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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/2/2008 11:50:46 AM |
think they go into the relationship with the idea that they will be able to mold you into what is in their mind the ideal partner,which is why they tend to present themselves as mr/ms wonderful in the beginning (whats commonly known as the honeymoon phase)
This is so true, when my H dropped the bomb on me that he was "done" I asked him if he ever really loved me, and he said "I do love you, and I do believe that one time I was in love with you, and I thought I could change you" | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/2/2008 12:55:38 PM | Msg. 298 - thank you.
Msg. 300 - Your point was made the first time you posted excerpts from the same book reference. While it may be your opinion that the opinions of the author are valid and factual truths, it is still biased opinion and nothing more. Furthermore, one author's opinion that validates yours is hardly substantial objective evidence sufficient to support your position on the topic.
That being said, IMO, it's a fair statement to say that any human being has the inherent potential to be violent. The difference between the abuser and the victims as far as violence correlates to the intent behind the violent behaviors. The irony is that a criminal can break into your home, physically assault you with or without a weapon and if you decide to defend yourself, you're applauded for your courage.
Yet, a husband can beat the sh*t out of his wife time and time again for being a minute late getting dinner on the table, failing to pick up after him, crying, or just because he simply had a crappy day and IF somewhere in that victim's deeper level survival instincts she so much as acts in her own defense, she is critiqued to be as violent if not more violent than her abuser. That doesn't even begin to touch the surface of the psychological warfare. Abuse is a form of torture. Torture someone long enough and eventually they will rise up to either leave or if leaving is not possible, they will rise up to defend themselves.
A soldier can take a life in the performance of his duty in service to his country. Yet that is acceptable, as it should be. A cop can use reasonable force to apprehend a suspect and if that suspect fires a weapon at that officer, he can use whatever force necessary. Yet that is acceptable, as it should be. Just a couple of examples.
Yet, let a victim in her torment rise up and act in her own self-defense, after prolonged abuse especially, suddenly that victim is judged as a scumbag abuser.
The truth behind the intent of those few victims that eventually attack their abusers is to diminish if not eliminate the threat as it is the only way out at that point. It's NO different than a soldier facing his enemy ready to take him out of this life or a cop facing a suspect who will take out his life.
It's the only option left for some victims to preserve what little remains of themselves. Some of the attitudes about victims contribute. They hear it every day within the relationship and when they finally do find some courage to reach out, then they hear the same crap criticisms from their families and friends, sometimes even their own churches.
Amazing how that happens. Appalling actually. Inexcusable. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/2/2008 9:30:13 PM | has anyone seen the movie Enough, with Jennifer Lopez....she trains in Krav Maga and after being pursued by her stalker abusive ex beats the living daylights out of him and he ultimately dies.....and the cop says you are one of the lucky ones......
There is nothing more just than a woman who has lived her life in fear because of one of these creeps turning the tables........it is self defense pure and simple......that doesnt mean if your husband leaves the seat up or forgets to put a new roll of toilet paper in you take a bat to his kneecaps....but in an instance where a woman, abused, takes matters into her own hands.....I would love to be on such a jury and applaud her as she walked free........but I still am having a terrible time trying to understand why a woman who has escaped........would go back.....In my particular instance she is in a church that exerts mind control.....and it almost paves the way for a controlling jerk to profess to have found religion and then poof....he is back in the drivers seat....in a walled off community that thinks it is great that he is studying to be a Jehovahs Witness and never once questions his nefarious motives........oh well......a man that hits his wife is no man at all.......just like a rapist is not a lover.....its about the control......love has nothing to do with it......but why go back......to this casual observer its like putting your hand back on a hot stove....... | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/3/2008 1:22:57 AM | | I think some people can control it but others cant!!!! Its all do with if they can undermind the person they are with i think x | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/3/2008 4:03:40 AM | Msg. 304 I saw the movie, as well as The Burning Bed and Sleeping With The Enemy. In those cases, the abuser was more interested in "winning" - control, fear, intimidation, stalking, violence were the means they applied towards that end. These are the type of abusers that will stop at nothing to win and are the hardest to leave. Their victims are well informed in advance of leaving what will happen if they do leave.
