| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 12:42:33 PM | When you are married, spouse is #1 and children are #2.
When dating, children are #1 and bf/gf are #10.
I'm single/no children, and I understand that and am willing to be #10. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 4:37:10 PM |
I never said that children should be forced to live with someone they don't like. If there is a strong ongoing animosity there, the relationship between the adults should and will end.
However, children should realize that the world doesn't revolve around them - think about it - if your marriage hadn't ended, wouldn't you and your spouse have directed the children's lives?
Of course you would have - the children would have lived where you both decided, attended the schools you chose, wear the clothes you bought, eat the food you prepare - so if you re-marry - guess what? The adults are still in charge. Not the children.
And frankly, you're depriving your child of the opportunity to participate in a family unit with all of the compromise, sacrifice and sharing that entails. How will your child know how to have an adult relationship if they don't see you doing it?
Gosh darn it, I just love this post! Such wisdom from one so young!
I used to be the "my kids are number 1, no matter what!" type and I paid quite the price for it. I now believe it's these very family dynamics that I highlighted above that teach our children coping skills, tolerance, patience, sharing, understanding, conflict resolution and how to co-exist with others.
I'd much rather show my children all the above, than hole myself off with them, showing them nothing of what it's like to learn to work through all that an adult relationship is, as well as a functional, healthy family unit. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 6:26:22 PM | MY OPINION THIS IS THE PROOF OF THE PUDDING
If you can not imagine your Signigant Other finishing the job of raising your child, if you passed prematurely,with love and without resentment. (not that you should nessicarily require this.... just know that they would)
They don't belong in your home or your family
When they fit this bill they DESERVE EQUAL BILLING | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 8:23:56 PM |
Moving in a year later we asked them first...what they thought. We felt it was only fair to include them in every decision that would reflect them. It should always be this way!!
Talk about backwards thinking. How about "getting married a year later we asked them first"? All that "my children come first" ranting immediately goes out the window in my opinion when you decide to "live" with someone rather than marry. "My children come first" also includes setting the proper example. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 9:24:30 PM |
Talk about backwards thinking. How about "getting married a year later we asked them first"? All that "my children come first" ranting immediately goes out the window in my opinion when you decide to "live" with someone rather than marry. "My children come first" also includes setting the proper example.
A proper example is a home full of mutual love, respect and stability regardless if there is a piece of paper on the wall that says you have this. A Marriage does NOT ensure a beautiful home life. Oft times because of the legal rammifications one or both partners don't feel the NEED to try as hard anymore. A pair of good hearts and souls, both living to enrich the others lives.........THAT SETS A PROPER EXAMPLE!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/12/2007 11:06:53 PM | wullis,
Once you bring children into the world those rules change in my book. Bringing a man or woman into those children's home comes needs to come with a marriage license.
A pair of good hearts and souls, both living to enrich the others lives becomes a revolving door without that bond of marriage. If the biological parents want to live together without getting married, that's fine. But a child that lives with mommy and mommy's "friend" (or daddy and daddy's "friend") is just being shown a life of convenience and impulse.
BTW, that "piece of paper" sure would have came in handy for a few of my friends who made the mistake of buying cars and real estate with Significant Others then finding themselves without a leg to stand on when the relationship came to an end. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 3:25:12 AM | I couldn't agree with you more.
I have been there and done that with bringing in a new partner. I told the person from the start my children were my first priority. After 7 years together it didn't work.
Not many people like taking a back seat to children. I found my partner started to become resentful of the time I needed to spend with my kids. No one can be a parent to your kids but yourself. They can try hard to be a good friend which sometimes works depending on the person.
I now feel the same way. I would love to have someone in my life but if its going to adversely affect my kids I am not interested. I'd rather have a friend who doesn't live with us.
When people read my profile they don't understand or comprehend the need for going slow. Its not just my life I would be bringing this person into but my kids as well. If they are unhappy I am extremely unhappy. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 3:29:04 AM | Its just a piece of paper in the long run.
Love and respect are what keeps people together. A piece of paper does not stop either party walking out on each other.
I don't believe in marriage anymore. I'd rather live with someone who respects me as woman and be on equal footing. I feel some people treat a marriage certificate like an ownership license and the respect goes out the door. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 6:27:45 AM |
I don't believe in marriage anymore. I'd rather live with someone who respects me as woman and be on equal footing. I feel some people treat a marriage certificate like an ownership license and the respect goes out the door.
