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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 10:43:34 PM | i reread for interpretation......I had already read his post 3 or 4 times to clarify it in my mind. His writing is a little vague, and I think it can be construed that he is talking about the denial of entrance to those unworthy of heaven. If i misinterpreted him, i apologize, but my reply still stands; i will just redirect it towards the circles of elites who look down upon others.
Morality was around long before religion. Religion was created because people had an innate sense of morality. The only thing religion has added to morality was to make it competitive. The market has been cornered on competitive morality. I bet i can build my church bigger than yours. I bet my priests deflowered ALOT less alter boys this year than your priests. Churches even have commercials: "unlike the other leading religious view, WE guarantee a streak free shine everytime!!"
The consequence of all this is that it makes our morality (which was orginally pure) selfish. Religious people view their moral acts as tickets to get into heaven. When an atheist does a moral act, he just does it because it felt right. (okay, maybe it was to impress the hot blonde walking her dog on the corner). But deep down we know that blonde will never give us her phone number anyway...so it really is altruistic..i swear.
greg | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 10:57:08 PM | | Just a gentle reminder, young one, what is the purpose of the truly ugly? Answer this for me. No answer?? And...I also have a hard time with the simple construct of HEAVEN. Do not believe in heaven. Never did. So don't diss me and misinterpret what I say. You did NOT get my meaning. Remove the blinkers plus all of the rest of you and answer the simple questions. I would not call myself an atheist, neither would I term myself one of the converted to some accepted religious denomination. Explain why you feel that you would welcome a crack-head loser into your inner circle. You wouldn't. You would write them off as the lost. But, did you know that there was once someone that responded to beauty in the same way you have? Did you know that each one that leaves this life in pain, leaves you also closer to the pain. Do not lump me into the safe and finally sorry, young man. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 11:11:31 PM | Morality was around long before religion. Religion was created because people had an innate sense of morality.
I wouldn't know. I wasn't there, and might have to trust a bible or book to figure that out. I don't trust many books, bibles or preachers. I sort of figured religion was created because people died of STD's and trichonosis, so they made it immoral to have sex or eat pork. They had no conciousness of germs, so they said "god was angry" I kind of think they blamed god for things long before they ever became communal enough to care about morality. Of course, in warrior tribes, it is still moral and righteous to defeat your enemies through means which others might not agree with. A common and time worn secular expression reveals the nature of the altruism in secular morality: "All is fair in love and war."
You should consider your own morals, and not act like atheism is a religion of altruistic people. As far as I know, there is not a consensus "morality" among any large atheist groups. You almost sound like you are preaching the holiness of a religion called "Atheism." Maybe you should do a commercial? Atheists are just as capable of perversion, murder, and criminality as the god fearing. You don't have as many commandments and ordinances as the religious. That might make your lawfulness a little easier to accomplish. You might consider the psychological effects of being burdened with so many "nit-picking" moral guidelines as cause and effect for a comparison, but that would be a tough row to hoe. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 11:27:03 PM | ^^
"A study says......"
"The Bible says...."
"I have heard that....."
"My mommy told me...."
You guys should do a commercial. Figures lie, and liars figure. When most people are asked what religion they are, they say one. Even if there is a check box for "athiest," people get strangely religious in prison. You get some time to go to the chapel. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 11:33:28 PM | You just can't stand it when anybody disputes anything you say can you? .
No. I am detail oriented. Religulous is a freaking movie by a creep with an ax to grind. Do you know what "cherry-picking" is. Comedians like Maher are always cherry picking so they can get a laugh. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 11:38:58 PM | | Do NOT bring the molester priests into the argument. You are the one responsible for your sexual urges. If you denied them, you wreaked havoc as a priest and also as a married man who loved little boys and girls. Please. And by the way...it was only the Catholic Church that foisted abstinence from sex upon their priests. Wasn't it?? And..why are men so consumed by revenge? And sex??? And...being right...and not listening. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/2/2009 11:58:30 PM | Someday you might actually learn to address the topic instead of pointing fingers at other people. I hope you wake up snoring. I don't accept platitudes from people who don't understand the difference between substance and emotional blabber.
