| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/11/2007 12:37:08 PM | To Nathan, re: msg 74
I didn't say energy was the source of greed, if that assertion was a response to my post. No motivation is likely to get a civilization to far-flung parts of the universe if it requires more energy than they have at their disposal or if it will cost them so much in resources (all of which ultimately are supplies of energy really) that they are left crippled as a result. That's the point I'm trying to make. Is it possible some crazed alien society would sacrifice themselves just to come and do us in? Sure, but it's highly unlikely and we have to base our decisions on probabilities.
And I'm not sure whether msg 75 was a serious or a joking response. Let's hope for the latter. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/14/2007 2:41:51 PM | i once read a good portion of the "battlefield earth" series (over all boring). it began stating that the malevolent alien race that invaded earth discovered its existence because of some stupid space capsule that we sent out into space telling 'em where it was. apparently, many of the materials found in the capsule were of great value, so the aliens came to earth, killed pretty much everyone, and subjected the rest to a slavish existence of mining the stuff they wanted. i got a good chuckle out of it. it sounded to me like the spanish conquest of south america and thier obsession with gold.
i'd say low profile. we humans have oboviously done this sort of thing to eachother, so what makes us think that some other beings would be any different? i'd say it's better to be safe then sorry...
lar | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/14/2007 3:49:03 PM | We have to keep ourselves in a low profile to a certain extent, wouldn't it be worthwhile to discover other civilizations that are at an equal technological state?
The dream of finding a civilization that is advanced enough that might help or destroy us is quite farfetched.
And then there's the complexity of comunication and inter-relationships between a network of planets that would be at a similar level.
This is all good, and I would want to be alive to see it happen, but, here (our solar system) is where the priority lies. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/15/2007 12:51:34 AM | | In my own Opinion, I think that if they are any Other planet Civilization traveling amongst the stars, they probaly if they get close enough to the area where our Television signals are, at least the good ones, not sure about the bad ones, cause they may have rules to agianst making "First Contact" too with out at least Us making the stepping stone to the stars, by Warp/Anti-Gravity technology, and Once we do that, 1st contact might happen, or they'll just be cautious and wait to come across us by ship.. I think the whole low profile tho idea is already out the window, our Radio/television signals at least the the first transmissions is well already at least 80 light years away.. if any civilization has come across them, well they know we're here but probaly couldn't understand it. but thats just how I see it.. SETI is well basically a program tho to do the same, to see if we get an external not from earth type transmission, and SETI does have protocols with regards to what we do after wards after confirming that this is a valid external Transmission.. But thats just my take.. Matt.. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/15/2007 4:39:46 AM | | It only matters if there is a method by which we can travel faster than light. I suspect there isn't. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/15/2007 5:00:14 AM | | I suppose that my concern would not be that an advanced race of Et's would wish us harm or enslavement (although that would be a problem). My concern would be that they would be that they would carry some sort of virus or germ that we could not handle. But, I have to say that I do not believe there is any life out there. The universe as vast as it seems to us is an ecological system all in itself, with ever light year of it required for the existance and substaining of human life. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/15/2007 5:00:42 AM | if they exist, I think that the attitude of human lifeforms in other planets towards us will depend upon their appreciation - appeal of universal pop cultural products such as The Beattles music (Michelle Ma Belle), Eric Clapton's (Wonderful Tonight), The Cosby Show and above all Frasier! And their approval rating of Arnold the Gov.!
Seriously, if we beam/send them episodes of Lost, one can expect that they will be confused or get lost!
Honestly: What do we have to gain by finding other human life forms on another planet? We have not yet managed to live peacefully between the 6 billion of us and in unison with nature and other life forms here on Earth. Unless we are looking for safety planets which could be inhabited by us as a hedging tool for our survival (global warming, nukes, viruses, metiors, etc, but are not inhabited by others!Remember what happened to the Vikings who crossed the Atlantic!!!
Actually: If they can come find us, that means they are superior to us, if we find them and go to them, it means we are. But does that matter? The keys to our progress and welfare are here on Earth (except for panic rooms outside Earth, maybe a constructed planet is the solution???)
Thus: A low profile and a high periscope seems indeed a prudent approach. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/15/2007 5:28:04 AM | | well i shoulda added this link for some of you guys, its my myspace page, and its got videos on it, the ones ya wanna see tho is the one that will play automatically, and then even the last one after that, and this stuff is not a Joke, Nick Cook is very Credible, and what he has uncovered in the last video, is well very well documented. so perhaps ya should check it out, http://www.myspace.com/macster2010 enjoy.. and of course ya don't have to take it at face value, but at least just try to keep an open mind.. I also Highly suggest Nick Cook's Book, The Hunt for Zero Point.. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/17/2007 7:17:39 AM | I think it's sort of interesting that everyone seems to assume that any "space aliens" out there would even find us intelligible at all.
