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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 11:54:05 AM | | Hi Poetic...First off, I would like to say how sorry I am that some of the people posting responses are so nasty !!! To those of you who are on your let's beat this woman, boo hoo "etc...SHAME ON THEM...My understanding from your post is that you want to know if others have ever experienced the "head in the sand" syndrome...MANY have, including me and YOU ARE NOT ALONE !!! A couple of the posts really did spell it out...LOVE IS BLIND (deaf, dumb and stupid t00) when you start off at an early age...Most humans want love and are willing to ignore the bad becuase of the early butterfly, we are in love, we can conquer all, head over heals love..."One post said it best, it forms a mental image of what this person is like and we hold onto that in the hopes that it will come back...It is so sad that it doesn't and never will...Yes, in very rare cases, the lightbulb goes off and the offender changes...NOT BECAUSE YOU WANT THEM TO, it is because they have realized that they have made a mistake and the only way to keep the relationship is by admitting their errors and working as a couple...As far as you dating the new guy, I think it is wise that you go slow and not slip into the same routine...I believe you will have a comfort zone because there is a "normal" feeling based on what you have experienced with your ex...Good for you on having concern that you are going to judge all men based on your past, you just being aware that you may do this will allow you to take a step back and hopefully know whether it should be a red flag or your own insecurities...I wish you all the best !!! You are not alone, you deserve happiness and hell NO, you are not too old to settle !!! | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 12:59:58 PM |
I also don't think I was out to change anyone when I married them...... I was just too young and clueless and head over heels to have an agenda with this person.... I just believed how could it go wrong or ever be wrong if you love someone so very very much.....
I hear you princess! I was flag blind for years...now I might even see phantom flags!
welcome to the forums disreguard the meanyheads and enjoy! | |
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daisie
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Joined: 9/22/2004
Msg: 31 | |
| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 1:17:51 PM | I never ignore any red flags. never. never
And I hope you're not including ME when you say "WE always think love and a ring and kids will change them." DONT INCLUDE ME IN THAT STATEMENT...THAT AINT ME AT ALL!!!!!! YOU DO IT....NOT ME!!!!
I have N.E.V.E.R thought or hoped anything about me would change a man.
They is what they is. If I wanted to change someone I'd babysit a friends baby and change some diapers.
Im not in the business of changing MEN.
they is what they is.
Im in the business of GETTING TO K NOW MEN. I dont ignore red flags.....NEVER!!
I may choose to store that red flag event in a mental filing cabinet labeled "things I don't understand yet".....and i MAY choose to give it another attempt to get to know the guy....MAYBE. It all depends on waht Red Flags I see. However after the Red Flag event EVERYTHING that happens between us will be filtered with the Red Flag in mind.....and I will always err of the side of caution. This only goes on for a brief time until it get resolved and meets my standards... in the VERY near future.
....At some point NOT too far down the road the guy will have to explain the Red Flag event to my satisfaction and demontrate behavior to conunteract it. If he cannot or will not do that.....then its adios muchacho! and I go get to know another guy who is more appealing and with fewer problems.
IGNORING Red Flags is a frustrating waste of your LIFE.
If ya like a person, stick wtih em. If ya DONT like a person (red flags) GET RID of EM! Why drag it on and on and on??? | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 1:26:41 PM |
I may choose to store that red flag event in a mental filing cabinet labeled "things I don't understand yet".....and i MAY choose to give it another attempt to get to know the guy....MAYBE. It all depends on waht Red Flags I see.
You have to have been caught with pants down to even know what would be a red flag. Thus putting one in the cabinet would be "not taking a close look" Explaining is a waste of time as they can spin it very convincingly and even rationally. | |
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daisie
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Joined: 9/22/2004
Msg: 34 | |
| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 1:43:21 PM | Nope. thats not how it works for me.
perhaps that's been your experience, but NOT my experience.
My filing cabinet method woks most excellently for me. It gives me a chance to be fair to people, and not make SNAP judgments based on simple appearances of a situtaion or behavior. I like to give people the benefit of the doubt while I get to know them...but TRUSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSST me....once they have planted a seed of doubt they have to work extremely hard - unbelievably hard - to recover from that. and a simple verbal explanation of the event is NOT good enough...I must see proof of this in their behavior. and any future red flags on that topic is means for termination. no questions asked.
