aso
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Joined: 7/10/2004
Msg: 51 | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 7/18/2004 8:48:10 AM | This war is soooooooo stupid. Alot of people are dying on both sides. We have much more in the world to worry about. Bush needs stop pressing on with this war. How many more people we need to die before they realize it's senseless? Bush may be a supreme whatever in the Republicans' eyes, but to me, he's nothing more than a coward who is picking up where his daddy left off, only to make it worst.
I really wish this war ends because people are losing moms, dads, sis, bros, and so on and for what?!?!?! For something that could have been already ended. We got Hussein. End the War!!! If you ask me, he's too stupid to catch Bin Laden. How do he expect people to vote for him, when he cost nothing but agony and destructions. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 7/21/2004 7:26:12 PM | In the first place, 911 has already been proven/researched to be a gov job folks, it is a fact, and also part of the new world order. isreal was involved in it as well.
The mainstream news media lies, they do the bidding of our Gov.
To get amy real news you have to go to alternative news source, onthe web and eslewhere.
I was in the Navy for 4 years on a destoyer, I also had security clearances, their is no possible way that the events on 911 happened the way the gov says, for hundreds of various reasons.
Even if you did not have this experience anyone can clearly see after researching what really happened.
Think about it, overnight, and all of a sudden, we have terrorists everywhere......NO......and I dont think so.......
This is also part of the gov's longstanding plan to take away rights of citizens, and to also control them monetarily as well.
Do not think that by voting for Kerry, he will be better than Bush, both work for the same masters, both parties are the same, the rest is their illusion of smoke and mirrors.
I will not go into it all here, I can't beleive people are not paying closer attention.
Don't beleive me, do the serious research yourself over a long time period, you will see and come to exactly the same conclusion.
We have alot of people shooting from the hip, instead of researching facts.
Wait till after the election when they start the draft up, no matter who gets in the draft will start. see HR bills now in defense appropriations commitee, they are just waiting to get past the elections.
Iraq is a farce, their was no WMD, our own Generals already said they were all destroyed in the first gulf war.
What better way to have perpetual war and continouis conquest as well as world population reduction among many other things, than to have "terrorists that do not exist" always threatening you.
They have to get up a lot earlier in the morning on this cat.
Its BS people..............
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 8/18/2004 10:26:58 PM | | at least ,this is limited in scale to a regional war and the administration ha snot allowed major players in like euro the way john kerry plans to do,the japanese naval fleets are based and practicing for a major invasion on the outcome of our election so as japan and south koreas bhudida armies and marines can take over fighting the way it was done in world war two. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 8/19/2004 11:14:18 AM | | IN THIS ELECTION,PROBABLY ONE OF OUR COUNTRY'S MOST SERIOUS ELECTIONS IN A LONG LONG TIME.THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAVE TO PUT THEMSELVES IN THE SHOES OF OUR ELECTED LEADERS AND WHAT THE OATHE OF OFFICE REALLY MEANS? IT DOES TALK ABOUT SOFTSELLING ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING YOU WOULD WANT TO HEAR OR WHAT PLEASES YOU! IT MEANS HEARING AND EXPECTING THE "TOUGH LOVE" AND FACE REALISM WITH THIS WORLD.I KNOW MOST AMERICANS OUT THERE HAVE KNOW IDEA HOW MUCH AMERICA IS REALLY HATED AROUND THE WORLD FOR VARIOUS REASONS BUT AMERICANS HAVE TO FACE THE FACT THAT THIS COUNTRY HAS NEVER EVER BEEN IN A WAR LIKE THIS ONE AND I AM TALKING ABOUT A RELIGIOUS WAR. DOWN THROUGH OUR AGES IN HISTORY IF YOU YOU JUST READ ABOUT WARS SUCH AS AS ISLAMIC VERSUS CHRISTIANS IT IS EASY TO NOTICE THAT ALL CHRISTIANS HAVE BEEN FIGHTING FOR THEIR SURVIVAL FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS.THIS WAR IS NOT A SMALL WAR.IT IS A WAR IN IT THE BEGINNING AND REGARDLESS OF THE ELECTION IT WILL CONTINUE SO GET REAL.AMERICA CANNOT AFFORD TO BE AN ISOLATIONIST POWER AS WE NEED AS MANY COUNTRIES AS POSSIBLE TO HELP.MAYBE THE PLANS AFTER 911 WERE THAT OUR CURRENT ADMINISTRATION WOULD ONLY FIGHT THIS WAR ON A BASIC LEVEL.TO UNDERSTAND THIS MEANING IS SIMPLE.IN THE NAVAL AND ARMY WAR COLLEGE WHERE SENIOR MEMBERS IN THE ARMED FORCES KEEP UP TO A RAZORS EDGE THE WARS ARE IN FOUR CATAGORYS JUST LIKE A HIGH SCHOOL BASKETBALL TOURNAMENT AS WE HAVE A SECTIONALS THEN A REGIONALS THEN A MIDSTATE AND A FINAL.WELL,IF YOU TRY TO REMEMBER NEWS ABOUT ADMINISTRATIONS IN OUR NATIONS PAST IT IS EASY TO DRAW UPON THE LEVELS OF WARFARE AND HOW AMERICA CAME OUT OF EACH IN THE LONGTERM.COMMANDING THIS COUNTRY WITH A BRILLIANT STRATEGY IS NOT EASY WHEN LED BY A BRILLIANT POKER PLAYER AND CABINET WHO IS VERY LOYAL TO ALL OF US. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/23/2004 6:13:55 AM | the dumber you are and less education you have,...the more likely you are to vote for Kerry.