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 12:11:56 AM |
And..why are men so consumed by revenge? And sex??? And...being right...and not listening.
Why indeed?
"Hell hath no fury as a woman scorned"
As far as not listening, that pretty much goes for everyone. It isn't just men.
Do you think you might be a bit biased in your presentation?
You are right about the sex, though. It certainly isn't on the minds of enough women for me | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 12:40:13 AM | | You, too, high iq have made a cheap judgement. Yes. I have been with the same man for three decades. So end the scorned woman argument. I just like to debate. And I am pretty good at listening and in this case reading!!! So true. Women do not value sex like men. Why? And do not tell me I suspect the grass is greener on the other side. It may be for about fifteen minutes. Or maybe seventeen??? lol. I am smarter than my physical instincts. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 4:22:11 AM | RE Msg: 1804 by Cyke:
I find it interesting that you say you would never dare attack someone for their drinking and in the same paragraph you say that you drink every day. I've heard it said that if you drink even one drink every day you could well be an alcoholic. You have no issue with attacking someone (me) for the occasional smoking of pot (which is nowhere near every day), yet everyone knows that alcohol is far more dangerous and destructive than weed. Talk about something that makes you stupid, drinking will make you stupid. No offense 2hi-iq-4u but turn around is fair play is it not? Come, on Cyke. Doctors said it was HEALTHY to have a glass of wine every day, as it cuts down your likelihood of getting certain diseases that are extremely common in Western countries. I think it was heart disease. You cannot start calling someone an alcoholic, for doing something that doctors generally recommend. IMHO, this starts to look way too much like an unjustified Ad Hominem attack. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 5:18:39 AM | Cyke, from what I can see (in my limited knowledge and years) you are a soldier of truth. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 6:05:04 AM | | 2hi, with no hidden meaning behind it... You remind me of my older brother.. And with no hidden meaning behind it, he is alot smarter than I am. I mean this as a compliment. I hope you accept it friend. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 6:27:03 AM | The answer is probably not.
Given numerous opportunities to present evidence that could be studied and debated,proven to be falsifiable and subject to later revision, the religious have failed time and again to do so.
Religious texts,preachings taken from those same texts and personal beliefs are NOT evidence.
Until there's solid evidence presented, there's no proof of the existence of any "divine beings." | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 8:14:51 AM | Thank you Brightspark,
I imagine you and your brother argue a lot until he wins. You seem to be the personification of a Britich Bulldog, and I mean that in the nicest way. I admire men who know that they should stand up for what they said previously, and don't try to wiggle out of it. You are a gentleman with some moxie.
60 to70,
I did not make a judgement about "a woman scorned," I lived the nightmare, but only quoted an expression. I don't paint all women with the same brush.
When you see these marks --->"""<--- . It means it is a quotation of note. I typically cite the author. I would have thought you would recognize that one.
CYke,
Your argument directly attempted to lable me as an alcoholic, and you have barely supplied any content that was not hearsay. Try to focus on the subject, the topic, or the point. I am not a big fan of drama queens, or putzes.
(I stated my feelings on the subject, and did not literally throw an insult. Hopefully there is not some putz here who was offended or a drama queen who will not recognize the difference of how the statment was written) | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 8:30:29 AM | Now I'm a drama queen and a putz.
If you say so. I quote "I am not a fan of drama queens and putzes," so I must not be a fan of yours. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 9:00:29 AM | ^^
So you just hate yourself, don't you? I might have declared all of those things about you on almost everything you have written in the last few days, but I focus on the subject at all times. I your displays are not intended to be dramatic, then I must be missing something. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 9:16:35 AM | Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. thank you.
Don't be a Drama Queen and announce your exit with a few more personal attacks or go on bragging about yourself. Try to focus on the topic.
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 9:25:27 AM | RE Msg: 1836 by Cyke:
Doctors say all kinds of things that later turn out to be not so accurate. There was a time that they said x-rays were harmless only to later retract that as they hand you your lead vest. Oops...sorry about that. Yes, they do get things wrong. They have had 10 years to retract this. All that's happened is that they've found MORE things that are beneficial, like green tea, and tomatoes. They're even about to make a pill out of tomato, that could really help with cancer.