It took me two years plus three months plus 2 days to get out although my ex was more covert than those abusers in the referenced movies. He used our daughter as the death messenger beginning when she was 2. But my ex's agenda was much different, as I was not his objective but his obstacle. He did erupt violently in the home during those last two years but at objects. Threats of suicide were common. I left the first time for three months with my daughter and stayed hidden. Ironically, the conflict for me was rooted in religion and the very vows I took when we married. So when our pastor contacted me near the end of that three month period to advise that the ex had turned his life around, stopped drinking, etc., after several conversations it was easy to return because my inner conflict was resolved. I had no experience or education in such things to grasp the concept that even the pastor had been manipulated.
I wasn't back in the home three months when I got the phone call from the police that my ex had stolen prescription pads from doctor's offices and fraudulently obtained multiple controlled substances under various names. The drinking had started again a month after I returned. Although I did not ever leave my daughter alone with him, he changed his modus operandi there as well. On one of the many occasions that the police were called, I was transported with my daughter to a safe location for the night while my ex was permitted to stay in our home.
I fled on January 23, 1983 and never went back. The motivator was the welfare of my daughter who was at imminent risk of losing her life with me as the ex had started the vehicle tampering - all the while knowing I transported her in that car. For the first year, she'd come home from visitation reporting that she and her daddy were following me around with a gun. That first year, my vehicle was persistently tampered with - sometimes just irritating things and other times the gas line. He always took the oil cap - sort of like his signature that he had tampered with the car. Police couldn't help as his name was on the title so I stopped calling them. By February 20, 1985, whatever he did to my vehicle resulted in a head-on multi-trauma near-fatal MVA with another vehicle. The rest of the snapshot is redundant as it's already been posted in one of the abuse threads.
To say I never thought about taking him out would be a lie. Of course I did. Yet even there I was in a double bind on multiple levels. My daughter for one would have gone into the foster care system as I would have gone to jail, so in effect she would have lost two parents. She worshiped her father and I know with every fiber of my being that she never would have recovered from that loss. My own faith did not afford that as an option and my own resulting guilt would have eaten me alive, not to mention the fact that he would have succeeded in bringing me down to his level.
It's so easy to judge when one is not or was not in the situation. What the victims in these situations are able to disclose is only a snapshot of what was really happening. Consider it akin to where there is smoke, there is fire. Some things that occur in an abusive relationship are so horrific to the victim that they are unspeakable.
We can theorize and draw conclusions about the similarity of abusers' characteristic behaviors just as we can about the victims who become involved with them and even reach conclusions that make sense. However, those conclusions don't apply to every abuser or victim as each is uniquely different.
The element that does appear to be consistent is comparable to a kidnap/hostage situation. The longer the victim is in effect held hostage, the more distorted the victim's reality becomes. It becomes more complex in the abusive relationship, almost like a reverse osmosis of the typical kidnap/hostage situation where the kidnapper is a stranger. In the abusive relationship, the victim trusts in the abuser at the onset and by the time the victim realizes that her trust (or his trust if a male victim) has been violated and misplaced, it's not as simple as packing up and moving on. Conversely, in the typical kidnap/hostage situation with a stranger, the more prolonged one is held hostage, the greater the likelihood that the victim will form an affinity with the kidnapper and begin to trust that person.
As for getting inside the mind of the abuser, we really can't unless the abuser lets us into his mind. Most of them don't. However, we can look at their behaviors to measure their beliefs that determine their actions. That's probably as close as we'll ever get to the inner workings of the abuser's mind. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/3/2008 5:13:49 AM | hi my name is ann im 21
im with my boyfriend 2yrs
i love him 2 bits
when he is nice he so kind ,loveable so caring
but when grumpy or tired he slags me/undermines me.
he never hit me yet but pushed me loads times roughley that i fell
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i dont no what to do he apolgises and i forgive him because hesays he sorry /never do again but always does and imsick of it
any advise | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/3/2008 5:19:56 AM | | I think every abuser goes into a relationship seeking power over another person, be it conciously or unconciously. I think abuse boils down to the power the abuser tries to gain and exercise over the victim in some form or another. It is all about bending another person and controlling their actions and thoughts so they conform to the will, whim and desires of the person who has control over the person being abused. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 6/3/2008 5:35:55 AM | sexykins20 - the moment he pushed you, it's the same as if he hit you. It's a physical assault. There is a cycle in the abusive relationship that goes like this:
Honeymoon phase: he's so nice, so kind, so caring and so lovable
Build-up phase: slags you, undermines you - whittles away at you. Grumpy or tired is how he justifies his whittling away at your mind, emotions and reality connect.
Explosion: eruption into violence.