To chose to NOT put Red Flag events in a cabinet to be re-evaluated ....to simply make a hasty decision (either way) based on the appearance of the event would be an example of "NOT taking a close look". that would be simply ignoring /accepting it or terminating the guy with no further consideration. I put some effort and consideration into getting to know someone who interests me.
But I err on the side of caution...always....once I see red flags I no longer invest anything into the guy (emotion, faith, much money, time, etc).....Everything kinda goes into limbo adn his job at that point (whether he knows it or not) is to correct this Red Flag event. If he cant or wont do it .....thats cool. Adios muchacho! he had a chance...didnt hurt me to give him a little time to work it out. and sometimes it does get worked out and find it was all a misunderstanding.
I do NOT make excuses for poor behavior. Heck no!!! but I do dig a little deeper....file it away breifly to give myself time to understand the MOTIVE behind the action....and to truly understand it. Appearances are often very very wrong.
Of course I pick and choose what goes in the file cabinet for futher consideration. If its jsut TOO weird, dangerous, illegal, etc then i dont want to get invovled....hes not worth the risk to me to sepend the time on him.
However, MANY MANY things do warrant a little more digging and depth of understanding. UNDESRSTANDING is what getting to know a person is all aobut. Anyway.......first and foremost is MY SAFETY.....so I dont reevaluate anything to jeopardize my safety. DRUNK drivers are OUT 1st offense. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:00:38 PM | Oh you mean those red flags weren't for decor? With my increased wisdom and experience now... I will be politically correct in saying that I have zero tolerance for any red flags now... well any flags after I've slept with him Rymz | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:11:23 PM | Im sure there were red flags within my marriage and beforehand-hindsight is always 20/20. However, I would not take one thing back, because I live by my no regrets policy-they are lessons learned.
He gave me a beautiful daughter and a huge list of what to NOT look for in a man. Because of him, I can thank myself for being the strong, independent single mother I am who will never settle for anything less.
We do not get along, nor cannot speak. He is not in my daughters life since I left him when she was 3 months old. He is an addict of the booze and pot. And because of those 2 main contributors, he is not a well man and not in her life. I am very successful and a confident woman who is content now. But, looking back on my 3 yrs. with him, it was mostly all bad with warning signs. But, Ive got the best thing in the world out of that, and she is about to start kindergarten!! | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:19:09 PM | | I've swept more than a few under the rug in my time because I thought that I was being too judgmental and not giving the proper benefit of a doubt. I've since learned that my initial feelings were right on the money, I have pretty good instincts and now listen to them most the time. The moment of truth came about 3 years ago when I was dating the poster child of red flags and the ultimate "dramadude". | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:29:06 PM | I just got out of one, thankfully, that in hindsight would have been a major disaster. Red flags like jealousy, total insecurity when I wasn't around, the obsessive need for near instant gratification emotionally, which didn't help because we lived an hour and a half apart, the fact that she blames her special needs daughter for her not having any free time, and add in the fact that she got ticked because I couldn't get her a replacement car after she totalled hers (hit a deer). . . that town was painted in red flags, but I love her enough that it still hurt when she ended the relationship after getting engaged to a guy she had only known for two weeks (who gave her the car) and hadn't bothered to tell me about. LOL
The hardest part was, it wasn't the other stuff that hurt, it was that she violated my trust.
My first answer to this question though was "Which time?" I do not believe that just because someone has a couple of red flags that you should dump them immediately, unless it is something like being abusive. If I had felt that way, I would not have the wonderful son I have because I never would have married his mom in the first place. To date, I have had only one relationship I didn't find any red flags in, and she decided that she would rather have me as a best friend than a husband/boyfriend. Nothing bad, just the way it worked out.
Red flags can be a guide, but like all guides, sometimes you have to look beyond the bad to find the good hiding inside.
RQ | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 2:33:29 PM |
I've swept more than a few under the rug in my time because I thought that I was being too judgmental and not giving the proper benefit of a doubt.
