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Algy
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Joined: 11/3/2006
Msg: 201 | |
| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 1:59:26 PM | | It's a red flag but it's not an automatic dealbreaker. I would want to know the whys and hows and I'd keep a sharp eye on it. I dated a couple of people who were on them. And boy did they need them - even when they were on them. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 3:58:31 PM | I have a hard time doing the whole chick on antidepressants thing. I'm a firm believer that most, if not all, depression stems from childhood experiences, and can be worked on with therapy and willpower.
I know that a lot of people won't agree with me, but i see using medication to control depression as an easy out, and shows that the person isn't willing to do any actual work. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 5:00:40 PM |
I have a hard time doing the whole chick on antidepressants thing. I'm a firm believer that most, if not all, depression stems from childhood experiences, and can be worked on with therapy and willpower.
I know that a lot of people won't agree with me, but i see using medication to control depression as an easy out, and shows that the person isn't willing to do any actual work.
Why do you believe what you believe? Therapy is needed, all the willpower in the world isn't going to balance the chemicals in a depressed persons brain. That would be like me telling my uncle if he has enough willpower his brain tumors will go away.
Any good Dr. will not only prescribe a medication but also refer them to a therapist. Unless you have actually experienced depression it is not wise to pass judgement on those of us who have.
I was diagnosed at the age of 28...knowing what I know from experience and getting educated. I know it started when I was 19. I am now 45...Don't you dare tell me that I am taking the easy way out and that I am not willing to do the hard work. As I said to another poster walk a mile in my shoes. You have know idea what I or anyone else has been through. | |
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| Depressed? Take a Pill.
Posted: 7/5/2007 5:00:46 PM |
indigoeyes in Msg: 183 wrote...your selective reading skills are something to be desired.
Yes. I've been told I should get into politics ;)
Seriously, indigoeyes deserves an appology from Ralph42. Just to preface, based on what you have revealed about yourself, I am of the opinion that you should not be taking any meds. Regardless, this is supposed to be a public forum for more-or-less general debate and I don't believe in making it personal. I had doubts about singling you out, by quoting you in my previous post, and I'd just like to state for the record, I'm sorry I did that. By pointing to you too directly, the less tactful comments I've made could well be taken personally (and from your response, they were), and that was not intended.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: ...it sounds like you are trying to say that you are "better" than someone who is having a "rough" time in life, whereas, I'm sure you've had your rough times, and other's lent a helping hand, or a kind word to you during your times of need, so why should it be any different if these people need that?
That is one heck of a stretch. To begin with, I haven't said anywhere that I'm better than anyone here. I've had my own issues to deal with and I would note the value of having a network friends to count on at such times and I think it helps if you face the issues rather than trying to hide from them.
I will readily grant some pretty intense mocking of people getting "a helping hand" from a pill. And that's the point really. We aren't discussing seeking support from a social circle in a crisis. This whole thread is a blatant attempt to pressure validation for taking pills rather than 1) confronting the issues that are causing the emotional disturbance and/or 2) turning to others for help. You and I seem to agree to some extent or another, many have no need for the pills they so readily swallow. They allow themselves to believe the hype that pills will cure what ails them when in fact it is little different than crack. It is a mask to allow them to perpetuate the circumstances that are undermining them in the first place. This is not a solution. Most people dealing with this don't need to be treated with kid gloves, rather they need to be treated with boxing gloves.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: This isn't trying to imply that you're seeking perfection in a mate/relationship, and if something offends your sensibilities, you wouldn't have anything to do with them? ...Sure sounds like it to me.
Define "something" in your comment. I defined the criteria (pill-popping) rather tightly I think and I gave my opinion of why that criteria matters for a long term partner. Did I give a long list of must haves and must not haves? Not being on mood altering drugs is twisted into meaning I'm "seeking perfection"? Come now.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: ....everyone gets old, and has their body begin to start failing them, if your mate was beginning to have problems, and you considered them to be "weak willed" because they either bothered to ask for help, or because they complained about it to their doctor, would you then dismiss them?
Surely not. And like you said, til death (or divorce) do us part. But your point is moot. We're not talking down the road in a relationship. We're talking about the start of a relationship. This is the reason I used the vows in my discussion of why a pill-popper is not a viable choice. Can any of these women honestly be expected to be able to handle worse? sickness? Not without upping their dosage. That's something you can tell from the get-go. Frankly, I'd be hesitant about somebody who's been there at all, regardless of whether they're on pills right now. As evidenced by some of the posts in this thread, this is an endless process. Every time an excuse comes up, they're right back, getting "a helping hand" from a pill.