The average Kerry voter is no different from the socialists in Europe......you want the government to pay for this, pay for that.. pay for YOUR healthcare with other peoples money.
I understand why Europeans do it, they are cowards and afraid of Liberty.. Thats why we always have to save their asses everytime a dictator threatens them... they always run with their skirts up, crying to us...
But for an AMERICAN...in the land of LIBERTY...to want others to pay for their healthcare, or retirement....is embarresing......if you dont want the responsibilities of freedom....move to France, Cuba, or China......Hey the will give you free asprin!!!!!!!!!!! | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 60 | |
| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/23/2004 3:53:43 PM | Did anyone think that if iraq kept quwait that they would control a huge amount of oil in the world and cause kaos. besides from what i am told we get most of our oil from vensuala not iraq. i for one am glad saddam is gone. i feel for the iraqi people. and you can not tell me that some... the ones that don't dance in front of the cameras for exposser are not happy... i have seen the reports of this one man named his kid dick chaney. just like viet nam they go for the things that will get exsposser and do it if front of the cameras. the terrioest are trying to play your emotions and use the media. i feel that many are afraid to come out and say i feel were better off. remeber they lived in a hell were if they spoke there mind they would be killed. they don't know what freedom is yet or there boundrys.. funny thing is all you people that are stating your opinion her on this web sight would be DEAD if you were in iraq and spoke against the goverment under this man. just like slavery and any other type of hate they twist the fact to keep people ignorant and blame the others to get people to hate.
other then people dieing ..that was going on anyway. and some of our brave sons and daughters giving there lives. ( i do not take that lightly and my heart goes out to the familys on both sides) there is a chance for freedom for these people. and in every thing i have read it is not a colony but giving them a chance to rule them selfs. you people take freedom for granted because you never lived with out it. are the iraqis alowed to get news from out side the goverment? all you see is the total negitives as the terrorist, media want you to see. freedom comes at a price. what about the positives? humm people can live again and not wounder is sadams hench men are at the door to take them away. do i agree with every thing in this war? no but i see good in it also. death is sad and never easy but dieing knowing your trying to help another is not dieing in shame or defeat. how many can say when there time comes up i died helping another not sitting on my butt looking out for myself...
OK. i exspect lots of nasty remarks my way and tons of !!!!!'s and for people to open up on me now. LOL. but that is what i feel.
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yna6
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Joined: 5/2/2004
Msg: 61 | |
| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/23/2004 5:40:33 PM | jimi....I have to agree with you....sitting on your azz at home in the comforts of "living free" watching those poor buggers over there, and NOT doing anything is the worst form of cowardice. I may not be able to do much now, but I can support the people there, and let them know that YES...we ARE cheering you on! I may not agree with the Bush plans, but it is a lot better than sitting back doing little or nothing...which the US was famous for during the first half of the 20th century. Now they DO something, and a lot of ppl say "I don;t understand why we are there..." Well WAKE UP! You want that crap HERE??? End it all THERE, and maybe you can still go to Walmart without taking the chance of getting your head blown off by some idiot making a political statement with a bomb, which happens all too often over there.
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 62 | |
| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/23/2004 6:14:23 PM | yna6 two things you said hit right on the money.
