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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 10:28:53 AM | Please don't make me do this. Even my old nemesis who went on rants and probably got a thread deleted still holds out a glimmer of hope and appears to understand the prize the right man can be if he is found.
I was married to a man, who knew how to share and knew what it took, in order to have a successful relationship & marriage. And, I will accept nothing less from a future mate. Unfortunately, to find another, like him, is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
Finding one is very rare indeed which is why when you do you hold on forever. A symptom of damage is the belief that this will NEVER happen because it is impossible and even if being able to find this is possible it's payback because men owe me soooooo much it can't possibly be paid back in a lifetime. So it can't exist, the damaged womans paradox.
Ok Dr. Fred; why don't you give us ladies of a few examples of how a man can make our lives "better"???
If you have to ask especially at your age I can never explain it to your full satisfaction. I also cannot fully explain the joy of feeling the sun on your face and the wind blowing through your hair. I also can't explain why a baby smiling makes me grin even though five minutes earlier I was wiping the smelliest crap off their asses.
Don't NEED anything but wouldn't it be nice to have everything. To be with someone you value more than yourself. Doing things for this person would not be a chore but a joy. This would be true love and failure to understand or acknowledge the possibility would be another sysmptom of "damage" This would truly be wonderful.....IF it worked BOTH ways. Unfortunately we live in a world where the "entitlement" seems to flow only in one direction.
Symptoms of damage is that past experiances can never be different from any future relationships and the disbelief that any man can do anything positve because it has and always will be in one direction. Men owe me a debt they can never possibly repay.
The direction of that flow is determined by the philosophy "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", so he/she who complains loudest and longest gets the flow. It's a great deal for the chronic complainer; but extremely tiring for the partner who prefers to accept personal responsibility.
Talk about Freudian slips did Grandma boo boo and describe herself.
You feell all men need to be "raised" you worked hard (it was a chore) at it and now men owe you. You believe it is impossible for a man to make your life better only worse. Very typical of a "damaged" male to ADD words which were NOT said.
The need to genderize and strike back is another symptom. When you say you have done something ("raised someone") and never want to do it again I can only conclude that it was not enjoyable. This led me to believe it was a chore. See the logical progression?
By adding the little "mind reading" trick.....which was NOT at all either what I said...NOR was it what I was thinking
I can never truely know what you are thinking but can only react to the words you express but due to the limits here I have to draw some conclusions based on my experiances.
it's proven that life with such perons (who THINK) they know what you think better than you do; IS in fact a very stressful, tedius and exhausting way to live. Having to continually argue with the demons which live in someone else's mind is a never ending, no win situation.
Teenagers think like this and also feel very stressed and the funny thing is when they outgrow this phase and learn the truth they begin to understand how wrong they were. Unfortunatly damaged women do not outgrow or change or even fully understand their damage.
You have however by the Freudian slip stated YOUR own feelings....that "now women OWE" you.
This is the oldest trick in the book. The old "I know what you are but what am I" defense. The only thing a woman 'owes' me is to enjoy her life to the fullest and if I am compatible with her to let me further enhance it.
This is exactly the sort of thing that a lot of women have encountered and personally, I've seen so much of it that one of my first observations about a male is to listen carefully to his complaints about his ex. In this way...I KNOW exactly what "debts" he will expect me to pay. (to right every wrong that was done to him).
Many men live in the here and now. Treat us properly and you have a friend for life. (yes just like a dog who also lives in the here and now even if they were abused previously)
The feeling of having to "raise" a partner is not gender specific, a great many single people (male and female) have had similar feelings. People are not always compatibly matched up in the area of maturity and the more mature partner frequently feels as if they are in essence..."parenting" the other partner. Maturity however tells us that at least 50% of our "misery" was of our own doing.....ie, we chose it. It was NOT "damage", but rather maturity which told me that I have the Worlds Lousiest Taste in Men (probably because I do find the little boy prankishness so damned cute) and therefore it is NOT a good idea for ME to "buy the cow". (marry).
People are never completely matched up in anything. Love blinders make us not see the differences and keep giving without expecting anything in return. You may not have the lousiest taste in men but may leave them with a bad taste. Perhaps your shallowness comes back to haunt you. Its a vicious cycle, the 'old catch 22.
I have yet however to encounter ANY male who accepted similar responsibility by honestly stating that 50% of THEIR misery was THEIR OWN doing by virtue of the lousy mates which THEY themselves selected.