I know exactly what you mean. That's why I ALWAYS follow my own instincts now. I select my own dicisions and keep my own council. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 6:27:35 PM | Egads! What a great discussion! Thanks to everyone for carrying this forward and to those being so honest and open and kind. I appreciate all your feedback, your wisdom, your journey...we all come at life from different directions, which may explain why some of us get tripped up on the smallest pebble, others are able to leap over all the boulders. I taught emotionally abused kids for years, I adored those kids, most of them were on parole, on probation or suspended, and were labeled as "BAD"...but there are no bad children, there are no bad people, there are misinformed people, judgemental people or very wounded people .... as their teacher, I had to steer them towards healthier attitudes towards "establishment" rules they kept getting slapped in the face with, rules they finally had to see were there because of the decisions they had made. Not unexpectedly, all of these kids had absolutely no home life, no steady relationship with a firm and guiding parent, their parents were into drugs, alcohol, prostitution.... so of course they were going to act out... sooner often more than later this kind of neglect and abuse wreaks havoc somewhere in a person's life...they were lucky they got into this program, where I just tried to help them see that that was all in the past and now their lives were theirs, they had to take possession, make the tough choices.... I used the metaphor of the bowl...I even dressed up as the goddess Ostara, flowing gown, flowers, twigs, weeds hanging out of my hair, incense and drums wafting around in the air behind me... I present them with my "sacred" bowl, formed from holy clay dug from an ancient druid spring, and as we passed it around, we had to think about the worth, the value of that bowl, what made it so special.... usually one kid would get it...the worth was that is was empty...and could be filled...and then the next 10 weeks were intense lessons on taking responsibility for their choices, their bodies, their mind and what they chose to put into it...drugs, crap, anger, resentment (justified or not)..or take a good long look at themselves and see where they can do better, make wiser choices.
I learned alot teaching them, I learned alot in the 8 years I was in Alanon... it is imperative to keep the focus on oneself, and to be honest with oneself. After reading all your replies, honestly? To be totally honest with all of you, maybe now is STILL not the time to think about any kind of "close" relationship with anyone. As that empty bowl, I can't fill it right now with another person to make me feel like I am worth something. I have a long way to go. I thought I was ready....I was so devastated by the death of my father after 9/ll I really did crawl into a cave, this house, his house, my old house I grew up in, hoping the walls would feel like his arms around me, the arms that never reached out to me in life, hopefully I would somehow feel in death... silly me. I've made my peace with his untimely death...., have recently lost 30 pounds, started a new job, but just felt this urge to feel real arms again, wanted to think about life again, not death, wanted to get back into life and love again.....but there is still some work to do. I do need to get back to AlAnon and I feel even surer now that he and I shouldn't be thinking of any kind of relationship with each other.... talking to him tonite, there were other things that he hadn't been above-board about...his own involvement with 9/ll, the havoc it wreaked on his life. So, we left it at emailing and maybe occasional phone calls, to keep in touch, see how each of us is doing and it feels good that we both realize this isn't wise for either of us now, that it didn't turn into a personal attack or blame thing or a total mistrust of all people in recovery thing. We are going to be friends. Perfect ending for this big "soap opera". I wanted to personally thank Cultured Pearl for her wisdom and response and apologize if I did come off as lumping all alcoholics into one basket...never my intention...I honor the hard work you have done and the courage you have evinced. And as for those hell bent on boohooing around here.... I think you heard the majority voice quite clearly, so can I paraphrase Andrew Lloyd Weber? Don't Cry for me O-Can-a-dahhhhhh (and you, you sweet ole Brit).... you've just made me so much happier, so much more aware of who I am and my worth and you all keep boo hoo hooing in your derisive little boxes.... as if you matter???? When did you not learn that kindness is a blessing you can bestow on someone who cannot find it for themselves? (Yeah, I felt terrible guilt all these years for abandoning my husband and his pleas for reconciliation, but after the good counsel here, the wonderful emails I really do know now that I did the wisest thing for me, that his refusal to choose a life of sobriety even though he was dry...and that is a tricky term, dry-drunk, which means even though he stopped drinking, his mind is thinking and acting just as drunk as if he was still active...and I was carrying that guilt and laying it on this new person.) I feel so sorry for you..... and I feel so much stronger for not withering under your spit.... and even though people here have made it perfectly clear you certainly aren't in the majority, I know it won't keep you from spewing your swill again....but realize how angry and sad you really do sound. You know so little, infact, practically nothing at all yet you feel so superior and confident you are so right about me? very doubtful...but when you do post again, it will be so nice to visualize you out there, in your vast, unplowed and level fields, barren of possible harvest, the drought of emptiness you exude as you try to spread your dust and lifeless ashes.....as you sow, so shall you reap. good luck to you . As for me, I will be content to listen to those who voices sing and glow and shimmer with grace... you only confirmed that I really would rather create my own darkness than be saved from disaster by your vicious tongue. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 6:32:38 PM | Oh.... I forgot....