As for showing me another point of view... Well, you've made a case that some people do need pills. I can agree with that. But have a look at the responses I've garnered from various pill-poppers on this thread. Everything from down right stupid to utterly offensive. (Sorry girls, I haven't bothered with the bulk of the nonsense.) Peter52245, do you think they are showing anything appealing? (Sorry Pete, you're just not my type.) If anything, they are confirming everything I've witnessed about pill-poppers and that's supported by other respondents to this thread who've had the unfortunate experience of being with this type. They use their so-called illness to excuse inexcusable behavior. Even here, on a dating site! The worst thing about it is the blanket validation they readily get from far too many otherwise sensible folk.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: (I don't judge someone as "weak" because they take medications...obviously you do. Which seems to involve a bit of stigma on your part, and a bit of bad past experience.)
Let's be clear about who I'm calling weak. People that honestly need pills are not weak as such, in my opinion, but I'd discount such females as mates on that basis alone. People who don't really need the pills they crave and rationalize a need for, they're the ones I'm calling weak, lazy, and whatever else I've thrown out there for them to chew on.
Now, do I have any experience with pills myself? Nope. I've known plenty of people on pills though and my observation of them would be the basis for my opinions. As for having a bad experience with a pill-popper? Yeah, I could say so.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: Should we adjust your sentence and say..."If you'd added to excess to people who use medications, it wouldn't be a good idea?"
Nice try. I suppose you could say that about any of those I've called pill-poppers in this post. But I've already discounted those that used medications because of a legitmate need too. So, that leaves me still rejecting all women on meds but also those that drink, eat, etc. to excess.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: it does seem like the OP is trying to get someone to say "I hate people on anti-depressents" so she can then go say everyone is horrible and gripe and moan about it.
Probably. So you know, I don't "hate" pill-poppers. Heck, some people near and dear to me are on meds and a few are even pill-poppers. I don't have a problem with them, though I do readily express my opinion when asked. I think that a lot of pill-poppers would be a lot better off if they just stopped. But, honestly, it just isn't that important to me. I've made my position fairly clear I think.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: I choose to not judge so quickly as others seem to do. I give people a chance.
Maybe as you get older and gain some experience, you'll be a bit more ready to admit to judging. I don't know you. And you don't know me. I wouldn't consider myself all that judgemental, actually. I'm as willing to let others live as they choose as you can probably find. I can get along with almost anyone. But, that doesn't mean I don't have worldview that guides me and it doesn't mean I won't express it when asked. And, let me remind all the readers, the OP asked.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: As Prof stated, in the U.S. the laws are becoming stricter and even doing something like throwing water on someone is now considered assault in some states.
Which, as I thought I made clear in my response to that fellow, leads me to conclude that if the situation were to arise now, in the US of A, I suppose I'd just have to beat the person to a pulp so at least I'd have some justification for doing the time I apparently would end up doing anyway.
Peter52245 in Msg: 185 wrote: Maybe they don't teach common courtesy over where-ever you are from, but some of us over here actually learn it from a young age on.
What? Canada? We're the kinder, gentler, polite people you all wish you were -- just don't piss us off ;)
idahosun in Msg: 196 wrote: Stressors are absolutely individualized and to people with panic disorder, one cannot "rank or rate" what might be a stressor for one person with what might be a stressor for someone else... So please stop denigrating someone who finds writing a term paper as extremely stressful, you are not inside that person's body, you do not understand how that person is feeling and you have absolutely no right to judge one person's "breaking point" with another's.
Right. So, essentially, you're saying each person's "stressors" are unique and "stressors" cannot be compared. So, I guess it's completely reasonable to believe that some person might be really stressed by writing a paper, but they might readily handle watching their best friend being blown to bits by a mortar round. Yeah. That sounds reasonable. And I suppose doctors have trillions of permutations of meds and dosages available so that they can handle all those incomparable individuals who are popping pills. Yeah, that's pretty sensible too.
I suppose, I could read these comments from the perspective that people have differing thresholds for what you call their "breaking point" but that would allow ranking. Hmmm. In fact, it means we could derive a formal definition for weakling. But of course, according to you, we can't even rank breaking points. Yeah. To put it kindly, I disagree.
idahosun in Msg: 196 wrote: I know of people who cannot leave the house to go the mailbox because it brings on such a serious panic attack that it is nearly or can be impossible to open that door and take those steps.
Well, let me suggest, you stop feeding their panic by not allowing them to get away with their self-indulgent behavior. Don't get their mail for them. Don't allow food or clothes to be delivered to them. Force them to make a choice. Go out and survive, or stay in and die. Sounds cruel, but you know, sometimes, you got to be cruel to be kind. You think allowing someone to fester like that makes more sense? Why is it that I know my tax dollars are wasted on such insanity, in the name of call this crap a disability? Oh, I know... because I know somebody that's paid to deal with such basket cases. And her opinion is pretty much like I just said. And, by the way, she is a professional. | |
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| Depressed? Take a Pill.
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:25:37 PM |
Seriously, indigoeyes deserves an appology from Ralph42. Just to preface, based on what you have revealed about yourself, I am of the opinion that you should not be taking any meds. Regardless, this is supposed to be a public forum for more-or-less general debate and I don't believe in making it personal. I had doubts about singling you out, by quoting you in my previous post, and I'd just like to state for the record, I'm sorry I did that. By pointing to you too directly, the less tactful comments I've made could well be taken personally (and from your response, they were), and that was not intended.