1. "it is a lot better than sitting back doing little or nothing...which the US was famous for during the first half of the 20th century." that is SOOOO true. iran did that with the hostages and we sat there? as a kid i was like why? there are people. also you don't hear to much from momar kadifie these days?
2. "Well WAKE UP! You want that crap HERE??? End it all THERE" AMEN to that. and it will come here. if we don't.
if anyone thinks that saddam if he had the capibilitys would not try to take us out... look to the curds! the dead children with there mother holding them in the streets that he GASED!
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/24/2004 1:52:21 PM | At the risk of being misunderstood again, I will throw a spanner into this well oiled machine. My aim is to get some of you to see the otherside of the argument. Please I beg you. Dont agree, just see it.
Here is what I believe
1. The US is the world's only super power
2. The US reserves the right to protect itself. Unlike many other countries it has the awesome reach and power to do this.
3. The US had the right to go in after Osama bin Laden, his Alqaeda and the tyranical Taliban regime that housed them.
4. Presdient George Bush was right to pursue and execute that war.
5. President George Bush was rightly suspicious of Iraq's intentions especially since they acted suspiciously by kicking out UN inspectors time and again.
6. GWB was right to threaten the use of force if Saddam and Iraq continued to play monkey games.
7. The UN was right in unanimously passing a 15 to 0 resolution forcing saddam to comply.
8. The weapons inspectors were right to go into Iraq and on failing to find weapons of mass destruction they were right to seek assistance from countries with powerfull and well developed Spy agencies e.g CIA, FBI, MI5, etc
I hope we are all agreed upto this point. Now I know many of youtake issue with the following two points. Lets discuss them rather than hurl insults please.
9. GWB was wrong to break ranks with allies who doubted Intelligence on Iraq's capabilities and program. The current state of the conflict, albeit hindsight, is testimony to my belief.
10. GWB was wrong to invade Iraq before the UN inspectors had been given enough time to prove the existance or not of Saddam's WMD program. Again albeit with hindsight the state of affairs on the ground proves my point.
11. As a result of the Invasion of Iraq some good came to the Iraq people. Dictator saddam was removed and is now in jail awaiting overdue justice and the death sentence. Let me state it clearly, this was a good by product of the war.
12. GWB was wrong to get into Iraq with a plan to win the peace. Again here we can have debates that he could not have foreseen the turn of events. With due respect to you all in here I beg to differ. The voices of governments and other groups and individuals that cautioned against the adventure into Iraq warned about this very scenario. I would like to believe that a super power like the US has overwhelming resources to plan such a mission. Lesser rag tag armies have managed to stabilise countries with populations more fractious than Iraqs. Examples Rwanda, Yemen, Uganda, Nigeria in Liberia, Tanzania in Uganda. This lapse of judgement has led to three catastrophic scenarios.
12.a). Iraq is now unsafe for Iraqis as well
12. b) Iraq is now a breeding ground for the world's most vile terrorists. People so vile and devoid of the slightest ingredient of human decency. Let us say a prayer for the poor Iraqis and the Americans and other nationalities who have been targeted as an excuse by these less than human terrorists.
12.c) GWB diverted resources from the better defined and justified war effort aimed at tracing and eliminating the criminal infidel Osama bin Laden and his Al qaeda.
13. With all this GWB says he would do it again and the same way. Yes he sounds tough and committed but in my opinion he has exhibited poor and very very very costly judgment. I dont need to spell out the blood and treasure the US has expensed.
It is for the last point above (13) that while I give GWB credit for liberating Iraq, I am convinced his stand does not foster world peace and the struggle againt terrorism. Right now he only sounds tough but his actions have actually put the US and all its dependants in harms way. His attitude is only uniting terrorists and dividing the civilised world. I am not a Democrat but Clinton put it well when he said "Wisdom and Strength are not opposing values".
It might feel like weakness but acting to ensure that the civilized world speaks and acts as one against terrorism will actually make the world safer. The world had sympathy when 9/11 occured, but it was mainly America's wrath that was justifiably aroused. And by that horrendous act, Americans were ready to expense blood and treasure to bring terrorism to its knees. You need to realise poor Philipinos were not equally motivated. While we may curse them for heeding to the terrorists threats, let us take time to see the world from their perspective as well. We may disagree but please lets try to seek reasons for why people act in ways we dont agree with.
I hope you will debate the issues raised here in the same light.