Perhaps they selected damaged women in which case less than 50% was under their control. All hope is not lost for damaged women. We all die eventually and all our problems are over but there's always hope for some:
... WE selected them. I think back and wonder just where the hell my head was at the time. Perhaps that is what makes me leary to do it again? Have I truly learned to correct past mistakes?
The mere question is in part the cure in and of itself. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 11:22:08 AM | | ^^^^^ For exhibiting a level of patience and persistence that I cannot endure--I just am not going to invest that much energy--but for making a case that I would love to be able to... [where's that damned "bow" emoticon?] | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 11:22:13 AM |
If you have to ask especially at your age I can never explain it to your full satisfaction. I also cannot fully explain the joy of feeling the sun on your face and the wind blowing through your hair. I also can't explain why a baby smiling makes me grin even though five minutes earlier I was wiping the smelliest crap off their asses. So, what you're ultimately saying is that you can't think of a single tangible way in which a man can "add" to a woman's life....but you're sure there must be some, as everyone knows that all women who don't want to be married are "damaged".
Men owe me a debt they can never possibly repay. Well, you said that Fred, I did NOT. Indeed, NO man, or woman for that matter owes me a darned thing. 0, zilch, nada. Now, the problem seems to be....convincing THEM that I likewise owe them nothing either!
Talk about Freudian slips did Grandma boo boo and describe herself. Scroll back....>BooBoo is NOT the one who's little brain came up with the "debt" scenario.
The need to genderize and strike back is another symptom. When you say you have done something ("raised someone") and never want to do it again I can only conclude that it was not enjoyable. This led me to believe it was a chore. See the logical progression? ROFL!!!! Who are you fighting??? RE READ....I've never genderized, if fact I have repeatedly stated that women want to remain single for EXACTLY the same reasons that men do; stated he/she repeatedly as I fully recognize that both genders can be irresponsible, immature.....and ARGUMENTATIVE.
The only thing a woman 'owes' me is to enjoy her life to the fullest and if I am compatible with her to let me further enhance it. HOW? In what way? Name ONE thing you can do to 'enhance' her life? LOL! one of your opening statements was to affirm that you don't know....but you're sure there must be SOMETHING. Well, NAME 1 thing! Stop arguing emotionally. We need some empiracle evidence, NOT just that you FEEL there must be something you can do.
Treat us properly and you have a friend for life. Please TRY to be specific. Do you mean properly as in.....let you (used collectively) treat us poorly until the score (with your ex) has been settled?
The feeling of having to "raise" a partner is not gender specific, a great many single people (male and female) have had similar feelings. People are not always compatibly matched up in the area of maturity and the more mature partner frequently feels as if they are in essence..."parenting" the other partner. Maturity however tells us that at least 50% of our "misery" was of our own doing.....ie, we chose it. It was NOT "damage", but rather maturity which told me that I have the Worlds Lousiest Taste in Men (probably because I do find the little boy prankishness so damned cute) and therefore it is NOT a good idea for ME to "buy the cow". (marry). Well, gosh, thank you for quoting me....and once again twisting, misrepresenting what I said by accusing me of "genderizing" when my own words, as you well knew were proof of the contrary, but you just thought if you slipped in enough BS inbetween that your contradiction would be overlooked.
People are never completely matched up in anything. Love blinders make us not see the differences and keep giving without expecting anything in return. You may not have the lousiest taste in men but may leave them with a bad taste. Perhaps your shallowness comes back to haunt you. Its a vicious cycle, the 'old catch 22. One more statement proving that it is impossible for you to accept any personal responsibility for YOUR own actions. Whether you blame another person, or....."Love Blinders".....you're still REFUSING to accept the responsibility for decisions that YOU made. Psssttt???? Who by the way made you put those love blinder on in the first place? Was she holding a gun to your head? You see....you refuse to accept personal responsibility.
Perhaps they selected damaged women in which case less than 50% was under their control. All hope is not lost for damaged women. We all die eventually and all our problems are over but there's always hope for some: LOL! Talk about a catch 22 Fred!!! My, my, my!!!! you certainly are determined to cling to refusal for any accountability in your life. Let's see what you've come up with this time. Ok, The reason men won't admit any responsibility is because they selected damaged women so therefore less than 50% of it was under their control. LOL! well, enlighten us please. How much control do men have in the decisions that they make? 25%, 10%? 5%???