I suspect that if they were to exist at all, they would be, well, *alien*. Possibly totally incomprehensible to us, and us totally incomprehensible to them.
Do we understand, for example, why dolphins and whales engage in complicated sonic exchanges with one another? That's a species on the same planet with relatively minimal genetic difference, in the grand scheme of things.
We would not even need to go that far. Were the culture, values, 'religious' beliefs of pre-contact Australian peoples really intelligble to Westerners? Were Westerners' intelligible to them?
SB | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/17/2007 10:22:29 AM | | Space being so vast i am sure there is other life some where. Low profile: i think not....i would love to met a ET. As people chow: doughtfull... just doesnt seem plausable to me. We most likely will never know what lies behond , in that dark never ending sky which is space....but it is wonderful to imagin........ | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/17/2007 7:56:49 PM | | To slybandit, I dont really assume anything, I just keep in open mind that is its a possibility, but Im not the type that goes and says, there are aliens amongst us or not, but its a possibility, but I would want proof tho to say yes they are here, But regardless, with the fact that the universe is so big, we really cant be the only ones, just the fact that if any other civilization exist light years from us, the real question is, are they space a space faring civilization.. But it is true that our Government uses the idea of alien UFO's (the CIA) for there own purpose's testing of new and top secret aircraft.. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/20/2007 4:19:15 PM |
it began stating that the malevolent alien race that invaded earth discovered its existence because of some stupid space capsule that we sent out into space telling 'em where it was.
Too late, we've already sent out two probes (the Voyager probes) with golden records that tell whoever finds it where to find us. Even if it didn't find any aliens quite as bad as the ones from BE (Travolta messed up big time staring in THAT one), it would be a simple matter for an advanced civilization to wipe us out if it chose to, and regardless of what people might think we'd be able to put up token resistance at best. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/20/2007 4:23:28 PM |
It only matters if there is a method by which we can travel faster than light. I suspect there isn't.
Keep in mind a little over 100 years ago people would've thought it'd be crazy to fly faster than sound or that we'd develop weapons that could flatten entire cities in the blink of an eye. Superluminal travel is probably possible, but also likely to be extremely difficult to achieve. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 4/21/2007 4:56:32 PM | This is like the 5th thread I find absolutely fascinating which I come into so late!
Has anyone heard of the Drake equation? It predicts the number of possible civilizations we could make contact with in our galaxy.
# of willing civilizations = (# stars in galaxy) * (fraction of stars with planets) * (fraction of rocky planets) * (fraction of planets which develop life) * (fraction of life which becomes intelligent) * (fraction of intelligences communicating) * (average lifetime of civilization) / (age of the galaxy)
Now that we're finding more and more (and smaller and smaller) planets, we're beginning to be able to narrow some of these numbers down. There could very well be a large number of communicating civilizations out there. The only problem is the interstellar distance scale and the amount of energy required to be noticeable.
I find the idea of harnessing the zero point energy of the vaccuum interesting and appealing. I know in a book called Encounter with Tiber by John Barnes and Buzz Aldrin, the more advanced Tiberian starship used a zero point energy laser as propulsion (the first used solar sails) to get up to relativistic speed (~0.98c).
As for going faster than light, globally at least, I don't see how that could be done in any way. It is possible to bend space in such a way that you can travel in a sort of bubble at globally superluminal speed while at rest in your own frame. The only problem is that that requires an incredible amount of energy and we have no clue of how to actually warp spacetime with a machine. That, the method of controlling the bubble after you make it is unclear, and blue-shifted light would zap anything inside the bubble. If you want to read more on that, go to wikipedia and look up the Alcubierre warp metric. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 5/26/2007 9:04:54 AM |
Msg 5: Of course, I could be wrong,and an advanced race of space Muslims might be on their way, and then we are all screwed.
I think you'll find that Christianity was spread by the sword, why pick on the Muslims?
Fact is, a superior alien race could be try and impose an infinite diversity of religions upon us, in the same way humans spread religion through conquering other nations and continents. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 5/26/2007 6:11:57 PM | Geneseo--clearly you haven't read the same sci-fi books I have!!! LOL Most of them tell us the aliens want food, space, or food!!!! And don't forget all the sci-fi movies/tv programs! LOL We're doomed I tell ya! Doomed!!!!!!!
I just hope you're aim is better'n mine!! 
so my answer is, we should all hide under rocks!!! | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 5/26/2007 8:28:15 PM | This is such a delightful topic for our minds flights of fantasy. Start with beings that wouldn’t even need a vehicle to get here, go then to the completely diverse chemical make ups as mentioned in earlier posts. We would have no idea how to relate or comprehend these. But, keep it simple and just stick with oxygen based human formed race.