And really Scorpio, for such an educated fellow you sure seem to be having a problem reading or is it a comprehension issue? Please tell me where I called someone an alcoholic? I said this... "I've heard it said that if you drink even one drink every day you could well be an alcoholic." Hmmm...doesn't look like I called anyone an alcoholic now does it? I've heard it said that if a girl got raped, she was asking for it. That doesn't make it something true, or even something that has any validity at all. We don't know who said your quote. It doesn't make sense to us. It's not qualified in any way, to say what drinks it's about. It doesn't contain any links to any verifiable source. You might as well say that someone who's had one drink in his entire life, could well be an alcholic. It's got about as much validity.
You put that a certain poster said that he did something, and that you've heard it said that a person who does that thing could well be an alcoholic. That's an unproved implication that the person is an alcoholic. That's not the kind of statement that I would consider anyone but a hick from a small town, whose brain is smaller than a nut, would make. If you want to start implying things, then be prepared for others to imply things about you.
I'm also not convinced that there's anything humble about your opinions, but that's just my opinion. Where exactly did I write that I'm humble? In what context?
Besides, what you wrote is YOUR opinion, about how humble I am. That's another Ad Hominem attack, based on your opinion, which has to be subjective, because it is about me, when you've not met me, and when it is the opinion of one out of many people. Considering that I've just criticised your attack on someone else, that doesn't exactly reflect as an observation that you could make without having any bias at all.
But I have to ask you a question: if you're being reasonable, then why not just admit that you made a gross unproved generalisation, say you're sorry, and leave it at that? Can't you handle admitting that you're not right, even once in your life?
RE Msg: 1839 by Cyke:
Scorpio, you said that doctors say a glass of wine a day is good for you. I've heard that too but I knew that there was recent evidence that disputed that claim. I just did one search and found this... If you'll note, this is a very recent study, only published a few months ago.
From the same article:
The findings contradict numerous other studies which have found that the antioxidants in red wine actually reduced the risk of cancer, and that a single glass a day was also good for the liver.
Judy O'Sullivan, of the British Heart Foundation, added: 'Between one and two units of alcohol a day may offer some protection against coronary heart disease.
A separate study last year published in the medical journal Neurology said those who drank modest amounts of alcohol developed dementia, including Alzheimer's disease, at an 85 per cent slower rate than those who did not drink. Clearly, there ARE reported health benefits, as long as you only drink 1-2 glasses MAX.
Also from the same article:
Britain is the tenth biggest drinking nation in the world, consuming around 12 litres of pure alcohol per person per year - the equivalent of three glasses of wine every day.
Luxembourg consumes the world's most, at 16 litres per year, ahead of Ireland, Hungary and Moldova, all on around 14 litres.
France is in 17th place, on around 11 litres of pure alcohol per year, according to World Health Organisation figures.
The same study also found that eating more than 500g (1.2lbs) of red meat can also raise the risks of colonic cancer, and that excessive levels of salt raise the risk of stomach cancer.
The report added: 'Cancer is dependent on many factors, and there is no miracle diet that remove the risks.
'But eating plenty of fresh fruit and vegetables, avoiding alcohol and tobacco, and doing regular physical exercise has been proven to reduce the risks dramatically.' Clearly, Britain has a drinking problem, because many British people don't drink at all, and yet the average alcoholic consumption is the equivalent is 3 glasses of wine, per person, per day.
The articles SEEM to be conflicting. But hang on, the prior studies that said that drinking alcohol was good for you, ALL reported that only applied to a measure of about 1-2 glasses of wine a day, or its equivalent, and the very same studies reported that drinking 3 or more glasses a day resulted in the health benefits of wine being outweighed by the damage to health by the alcohol. So this article isn't telling us anything we don't already know.