Apology accepted and appreciated. I know you don't believe I should be on meds...I am here to tell you that if not for meds...I would have died by my own hands. I have never in my life experienced a low so low. I know when I need meds and when I can go off of them. I pushed to hard for to long. I won't put myself through that ever again. Your conclusions are based on other peoples experiences. My conclusions are based on my experiences, my Dr. and my therapist. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. | |
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| Depressed? Take a Pill.
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:33:00 PM | It's so amazing to read when people write things like 'it just proves that people aren't willing to work'
I pushed to hard for to long. I won't put myself through that ever again.
That's how i feel. I used to refuse antidepressants on basic principal. Then I realized that it doesn't matter how I get happy, as long as I get happy. The rest will come. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:05:50 PM | This I am sure has generated quite the debate. As I do not have the time to read through all the postings I will just list my take on your question. I agree with your comment. I think it is best that if you have a medical issue that it remain treated. I would base my decision in this scenario the same as I would usually. I would see if our personalities meshed well and if I was physically attracted to her then I would continue on the 'Relationship Path'. The fact that medication is being taken is not an issue.
On a side note I do hope you don't let your health suffer just because some people cannot get past your medication. I wish you all the best. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:20:58 PM | Yikes I would be scared...my husband is on 17-18 meds right now, no anti-depressants but I think he should, he's very negative....it would help...I would not consider my daughter to go out with a man who takes anti-depressants...all my life I saw people around me taking some form of meds....it would be nice for her to meet a normal guy!
One of my friend's hubby is bipolar, and they constanltly have fights, he can no longer work and she has to bring home the bacon..very strssful on her--not a life to have...
-gab | |
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| no way
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:27:28 PM | I work with emotionally disturbed kids and no way do I want to date anyone one meds.
That said, if I fell in love and THEN they told me, it might not be a deal breaker, if they can keep it together.
But in general, I have little sympathy for depressed adults. I KNOW it is medical but.. it is annoying to the friends and family. I wouldn't want to marry it and would not want to pass it on to my kids. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:28:55 PM |
he can no longer work and she has to bring home the bacon..very strssful on her--not a life to have...
Yes, but which would you prefer a husband that can't bring home the bacon or someone who is a quadrapelegic. Both illnesses can be just as debilitating, but in different ways. Now I wouldn't wish either of these conditions on anyone. But I can tell you right now, there is more sympathy in the world for any physical dissability than there is for a mental dissability. The reason is simple, one you can easily see the other is hidden from view, hard to see and define. Several people in this thread have shown just how true it is that we still a long way to go before one can say that mental illness doesn't come with a huge burden of a stigma attached. Which in it self also causes a lot of people with one to hide it from all those around them, and not get the help they truely need. I know I did for more than 20 years. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:44:37 PM | WHO can cast that stone with dirty hands? In other words, who doesn't take one or two types of meds a day here? Prostate? Cancer? Diabetes? High blood pressure? Depression? Any and all types of ailments need medication. Depression is a chemical imbalance due to stress or loss, bi-polar is a chemical imbalance.
What I'm trying to say is this: NO one is perfect.
Say you find someone that you adore, they have perfect health, you marry your dream gal or guy. Two years later they fall out and have a major stroke or in a terrible car accident. What are you going to do then?? Leave them? Dump their sorry sick a** and come back on POF and look for Ms or Mr Perfect again?
As I said, no one is perfect. If you do find someone that you can share your life with, the ups and downs, enjoy each other's company, support each other in the daily grind, then you should overlook the small stuff that is not of their control.
Who knows, when you fall in love with someone your chemical balance changes for the better, people have been known to get 'high' on life, lose weight, look brighter, smile more, and its proven that people that are living with a partner live longer.
I would think twice if they are constantly receiving electro shock treatments and can't remember their name.
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| no way
Posted: 7/5/2007 9:49:20 PM | | It's a deal breaker. That's why I mentioned it as a no-no in my profile. Been on that boat, and once your a couple miles offshore, you only have the choice of sailing back w/the whack, or jumping ship and swimming back, and the more miles offshore you find yourself, well,...I chose taking my chances on the backstroke, no matter how cold the water. No drugs, no antidepressants, no exceptions...not looking to inherit an ongoing quicksand thing; I'm not a doctor, but Homey don't play dat. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 10:29:29 PM | | If you need them,you need them.No big deal in my book.I've been seeing a woman for a few months that has to take them for panic attacks.As we've been getting to know each other more and more,I have a better understanding of why she's taking them.It's certainly had no effect on how I view her or our relationship.You do what you have to do. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 10:49:08 PM | What an interesting, diverse, unbelievable thread!
