| | Should alchoholics be given DLA?Page 2 of 5 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5) | | Who are we to judge what drives people to alcoholism? Come to that, what about people who smoke and have heart conditions, lung and various metastisis caused by that primary cancer. What about obesity leading to orthopaedic conditions? Where does it begin and end. Who are we to judge? | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:04:16 PM |
mental illness... depression ??? when can these people claim it ? depression... you cant claim it... mental illness ... you cant claim it.
Sorry but you can claim DLA for mental health problems, it is not exactly what illness or disability you may experience that counts for the benefit, rather it is how that illness or disability impacts on your day-to-day life.
Long term illness includes mental health problems so depression can and does lead to mental health problems. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:16:59 PM |
message 3 wtf is a dry alcoholic? I thought that you were either an alcoholic or a recovering alcoholic, there's no such thing as an ex or dry alcoholic
a common mis-conception, you admit you have a problem with alcohol to your doctor and seek conuselling. the term alcoholic dry/rehabilitated/off the wagon never leaves a person.
if you have no idea, do not comment.
yes i stil have demons with alcohol, i drink now and again. i stil regard myself of having a problem yes. but not to the extent were it is dangerous.
once you admit to being an alcoholic, thats what tag you get for life. no bull no lies thats it..
ive admitted a problem, i am still know as an alcoholic by my doctor and ex employers. on some documents i have to put down im a recovering/dry/rehabilitated alcoholic.
its small minded perceptions, that really do my head in i went through hell at 18. i sought alcohol for comfort. by 22 i was drinking 24/7 at 26 i drink once in a blue moon when im out. whats the problem? | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:20:50 PM | | NO WAY! It's an addiction so the addiction should be treated rather than claiming them to be disabled at the expense of the tax payer and allow them to drink even more booze. It's like smack heads, they get methadone from the doctor. What the hells going on. I say they should stone the dirty sods to death lmao | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:21:19 PM | i think bloody good for you ste for admitting it actually !!! You dont need to defend your views for anyone !!! whether they understand terms or not .... their problem ! You were sooo brave for admitting that on a bloody forum of all places !! GRrrrrrrr to all them that say ehh ?? what you mean ?? lucky them for not not understanding or needing to understand ... i quite agree with with
if you have no idea, do not comment. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:34:43 PM |
NO WAY! It's an addiction so the addiction should be treated rather than claiming them to be disabled at the expense of the tax payer and allow them to drink even more booze. It's like smack heads, they get methadone from the doctor. What the hells going on. I say they should stone the dirty sods to death lmao
That coming from a member that has a can as a main picture, Doctor Good Guy.
Well lets hope smack heads or alcoholics dont have to come to your surgery for fear of being stoned by the good doctor..Infact lets hope you never get a patient as most Doctors are impartial to whoever they treat. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:47:47 PM | DLA is split into two parts...
care and mobility
then it is in three bands
high. middle. low
you are only entitled to a car if you are on the high mobility rate and you have the choice of either a car or your benefit... not both ....
If you are an alcoholic..
you would receive high/middle/low care.. depending on the circumstances...
with mobility you would only receive a low rate (if that)
if you are a regististed alcoholic (which you would have to be to apply for DLA) you are not allowed to drive anyhow.....
As I said before ... high care/low mobility = 315 per month.. this is the highest amount an alcoholic could claim ..... (unless he had liver disease, and that would affect his mobility)
then he could have a carer paid by CA... "wage" (because it pays for your stamp) of the grand sum of £77 per week ...... so the most really he would receive per week (topped up with SS... =£123.34..................................
Yes he/she is getting about £70 more than anyone "just signing on"....
and yes I think the money could be put to better use ...
eg....A fund to go towards rehabilitation of recovering alcoholics.....
As I said in my last post... to find a place in rehab or for counselling there is a 6month waiting list ...................... | |
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44Boz
| | Joined: 6/22/2007
Msg: 33 | |
| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:52:34 PM | Well I'm sorry but anything self inflicted like alcohol and drugs shouldn't be rewarded with DLA [...]