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/24/2004 10:03:59 PM | Not related or coordinated with the previous post:
1. Bush never finished in Afghanistan before going into Iraq.
2. Bush lied to the country regarding the reasons for going to war.
3. The 9/11 highjackers were from Saudi Arabia, and the Bush family's connections in Saudi Arabia are the underling reason why we never went there.
4. We should go after those who are an immediate threat to our national security first, then those who are a threat to their own people. Saddam did not have the ability to harm the continental United States at all. Saddam was not even capable of harming the Kurds in the north of his own country, who were only 150 miles from his door step.
5. North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il threatened to "reign fire of the west coast of the united states," and Bush offered to negotiate with him. Saddam Hussien is complying with U.N. inspectors, and even offers to negotiate with Bush and crew in a location of Bush's choosing. Iraq offers no threat no the United States, and Bush goes to war with him. So, negotiate with the nuclear threat making dictator, and go to war with the dictator of the oil rich country's dictator who is willing to negotiate.
6. Answer: North Korea, China, Thailand, Botswana.
Question: Who are countries with more human rights violations than Iraq. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/27/2004 12:51:29 PM | Not related or coordinated with the previous post:
……1. Bush never finished in Afghanistan before going into Iraq.
According to the 911 report “Within about two months of the start of combat operations…….They had killed or captured about a quarter of the enemy’s known leaders. Mohammed Atef, alqaeda’s military commander and a principal figure in the 9/11 plot, had been killed by a U.S. air strike.
……..2. Bush lied to the country regarding the reasons for going to war.
Quote me one lie he said, just one. Honestly there is nothing he lied about. NOTHING>
………3. The 9/11 highjackers were from Saudi Arabia, and the Bush family's connections in Saudi Arabia are the underling reason why we never went there.
What would we do in Saudi Arabia? Who would we attack? HUH any idea? Yes there are terrorists in Saudi Arabia, but the government is not at fault.
…………….4. We should go after those who are an immediate threat to our national security first, then those who are a threat to their own people. Saddam did not have the ability to harm the continental United States at all. Saddam was not even capable of harming the Kurds in the north of his own country, who were only 150 miles from his door step.
Saddam was at war with his own people and yes he was killing the kurds.
…………………..5. North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il threatened to "reign fire of the west coast of the united states," and Bush offered to negotiate with him. Saddam Hussien is complying with U.N. inspectors, and even offers to negotiate with Bush and crew in a location of Bush's choosing. Iraq offers no threat no the United States, and Bush goes to war with him. So, negotiate with the nuclear threat making dictator, and go to war with the dictator of the oil rich country's dictator who is willing to negotiate.
You have no clue what is going on in N Korea. None, zip, ziltch, nada. Do you know why we don’t enter into unilateral negotiations with N. Korea. It is because N. Korea is surrounded by S. Korea, China, Russia, and Japan. Now wouldn’t you consider it an Imperial Act to negotiate without including these countries.
………………..6. Answer: North Korea, China, Thailand, Botswana.
Question: Who are countries with more human rights violations than Iraq
You are absolutely right so why don’t you do something. Maybe stop buying made in china and buy made in America so we can have enough resources to deal with these abuses, NO ONE ELSE EVER WILL. Not the Europeans, Not the UN, no one. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/29/2004 9:12:37 PM | Well, I have read about all you and that other guys statements and you to are very smart and vivid in your beliefs. Im a Republican economics major and current a US Marine. I have done my time in Iraq and going back for a second term shortly. Ask most Marines, I didn'ta say navy, Army, or Air Force...Ask a marine on their views about Iraq and about 99% will tell you that we are doing to right thing over there. What the media says and what really goes on is two different things. You can watch the press conferences and read any report you want, but to walk through the cities over there and have children and men and women run to you crying, kissing your boots, giving you food and water that they can hardly provide for themselves. Its a obvious fact that we are doing the right thing. We are the most powerful country in the world by more than one aspect, that counrty needs help, who are we to sit back and watch them go to waste when we can do something about it. I would serve 100 terms over there if I had to. It has to be done, and we the Marines signed a paper saying were willing to do whatever it taks to do so. Keep it up you two, your probably the most honest, upfront people on here. Love reading your material.
Support your troops, we support you | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/29/2004 10:28:31 PM | thank you for your service. i spent almost 9 years in the army serving in elite and special operations infantry units. had two overseas combat tours and spent 2+ years in LRRS Company. I have talked to many soldiers who came back from iraq or are there now. It is always the same thing, "the media is not showing the truth." It many of my debates with people I say " go talk to the soldiers who served over there, they will tell you the truth." I wish more people would. I also think about all of these people who are against the war in iraq and are protesting. I wonder, where were they while 370,000 men, women, and children were being slaughtered by saddam and this is just the mass graves we have found so far.
