| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 1:45:46 PM | Well El,
Sometimes what THEY are SELLING, YOU - ARE - BUYING!
. . . so it goes back to the question -- What is the difference between being a manipulator and a salesperson?
. . . who wields the heaviest weight on the teeter-totter?
. . . who (and if) someone gets "buyer's remorse"
. . . Ethics? (reminder: all's fair in love and war)
I am a gentle soul -- really I am -- but I see no substantial difference. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 1:54:37 PM | Hi
Our life is full of manipulations, everywhere around us,
in a shop, in our work to the full .... very often at home, in our relationship ....
We may do this, someone is doing this, the best example is the sweet JEALOUSY
On Forum > Relations, there is another Subject "Why do some women stay in abusive relationships? "
As always there is only one way .... say good bye .... | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 4:19:38 PM | to answer kimnyc:
they do not know what the truth is or how to be honest, all they know is how to manipulate people, they will turn anything around on you, so you look like you are in the wrong, when it is them that is in the wrong..they will never see what they are doing as wrong...everyone else is wrong...they are right!!! | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 4:31:00 PM | Manipulator, trying to manipulate manipulatee,
Manipulatee beating manipulator at his/her own game.
KEY WORD = GAME!!!
Cant stand head games, or any thing of the like when it comes to relationships.
Once I figure said person is trying to play games with me,
she will:
GO STRAIGHT TO JAIL. DO NOT PASS GO!, and DO NOT COLLECT 100 DOLLARS! | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 6:48:22 PM | | oh yes there are definitely people who don't realize they do it....my ex did that all too well. i would have loved to teach him a lesson, especially for our son's sake, but i see it as pointless to try. he did to his mom, too. everyone he came in contact with, actually. and he saw nothing wrong with what he was doing. he does not want to change. you cannot change someone or convince someone to change. people only change for themselves. even if he changed for you or if my ex changed for his son, it would be his idea not mine or yours. otherwise it would never work. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 7:11:06 PM | I've gone out with guys who do and I've done it myself. I think emotional manipulation is something that we are often taught at home (sometimes by those who really don't know any better and/or have a good reason -- and sometimes by those who are cunning and deliberate).
My great-grandmother used to insist on doing almost all of the housework herself even though her son and daughter-in-law, myself, and at one point the daughter-in-law's widowed father all were available and willing to help.
I guess she felt that if she didn't do it herself it wouldn't get done 'right'. But she'd also remind us at least once a day that we were going to be sorry when she died and how we would miss her etc. It was a Catch-22 situation.
As a young child I learned all kinds of nasty stuff I had to later clear from my repetoire and that was before I met the side of the family I was being protected from.
It can be un-learned but a person has to value self-growth and have a sense of humour about their own flaws in order start the process. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 8:40:54 PM | Your great grandmother sounds like my ex mother in law. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 9:08:23 PM | Nope....
It's almost impossible to beat a manipulator at their own game. One might try. But the thing about a manipulator is, they will ALWAYS have the edge on you. They are as diligent in honing their 'skill' as any person would be in whatever craft they choose to pursue. And they can become masters of it. They will always be in the 'power position'. One might HATE it...or wish to seek 'revenge', or to try to play their game. But they will always be one up on you.
A wise old friend gave me the best piece of advice that's never failed me when dealing with self centered manipulators.
Act instead of talking...and sometimes the best 'action' is 'no action' other than to disenfranchise yourself from the situation or the person. Talking provides a means where the manipulator can and will use everything you say against you. (which is why the fifth amendment was actually written anyway....) And making an action in retaliation only fuels the manipulator, as they do not respond to 'reward' and 'punishment' type consequences. They will ONLY learn by NATURAL consequences. Talk as much as the tongues in your shoes can talk. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 10:32:03 PM | | Yes I have and I believe I beat him at his own game but unfortunately he is in a dream world and does not have a clue about reality at all. He is so stuck on him self and his apparent "accomplishments", that in his mind he does nothing wrong or sends all the right messages and communications. All I can say, is he is gone from my life and I am so happy I didn't get pulled in deeper and realized soon enough and that I beet him at his own game. He was so stupid that he wasn't even humiliated at being confronted by two women he was seeing at the same time. He denied it all to both of us in front of our faces....well, enough of that, I could go on with more details but they get a bit out of had....you can never be too careful is what I have to say. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 11:06:16 PM | | him look good ??? whoa, woman do the same thing !! not bashing,just my 2 cents. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 11:13:35 PM | TAKESSS ONE TOO KNOWW ONEEE! (that's all I ave to say about that) I am outt here!