Honeymoon: he's remorseful for the explosion. Back to the wonderful guy you fell in love with in the first place
Build-up: again, tensions are building. You sense something wrong yet can't put your finger on what is wrong. You might even ask him what's wrong. Covert aggression again from him: slagging, demeaning, degrading you.
Explosion: erupts again overtly violently.
And the cycle continues and progressively worsens. It does NOT get better.
The best advice would be #1, develop a safety plan for yourself. Your safety is #1 priority and do NOT let him know about it. Don't let anyone that you are aware buys into his crap know about it.
#2 Contact the Domestic Abuse Hotline, which you can do anonymously, and talk to a counselor about your situation. Start networking safe places to go.
#3 As afraid and confusing as you feel, push through that fear and confusion and take action to bring yourself to safety, but do so safely.
Don't worry about how you are going to manage after leaving before you leave. You can and will manage after the fact but your want to get out has to exceed your fear of getting out.
You're not going crazy. I know you're young, but you already know you're in over your head or you wouldn't be reaching out and asking. There is hope. Yet hope, as you already know, is not within your relationship with this man.
Email me and I can direct you to support sites that will help to validate the reality of your situation, as well as offer support as you face some very tough choices ahead of you. However, you will survive. You deserve better. You are worth more. All the crap he feeds you that diminishes your worth is only to create and foster his belief in your mind that you are the one causing him to be abusive. It's a lie. Don't believe his lies.
You are so very young and I regret that you are in this situation. Use your head, not your heart, and begin to act in your best interests. Sometimes what we want is not in our best interests.
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/12/2008 5:02:32 PM | I'm a survivor. And, maybe I can help with a few questions. My ex and his daughter were my abusers. So, NO, not all abusers are men! At times, I was more worried about his daughter than the ex. The motivator is to WIN at all costs. Win control, Win whatever makes their low self esteem feel better at the moment. Some want to control, some go the next step and want to defeat and destroy. There's usually a LOT of denial going on on both sides. Both sides need intervention. However, abusers rarely get the help that they need because they can't admit it. I went to my local Domestic Violence Coahlition and would tell anyone who even "thought" this may be and issue to call.
Why Do persons go back to an abusive relationship? Abuse is a form of brain washing. You are slowly, ever so slowly convinced that this is love. That you are wrong. That no one will love, respect and accept you for who you are. I'll stop there to not sound like I'm having a pity party,k? Someone in my recovery compared it to a story about a frog:
If you put a frog in boiling hot water...it will climb out...quickly and desperately!
If you put a frog in water and slowly, ever so slowly turn up the heat (sound familiar?)
The frog will die.
This isn't easy to type/ talk about, but, if it helps one person out there I'm glad I have shared. There is hope, there is recovery. Once you have gone through something like this...or any personal, life changing situation...you will find that you will appreciate EVERYTHING about life! I'm told not to reveal my past. And, that if I talk about it, I'll just end up with another abuser. I can see the reasoning. However, I take a different view, if people were more comfortable talking about it and asking for help, it may decrease the insidence of abuse. Survivors are still ashamed that they got into an abusive relationship and that they stayed as long as they did. When I catch myself feeling/thinking like that. I pat myself on the back for my resourcefullness, strength and hope. Please consider being supportive of survivors.
Thanks
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/12/2008 5:06:18 PM |
If you put a frog in boiling hot water...it will climb out...quickly and desperately!
If you put a frog in water and slowly, ever so slowly turn up the heat (sound familiar?)
The frog will die.
Sums it up quite nicely on the how we end up in those situations.
Thank YOU, still hope, for sharing. . | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/12/2008 8:49:20 PM | Still Hope... that was a very good point that you made. Some times it is so slow and subtle that you just do not see it nor do other people. My exhusband was so well liked that even his closest friends can't see it and one person that did see a lot of what happened in our relationship, remarked "I know that what he did was wrong but , you see, we love Ron." like that excused everything. He feels okay about what he has done because everyone has turned a blind eye to it and I just moved away and did not tell things about our relationship. He told things and had them very out of context. I still become very angry about it but do not discuss it with people in our home community. It wells up inside me at times and I have to go to a counselor just for a chance to vent. I never discuss it with my children as they adore their dad. I feel at times like I have to live in isolation and that the young years of my adult life were for nothing.
