFER ME advice!!! As per how RESPONSIBLE I am re relations with the opposite sex, take a look at previous posts of mine on this thread to find out. PLUS ( I said PLUS) I always use a candom, unless you want to turn this thread into a thread against condom use. I guess you know better than all agencies which promote the use of condoms in Africa, etc. If you or others think that condoms are not safe enough, then take the issue up with the candom industry, not me. Plus I repeat my question: Do you ever fly or drive, etc., or is that too risky?
Rhetoric as some of the one which has been used here by excl. LTR "proponents" gives LTRs, to which I am not against, a "bad image"! And that is indeed a shame, cause there is nothing wrong with excl. LTRs. But there are other options too.
Cheers | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 8:52:55 AM | Flying scares the crap outta me honestly! LOL I only do it if I have to, which is rare. As far as driving, yes, I do. But there are precautions you take when flying or driving...such as informing any passengers of the dangers of it and your responsibility to them. When flying you sign releases. When I am driving children or clients for work (on the odd chance) I ALWAYS have them sign a release of liability form explaining my responsibilites and duties to them, as well as theirs to me.
As for the "advice" I gave...it wasn't merely to you, but to everyone reading this thread! I don't know what your practices are, so of course, I'm not doling out advice specific to only you, but to people in general. Being a woman, I think I am fully able to dole out the suggestions I did.
As for condom use, OF COURSE everyone should use them! They LESSEN your chances of STD's and pregnancy. But they don't protect 100%, which is the point I was making. Just because you are using condoms does not give you ample reason to go sleep with alot of people, as there are always chances. If you ARE going to be partaking in this behavior, then you need to do the responsible and mature thing and discuss the relationship, whatever form it takes, with the other person PRIOR to sleeping with them.
This all being said, I revert back to my original opinion:
The OP asked why "women equate sex with committment"...the answer is because we DO. Whether someone (anyone, not just you) agrees with it makes no difference. It is just what is.
Second, I still stand by my statement:
If you are going to have sex with multiple partners, make sure you are informing them of this beforehand. To assume that women would EVER want sex without committment is reckless and dangerous. You will end up seriously hurting someone | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 9:10:02 AM | I am scared of flying too, if that tells you something.
If yoiu have gathered by now, it is not what you say per se which draws my retort, but the argunenation you use to support what you say about LTRs, etc.
"Just because you are using condoms does not give you ample reason to go sleep with alot of people, as there are always chances". I agree fully. As long as we define what "sleeping around means".
Now, leaving STDs/STIs aside for a minute, "would EVER want sex without committment is reckless and dangerous. You will end up seriously hurting someone", the assumption that if one wants to have sex with another one is that a commitment is implied is not a universal one. Whether it is the "non commitment" oriented or the "commitment" oriented party which should "warn" the other is a matter a) of customs b) responsibility c) law???? d) other (specify). I would, actually, be in favor of an international law (option c) to be signed by all UN countries!
Mind you, to end this philosophically, after all is said and done about all the various risks (STD, hurt feelings, etc.), the concept of a "risk free" life is, alas, still very farf away from humanity. Plus I am so sympathetic of spouses who caught diceases because of an unfaithful partner in a commited, tested, but not either loyal or responsible LTR. The rest of us do know that we are taking "some" risk. They assumed, trusted, they did not!!! That is why always I use and will use a condom to better protect myself (and my future sexual partners), no matter what other protection or such is used. Like the dollar note says .... I only trust ... Humans err.
Cheers to all and let's all be responsible and honest, not only because of STDs.
Goodnight! | |
|
k.kong
|
Joined: 1/4/2006
Msg: 106 | |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 9:14:41 AM | Maybe because women aren't dogs (although I understand it is a favored position) who can just rut at a moments notice, or maybe because women need to commit to having sex with men (or is that be committed?), or maybe because to really enjoy a connection there should be one...who knows? I'm an ape and I just find the ones chained to a rock | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 9:39:51 AM |
"....instead of accepting it for what it is, human female nature...."
Have we entered in an era where it is popular to DEFINE monotypes of gender determined human nature? Is this 1907 or 1807 or 807 (AD)? No, it's 2007 . They only began studying gender differences in the actual brain in the last 15 years, due partially to the assumptions that males were the same as females with the exception of reproductive equipment, and also the technology to do the research necessary has only existed for the last 20 years or so. If you bothered to read any of the studies done on gender differences in the brain you might reconsider this comment.
Nothing more frustrating than when people try to use our current "day in age" as an excuse for poor behavior. If you want to have sex with multiple partners, that's your perogative. But don't try to defend it, especially with this defense. Our world (morals, values, etc.) are going down the crapper because we are being forced to accept ideas like this where people think they can have both! I say, let's stop being forced to accept things that are inherently wrong. Stand up for ourselves. Here here Ambie! Yet when we do stand up for ourselves, we are called prudes or demeaned by men for following what we believe is right for us.