Yep, seen that far too many times to argue against that point. Only seems to take a couple of months after the officiating for that to happen too.
If you can not imagine your Signigant Other finishing the job of raising your child, if you passed prematurely,with love and without resentment. (not that you should nessicarily require this.... just know that they would)
They don't belong in your home or your family
When they fit this bill they DESERVE EQUAL BILLING
I agree 100% | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 6:42:44 AM | In todays times I know JUST AS MANY people that have lived together and raised their
children to adulthood without seperation that WERE Never married as I do that ARE. IF the Love and respect are there the unit will stand ........If the love and respect are not there, a forest full of paper will not hold it together. In many cases I see people stop trying as hard to make love and life work when they are legally bound
BTW, that "piece of paper" sure would have came in handy for a few of my friends who made the mistake of buying cars and real estate with Significant Others then finding themselves without a leg to stand on when the relationship came to an end.
I don't know how....... by the time I got my ex into court for the divorce (that she filed)
almost everything I owned, had owned, had made, had been sold or destroyed(including our properties, our vehicles, my artwork, my library, my collectables, and my families heirlooms. What little was left, I had to liquidate to hunt them down as she left the country with my son. SEE IF THERE IS MALICE IN THEIR HEART PAPER WON"T CHANGE IT. Before I was married I carried a BIG torch for the institution.
They would be better served by a buisness contract for property and cars.........They have nothing to do with love, family or children!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 8:29:37 AM | I don't know how....... by the time I got my ex into court for the divorce (that she filed) almost everything I owned, had owned, had made, had been sold or destroyed(including our properties, our vehicles, my artwork, my library, my collectables, and my families heirlooms. What little was left, I had to liquidate to hunt them down as she left the country with my son. SEE IF THERE IS MALICE IN THEIR HEART PAPER WON"T CHANGE IT. Before I was married I carried a BIG torch for the institution.
That speaks more to the quality of lawyering you received and the quality of person you ex-wife is. It has nothing to do with marriage.
I speak from my observations. Living together turns into a revolving door of Step-boyfriends and Step-girlfriends. A lot of children don't like having mommy or daddy's "f**k" buddy living with them and being considered a part of the household. | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 63 | |
| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 12:33:34 PM | ^^^^living together does not mean revolving doors with many gf/s or bf/s. Not everyone is suited for marriage. I know several couples who are not married who have been together for years.
I have been married once and i agree with some of the other posters that a piece of paper does not guarantee or bring happiness. You can raise children in a healthy environment without marriage. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 2:13:28 PM | I very simply do not believe in marriage. There are far too many people my age (25) who are already divorced and working on their second divorce. I do not have the religious constraints to believe in marriage. I have been with one person since my pregnancy, and I am still living with that person. My story about that is on the first page of this thread.
I could easily see my man raising my son if the worst happened, and I passed away or some such. He is only a little stricter than me, but on the other hand my son has more fun with him too. As far as I am concerned, he is the perfect father figure. We are happily unmarried, and are staying that way. How is that a revolving door? I think it is better for a couple to be happy than to get married just to please some social construct.
I do not see how he means less as a parent because he is not the genetic contributor. He shares the bills, shares the love, shares the discipline, shares all the good and all the bad that comes with parenting. Why would marriage make this a better arrangement for anyone? | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 3:26:15 PM | ^^^^living together does not mean revolving doors with many gf/s or bf/s.
I repeat, based on MY OBSERVATIONS.
I never once said that marriage guarantees happiness. My comments concern the dynamics of how the children are affected by their parents "living with" a boyfriend/girlfriend.
I believe the effects are negative and help perpetuate the cycle of out-of-wedlock pregnancies.
Selective reading in these forum runs rampant. | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 66 | |
| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 3:30:37 PM | ^^^How are children affected by a bf/gf living arrangement? Mom is mom and dad is dad. If they love each and love the kids why should it matter.
Also, imo, i do not think you need to be married to have a pregnacy. Sounds too old school too me. Couples can be effective parents without marriage. You can also be committed to a person without signing off. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 4:10:57 PM | How are children affected by a bf/gf living arrangement? Mom is mom and dad is dad. If they love each and love the kids why should it matter.