Dixie | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 4:26:30 AM |
It wells up inside me at times and I have to go to a counselor just for a chance to vent. I never discuss it with my children as they adore their dad. I feel at times like I have to live in isolation and that the young years of my adult life were for nothing.
Dixie - those young years of your adult life were not for nothing no matter how it feels. From what you describe, sounds like you encountered similar to what I did in my young adult life - an atypical abuser (officially diagnosed ASPD). He was also well-liked although it was no secret he "had problems", yet his charisma had a way of engaging people's sympathy towards him. It is very isolating for the victim(s) and even more difficult when children are involved. I shielded our daughter from quite a bit, as she initially was still a toddler when we fled from him. In retrospect? I don't believe that was the right choice at all on my part at the end of the day.
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 7:46:59 AM | pies26 wrote....
******You know what oh BOO HOO!! We all have choices in life, if getting abused LEAVE. IMO if you don't leave you two are just as unhealthy and abusive as the so called "abuser" is. Get off the pitty potty. ******
LOL it appears you are one of those compassionate people who are making this a much better place to live. LOL
Sharzi | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 7:59:37 AM | First of all, most abusers suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder. They have no idea that relationships are about giving. Whether it's because of nature or nurture that they've developed this dynamic of being, their idea of a what constitutes a relationship is about what they can "GET" from it. Any giving on there part has strings attached, you are going to owe them.
For the most part, they share many of the same characteristics as a "Black Hole" in space. They suck up and destroy everything that comes into contact with it. Just like a Black Whole can never be filled, the massive void they have in their psyche can never be filled either. Yes, they will suck the life out of you, if you allow them too. Without being sarcastic, dealing with these people is like dealing with a four year old, that is truley their level of reasoning. It's all about them and the moment.
If you think you can change someone who suffers from Borderline Personality Disorder (an abuser), think again. Many of my collogues in the metal health profession would rather not deal with them. Why? Because they seldom respond to therapy, and if there is progress, it takes years. So unless you have a psych degree and focus on personality disorders, or you can walk on water, or for that matter, change it into wine, RUN FROM THESE PEOPLE!!! | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 8:38:02 AM |
For the most part, they share many of the same characteristics as a "Black Hole" in space. They suck up and destroy everything that comes into contact with it. Just like a Black Whole can never be filled, the massive void they have in their psyche can never be filled either. Yes, they will suck the life out of you, if you allow them too. Without being sarcastic, dealing with these people is like dealing with a four year old, that is truley their level of reasoning. It's all about them and the moment.
That is one of the most eloquent descriptions of my ex that I have ever come across. Thank you!
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 9:05:38 AM | OP..I think this is a thread that really needed to be brought out,and I hope it does not get deleted...as this is a serious issue in today's world...
Now for an opinion to your question...does an abuser go into a relationship with intentions of abusing?? That is a catch 22 sort of answer....some actually go into a relationship with the best of intentions,then one day something happens,and the "abuser" snaps...he/she needs to teach someone a "lesson" or they truly believe they are metting out an "appriopaiate" punishiment...
And then sometimes I honestly believe that 2 people can really bring out the worst in each other.... I have a friend that was married to a guy for 13 yrs....whenhe got drunk he had to "teach her a lesson" by kicking her with the toe of his cowboy boots...she loved him,and therefore thought she had it coming,and strived to do better the "next"time...there was always a next time because she truley believed her love could change him...FOLKS,that just does not happen....one day after she woke up,covered in bruises,she had the help of her co-workers pack up a moving van and left!!!
I truley believe that the person being abused always on some level believes...he/she can change the abuser with their love...maybe they will be lucky and the abuser will change,,,or maybe not...abusers are like alcoholics...they NEED HELP/COUNSELLING to help control their anger issues....if you are in an abusive situation..for your own safety & your children if there are any..RUN...DON"T WALK TO THE NEAREST SAFE HOUSE..if you cannot find one..police officers will be more then glad to help you get to one....press charges against the offender..in some cases..the "victim" goes back sadly enough,and may do so several times before they have had enough or worse....if you need to know some numbers to safe houses..pls just email me.....there are links....I'm sorry this is so long....Good luck and I hope this helped you a little...and remember,this is just my opinion only... | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 9:11:17 AM | msg 311
OP..you and I are SURVIVORS in every sense of the word....it takes a very strong person to be drug through hades and back,and nstill have the strength & the faith to begin a new life!! God Bless you!!