Thanks very much to the men for being so open and sharing their thoughts, how great to see so many of you so willing to share your experiences, strength and hope (a little phrase from the Alanon opening !)
And Steve???????? Thanks for the half hour cleanup on my keyboard.... I wasn't expecting it, and had just taken a gulp of soda, and it spewed right out of me!!!! thanks for the best laugh I have had in the last 5 and one half years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 7:57:53 PM | Let's see...the one that was in a band and wouldn't invite me to his shows, but would call me on the way home and want to see me, but wouldn't introduce me to any of his friends. Stayed with him four months.
the one before that who would turn his phone off on weekends and always had some phony excuse, stayed out until very late every night and claimed to be "working", had people calling him at all hours of the night, and he didn't answer the phone, answered phone calls and walked outside to talk. Stayed with him four months.
the one before that who started playing "night golf"...WTF???? yeah, there was a night golf league, but he wasn't in it. I was actually with him four years, and this behavior started sometime during the last year. I think by then, I just didn't really care anymore.
the one before that who had to borrow $900 from me to make his house payment, and now has cirrhosis from drinking too much all these years. I was with this loser for a year and a half.
And people want to know why I don't want to be in a relationship. I'm obviously NOT a very good judge of character. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 8:19:29 PM | | It's so sad, now I understand why it's hard to find someone special. This woman has been diagnosed with cancer and is having a difficult divorce. Most of the posters are attacking her instead of having some compassion. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 8:28:59 PM | | Good luck with your cancer and if in remission it is not the only success you should celebrate. Being single and having peace of mind psychologically and medically should give you such fulfilling happiness. God Bless! Donna | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/11/2007 8:55:32 PM | Oh gosh guys, who read that cancer poem???? I actually penned that after the fourth round, I posted it on that woman's board in case it "spoke" to someone going thru it too.... just got over the fifth round with it last year.... Yep, I'm a tough old coot. I refuse to let it get me.... they don't call us "stubborn" Irish for nothing!!!!!
I actually had my last round of chemo last year...am cancer free for 11 months in 3 days...I go for the one year cat scan at the end of August, so wish me luck. Yeah, there's been many battles to fight, and they all take a bit out of you, but whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger...and I really do feel that staying as positive as I can helps.... I actually had been cancer free for four years until my dad's death, then I think the stress of it all sent me spiraling back into illness...and those mega doses of steroids sure don't help, but I keep going forward because what's the alternative???? I have so much to be grateful for, I have my little house, and my little dog and I have some new friends and I've started to work again, and I got me a gorgeous celery green Trek bike and it rained here in Joisey, the heat has dissipated a bit, and I have now lost 32 (!!) pounds and I think if I just keep smiling and being grateful, the universe will be kind right back at me!!!!!!!!! I'm loving the wonderful people that are showing up here, you guys are so nice. | |
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| How Many RED flags did you ignore before you got wise?
Posted: 7/12/2007 8:04:24 AM | to the OP, Hi Princess..
It takes differant red flags for differant people..
I should have paid attention to the phone calls from women that he said were his "Friends girlfriends". He said that his buddy was fighting with them and he was trying to patch things up for the buddy.. That was about 1988, we finaly divorced in 2005.. So as you can see I did the "girl thing" and waited till I KNEW I couldn't fix it, no matter how hard I tried !!
Don't kick yourself for doing everything you could, when it still didn't work.. It takes two to keep it together !!
As far as keeping sane, learing to let it go, and having the optomism (sp) to go on and find the "right" relationship. That depends on you.. Don't let anyone change YOU or make you feel as though you should just give up !! Remember you're going to kiss allot of frogs along the way, but you will be ok !!
Hugs.. Ems.. | |
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