...waaayyyy back in this thread I said>>>" If the biological parents want to live together without getting married, that's fine."
I'll put it this way. If my ex wife decides she wants to shack up with a man she will be immediately hearing from my lawyer and I'm quite confident I will win primary, or even full, custody of my children.
As I thought, the "children first" mantra goes straight out the window if it were to interfere with the convenience of having a girlfriend/boyfriend sleeping in the master bedroom every night. (this comment is directed at no one in particular, just a generalized thought based upon what I have read in this thread) | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 4:31:55 PM | That speaks more to the quality of lawyering you received and the quality of person you ex-wife is.
Well the person she is and my stupidity in trying to save a marriage long dead because I didn't believe in divorce. (She filed) Every thing was gone before the lawyers even got started.
It has nothing to do with marriage.
MY POINT EXACTLY!!!!!! ........The end result would have been the same if I had never married her........except Her name would not have been on some deeds so I might have salvaged something.
I speak from my observations. Living together turns into a revolving door of Step-boyfriends and Step-girlfriends. A lot of children don't like having mommy or daddy's "f**k" buddy living with them and being considered a part of the household.
FROM MY OBSERVATIONS I see just as many revolving marriages, .....three, four, six marriages and they file for divorce over whats for dinner. "You don't want to buy me a car for my birthday I'll divorce you and you'll pay for it anyway" (I heard it come out of a womans mouth, ) or I want to bring another woman into the relationship, no well I'll divorce you and she came pick the woman then........ And children don't want to go to there moms annual spring wedding either.
Their is a saying that locks only work for honest people ...............so true
Marriage is a lock, and is only effective if the parties chained together respect it
NO selective reading here, only selective agreeing
And if the man your ex "shacked up with " held down a job, had no criminal record and did not interfer with your custody arraingement you WOULD HAVE NO CHANCE in Changing the primary . COUNT ON IT | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 4:58:01 PM |
If the biological parents want to live together without getting married, that's fine.
What does genetic contribution have to do with parenting? There are good and poor genetic parents, and there are good and poor step parents. Getting a piece of paper isn't going to make the step parent a better or worse parent.
My son's bio dad barely makes the time for the once a month visit I foist on him. I am not bitter about that - that is the person he is and I knew that when we dated. That is why I dated him (At that time I had been told my cancer would make sure I could not have children, so I chose to date guys who were not family oriented.) Now I am with someone who has suitable familial priorities for my new circumstance. We live together. We both have the same views on marriage. We have our domestic agreements written out. Neither of us care for the social constraints, or the expense of a wedding (or divorce.) In the eyes of the law, we are married - its not just "sharing the master bedroom" we have built a house together, bought land together and etc.
Why should anyone go out to get married just to make it ok to be with a step parent? Why (in your view) is it ok for bio parents not to marry, but if one parent wants a relationship they cannot have the step parent in the house without that piece of paper? That logic baffles me. It is either ok to not marry (shack up) in both circumstances, or the couples ought to marry.... what is this half way business? My beliefs require that I honour and respect my partner and child(ren), nothing about marrying them for another religious faction's piece of mind. How am I not putting my child first? (I know you were not directing at me, but I am curious as to why you think marriage is the be all and end all of relationships involving children?) | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 71 | |
| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 6:33:27 PM | Hey Rjpeagles,
Families are changing. While i'd much rather have biological parents together i realize in today's world and with varying circumstances this is not always possible and seems to be becoming the norm.
You said, if you ex wife shaks up with another man, she'd be hearing from your lawyer. And further you'd win primary custody.? I'd like to no how you would accomplish that.
Your ex wife have every right to have a bf and further to reside with her man. Please explain, me curious.?????????? | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 10:08:53 PM | When I say the child comes first, I don't mean that the child should get everything they want in every situation.
To me, it means that the child's needs will come before the partner's needs. The child's wants will often, though not always, come before the partner's wants.
For example, if your child has something extremely traumatic happen, the partner needs to understand you cancelling a date. If your child is sick and wants the parent there, the partner should understand a date being cancelled.
On the other hand, always giving in creates the kind of spoiled children we see so much of today. A large portion of today's youth are spoiled brats. I remember in high school, a girl being bought a $12,000 car for her 16th birthday. She demanded her parents take it back because it wasn't good enough. Kids expect to always get that new outfit they want, to always get that new phone they want, if you don't you're neglecting me.