I tried to read all the posts, but 9 pages....couldn't do it...what I did do was try to see if anyone addressed the ACTIONS of these drugs. I didn't see very many people acknowledging that these drugs alter NEUROTRANSMITTERS in the brain aka 'chemicals' in the brain. These chemical messages/actions are the beginning of feelings, thoughts, behaviors, etc.....they jump start (or NOT) our reactions when it comes to mood and behavior. IT IS a PHYSICAL thing. Check out this link;
http://www.healthcentral.com/depression/introduction-5003-109.html
You've got tricyclics that increase norepinephrine reuptake and serotonin reuptake.
It is believed and been studied that these neurotransmitters are deficient in some people. That is, they just don't have enough, OR they aren't transmitted correctly.
And that's just Elavil and tricyclics. Compare it to a diabetic who makes SOME INSULIN, and takes oral hypoglycemics to assist insulin in glucose metabolism.
It's a fact that some are lacking in enough insuling, but still make SOME!!!!
Above is ONE example of an antidepressant. Let's look at dopamine and serotonin
<div class="quote">Decrease in serotonin(for example through MDMA, MDA,etc) leads to stimulation of sociability and mood,aggressivity and sexuality,etc,probably by augmenting dopaminergic activity normally blocked by serotonin(except 5-HT2A receptors).However MDMA and MDA lead only to stimulation of sociability, probably at a site or sites modulated by the Median Raphé Nucleus.
Here are some effects of serotonin, as demonstrated through zimelidine and fluvoxamine:
I.Decrease in informational flow from memory to consciousness:the quantity
of thoughts per unit of time,under zimelidine or fluvoxamine,reaching
consciousness is diminished as to base-line levels.
2.Motivations are decreased.
3.Emotions are anesthesised
4.Sexual desire is decreased or suppressed
5.Sleep or quasi-sleep is increased
6.Aggression is reduced.
7.Locomotion is diminished
8.Because of (1)obssesive thoughts or suicidal thoughts,etc,are reduced
9.Under fluvoxamine suicidal ideation can be reversed quite fast but not as
spectacularly as with Gamma-hydroxybutyrate.
Contrary to typical serotoninergic reuptake blockers which induce somnolence
fluoxetine is atypical because it induces insomnia.It can also induce
headaches which are reversed by fluvoxamine.Insomnia is also reversed
through fluvoxamine (Luvox) .As also fluoxetine(Prozac)is SUBHALLUCINOGENIC one
concludes that fluoxetine has a differential tendency to indirectly
stimulate 5-HT2A receptors,thus activating dopaminergic activity.
Activation of dopamine neurotransmission leads to insomnia.
Effects of Dopamine on Behaviour
-----------------------------------------------
The effects of dopamine on behaviour can be evaluated with the dopamine
reuptake blockers amineptine and nomifensine(nomifensine has also a
noradrenergic component).
Stimulation of dopamine neurotransmission can induce the following effects:
I.Mental and motor activation.
2.Stimulation of mood WITHOUT concomittant "euphoria".
3.Amineptine can induce a potentiation of benzodiazepines induced
anxiolysis (anti anxiety) .
4.Some authors say that amineptine can alleviate some schizophrenic symptoms,which is consistent with the hypothesis of hypofrontality linked
to decrease in dopamine neurotransmission.
5.Dopamine seems to be an UBIQUITOUS METABOLIC ACTIVATOR.It thus activates
neuronal systems while serotonin,normally,seems to deactivate neuronal systems.So the purpose of dopamine,PER SE,in the CNS seems only to modulate metabolic
activity of other systems.
In this sense,dopamine IS NOT directly linked to pleasurable experiences.It only
serves to activate post-dopaminergic systems involved in these behaviours...
6.Dopamine stimulates motivations and lifts undecisiveness.Undecisiveness gives rise
to self-confidence.If dopamine is overactivated then self-confidence increases to the
point of being delusional!
7.Activation of some dopamine autoreceptors seems to decrease activity.
So there should also exist a Dopamine/Dopamine balance.
quote]
Ok, sounds like a lot of mumbo jumbo. But, it's NOT. There are so many ways in which our neurotransmitters cause reactions and thoughts it's phenominal! These neurotransmitters ARE responsible for certain reactions/moods/behaviors, etc....YOU CAN'T DENY THAT AND SAY THAT Cognitive Behavioral therapy OR family therapy OR whatever change in thought patterns WILL NECESSARILY work. Not when there is an actual deficiency OR malfuntction in these transmitters.
Think of it when your body increases adrenaline....Heart rate increases, BP increases, muscle strength increases...there is a whole series of events that result from one transmitter EPINEPHRINE.
Now, I'm not a doctor, but I am an RN. I've been on Elavil in the past because of Fibromyalgia. The indication was that a low dose (not for depression) but for increasing serotonin reuptake , it would increase my stage 4 sleep (yup, it's responsible for that stage of sleep)...the theory is...our bodies repair muscle tears during stage 4 (REM) sleep and if we don't get it, or enough of it....we wake up often thru the night and in pain in the am, feeling as if we've never slept. When I was on Elavil, I actually slept 8 hours a night, didn't wake up 10 times, finally experienced dreams for once, and felt much less pain, and had more energy.......