LTRs are OK, but they are not being best served by calling on non LTR behaviour "abnormal"or "un-natural" for women in 2007 !!! and calling ALL types of non exclusive-so called-LTR hehavior "casual sex" or other demeaning nicks! OK, so calling sex with someone with whom you are not committed is not casual? You prefer "friends with benefits?" Why do you consider this negative in the same breath that you demean LTR's? Long term relationships are "OK?" This coming from the guy that assumes we don't like sex if we prefer a LTR? Talk about negative generalizations...
Totally confusing! Who are the confused? Us men, or them women?
Astrophysics is simpler than relationships between men and women. LOL
Well, then you are just not paying attention. We're telling you in pretty simple terms. The fact that you choose not to pay attention or to mock our feelings and ideals is frankly not our problem. We get you loud and clear. Sex without responsibility. Sex without commitment. It's not like we did not already know this.
Social workers have an MA degree to work in the US, it's required. You must study psychology and sociology. Some of the MA in social work programs are designed strictly for marriage and family counselors, qualifying them to practice using the psychological/sociological paradigm. This would include things like group and family therapy, as well as individual counseling. To get your MA, there is a requirement that you get counseling yourself, as well. Since you are so quick to speak of psychology:
The fact that you are a social workers and experienced the experiences you write does not make you an expert on psychology or STATISTICS. I must assume you are an expert. So, anyone who takes psych 1 or 2 knows all about Erickson's Developmental stages of life. Each of these stages is marked by a conflict, the successful resolution of which results in an outcome which lays the groundwork for the next stage in maturity/virtue finally to end in wisdom as the desired result of our life experience. Young Adulthood, intimacy vs. isolation. Think about it. I am not dissing your lifestyle choices, I am merely seeking to point out that it's a deviation from the generally accepted "norms."
Cheers to all! Let us break from molds and promote the American Way of life: PLURALISM in behavior and lifestyle choices!!! Since you feel it necessary to characterize casual sex with Americanism... Well then OK, let's examine this from the "American Way" of looking at things by listening to our founding fathers opinions:
"Let them revere nothing but religion, morality and liberty."
"It is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue."-- John Adams
"[A] good moral character is the first essential in a man... and your conduct here may stamp your character through life. It is therefore highly important that you should endeavor not only to be learned but virtuous."--George Washington
"What is liberty without...virtue? It is...madness, without restraint. Men are qualified for liberty in exact proportion to their disposition to put moral chains upon their own appetites."--Edmund Burke
"Yes, we did produce a near perfect Republic. But will they keep it, or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the surest way to destruction."--Thomas Jefferson
"We have staked the future of all our political institutions upon the capacity of mankind for self-government; upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God."--James Madison (Author of the Constitution)
You know I could go on... but I conclude with the Frenchman who wrote [u]Democracy in America.[/u] In this work he discussed why Democracy worked in the US, when it had failed in so many other places.
"Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith." -- Alexis de Tocqueville
Just because I am free to do as I please, does not make it right. John Locke maintained that under Natural Law, as long as what you did not hurt others, you should be free to do it according to your own conscience. You see in most of the posts from women here, how they feel about sex and commitment. Yet instead of listening to what is being said and thinking about it's ramification, you have sought to demean it repeatedly. | |
|
k.kong
|
Joined: 1/4/2006
Msg: 108 | |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 9:46:34 AM | ^^^^^I salute you and your well thought out responses. This is, by far, one of the most compelling and intellectual responses I have read on this site.  | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 9:50:04 AM | I am not going to enter again into a debate who is demeaning what or whom (eg demeaning LTRs into an anti-STI "protection" tool, instead of something people enter into for more fundamental reasons rather than in return for sex or for protection against STIs). The answers to most of your argumentations can be found in my previous posts in this thread.
As for the rest, I yield.
Note: This Thread is not the sum of all Forums nor are the Forums' majority views representative of all POFs. And statistics on number of partners women have per year (average) paint a different picture for what goes on in the world out there (offine) than a proclaimed "view of all women" in this thread!
Cheers | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 10:12:40 AM | It depends on how good he is. If it's really really good...yeah, I'd like to be able to enjoy that long term.
But I don't see sex as commitment, even good sex.
I see commitment as commitment. There are no guarantees. | |
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 10:24:28 AM | RE :message # 107 great answer/post  BUT
I like good answers , but I like " SHORT ANSWERS" 
Great to see so much effort but the real answer is less than a paragragh ..... | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 10:30:45 AM | sex is the closest you can ever get to someone and the simple fact that you are sleeping with that someone must mean an attraction.
most women are simple when they like someone enough they want to share that with them and hope for the best comes from it. they dont just chuck it aroung here there and everywhere!!!!!!!!