Right on Piano4te youre friend knew what they were speaking of! So simpke, but so easy to fall into the dumbness of it all (by manipulation, by sex, bycompliments and promisies, or hints of a promise, the list of discussions that we allow to happen are as endless as the stories created (in other words, and many people as there are on earth) | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/6/2007 11:18:08 PM | | In my particular instance, he wasn't really attractive but had this gift of gab and gab and gab....all about himself...I wish I would have picked up sooner on what he was but it was nice to have a little attention paid to me at the time. He really had this thing about wanting to take care that a single mom had attention for herself....I think he had a thing about thinking that he might be able to save all the single women...just somethings he said brought me to believe that. He was by far the most screwed up man I have ever met. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 4:42:31 AM | I once met a manipulating woman, and thought is was a relly keen thing to outplay and sidestep her - HUGE MISTAKE! She went crazy and made my life hell during that time...
Mind games and manipulation are great for Texas Hold 'Em, but not for dating and/or relationships... | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 5:05:15 AM | | There is only one way to beat them at their own game, don't play the game. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 6:25:51 AM | Sometimes what THEY are SELLING, YOU - ARE - BUYING!
That doesn't make any sense. I'd never be "buying" manipulation.
. . . so it goes back to the question -- What is the difference between being a manipulator and a salesperson?
I was answering the OPs question. She didn't ask about sales people.
There is only one way to beat them at their own game, don't play the game.
Yeah.. you can try telling them they're manipulators, but that conversation could last way too long. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 8:11:52 AM | For me the manipulation is more of an honesty issue. I don't mind being persuaded if its transparant. But as the manipulation frequently involves lies or half truths I quickly stop paying much attention to their opinions . I don't want to be around some
one I don't respect and who have so little respect for honesty. I don't want to be constantly second guessing what their motivation may be and never being able to trust their words not to mention the arguments.
As for changing them. You would have to convince them thay have a problem first.
In my experience changing most people's core behaviour is very difficult. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 8:38:31 AM |
can he be taught that it is not a good thing and that honesty is better than trying to manipulate people to agree with you and therefore like you?
All I really expect of grown man is that he's housebroke....
beyond that I will look for one I can learn to love in spite of his faults, but there are some faults that will make him a nonstarter. Controlling/manipulative behaviors will make me send him on to find some other fool.
I suspect that most adult manipulators/controllers DON'T KNOW any other way to handle their lives and deal with other people. And you could never ever convince them that there's some other way to live life. So why waste life's precious time on an exercise in futility??
Cindy O | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 3:46:45 PM | [Yeah.. you can try telling them they're manipulators, but that conversation could last way too long. ]
not if you are walking out the door, which is what I meant by not playing the game.
op don't waste your time or your mind. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 4:19:18 PM | | I dont think i've been with anyone like that. I really dont know what i'd do in that situation. But I see a some of my girlfriends doing it to guys. Getting what they want...I really dont know how the heck their concsiounce lets them do it. But to each their own! | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 4:31:22 PM | No.
And it's not possible to change anyone. They make that decision alone. | |
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.john
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Joined: 6/3/2007
Msg: 46 | |
| Manipulators
Posted: 6/7/2007 6:04:54 PM | the word manipulator is more akin to spindoctor than salesman because it involves showing facts to ones best advantage,but i concede that self promotion and salesmanship overlap.
i would like to ask in all seriousness who does not put a positive spin on themselves?
there is nothing wrong at all with accentuating ones assets to gloss over ones failings.
what i think this thread is aimed at is partners who must win arguments at all costs,and this characteristic truly is pathetic.
qed,strike 1
thanks
john | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/17/2007 11:58:05 AM | | Oh those? Yeah..I string 'em along occasionally, for amusement. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/17/2007 12:14:28 PM | | The way you beat a manipulator at their own game is to see through their game quickly and walk away. Don't be baited into engaging with them past one clearly stated exchange. After that it's all a game they want you to play. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/17/2007 12:38:53 PM | | If you show them that they can't manipulate you, some move on. Some ratchet the game up a notch, and since they have manipulated many people before you, they're very good. You're likely to lose the game. The only way to win is not to play. | |
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| Manipulators
Posted: 6/17/2007 12:49:17 PM | | +1 to above poster. You either play by their rules or they will find someone else. It would probably break your heart if you try to change them. | |
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