I have been thinking about joining back up after the slaughter in russia. The media has done a great injustice to the people of the US and the world. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 12:10:25 AM | Stop the murder in Iraq.
Stop the senseless bloodshed.
Stop the bloodlust of the evil empire in place in D.C. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 1:27:49 PM | | 3rd batt. 4th marines Charlie company here. There will always be bloodshed everywhere in the world. Empires have been created and destroyed by war. It will never change, its a part of human nature. The thing that upsets me about people like yourself ande the other Americans that protest the conflict is that were not over there fighting for Bush, or the republicans, were over there fighting for America in general. You should be greatful that there are people like me who are willing to risk my life to fight for your freedom, so you can sleep at night without worrying about people storming your house and killing your family because you wont agree with their laws and beliefs. You were givin all these freedoms, speech, religion, rigth to bare arms. In Iraq, they are told what they can say, think, believe in, they have no choice. Then you take our freedoms that I am fighting for and use them to bad mouth the country that gives them to you. You do have your own beliefs on the current situation and thats fine, everyone does. Thats what beautiful about this counrty, you can do and say what you want and your not going to be killed for it. Thats what were are fightin for in Iraq, to let the people over there live a civil free life as we do here. You should think about all these things that you have been givin the power to do and not take them for granted. Hundreds of thoushands of men and women have givin their lives so that you can live the way you do today...FREE!!! | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 4:31:27 PM | Blue eye
news flash
We stopped the murdering in Iraq
We stopped the senseless bloodshed
We destroyed a truly evil regime in Iraq.
When you say evil, do you know what it means. I would bet that social kick does, because he has seen what evil actual is. I have seen evil with my own eyes. To those who haven't, it is just a word they use. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 4:33:18 PM | | And sorry Blue Eye but you really loose a lot of points when you state that the leaders in DC are bloodlust. Do you really believe that they are doing this just to kill people, if so why do you think this? | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 5:25:50 PM | I think that oil and geopolitical power means more to them than American and Iraqi lives.
STOP THE MURDER! | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 5:50:42 PM | | Well I know we have stoped the murder of Saddam and his evil regime. And if oil and geopolitical powere was what they wanted they could have purchased oil from saddam at pennies on the dollar, just like france, germany, and russia were doing. They also could have made him thier puppet in the middle east. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 9/30/2004 11:39:58 PM | Like Bin Laden...we made Hussien.
We gave him the implements he used to fight Iran.
HE WAS OUR PUPPET ALL ALONG....AND OUR CREATION.
Take some responsibility for that fact.
It would be a nice switch to hear a Republican say "well...ok fine, we did give Hussien Anthrax and most of the outdated weapons that are being used to kill our troops now....and sure we finnancially backed him as well during the Reagan administration....and the first Gulf War was because Hussien invaded Kuwait with weapons and artillery we provided to him."
Irsshadow- Remember this: We supported Hussien. We funded Hussien. He would not have been able to oppress his people without our finnancial backing and weapons.
Do we really need to explore the other dictators whom we have supported that have committed mass genocide in their little republics? Do we need to count the bodies from all of those oppressive regimes?
The United States should be awake every single night afraid to go to sleep lest it see the nightmarish visions of mass graves that it helped to make real by supporting certain dictatorships and leaders.
But we don't like looking to the past do we? Always looking ahead and beyond those blemishes on a history stained with the blood of the innocent. | |
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| Re: Iraq - What a mess...
Posted: 10/1/2004 7:28:05 AM | simple not true
we have already been over this point more than once. saddam received most of his support from china and russia. US gave him 3% of his total support. Look you said that they are using are weapons against us. You should look on janes and see where an ak-47, rpg, ect are made..... ahhhhhh china, russia, they are not using LAWS, AT-4, M-16, M-60's, which are us weapons.
As far as the rest of the dictators who you said we put in power in the past. THEY WERE ALL PUT INTO POWER DURRING A DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENCY. so you vote for kerry if you want more dictators like Kim Jong Ill to be supported. Did you know that during clinton’s presidency he gave kim jong ill 6 billion in nuclear technology WHICH HE HAS BEEN USING TO MAKE NUCLEAR WEAPONS. thank the democrats for there idiotic foreign policy. | |
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