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 1:10:05 PM | | The term abuser could maybe be seen as say 'controller'...a person who likes to control other people to their satisfaction. Then, most often this control turns into abuse whether it be financial, emotional, physical, etc. The abuser (controller) doesnt in my opinion see this as abuse, they just want there own way. This is often learned behaviour and is seen as 'normal'. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 1:13:18 PM | Blimey I got told off for starting a thread like this, how come some get through and others dont?
Who cares what the abuser has in his mind - they should be off the site - gone blocked deleted from the main frame. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 1:42:22 PM | It is a learned behaviour. The abuser has been abused as a child and as an adult
if not acknowledging their behaviour, and seeking help, is out of their control.
No one can change the behaviour except the abusers' themselves.
Out of control, does not mean they don't know what they are doing ,
they very well do, wether abused themselves and let loose in the world.....
or abused and taught its the way to keep woman or others' in line.
either way there is no excuse!! | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 2:55:12 PM | Yes endless it is true it's a learned thing. Either watching, hearing or actually being abused they do learn from it. I have been sexually, mentally, emotionally and physically abused. Plus i have seen and heard things. Best way to fix the problem is to realize you have a problem then work on changing it.
What needs to happen is education. We don't learn from school about abuse and how to deal wit it. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 3:44:08 PM | I am sorry to hear of your ordeal...and when one can understand and stop
self-blaming for what they had endured in childhood..and obtain the help
the require....less of a chance of history repeating itself!
as for schools, yes they have taught about abuse to the children, how to report
ect. The biggest problem is , having encountered several teachers along the years,
who verbally, and emotionally abuse......(that somehow is left out of the equation)
when teaching the children to report abuse.
These are issues that have to be brought forward......in every walk of life.
As a mother, I was grabbed physically by a teacher, for choosing to walk
away from her verbal abuse to me.Previously has put a complaint in about
her mistreatment of certain children (abuse) She is still there.And the board
blames it on the union.Give me a break.
If they going to put out warning of abuse to children, they better damn well
make sure they include the same behaviour is not acceptable from teachers'
as well.
abuse can come from many directions,social service agencies, counselling
agencies ect. It is important to recognize abuse in all its forms to put
a stop to it...even the ones who feel they can do it.....in a protective push it
other the carpet job!! | |
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Joined: 6/16/2008
Msg: 324 | |
| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 4:13:36 PM | | Wow, that was a very thorough analysis. I used to work with the victims, and saw things both through their eyes as well as with their and kids overall safety in mind. After I moved on to other career choices though, I kept meeting male victims of abuse, some who had been with sociopaths. I really saw how abuse is not only perpetrated by males, but also by females and by now I am also curious about the abuser's pathway/recovery/ healing. I always look for stories of hope and healing. I love miracles. Fortunately, I'm not in any relation with any abusers and never have been . Thank God I am not hoping for 'the big turnaround' with a certain person in mind. I would like to ask anyone on here who might know though, has anyone ever heard of an abuser as described above actually want to change their life and done so? I mean it's not as concrete as someone quitting a drug addiction is it. Usually noone changes unless they have a very strong motivation. At least with substances/ domestic violence (physical), the person faces consequences of courts, divorces, finances, etc. But take a verbal abuser-why would they want to change -you know. And I have never heard of one changing, but, my whole intent in asking here, is I want to hear the story about the terrible abuser who humbled up and turned their life around-Does that ever happen? No-not the empty promise crowd either. Probably if there was such a person, I imagine theyd be on Oprah lol, or preaching or writing a book. I just dont like to thing that peoples fates are sealed forever-once bad, always bad, you know-with one caveat-I do understand that where sociopaths are concerned noone has truly succeeded in curing them. | |
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| The mind of an abuser
Posted: 7/13/2008 8:00:38 PM | I heard it was one in a million that changes. That was when the woman,finally left
with the intentions of never returning;not leaving to fix him, but leaving to find
her own healing and understanding of the abuse,and how she could empower
herself through therapy(with a good therapist of course)
she then went on to school got her degree in psycology, and became the most
exceptional therapist, without question.
The moral of the story is....you cannot fix or change the abuser, but you can
change yourself for the better,by seeking yourself, and learning you are worth
much more than you have been dished out!
Though it may not seem an easy road for victim of abuse,as they have
co-dependancy issues embedded in them strongly;at least they can seek
out the tools to a better tomorrow,Instead of drowning forever in
the storms of yesterday,and allowing No more storms to ever enter
and leave them drowning again! | |
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