All the therapy in the world (or even 'exercise') didn't change that since I was lacking in Serotonin reuptake. Now....after I was diagnosed with breast cancer my MD prescribed Lexapro 'prophylactically'. Was that right? I doubt it. I took it, but didn't really need to....I had a 'situational depression'....IN THAT I JUST FOUND OUT I HAD CANCER!!! That is an example of when therapy helps. Cancer didn't mess with my neurotransmitters....so, did I really need the Lexapro? NO.
Fast forward to two years after my cancer diagnosis. Suddenly I found myself depressed...not sure why? I kept my feelings and fears inside, didn't do the 'therapy' thing...and subsequently went on Zoloft. My mood improved. No doubt. Now, I haven't seen studies on the effects of chemotherapy on neurotransmitters, but I do know Taxol (one of my chemo drugs) had long term 'cognitive' effects. Did it screw up my neurotransmitters? Maybe? After all, it is a toxic drug, not selective to only cancer cells, but NEURONS too.
What I'm trying to say is......yeah, antidepressants are most likely over prescribed.
As a visiting nurse, I'd say about 75% of my patients are on one or another...do they all have neurotransmitter deficiencies??? I doubt it. Most likely they have deficiencies in dealing with their circumstances, they lack coping mechanisms. HOWEVER, that does NOT negate the reality that some people are lacking in the neurotransmitters responsible for depression and all it entails.
We all know that pregnancy changes hormones right??? Estrogen and progesterone...well...why not neurotransmitters too? And therefore leading to Post partum depression, psychosis, etc....I'll take on Tom Cruise any day! (no, I did not have PPD) although my oncologist did wonder if I had PTSD from my cancer diagnosis...
We have so many chemicals in our bodies, as well as electolytes such as Potassium, Sodium, etc...that are all needed for our bodies to function normally...think of hemophiliacs...sickle cell syndrome...WHAT is the DIFFERENCE...these are molecular physiological functions and some people do lack them.
So, you can't say with certainty that doctors prescribe them inappropriately.
And you can't say that someone who lacks a simple chemical is 'crazy' or should be avoided. Like another poster said...think of the diabetics out there...Or those with adrenal insufficiency....Not all counseling, therapy, reading self help books, great support systems, diet, etc....will change the fact that someone's insulin production is low and diet only does so much OR that someone's neurons are misfiring or lacking!!! (did that sentence make sense?)
That's my 0.2 I feel like I had to comment because in reading this thread, I don't think people educated themselves enough to understand exactly what these drugs do! And what happens in our brains! One thing about being a nurse, you've got to know your drugs...and with such a high percentage of people on these drugs....well...you get to know them...
An afterthought...do I think they should be prescribed for temporary depression? NO.
Say if you lose a loved one, like on 9/11...that's when therapy is appropriate...
Do kids need them? Sometimes...it all depends on the diagnosis, measurable behavior, suicide ideation etc....I really believe medications are a God send...if a pain med works...one should take it to relieve their pain....if it's chronic pain...and they take a drug long term because it alleviates their pain, does that make them an addict anymore than someone who takes a blood pressure med to decrease their BP and risk of stroke????
Ok, I've rambled. Sorry...
Time to sleep now...
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 11:11:16 PM | what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
I have found in the past it is a sign of another underlying problem not yet solved, confronted with, or dealt with. In one person, she was unable to understand how to deal with the problem. ( I was unable to help her ) Classic signs of the change of life, she refused to accept the physical signs that showed she was in the middle of it. So depression really set in and she was takening a lot of medication.
I lost my job & directorship of a company many years ago when my kids were just a year or two old, I know what it is like. Mine was not a medical problem though. I throw all the tablets in the bin after a few months and eventually solved the problem and vowed I would never suffer from this again. I was lucky. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/5/2007 11:21:52 PM | Well, seeing as my profile states that I am working on some issues, might as well come out of the closet and put in my two cents. I am a sufferor of Post Traumatic Stress, Severe Clinical Depression and Anxiety disorder, with insomnia. I do take meds, however it is temporary for my situation resulted from a trauma that was indured 6 months ago. I am doing therapy to heal, as well as working with two psychologists, I see my family doctor weekly, keep two different journals and am adding a dream journal to catch my nightmares so that I will know how to stop them. I went through something simliar last year and I let the stigma of being on meds, seeking help stop me from what I am doing now. The result, recurring illness. Not this time.
AS to the OP's question....someone being on medication for what ever illness they have is not a deal breaker for me. Someone who definately has issues who chooses to not face them, not work on them, and just sit there either drowning their sorrows in their favorite beverage or illegal drug would. I do not agree with people who say i went through this or that, and that is why I do what I do either, for personal responsibilty and accountability are very important to me, hence me doing the work for me, to heal from what happened to me.