For Moonchild who asked, have I truly learned to correct past mistakes? LOL! I know I haven't hon! LOL! That's why I just have fun until I can't stand em anymore and then say....NEXT!!! | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 11:57:40 AM | We are both off topic and this is not the time or place to continue so let me be the bigger man and say it needs to stop here and I rest my case and let the jury decide, the good people of this forum (bad ones too).
I cannot win any debate with you while I use logic and common sense and you use the damaged womens defense and just contradict whatever I say and just argue.
I repeat for the hard of hearing and hard headed, for the last time, not all women that don't want to get married are damged but it is a symptom. What I said is self evident to any normal healthy adult and those that have waded through the mess are shaking their heads in agreement with me.
Allow me to let you have the last word"
...have I truly learned to correct past mistakes? LOL! I know I haven't hon! LOL! That's why I just have fun until I can't stand em anymore and then say....NEXT!!!
Yes, very amusing and thank you for sharing. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 12:31:24 PM |
I cannot win any debate with you while I use logic and common sense and you use the damaged womens defense and just contradict whatever I say and just argue. LOL! Ok Fred, truce (backs away without turning around).
Did anyone else catch the little game here? The title of the thread is "WHY are women over 40 SO DESPERATE to get married?" The so called "logic and common sense" being used is designed to women in a lose/lose situation. If you defend any pro marriage position, then.....you're labeled "desperate". If you take an anti marriage stand, then you're "damaged". (Not directed at anything Fred said....he just happened to be the one who took the bait)
The OP in this thread tossed out an inflammatory statement designed to relieve himself of responsibility. How many times have we seen a person emphatically state a position, only to do a 180 degree turn around when you AGREE with them!
I saw only 1 or 2 males who caught onto the true purpose of the orignial statement. Some wholeheartedly agreed...yeah, women are desperate, blah, blah, blah. However, the more vehemently the women asserted that they are indeed not desperate to marry, but in fact have NO desire to remarry.....well, then come those with insecurities blazing wanting not only to know WHY NOT....but proclaiming it can't be them....so it MUST be us!
I'm still waiting to hear though about any (1) positive aspect of marriage. Heck, who knows...there might be somthing I missed. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 12:55:34 PM | Hi again grandma Boo Boo. A "damaged woman speaking" 
I come from a completely stable foundation. Well one of emotional stability anyway. I have no geographical roots, but this has not hurt me, it has actually enhanced my life.
You asked for an example of a positive aspect of marriage. I can only think of my parents who have been married since before I was born! They have had problems, who hasn't? But have stayed together through a lot of sickness and an equal amount of health. They are devoted to each other and have separate interests, so don't live in each others pockets.
I don't know the magic ingredient that has enabled this to happen, but if actions speak louder that words there must be something positive.
We are meant to follow in out parents footsteps, but this has not happened for me. Because I am confident through my parents love for me, I have been able to navigate life independently. I have had some good relationships and an extremely bad one. But because of my inherent belief in life's goodness and diversity, I am able to bounce back quite quickly.
So OP I am certainly not desperate! Hopeful? Possibly!
This way of communication tends to make me ramble a little, so apologies if it is a tad difficult to read. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/18/2008 9:58:15 PM | Hypno: I love hearing about people who have celebrated the quickly disappearing "Golden Wedding Anniversary", and yes...it does offer "hope". I love tellling the story of my grandparents who knew each other 6 days when they got married....but it only lasted for 70 years!!!! LOL! My Grandma was a wild woman....she was engaged to another man when she went to W. Va where my G-Grandpa was preaching at a 2 week camp revival meeting...met my grandfather....married him 6 days later...and of course mailed back the engagement ring to her Dear John in Columbus Ohio!!!! LOL You Go Granny!!!!
I have also witnessed examples of some other very long and stable marriages....some happy....some NOT so happy, but all deserving a big round of applause for endurance.
The question I asked in regard to a "positive aspect" of marriage however STILL goes unanswsered. The title of the thread is about WOMEN OVER 40....and their desperation to marry. We have 17 pages of answers where in spite of the fact that the women have sited some definitive reasons for NOT wishing to marry, men still insist that we really don't mean that; of course we want to get married....because we're all loosing our looks and are terrified of being alone. If we say otherwise...then we're being labeled as "damaged".....in spite of the FACT that not one single male has been able to give us 1 single example of a GOOD reason why we should want to marry. (Keep in mind that we're addressing the OVER 40 age group of women, so legitimacy of offspring is highly unlikely to filter into the discussion)
As the thread started out with the intention of painting women over the age of 40 as desperate, when that backfired, we now have those who cannot even supply a good reason why we're even want to consider marriage, much less be desperate for it.