Where is the benchmark for 'self - inflicted'?
A child falls from a tree and becomes quadriplegic. Self - Inflicted?
A Rugby Player/Horseman/Racing Driver is injured and has permanent pain as a result. Self - Inflicted?
A worker takes a short cut in breach of Health and Safety regs and is permanently injured. Self - Inflicted?
I know lots of genuine people who have disabilities, through no fault of their own, and have been turned down for DLA
A fundamental flaw of the benefit is that it is misnamed. Having a disability has little or nothing to do with receiving a payment. Claimants have to demonstrate that they have needs in connection with personal care or that they are unable or virtually unable to walk.
People who do need the help often fail to articulate their needs. Not least because being disabled and 'coping' become a way of life. They forget that they don't carry out their lives 'normally'. e. g When asked 'How far can you walk?' they will answer the question factually but not mention that they are in agony after 10 yards or so.
Also once you qualify for DLA you'll then be able to apply for a mobility car, so these alchys also can get a brand new car to drink drive in.
Only if they get the mobility element awarded for a period of 3 or more years. Not every DLA claimant gets everything associated with the benefit. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 1:52:42 PM | this test will shock alot of people, try it and see
http://www.aa-uk.org.uk/publications/areyou.htm
on that test i still score 7 because of my past...
vvv my alcohol dependantcy was caused through stress and berievemnet. at 18 i went through some crap i doubt anybody would cope with | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 2:01:10 PM | all i know tinny is its pisin hard to claim from being depressed or having mental illness.... if it was so easy ( which your post does imply ) we'd all be doing it !!!
have i wrote 200 words yet ... guess not .... shall i try again... cant be arsed .... 200 words ?? how many is that in paragraphs??? erghhhh this 2/10 rule does my head in... an i still dont get dance off !!! | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 2:22:59 PM |
this test will shock alot of people, try it and see
http://www.aa-uk.org.uk/publications/areyou.htm
on that test i still score 7
Zero here.
Admittedly I'm tea-total for the most part though, which I suppose is sort of cheating  | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 2:29:14 PM | Message 35.
I wish it was that easy to claim DLA, sat at my PC tapping away at the keypad whilst drinking cans of stella, never getting drunk, but having bouts of severe depression whilst reading some of the threads that go on and on about the same thing and when they die someone starts another disguised as something different, that in turn is leading to mental illness.
Should be a health warning, POF can seriously damage your mental health and lead to serious paranoia and alcoholism whilst not improving your love life...   | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 2:42:12 PM | zero.... I very rarely drink .. ... I do not like the taste of the stuff!
People cope in different ways when they have gone through a traumatic time in their life... it does not turn everyone into an alcoholic...you could have a break down , depression, sleep around, get divorced, do drugs, or you may even do nothing... it depends on the person and their addictive nature.... Alcoholics tend to run in familes (its been proven)
I will give you an example.... my mom died.... my brother turned to his "crutch" the demon drink... sister had a nervous breakdown.... my relationship broke down ... due to the fact I had a wake up call, *what im I doing with him?* my dad kept to his routine, familiar things, got him through the 1st year... some went into their shell and cut the family off.... and some turned into party animals .... one even got into fights.....All different ways of "coping"
Some have an addiction to drink... and it is an illness sometimes genetic and sometimes going through some emotional rollercoster..... and "use" drink to block out all the thoughts of that event....(it is not an overnight thing)
This is why it should be pushed that the money used for paying Alcoholics, be used for more places in rehab centres and counselling... instead of "masking" the problem by plying these suffers with more drink........... | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 5:44:21 PM | | I have worked in bars for over 10 years and i have seen alcoholics drink their dla in the space of a day and go back to the social security and get another cheque and drink that. i dont believe that anyone who intentially damages themselves shouldnt be allowed to claim anything. that includes druggies and alcoholics. if someone is intentionally harming themselves to a state that they cannot work then the best thing for them is to send them to a hospital for treatment and not to keep supplying them with the means to keep their habits going strong. if they have no money they will soon have to stop. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/1/2007 11:33:40 PM | i also know of a fair few alcoholics - most of them are just intent on killing themselves slowly and despite all their protestations to the contrary, don't give a toss about anyone but themselves. why should someone whose illness is self imposed be given extra money? should we give more money to drug addicts too? maybe this will stop them from robbing and prostitution....although i very much doubt it.
