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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 12:17:43 PM |
What would the world be like if there were no religion? The answer lies within the one asked..
Here is my question: what if we all thought the same?
Isn't diversity a wondrous and beautiful thing?  | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 12:18:15 PM | Religion , that dangerous topic,
along with politics!
Op mentioned how many wars are fought over religion,
actually 'fanaticism' takes many forms.
One could argue that "sex is my religion".
Throughout history, 'unchecked fanaticism' breeds
wholesale BRUTALITY.
From these isolated islands, as well, the 'dictatorships'
we often hear tales of terror, brutality, all unchecked 'fanaticism'.
Seems all societies through the ages developed 'religion', not sure
if they all came from one source, yet evidence often links them,
so it is a possibility.
Course, religion and 'mind control' often go hand in hand too.
Could one declare 'nazism' a religion, for instance?
Bottom line for me , based on my own observation, is without
religion, the human condition deteriorates, hungry for something
LARGER than oneself, Purpose, Philosophy for good. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 12:28:32 PM | Just alittle Crazy said :
After John said that the Beatles where more famous then Jesus. He was shot dead.
Reverend Alfred Kunz (roman catholic priest) was murdered in 1998 after blowing the whistle on the misconduct of several priests with alter boys.
But hey.... who's counting...
Weak jab, justalittlecrazy, very weak.
*yawns loudly*  | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 6:37:40 PM |
I said: I think it's untrue and another example of you pulling stuff out of thin air and declaring it to a "fact". Please provide proof of the claim, "the more secular nations hardly have any crime worth mentioning". Thank you.
Limey said: Sorry, I'm not doing your thinking for you. There's this thing called "Google" try exercising your ability to think for yourself. You will find vast amounts of stuff to back up what I said.
What a pathetic cop out! If you knew anything about debate and proving a claim, you would know that it is the one making the claim who is responsible to prove it. After all, it's what you insist on. Anyway, from now on I'll just assume you are a hypocrite who asks others to provide proof of claims, but doesn't do it himself, and that you make stuff up to support your ever-eroding position. Too bad, really. I had mistakenly believed you to be as intelligent as you presented. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 6:47:39 PM |
If you knew anything about debate and proving a claim, you would know that it is the one making the claim who is responsible to prove it
Absolutely agree.
This is known as the burden of proof.
When it comes to matters of religion,it is the theists who claim a god/gods exist, therefore the burden of proof falls upon them to back up the claim. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 6:49:38 PM | Msg: 103
Remember the infamous quote from Edward John Smith, the Captain of the Titanic:
"Not even God can sink this ship!"
An iceberg sank the Titanic.
On topic:
Msg: 100
Isn't diversity a wondrous and beautiful thing?
Yes, it is...
and if there were no religion in the world, people would find something else to bicker about pretty quickly. Methinks it is in the nature of the beast. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 7:19:17 PM | What a pathetic cop out! If you knew anything about debate and proving a claim, you would know that it is the one making the claim who is responsible to prove it. After all, it's what you insist on. Anyway, from now on I'll just assume you are a hypocrite who asks others to provide proof of claims, but doesn't do it himself, and that you make stuff up to support your ever-eroding position. Too bad, really. I had mistakenly believed you to be as intelligent as you presented.
This took about 15 seconds to find, you'l notice that Holland, Norway & Sweden didn't even make the list.. & that the ones above the US are absolute shitholes....This is just the list for murders btw.
Rank Countries Amount (top to bottom)
#1 South Africa: 0.719782 per 1,000 people
#2 Colombia: 0.509801 per 1,000 people
#3 Thailand: 0.312093 per 1,000 people
#4 Zimbabwe: 0.0491736 per 1,000 people
#5 Mexico: 0.0337938 per 1,000 people
#6 Belarus: 0.0321359 per 1,000 people
#7 Costa Rica: 0.0313745 per 1,000 people
#8 United States: 0.0279271 per 1,000 people
#9 Uruguay: 0.0245902 per 1,000 people
#10 Lithuania: 0.0230748 per 1,000 people
#11 Slovakia: 0.021543 per 1,000 people
#12 Czech Republic: 0.0207988 per 1,000 people
#13 Estonia: 0.0157539 per 1,000 people
#14 Latvia: 0.0131004 per 1,000 people
#15 Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of: 0.0127139 per 1,000 people
#16 Bulgaria: 0.00845638 per 1,000 people
#17 Portugal: 0.00795003 per 1,000 people
#18 Slovenia: 0.00596718 per 1,000 people
#19 Switzerland: 0.00534117 per 1,000 people
#20 Canada: 0.00502972 per 1,000 people
#21 Germany: 0.00465844 per 1,000 people
#22 Moldova: 0.00448934 per 1,000 people
#23 Hungary: 0.00439692 per 1,000 people
#24 Poland: 0.0043052 per 1,000 people
#25 Ukraine: 0.00368109 per 1,000 people
#26 Ireland: 0.00298805 per 1,000 people
#27 Australia: 0.00293678 per 1,000 people
#28 Denmark: 0.00257732 per 1,000 people
#29 Spain: 0.0024045 per 1,000 people
#30 Azerbaijan: 0.00227503 per 1,000 people
#31 New Zealand: 0.00173482 per 1,000 people
#32 United Kingdom: 0.00102579 per 1,000 people
Link:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-crime-murders-firearms-per-capita
also here:
http://tinyfrog.wordpress.com/2007/10/23/wealth-and-religiosity/
& pay particular attention to this link
http://askville.amazon.com/Religion-prison-populations-Atheists-ethical-Christians-Muslims/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=8384184
In **1997**, the Federal Bureau of Prisons released the professed religious adherence rate of those in the U.S. Federal Prison system.