The child is entitled to love and affection, food and a roof over their head. Beyond that, its all discretionary. I know I certainly didn't get a car for my 16th birthday. My first car I bought at 18, a $450 junker. I was happy to get it, and when my parents agree to pay for the plates/transfer fee, I was grateful. I know a 20 year old whose parents still pay her car insurance. I consider that absurd.
From a young age, its important for parents to teach their children that although their needs will often come first, as they are the first priority in their life, their wants will now always be above a parents wants or a spouses wants. You aren't going to never go out if your kids don't like being with a babysitter. You aren't going to never buy yourself new clothes because your children want more. You're not going to give them everything they want. This is important wether in regards to a relationship or not.
That said, a parent choosing to be with someone that their children hate has always annoyed me, because the parent can choose from a lot of potential partners, the children can't choose from a lot of potential parents. When you create a child, bring it into this world, you commit to always putting their needs first. But not always putting their wants first.
Yes, being with a partner will mean less time with the kids. But you have a right to live your life too. Its all about managing. Your children really do not need to spend all of their time with you. That leads to a lack of independence. Its healthy for them to go out and have time with friends, spend time outside, go to activities, go to movies. Its healthy for them to see you in a healthy and happy relationship. No child decides their future within their home. If you're moving, you're moving. You pick their schools. You pick whats for dinner. You should let them have input but the ultimate decision must be yours. When you put the kids in charge, you take away the natural order of things. They are not in charge, you are. You are the parent. You are the adult, who is best equipped to make decisions. When you release that, you loose all respect from the children
I agree that when you start to neglect one, the family crumbles. My dad (actually my step dad but the best dad I've ever had by far, been involved my whole life) became a truck driver about 10 years ago. He's on the road a lot and my parents spent less and less time together. They drifted apart, even when he was home, they rarely did anything together, it was all about running kids to school, to activities, spending time with the kids, not spending time together. About 5 years ago, my dad asked my mom for a divorce. She agreed but after really talking for a few days, they realized that they'd just totally disconnected but neither wanted to break up the family that easily. They agreed to try. 5 years later, they're happier than they've ever been, and its because they now take time for themselves. Once a week they do a date night, they go out to dinner alone, they go see a movie, whatever. Just spend time together, nurturing the relationship. When you fail to nurture your children, they suffer. A relationship is the same way. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/13/2007 10:57:19 PM | I don't think the marriage should be about what assets there are. Unfortunately I don't know how many times I have heard people say when they are married " If we split up tomorrow I would give her/ him the house and there would be no arguments".
Once Lawyers solicitors become involved things can get totally out of hand.
When I decided to split with my husband I said let us sit down here with pen and paper and decide what each other wants. We went through everything piece by piece. Once it was decided we both signed and had a friend witness it. I happily let him take the stuff out of the house.
We both worked and contributed to the home and both deserved what we wanted. If the other wanted the item we paid the other our half share in money. If it couldn't be decided I said " You have it". I am not interested in making this into an arguement.
I wanted things to end on friendly terms but however with recent things that have occured with my youngest son it has not happened that way. I still know in myself I did the right thing and after all I have to live with myself.
I don't believe in arguing over possessions. I don't have the big screen tv and am happily watching a smaller tv with the kids. Its the time we spend together watching a favourite dvd and all cuddled up on the couch together that counts for me. Its just another possession and I have what I want most and that is the love of my kids. | |
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| Priorities: New BF/GF vs children
Posted: 7/14/2007 8:17:22 AM | Your ex wife have every right to have a bf and further to reside with her man.
B/f she can have, there's no question to that. Having a b/f live with my children, nope, it's not going to happen. Pure and simple. If my ex' thinks a man is worthy of living in my children's home, then that man better be worthy of marriage. If not, then she can wait til my youngest turns 18 then she can do whatever the hell she likes.
My children have 2 active, participartory, and visible parents. The only way any other adult will get the privilege of joining in on the parenting of my children is as my wife or as her husband. They aren't going to get the privilege just b/c it will save on the mortgage or help rebuild somebody's credit.
I guess I'm cynical b/c I don't believe the majority of folks who choose to live together do it out of "loving bliss". Most times it's done out of a combination of lust, infactuation, and convenience. | |
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