as far as i know the highest rate of dla is about £180 a week - my brother has severe religious schizophrenia and is in receipt of it - although maybe it varies around the country.
really in two minds about this one - its not fair to hand over a large sum of money to someone who is simply buying drink with it, on the other hand, alcoholism is a disease that needs to be treated - i suppose when the alcoholic gets to the point where they are terminally ill then they should get the payment - i'm glad its not my decision to make, to be quite honest. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/3/2007 1:57:26 PM | Naillmc75 in some cases its essential to supply alcohol to a dependent otherwise they are at risk of heart attack through withdrawal especially if DTs are sufferred, severe withdrawal without medication or alcohol can kill!
Just by stopping money it will not change an individuals behaviour and alcohol will be sought through other means.
Even though individuals are perceived to be damaging themselves, usually mental damage has been done previously before coming dependent on alcohol or drugs and stems from underlying issues.
I have found that not a lot of dependents receive DLA and the majority are on job seekers. And if money being given to dependents is a problem, what about money being given to families with an excessive number of children and have never worked a day in their life, thats as big a problem! | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/3/2007 2:31:00 PM |
Where is the benchmark for 'self - inflicted'?
A child falls from a tree and becomes quadriplegic. Self - Inflicted?
A Rugby Player/Horseman/Racing Driver is injured and has permanent pain as a result. Self - Inflicted?
A worker takes a short cut in breach of Health and Safety regs and is permanently injured. Self - Inflicted?
Sorry for post padding but your post seemed to ring bells and rang true
Who is it for anyone to decide we are entitled to DLA?
Where is the benchmark for 'self - inflicted'?
And whom are the powers that be decide on this benchmark?
Can you define a person that drinks socially & class them in a different league to one who drinks in a binge type of way?
What about those who wake up to a can of Tennants super strength?
Are they worse and in more need of government health for their problem?
1000's of people need the help of DLA for one thing and another.
Don't we have drop in centres for needle exchange?
Don't we have methadone for those who have a 'habit'
I guess we should judge each case on its merits..
If Mrs C can't wash or dress herself cos she is on the sherry then why should she not be entitled to higher rate DLA just like anyone else.
I do NOT agree with the 'up' in the pay out stakes to enable folk to go line the pockets of Bargain Booze but I guess what I am trying to say is that not everyone can drink theirselves into the gutter every night whilst holding down a job..
Some need help with their addiction.
Some can just jog along
Some might get the afore mentioned DLA and p1ss it up the wall while some may actually need this money to live some form of normality with their family..
I am a great believer in the old saying..
"Don't ever call a person til you have walked in their shoes for a day"
And believe me I have many blisters from the ill fitting shoes I have wore along the way..
Just to clarify I do believe that some people although not all are entitled to higher rate mobility because they have NO choice but to face their demons with drink
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-LIL-
| | Joined: 2/3/2007
Msg: 43 | |
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msgib
| | Joined: 4/25/2007
Msg: 44 | |
| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/3/2007 3:33:53 PM | well good arguement.
my late husband was an alcoholic but he didnt claim benefits. he managed to work sometimes. i worked full time and paid for everything. to be honest i also paid for his daily alcohol for quite a few years.
he was off sick for quite a few years with various illnesses. so dla or some help would greatly assisted me.
we separated because of his illness and sadly he died last year with cancer. alcolol related.
so dla could be an asset to families suffering as well. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/3/2007 5:05:35 PM | | alchohol is now cheaper to buy than at any other time the licencing laws are all but done away with and alcohol related medical/mental health problems are at their highest. so why not give food stamps rather than cash or pay certain bills at source rather than let temptation win over vulnerable people. and consider the fact that we all could become alcoholics given the right cirumstance. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/4/2007 3:43:00 AM | Yes I think they should get as much living allowance as the government can afford to give them.