Christians make up about 80% of the American population AND prison population.
However, Atheists make up about 8% of the American population but only 0.2% of the prison population.
On the flip side, only about 1-3% of Americans are Muslim, but 7.2% of inmates are Muslim.
Atheists, are, by in large, highly educated and have moderate to high incomes.
Christians span the entire strata from poor to wealthy.
Studies of incarcerated Muslims in Ohio say that Muslim inmates are largely African American males and convert AFTER incarceration. 90% of African Americans living at least a year in poverty during their lives.
One more link:
http://www.adherents.com/misc/adh_prison2.html
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/2/2008 7:57:54 PM | Dang ! Canada made into the top 20 !
Ok, that sucks.
I thought we Canadians were laid back schmucks like the Aussies ?! Well, there goes our reputation for being happy, smiley people down the drain....
Eh.
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/8/2008 2:31:04 PM |
I wonder where Canada would rank if they split the Brit part from the French part?
Hmm... If the Quebecois were to separate from the rest of Canada...?
Hmm...
Hmm...
Welp, the only thought that comes to mind is : "ahhhh"
(oops I didn't say that out loud did I?) | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 4/9/2008 1:41:01 PM | Limey, What does all this cut and pasting have to do with proving the claim,
The more secular nations hardly have any crime worth mentioning All you seem to be proving is that America is a violent nation, something that is commonly known and seems to be routed in the national identity. You are also guilty of oversimplification. Your own quote from the Federal Bureau of Prisons (1997?) suggests that poverty not christianity seems to be the common factor. You're as bad as the people who claim that Afro-Americans and Hispanics make up the majority of the prison populations as proof that those ethnic groups are more criminal and violent, rather than that those groups are more disadvantaged, poor, and disenfranchised, all of which lead to a greater possibility of becoming involved in crime.
Please prove your claim. May I suggest you produce the table or cross-reference or study on which you based your belief? After all, you do base your beliefs on facts not presumptions, yes?  | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 2/28/2009 10:38:16 PM | | The world without religon would be the same as it is now just no people and lots of plants and animals. but mostly bugs because with out some beleif system people groups break down and kill eachother | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 3/1/2009 12:15:10 AM | ^^^^^^^^^^
A world without religion, would be a world with fewer reasons to kill off thine neighbours for not holding to the same set of superstitions that one does. You make the usual tired and fallacious suppositions that only a religious code of morals (ostensibly provided by some god or gods) can assure the peace, tranquility, happiness and justice that could not be attained by any non sectarian belief system.
with out some beleif system people groups break down and kill eachother (sic)
Many secular people are quite happy to co-operate and help their fellow humanity without having to resort to some sacred text as to whether their behaviour is moral or immoral...or their actions ethical or unethical, conscionable or unconscionable.
It is arguable whether the world would be a better or indeed a far worse place if all the faithful religiosely adhered strictly to all tennets of their faith.  | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 3/1/2009 3:42:40 AM |
In **1997**, the Federal Bureau of Prisons released the professed religious adherence rate of those in the U.S. Federal Prison system.
Christians make up about 80% of the American population AND prison population.
However, Atheists make up about 8% of the American population but only 0.2% of the prison population.
On the flip side, only about 1-3% of Americans are Muslim, but 7.2% of inmates are Muslim.
Atheists, are, by in large, highly educated and have moderate to high incomes.
Christians span the entire strata from poor to wealthy.
Studies of incarcerated Muslims in Ohio say that Muslim inmates are largely African American males and convert AFTER incarceration. 90% of African Americans living at least a year in poverty during their lives. I always wondered about that. This would imply that non-Atheists are about as likely to commit a murder as 40 Xians, and as high as 96 Muslims. Granted, Atheists aren't religious, and that might have an effect. But not that large an effect, not without a massive psychological explanation, that claims that atheism re-wires every part of impulse control, because a great deal of murders are the result of a lack of impulse control. So it seems that these stats are a bit odd.
So let's look at this another way:
1) "Atheists, are, by in large, highly educated and have moderate to high incomes."
2) "Christians span the entire strata from poor to wealthy."