For the absolute life of me......I truly cannot think of a single advantage in being married; while I can think of MANY disadvantages...ie, loosing my freedom to come and go as I please, having to pay his bills, having to do what he wants to do when he wants to do it, having to cook dinner at x time every day...whether or not I'm even hungry, twice the laundry, having to play secretary for him, more "relatives" wanting inconvenient favors, being forced to watch sports on TV constantly when I want to watch History Channel....and....being banished to sleep on the couch because his snoring keeps me awake. (Weekends....ok, fine...I can catch up on my sleep during the week).
We have to face the facts, as we get older....we simply have less energy. My choice to remain single is based on the desire to thoroughly enjoy the time between being newly retired.....and ready for the rocking chair. When someone is "over 40"....and definitely by the time they're "over 50"....we should be looking toward reducing our work load....not increasing it. In that vein, marriage.....for women...is nothing more than.....more work. I don't care if you walk past a man 6 times carrying in groceries....he is NOT going to get off the couch and help you. If he hears you start up the lawn mower...he might stick his head out the door and yell "Hey....I was going to do that......next week", but he's not going to run out fight with you over his masculine right to mow the grass....nor will he grab the snow shovel from your sweet soft little hand....unless HE'S the one who needs to get out of the drive. These are the examples that I was looking for. NOT one single man here has been willing to to NAME ONE! NOT ONE thing will they specifically commit to.......to "enhance our lives"....yet they maintain...that sitting on the couch somehow "enhances" our lives.....because....WOW.....we must not have lost our looks....we have couch jewlery!!!! I'm just NOT a jewelry kinda gal. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 5:08:31 AM |
The "positive aspect" of marriage however STILL goes unanswered. The title of the thread is about WOMEN OVER 40...and their desparation to marry. We have 17 pages of answers where in spite of the fact that the women have sited some definitive reasons for NOT wishing to marry, men still insist that we really don't mean that; of course we want to get married...because we are losing our looks and are terrified of being alone. If we say otherwise...then we are labeled as " damaged"...in spite of the FACT that not one single male has been able to give us 1 single example of a GOOD reason why we should want to marry.
Another damaged woman here.  who's not looking to become some man's, 21st century CINDYrella. I too, don't wish to increase my work-load by becoming a man's scullery maid. It's certainly one of the reasons that the prospect of marriage is not attractive to me.
NOT one single man here has been willing to NAME ONE! NOT ONE thing will they specifically commit to.......to " enhance our lives"....
When one single man, from the entire POF population, is not willing to answer this question, it makes me wonder too ? | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 6:16:33 AM | I would not like to get married again.. Not because i am against marriage but you get a bit mean with your own space...even over 30 people become more not set in your ways, yes sort of set in your ways a bit... see what i mean im a non starter soz for confusing what must be a very interesting topic. I will have a little read.. might hear from me later.....bye for now. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 6:49:25 AM | Ladies, while I agree that SOME men feel it’s their God given right to park their azz on the couch and watch sports and drink beer while their woman scurries around doing all the household chores and cooking and whatnot, not ALL men are like that. I know this because I live with one who isn’t. If I’m up and about doing something around the house, so is he. EVERY time. And he often does things that solely benefit me and not just the general running of our household. Like this past weekend when he cleaned MY car while I was doing MY ironing. His philosophy is that the sooner the chores get done, the more time he and I have to spend with each other doing things that we both enjoy.
These behaviors and attitudes have never been demanded or negotiated, it’s just the way he is. And I also know that he’s not the only man in the world who thinks like this.
Marriage or cohabitating is supposed to be a partnership that two people enter into because, not only do they love each other, they really LIKE each other and they enjoy spending time together, doing things together, sharing their lives together and planning their futures together. There are still enlightened men AND women out there who sincerely believe this and behave accordingly.
We think that’s a very positive aspect and pretty good REASON to marry, legally and traditionally or otherwise.
LH and HH
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 8:06:52 AM | Aren't you the lucky gurl!!! I also was married to a man who shared in the household chores so that we would have more time to enjoy having time with each other. Unfortunately, what I have experienced recently, are single men, of my generation, who want a woman to look after his needs, scullery and otherwise, without the benefit of a commitment to "being a team".