I have noticed huge changes already, and yes the meds do help me control my racing mind. In a couple of weeks, after the trial next week I will be going off the meds, and using just counselling. I am lucky in that my company that I work with is a hundred per cent behind me on my recovery and when I am done my job will be there. I do not have to go on welfare, or EI benefits because we have a great benifts package that covers psychological long term leave (which is what i am on).
In my case, as in a lot of others, the meds are needed, be it temporary or long-term depending on the damage that has been done, or the biological condition that one has. To say oh i can't date you cause you are on meds is just like saying you would not date someone who has red hair because of the firery tempers that goes with it or a blonde because they are stupid. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 12:16:00 AM |
So please stop denigrating someone who finds writing a term paper as extremely stressful, you are not inside that person's body, you do not understand how that person is feeling and you have absolutely no right to judge one person's "breaking point" with another's. And although I mostly admire what you have written Peter, what you had to say about that was unkind and unfair.
Erm, what? I don't believe I said anything about any term papers or any such thing. Maybe you're mistaking me with someone else?
In fact, I believe I was pointing out exactly the same thing you are saying...
Who said a few of these people's problems don't compare?
I know that stressors vary. I'm the one with social phobia/social anxiety and PTSD, remember? I think above all, I'd understand the difference. :|
To begin with, I haven't said anywhere that I'm better than anyone here.
No, you implied it with your words and attitude. Maybe that's just how I'm reading it, but I don't believe I'm the only one seeing it this way.
I would note the value of having a network friends to count on at such times
Welcome to what the therapists refer to as a "support structure" or an "emotional support". You sure you haven't been through therapy? 
I will readily grant some pretty intense mocking of people getting "a helping hand" from a pill. And that's the point really. We aren't discussing seeking support from a social circle in a crisis.
And you don't see what's wrong with this? Maybe you should study what happens to children who are exposed to bullies throughout school, it's the same concept. The whole point in "mocking" or "condemning" someone is to purposely lower their self-esteem.
I.E. My statement.
it sounds like you are trying to say that you are "better" than someone who is having a "rough" time in life, whereas, I'm sure you've had your rough times, and other's lent a helping hand, or a kind word to you during your times of need, so why should it be any different if these people need that?
The point I was trying to show you, is that these "bullies" usually consider themselves to be "better" than someone, whereas what they themselves are doing is trying to compensate for something missing in their life.
The people that "lend a helping hand" or a "kind word" to these people are usually trying to boost their self-esteem.
The same could be said about pills, except you are taking away the human factor and making it into a vice/addiction which they will return to, to achieve that "boost".
This does not only refer to medications, this refers to all of the vices/addictions I spoke of. Same goes for every one. People are using them to replace something that was lost in their life.
This whole thread is a blatant attempt to pressure validation for taking pills rather than 1) confronting the issues that are causing the emotional disturbance and/or 2) turning to others for help.
Actually, it started as a simple question of whether or not men would accept someone on medication. It's turned into a much larger debate now.
As for trying to pressure anyone to accept something, that's not what I'm trying to do, I'm just pointing things out. You can take what you want from what I said, or you can leave it. That's all up to you.
You and I seem to agree to some extent or another, many have no need for the pills they so readily swallow. They allow themselves to believe the hype that pills will cure what ails them when in fact it is little different than crack. It is a mask to allow them to perpetuate the circumstances that are undermining them in the first place. This is not a solution. Most people dealing with this don't need to be treated with kid gloves, rather they need to be treated with boxing gloves.
Yes, I do agree on some aspects. What I'm trying to point out, is that condemning/victimizing/abusing people who do choose medications(Or whatever vice they have) for themselves is not acceptable. It comes off like an attack. Your words are reminding me of my father's abusive attitude towards everything. So I'm sorry if anything I say comes off like a personal attack, because I'm trying to be civilized and show you things without attacking you.
The whole point is that abuse is a learned behavior and some people don't even realize they are being abusive. (I've noticed this for years about my father. I could tell you some personal stories, but I'd rather not go delving into them, because they stir too many feelings.)
Define "something" in your comment.
Something, in this case "pill popping", but it could be any number of things you yourself find offensive.
Did I give a long list of must haves and must not haves? Not being on mood altering drugs is twisted into meaning I'm "seeking perfection"?
Actually, you'd started on one(Drugs, not drinking in excess, medications), just like a lot of people have. It's what makes up our "deal breakers".
Some people, after experiencing certain things, cannot stand them, and choose to deny any chance of them in their relationships with others.
We're talking about the start of a relationship.
Actually, the original question was whether or not someone could handle being with someone on anti-depressents, or whether it would be a deal-breaker. That involves more than just the "start" of a relationship.
The question was trying to ask whether or not you could handle a short, or a long-term relationship with someone on these meds.
Can any of these women honestly be expected to be able to handle worse? sickness?