3) If you are not very educated, and you are not very wealthy, you have a much higher likelihood to be in prison. Even just growing up in foster care in the UK, multiples your chances to not going to university, having a low income, ending up in prison, turning to drugs, and to prostitution, by several times. It's pretty obvious that most people in priosn are not university-educated, and not on a high income, especially since if you have a high income, you can afford a good-quality lawyer, who can get you a much lighter sentence.
4) There are lots of extremely intelligent people, who don't have a good education. I've met plenty. They don't have the same life-skils that get them lots of money. But money isn't their goal. Likewise, they lack the life-skills to gain qualifications, but they know far more than most scientists, just not about stuff that gets cited in a science journal.
So, all I can surmise, is that the vast majority of atheists have lots of qualifications and high levels of income, which requires that the vast majority of atheists are NOT lacking qualifications and of a low income, and since these are dependent on certain life-skills, all we can determine, is that most atheists are people with the life-skills that make them successful in our society.
Since these people are so successful in their lives, without turning to G-d, why would they have any motivation to believe in G-d? They didn't believe, and they were successful. If they did believe, they'd might threaten that success in some way. The subconscious won't let someone who is regularly successful, screw their own lives up. If our lives are focussed on success, it won't let us think things that we associate with failure. That's simple psychology. So we would expect a mental block about changing your POV, in very successful people.
But not so, in failures. So, what I would like to know, is what proportion of atheists exist in the general of population, amongst those who are curious about everything in life, but lacked qualifications, due to things like dyslexia, and a bad home environment, and as a consequence, have a low income, and what proportion of them are in prison, and what proprotion of the ones in prison, are atheists. That would eliminate the superiority bias of success, but the curiosity factor would determine that these people are open-minded thinkers, who are open to everything.
I'd love to see some proper stats on this, that factor out the factors of education and income, because these massively skew the results. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 8/15/2009 12:05:11 AM | Kind of impossible situation due to the fact - everyone has one - like politics.
It's a closed circle of extremes, even Athiest have their own religion, because if you were to void religion, then you would have to void questioning, or thinking making yourself a lower form of life.
Yes Insects, Birds, Lizards, have no religion - they also just excist, no thinking involved in this. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 8/15/2009 7:08:48 AM | In order for there to have been no religion throughout humanity's evolution, perhaps we would need to have been different creatures with more primitive, less imaginative brains. This might not have been such a good thing, 'cause besides not inventing religion we wouldn't have had the capacity to perform lots of other imaginative feats. Maybe there'd be no written or spoken language and no art. That means no Supper at Emmaus by Caravaggio, or Ceiling of the Sistine Chapel by Michelangelo and no The Last Supper by Da Vinci, but also maybe no works by Van Gogh, Jackson Pollock or Mark Rothko either.
The English landscape obviously wouldn't be punctuated with beautiful churches with their spires pointing rocket-like towards the sky, foreshadowing the Space Age. One thinks of a local church at Laughton en le Morthern that was built in the 15th century and appears in its shape and skyward pointing stance to foreshadow Thunderbird 3 on the launchpad, a full five hundred years before Gerry Anderson would be born. Hmm..maybe there'd be no Thunderbirds, no NASA, no Moon Landings, no robotic exploration of the Saturn and Jupiter and their moon systems, or the surface of Mars. Boring..
Back on terra firma, There'd obviously be no Carry On Vicar, Father Ted or Vicar of Dibley but maybe if humans had been deprived of that all important religion producing creative gene complex, there'd be no telly at all. Imagine that! No BBC News 24, Star Trek, televised Wimbledon Tennis Championships or Tour de France every year, or wildlife documentaries presented by David Attenbrough, including that good one about evolution he made this year as part of the beebs Darwin Season to mark the 200th anniversary of the great Englishman's birth.
Yeah, in fact without the imaginative genes that produced religion, maybe humans wouldn't have had the capacity to form ever more accurate ideas about the way that things really work in the universe, and there would be no theories from Newton, Darwin and Einstein.
I've seen it before on Doctor Who where the Doc, suitably accompanied by a glamorous assistant goes back and alters a fact of history and it resultantly has dire consequences for the "Space Time Continuum", whatever that is. Don't ask me what, but suffice to say that it is heavy shit that causes things to go wrong if messed with, and I think that if the gene complex in humans that gave 'em the propensity to develop religious beliefs was magically excised or altered at the outset, we might be living in a very different world - in a bad way.
Leave well alone I say.. | |
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| What would the world be like if there were no religion?
Posted: 8/15/2009 8:47:33 PM | The Space-Time Continium is what we all live in.
Time is a straight line from the Big Bang to Now and the Future, and Great Convergence - it has a begining and end.
Space is what we live in the Universe or Universes.
Outside of the STC is Heaven and Hell - is that clear? Eternity.
Athiests do not believe this - they believe it is never ending and never started it always was and is.
Where do you fall?
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