Sadly, the advances that put the human race into space were based on weapons technology. I would think if the same advances were what drove another species into space, they would have the same warped and aggressive tendencies that we do. Hopefully they will have advanced beyond these tendencies, but can you see humans running into another race and not trying to exploit or control them.
As far as an answer to the OP about keeping a low profile, I think we should get on with life, worry about what we can do something about, try and clean up our own aggressions and maybe try to become more civil to each other, Then worry about the miniscule chance of an ET encounter | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 5/28/2007 8:19:07 AM | Would Extra Terrestrials be friendly, or would they eat us?
My way of looking at this question is this. Why would they wish to harm us, or even eat us?
When all the wars of man kind are boiled down to the nitty gritty, they are a result of need for land, food, or fought over because of ideals such as religion.
One might expect that an advance race of beings who can travel faster then the speed of light, or bend space so that they can leap from one universe to the next, would have already been able to settle the things which we fight over.
This encapsulates what I think is the wrong way of looking at it. The reasoning is all about man's wars with man, not man's treatment of creatures which he is incomparebly more advanced than. When we find a field and decide we want to build condo's, we go ahead and dig. We don't spend a lot of time thinking about the trees there at all.
So I see three scenarios. If we are very, very lucky, they send some biology graduate student to give us the anal probings of our lives, and leave us alone. If we are unlucky, they wander by and decide the sun would make a good stellar beacon, or they want to terraform the planet to their liking or something.
The third scenario is more chilling. In a universe in which any sufficiently advanced civilization can eliminate others through self-replicating machines, the only prudent course may be paranoia - kill off any potential threat early, like you would a strange fungus growing in your garden.
This theme has been explored in science fiction - Greag Bears Hammer of God and Gregory Benford's Galactic Center series come to mind. It is worth noting the timelines and implications. The timeline says that if it takes 100 years for radio signals to reach another civilization, then we can expect killer probes traveling at sub-light speed in another 150 years or so. That's why nobody has answered back yet.
The implication is this: young civilizations that announce themselves are extinguished within 300 years. The only ones that survive do not give themselves away. So at any given time you would not expect to hear anything out there. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 12:28:32 AM | BE ABLE TO KEEP A LOW PROFILE, ie we are all given one small slit in our strange ovals oft named faces but from which we amazingly emit such strange, rare, rude, and mostly illiterate 'sounds', I would be totaly amazed if we should ever understand the rare and more highly ev' comnications from any other planet or universe, should it exist, which of course it does...
Point in case, if we, mere, and I do find us very 'mere' if lovely humans, if we were to ever understand, no, truly understand, or even TRY to understand, each other, be it Father, Mother, Sister, Brother Neighbour Friend Pet, or otherwise, then why on earth do we pretend, but fail miserly (if not why are you HERE people!!!!!) to have evolved far enough into that translucent sphere to understand, appreciate and connect with, an intelligence way above our own!!?!!!
Probably best to keep it simple, stupids! Me included
Smiling broadly!
x | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 2:43:50 AM |
Why should we assume we have unlimited growth potential? And the fact that nobody knows everything doesn't prove that the laws of the universe change. Perhaps their intricacy surpasses what our intelligence can grasp.
Why would you want to assume we have limited growth potential? We have never reached it yet...
The fact that nobody knows everything means that we haven't figured out the natural laws... The natural law once said the world was flat... When it was noted that we were mistaken, it changed...
If we don't make the natural laws, who does? | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 3:27:29 AM |
If we don't make the natural laws, who does?
Well, nature does, presumably. We just try to figure it out and write it down. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 4:17:06 AM | ^^^Good point, 
I really should stop stopping by here on my way to the can in the night... | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 4:04:27 PM |
The punch line went something like "They were 8 feet tall, they were black and they were pissed off."
That's from an old Arthur Clarke short story. Earth gets a message from space saying they're advanced enough now to join the galaxay and oh by the way if any of you are still white we can cure you.
Regarding the point that any advanced race might not be a bunch of pirates... I dunno. You coulr argue the Mayans might have said the same thing. They might want some resource on our planet that seems stupid to us - sand, water, copper, I dunno, but might be rare in their world. Or we might just taste good to them.
I suspect if there's other races out there it might be star trek like. There some good and some bad.
But I agree the chances are very very small we're have contact.
There is a gorup that meets in northern california once a year for a "Contact" symposium where they ponded these thoughts and have done so for about 15 years.
My only hope is aliens cherish mosquitos and take nearly all of them. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 5:31:13 PM | It is strange. Maybe we are raised as pets by ETs.
Sorry, I seldom think about problems from ET, as well as most people in China.
Because we have known many times from Movies that ETs only attack and catch Americans. | |
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| Should we keep a low profile?
Posted: 6/8/2007 7:57:52 PM |
Sorry, I seldom think about problems from ET, as well as most people in China.
Because we have known many times from Movies that ETs only attack and catch Americans.
 So true | |
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