Yes. You'd be surprised at how strong a person who's lived through depression can be. If you've lived through your worst moments in life, wanting death with all fibers of your being, and you've pulled through, you can't tell me that these people didn't learn how to be something stronger, who cares if they had pills, or a person lending their hand, or a kind word, or whatever else helped them pull through. They made it, and they are still alive to talk about it. Now imagine the people who have regular bouts of depression. Don't you think these people would be some of the strongest people there are?
That's something you can tell from the get-go. Frankly, I'd be hesitant about somebody who's been there at all, regardless of whether they're on pills right now. As evidenced by some of the posts in this thread, this is an endless process. Every time an excuse comes up, they're right back, getting "a helping hand" from a pill.
And that's your choice. Just remember, you might be avoiding someone who might even be stronger-willed, or in general stronger as a person than even you.
As for showing me another point of view... Well, you've made a case that some people do need pills. I can agree with that.
That's just one of the things I was trying to show you. But at least you see what I mean in one sense.
Peter52245, do you think they are showing anything appealing?
Actually, a few of them are showing quite a bit of knowledge, and a sense of caring, which is something I personally strive for in a relationship. Someone that bothers to use their brain, and their heart. (You probably won't understand what I mean by this. That's OK though.)
Sorry Pete, you're just not my type.
Back at you.
If anything, they are confirming everything I've witnessed about pill-poppers and that's supported by other respondents to this thread who've had the unfortunate experience of being with this type.
A lot of the respondents are not knowledgeable about what they speak about. People like to blame stuff like abuse, or bad behavior on someone's disability, and that's part of what stigma is. I've watched a few of these types of threads, and some of them turn into witch-hunts for people with disorders/mental illnesses.
They use their so-called illness to excuse inexcusable behavior.
People do this in lots of situations, not even just about illnesses. I just got banned for 3 days for "flaming" someone who'd been sitting there griping and making multiple threads about his "looks" causing him to be unable to "get the ladies". What I was actually trying to do, was point out that it had nothing to do with his looks and everything to do with his attitude.
People just don't understand that what's "inexcusable" to one person, might be excusable for others. And vice versa.
Let's be clear about who I'm calling weak. People that honestly need pills are not weak as such, in my opinion, but I'd discount such females as mates on that basis alone. People who don't really need the pills they crave and rationalize a need for, they're the ones I'm calling weak, lazy, and whatever else I've thrown out there for them to chew on.
Thanks for clearing that up.
But I've already discounted those that used medications because of a legitmate need too. So, that leaves me still rejecting all women on meds but also those that drink, eat, etc. to excess.
Again. That's your right.
So you know, I don't "hate" pill-poppers...And, let me remind all the readers, the OP asked.
Yes, she did open this can of worms, so to speak.
I don't know you. And you don't know me.
Never claimed to, I think our writing shows a bit about ourselves though.
Which, as I thought I made clear in my response to that fellow, leads me to conclude that if the situation were to arise now, in the US of A, I suppose I'd just have to beat the person to a pulp so at least I'd have some justification for doing the time I apparently would end up doing anyway.
What I don't get, is why you feel you'd rather "beat them to a pulp" rather than show some dignity and integrity and walk away from the situation.
What? Canada? We're the kinder, gentler, polite people you all wish you were -- just don't piss us off ;)
Or maybe you're delusional and believe you are. They have medications for delusions of grandeur now, or didn't you know that?
Sounds cruel, but you know, sometimes, you got to be cruel to be kind.
This is what I meant by the abusive stuff. Whoever came up with this kind of thinking, had something wrong with them. Never is cruelty required for kindness.
Why is it that I know my tax dollars are wasted on such insanity, in the name of call this crap a disability?
Ah, your true motivation shows. Greed.
Peter: You said
Yeah, it does seem like the OP is trying to get someone to say "I hate people on anti-depressents" so she can then go say everyone is horrible and gripe and moan about it. But if you bother to look around on these forums, you'd realize, that's not just this thread, nor this subject alone.
duuude! I thought you were on my side man. It's okay I forgive ya.
I'm on nobodies side but my own. Too many people have purposely hurt me. I do try and defend what I believe in though. And you've got to admit, what I said is exactly what this thread seems like, once you step back and look at it. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 12:16:37 AM |
I don't think people educated themselves enough to understand exactly what these drugs do! And what happens in our brains!
According to your theory, I'd be a wacked out crazy person because of my "chemical imbalances" that come with my Bi-Polar disorder, because I'm not on any medications.
Somehow, I don't believe you are correct. I'm about as close to sane as they come...sadly.
As for whether I "educated" myself, I've read up on plenty of the drugs, and read all kinds of nonsensical jibberish like you included in your post from some website, and what you fail to realize, is that a lot of that "mumbo jumbo" is just someone's attempt to make their drug look decent in the eyes of the people.
Think about how many billions of dollars the drug companies make off of all the medications that are out there. And yet they are continuously asking people to "donate" to charities to search for "cures" for things.