However, what it DOES point out, is that the French over drink, as do many people, and therefore, most French aren't following the recommended 1-2 glasses a day. The article also says that the British Heart Foundation, doesn't argue that 1-2 glasses a day is good for you. It's clear that from the point of view of INCA, which is in France, where drinking alcohol is a way of life, that drinking 1-2 glasses of wine a day becomes a lot more, because most people in France are drinking more than 1-2 glasses a day, because the average is the equivalent of 2.75 glasses a day. So from INCA's point of view, they would argue that 1-2 glasses is a stepping stone to more, and therefore, is unhealthy, because it leads to unhealthiness.
Here's a final question for you: where does the article say that one drink a day makes you an alcoholic? So what on Earth has this to do with what you heard about alcoholics? | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 9:39:19 AM | That's an unproved implication that the person is an alcoholic. That's not the kind of statement that I would consider anyone but a hick from a small town, whose brain is smaller than a nut, would make.
Perfect execution!
Scorpios comment addressed the "statement" made, and the type of "behavior" as relevent to culture, sophistication, and understanding of the person whom made the statement. He did not simply call a man a pig.
But you know that you should not throw pearls before swine. First they will take the pearls, and then they might turn to rend you.
Absolutely flawless execution of wisdom found where? Only an uneducated hick would say; "Jesus just called me a pig!" I didn't make any judgements. The actions of the players determine the parts they play. Jesus didn't call anybody an "unsophisticated hick," he described the behaviors of those whom would act like they. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 11:10:32 AM | ^^
or maybe some of us here are just more civilized and cultured to bother with such childish play. Good luck finding a playmate.
I believe I speak for the POF community when I say:
Address the topic.
For those who have no ears: Continue you with your ad hominem and topicless rants.
For those who have ears to hear the metaphor of swine and pearls written in the bible: respond appropriately. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/3/2009 12:18:54 PM | OK...does god exist? Certainly not.
Oh, good. In my next argument about it I can state "I have heard it said that God does certainly not exist." I will state it authoritatively without any supporting data, and everybody will believe me.
Now to address the your comments directed at me. I think that you meant to say that some of us are 'too' civilized and cultured.... Then you continue with exactly the kind of childishness that you say you're supposedly to cultured to engage in. Maybe you meant cultured as in yogurt?
You contend to speak for the POF community, which of course you don't, when you tell me to address the topic in a post that of course doesn't address the topic. In fact in looking back I see that 7 or 8 of your last 10 posts were off topic.
It is generally up to the members of the community to advise a poster when he is disrupting the discussion, or to report it to the moderators. You asserted that you had some intelligence, so attempted the former. (about 15 times now)
Why is it that you are constantly editing and adding to your posts anyway?
It is a site feature, if you don't agree, you can report it as a bug. Some of us take advantage of the tools we are provided. Others just brag about how sharp their tools are. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/4/2009 4:32:35 AM | | Evidently yes, even atomic physicists are looking for a particle with a bit of x - factor, they have called it the ' God Particle ' | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/4/2009 4:37:15 AM | ^^^^^
You're obviously oblivious to the irony (and probable sarcasm) behind calling something a "god particle." | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/4/2009 3:21:51 PM | kaos86 don't you mean She? I'm sorry, I couldn't resist. I agree with you. Some things you can't discuss well on line, verbal discussions are better.
As far as I am concerned, I am a Reverend. I sell antique Bibles and other antique history type books. History books were primarily written by Christians as they were the only ones educated. So I am sure that I have a slant on my education, what I have learned as a result. I do look outside and see grass growing, trees, flowers, etc. and that is how I know there is a God. But that is my simplistic view on it. | |
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| Does God exist?
Posted: 7/13/2009 8:41:15 AM | Barewolf we our all aware of a personality disorder , well some beleave this jewish fella jesus may have suffered from it.
Think it's called narcisasstic , anyhow i beleave in life not some ordinary fella whom thought he was a lot more than he really was.
A lot of people were put to ther death for claiming to be the creator or a mere messanger.
They were never documented , but the jewish fella jesus was, why, i imagine your thinking , simple !
Back in the biblical tims it was a form of control, now it' become the biggest business in the world, so ofcourse people will fight to keep the " tale" alive as ther lively hood depends on it.
Don't waste your time pls. | |
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