NOW THAT IVE ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION ANSWER MINE
WHY DO MEN HAVE SUCH A COMMITTMNET PROPLEM??????????????? | |
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 10:59:56 AM | ^^^ Well you just said it - sex and committment -
you dont have committment issues with someone if you are sexually involved
with them- so what is the problem- the original question -why do WE equate sex with committment- well you just did-
and anyway Sex is a committiment to someone - you are giving yourself to them-
I dont give a shit about FWB or one night stands - those people - they have thier own agendas -
And when building a foundation for a solid relationship with someone - a committment is a building block and Sex is just what keeps it solidly together and I am sure men and women seeking real relationships will agree- | |
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 11:24:19 AM | If I am close enough to someone to have sex with them, then there is commitment there. I don't have one night stands.......I don't sleep with people I don't have feelings for beyond plain old lust.
Its just never been something that I have been comfortable with doing. I have enough regrets lol
I don't need to regret the men I have chosen to sleep with.
I've loved/cared deeply for the men I have shared my bed with........Thats the way its going to stay. So yeah long story short, this Fishy wants commitment! | |
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 1:15:45 PM |
Men equate sex with committment because 9 in 10 women go crazy commitment stalker on the guys ass after sex!!!!!!! Wow, way to set your own gender back 20 years. I am stunned a man did not post that, frankly.
Maybe women would not go so "commitment crazy" if some men were not screwing and dumping them repeatedly. It's happened to most all of us at least once. Some of us are savvy enough to learn from it. The wise choice for a woman is to communicate her thoughts and beliefs up front, so there is no possibility of a misunderstanding. Then if he is on a different page, end it right there, and don't continue under the mistaken impression that things will ever change, because it's too rare to mention. Of course, some evil men have been known to lie at this point to get it anyway. Stick to your personal boundaries and you will have fewer regrets.
If you check the threads here, you will find many women complaining about men getting possessive too early on in a relationship. This stalker door can swing both ways. I had a guy stalk me for over two years that I dated a total of three times before I decided it was not something I wanted to pursue. He wanted a commitment, I did not. | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 1:15:56 PM | | This posted twice, for what reason, I know not. Sorry I cannot come up with anything more profound to say on this matter of internet glitches. :) | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 1:53:23 PM |
No, it's 2007 . They only began studying gender differences in the actual brain in the last 15 years, due partially to the assumptions that males were the same as females with the exception of reproductive equipment, and also the technology to do the research necessary has only existed for the last 20 years or so. If you bothered to read any of the studies done on gender differences in the brain you might reconsider this comment.
One recent brain scan study caught my attention. When men are shown a picture of a woman's face if they like the face, their pleasure center lights up in the scan. Women had no such reaction to men's faces (can't say I blame them).
You see in most of the posts from women here, how they feel about sex and commitment. Yet instead of listening to what is being said and thinking about it's ramification, you have sought to demean it repeatedly.
Another poster in this thread mentioned that it is not going to change. Yet instead of accepting that reality we see repeated whining about it instead. Guys, use the insights her to learn something; don't expect to whine in a forum and make all the women of the word change to be something they're not. | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 3:10:14 PM |
I like good answers , but I like " SHORT ANSWERS" Somehow, "because they feel like it" did not seem to encompass all I wanted to say.
Actually, I would rather get all the quotes replied to in one fell swoop, rather than a message at a time. And here there was a lot to um, respond to. | |
|
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 3:22:47 PM | I think what it boils down to is that some (many, perhaps) don't see sex as a "stand alone" activity, rather one aspect of something else. Sex just for sex is different in context than sex as an expression of closeness and intimacy within the context of a relationship, likely one that would be include mutually agreed upon monogamy.
One thing that seems to stand out reading many threads here is how little many apparently communicate with someone, whether they're "seeing" them, "dating" them, spending time with them, the semantics seems to be confusing. What does this mean, what does that mean....when I'm confused, I usually open my yap and ASK. And I guarantee before I become sexually involved with someone, there WILL be communication and an understanding.
People seem to be afraid to communicate because they're afraid of what the other person may think. Wow, to me that's almost scary....how can you possibly know what someone else thinks if you don't talk to them? I'm not a mindreader, my tarot cards caught fire, crystal ball has a huge crack and my kids took my magic 8 ball. I'm left with nothing else but having to talk to someone to "divine" what they're thinking!  | |
|
| |
| Why do women equate sex with committment...
Posted: 3/14/2007 3:50:25 PM | Wow
GEEEZZ!
Moma and Nick you two are unbelievable!
Quite a sparring match going on!!
How will it end??
I can't guess what else either of you have to say about this subject.
Lets just say YOU BOTH WIN!
All relationships, whether business or personal, friendships with same gender or otherwise, and sexual encounters in an LTR or otherwise can be good only if a WIN_WIN relationship exists. | |
|
|
| Page 5 of 14
|
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 |
|
Home
login 
golly gee he had sex with me...now why don't he call LOL 