If I was a conspiracy theorist, I'd suggest that the government or something is holding the actual "cures" somewhere, and depriving the general public of access just so they can pocket more cash.
But see, I'm not a conspiracy theorist.
I just believe that we all can function without medications if we so choose.
The world didn't always have access to medications. Did you know that in the medieval age, they used to use leeches to try and "cure" someone? They also used to use hand drills or small picks to punch a hole in people's skulls to "release the inner demons"(Hearing voices).
These usually resulted in the patient's death. I'm glad we've advanced somewhat from those times, but I don't believe we're much farther.
I do believe they are purposely trying to medicate/subdue the masses with some of these drugs, rather than actually deal with some of the problems.
If you noticed, a lot of the major companies are now getting sued for lying about their products. How much longer till they realize some of these other medications were lied about? Do you always believe anything and everything you are told/read somewhere? | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:14:07 AM |
Think about how many billions of dollars the drug companies make off of all the medications that are out there. And yet they are continuously asking people to "donate" to charities to search for "cures" for things.
If I was a conspiracy theorist, I'd suggest that the government or something is holding the actual "cures" somewhere, and depriving the general public of access just so they can pocket more cash.
I actually know some people in the pharmicudical industry, and they have said that the entire industry isn't looking for cures, they are looking for things that manage the symptoms. There is no money in cures, because once the illness is cured there is no money making machine left. But if you can make it possible to remove the symptoms, and keep them using the medicine to do so, you have a money maker. Which is why I've said repeatedly if you are ever going to get yourself off the meds you need to be involved in therapy as well as the meds. With the right kind of therapy the root cause of the mental illness can be cured. This of course depends on the kind of mental illness, because there are some where no amount of therapy will cure the problem, but it might make it more manageable. | |
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Algy
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Joined: 11/3/2006
Msg: 220 | |
| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:35:42 AM |
who doesn't take one or two types of meds a day here?
I don't. That includes vitamins, aspirin, cold or allergy medicine. I'm opposed to ingesting non-food substances on a regular basis. Not that pharms or even some illegals are absolutely without merit under any circumstances. But I prefer to avoid them - and I think my SO should be of similar mind. | |
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UR4ME?
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Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 221 | |
| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 2:58:51 PM | The real problem with people on antidepressants, and the people against them, is that they type too much. I lost interest in this thread once everyone started posting essays on the topic.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt:
Be sincere; be brief; be seated. | |
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| what do guys think of girls who take antidepressants?
Posted: 7/6/2007 5:15:41 PM |
The real problem with people on antidepressants, and the people against them, is that they type too much. I lost interest in this thread once everyone started posting essays on the topic.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt:
Be sincere; be brief; be seated.
So you believe in the philosophy of being told something, believing it, and never questioning.
Albert Einstein :
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. The mediocre mind is incapable of understanding the man who refuses to bow blindly to conventional prejudices and chooses instead to express his opinions courageously and honestly. | |
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| Depressed? Take a Pill.
Posted: 7/6/2007 8:06:26 PM | idahosun in Msg: 196 wrote: Stressors are absolutely individualized and to people with panic disorder, one cannot "rank or rate" what might be a stressor for one person with what might be a stressor for someone else... So please stop denigrating someone who finds writing a term paper as extremely stressful, you are not inside that person's body, you do not understand how that person is feeling and you have absolutely no right to judge one person's "breaking point" with another's.
Right. So, essentially, you're saying each person's "stressors" are unique and "stressors" cannot be compared. So, I guess it's completely reasonable to believe that some person might be really stressed by writing a paper, but they might readily handle watching their best friend being blown to bits by a mortar round. Yeah. That sounds reasonable. And I suppose doctors have trillions of permutations of meds and dosages available so that they can handle all those incomparable individuals who are popping pills. Yeah, that's pretty sensible too.
Ah, here we go again, comparing apples to oranges and making ASSumptions about a subj. you obviously know nothing about. Panic attacks can be cued and non-cued, or to clarify for you, a person who sees someone blown up has experienced a traumatic event that has cued the panic, while someone else might have them because they have been genetically passed on to that person, they just happen out of the blue. And yes, there ARE numerous permutations of meds and dosages, of course!! That is why some people with mental illness must try drug after drug after drug until they find the right combination that works on their chemistry, duh. | |
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| Depressed? Take a Pill.
Posted: 7/6/2007 8:12:29 PM | I suppose, I could read these comments from the perspective that people have differing thresholds for what you call their "breaking point" but that would allow ranking. Hmmm. In fact, it means we could derive a formal definition for weakling. But of course, according to you, we can't even rank breaking points. Yeah. To put it kindly, I disagree.
No, it is not ranking, it is the dawning in some people's tiny brains that we are all unique and what you may consider to be a weakling has no validity whatsoever because you are not qualified in any way shape or form to be the judge, although that is what you do, judge, judge judge. | |
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