Let them buy as much booze as they can with it and let them kill themselves.
Will save the government money on the liver replacement in the long run.
Is the world gonna miss another sad sack who cant be bothered to help themselves?
Erm..... no. | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/4/2007 5:49:06 PM | I suppose Bona dea that you would side with the chinese authorities who flooded the heroin market in China to do away with customers and some suppliers. Whatever next Invade Poland maybe?
There is a puzzle to all this though.
The drinks industry spend alot of money promoting the idea that drinking is enjoyable the government admit the fact that drinking causes problems atnd that we should drink responsibly.
The government makes a mountain of cash from taxation and local councils also make a fortune from business rates on pubs although the claim is that it is spent on extra policing/ambulances/health care in general.
Yet everyone in the medical and political field accepts that there is an alcohol time bomb with regards to liver disease and other alcohol related illnesses in the future.
I wonder in 20 years time whether they have the drinker on the run as is the case of the modern day Smoker?
As for letting people drink themselves to death Possibly. but we shouldn't sponsor them.
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/5/2007 12:41:04 AM | You cant help someone who wont help themselves at the end of the day.
I knew someone who had £25 a day DLV for his alcohol abuse. And he spent it on alcohol, he lived in the pubs. Was there as soon as they opened.
He's dead now. Good riddance.
1 down...... | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/5/2007 1:08:11 AM | It is a condition like any other... Just because I am not an Alcoholic does not mean I can not relate to their plight... Any addiction being food, drugs, smoking, or the booze creates a personal hell for that individual ... Some want help to beat it, some don't... We should not judge everyone the same "sterotype" I know quite a few Alcoholics that have been dry for more then 5 years and doing really well... some of them have become counsellors for others...
No one can tell another person what to do.. for it is up to them to make the first step on the road of recovery.... As for it draining the NHS... maybe the government should be looking at other ways of saving money ie... getting rid of the majority of pen pushers within the NHS that have no medical knowledge and put more nursing staff back on the wards where it is most needed.... Brushing a national problem under the carpet will not make it go away ...
Education is a good place to start (get them before they turn to drink) There are deeper issues as well ... Someone does not just become an alcoholic over night... It may have different psychological issues attached to it.... When they are pin pointed, then maybe the drink will be "easier" to give up .... No one can paint everyone with the same brush ... If that was the case... We would be taking a step back in time where only the "elite" or the select few would be treated .... the NHS putting a means test in place to see if the patient is "our sort" of person that deserves treatment .... I do not call that caring, I call that discrimination | |
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| Should alchoholics be given DLA?
Posted: 9/5/2007 1:31:17 AM | Storm, I dont know where the hell you get your information from with regards to the NHS... your way off mark.
you say....
" Any addiction being food, drugs, smoking, or the booze creates a personal hell for that individual "
Im sorry but that is complete & utter rubbish - PEOPLE create their own hell.
They are the creation of their own ruin and why the hell should the NHS pick up the bill everytime?
The NHS do not "means test".. the patient must meet a criteria before treatment is carried out.
If you are willing to throw money at an alcoholic who has damaged THEIR OWN stomach lining, heart, liver, nervous system and various other muscles....
then by all means - you volunteer to sit down with the yearly hospital budget and decide whether to spend money on that - or say treatments for people with terminal illness.....
I wouldnt like to do it - and its all very easy for people to slag off the NHS.....
Until they need it. | |
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and I realise now & take onus that she has tainted my opinion. I suppose what I should of mentioned is that although she does have cirrhosis...she's not disabled by it at all! Certainly doesn't fit any of the criteria for either the 'care' component or 'mobility' to recieve DLA ... she lied through her teeth get it. She can afford to drink & gamble loads more since the award...she doesn't want any help. 