I agree that marriage or cohabitating is supposed to be a partnership. Unfortunately,from my own personal experience, they're lookin' for a Mama to take care of them. And, I'm not interested in a Master/Slave relationship. Therefore, I'm not desparate to change my work load! | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 8:30:59 AM |
Unfortunately,from my own personal experience, they're lookin' for a Mama to take care of them. And, I'm not interested in a Master/Slave relationship.
A Mama-son relationship equates to a Master-Slave relationship? Freudian slip? And just think: the son committed patricide just to have his momma as his mistress...I'm proud of y'all, reading and understanding the theories of my hero, Siggy Freud. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 9:11:57 AM | LH: you're quite fortunate to have found one in 10 million who does think that way. If you read the prevailing attitudes in the forum however, you will notice that about 95% of men believe that the work women do is NOT ..."real work". Judging from my own experiences, I can only imagine what resistance most women run into when attempting to get a male partner to help out. My background is....20+ years in construction trades, an extremely physically demanding job, one at which I earned approximately double what my husband earned. I've heard many men comment that well, yeah...their wives do "work"...but it's not "hard" work.....like THEY do. Or something like (as is very prevalent on POF) that their wives worked...but didn't earn as much as they do...so they discount the value of that contribution as petty...and therefore their women SHOULD make up the difference by also doing ALL the work at home as well.
I have often stated (in a joking way, but I'm VERY serious) that men should take their damned flowers and shove em where the sun don't shine...if he REALLY cared about ME...he'd offer to take my car and get the oil changed......now THAT would be a truly romantic gesture! But I have yet to find ONE. AND.....ya know.....we're still waiting for that ONE single man to speak up and tell us ladies what he thinks makes him such a catch! | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 11:31:55 AM | ROFLMBO!!! Phoebe48!!!!! My dear....don't you know by now that when a man makes a mistake he's simply misunderstood, but when a woman is misinterpreted that it's always a sign of deep psychological damage?
(I totally understood that the comment being criticized was 2 separate sentences and reflected 2 different, although complimentary sentiments......as I'm sure your critic did as well...but then...what would there be to cry about if refraining from deliberate misinterpretation were banned?) | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 12:30:12 PM |
For the absolute life of me......I truly cannot think of a single advantage in being married; while I can think of MANY disadvantages...ie, loosing my freedom to come and go as I please, having to pay his bills, having to do what he wants to do when he wants to do it, having to cook dinner at x time every day...whether or not I'm even hungry, twice the laundry, having to play secretary for him, more "relatives" wanting inconvenient favors, being forced to watch sports on TV constantly when I want to watch History Channel
Every single woman I know, feels exactly the same way. I like my freedom. I would rather do things I like to do instead of worrying about how clean my house is. I like the peace and quiet. I can't stand having a tv on all the time and having other people in and out of my house. (My first husband's brother practically lived with us and my second husband always had his friends over "working" on stuff and drinking.) I don't want to cook since I can't eat without gaining weight. Since I don't want to do the things a husband would expect me to do like cook and clean all the time, it's doubtful most men would be too happy with me, and if I did like I did before and tried my best to be the good little wifey, then I probably wouldn't be happy. Neither of my husbands wanted a divorce. My first husband said he was happy and he couldn't understand why I wasnt. My second husband wasn't any happier than I was but he got extremely upset when I left and was very vindictive afterwards and made sure I had nothing. I lost everything. Why would I put myself through that again? I would love to find a man to do things with on weekends, but I can't really see how marriage would benefit either of us except for the financial benefits of sharing one house and the availability of sex whenever we want it. Maybe if I met a guy like Lola's I might at least consider it but really, most women based on all their previous experiences with men, consider marriage to be too much added work without much in return. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 1:11:24 PM | To tell the truth! Most men in their 40's and 50's chase the 30 and 20 year olds--so that knocks out more than half of the men in that age range for us 40ish females to date. It's like fishing in an empty pond---however those of us that have had bad marriages are not in a hurry for all that pain to return--we are however in our sexual prime--hotter than teenagers!!! Maybe you are mistaking that for the pushing of marriage--after all most of us have been with the same man for 20 years or more and that may have been the only man we had been with at all. This answer is more true than the others shown here! | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 1:18:55 PM |
I know I can't paint all women with this brush, but my experiences in the last year have really surprised me. Out of the 4 women I have dated, I had to break things off after a short period (2 mos and 4 mos) because 2 of them assumed we were next at the marriage altar. This was without hints, discussions, or talking about this subject. The other two relationships faded due to no chemistry, etc.
Well Mr. OP,
I hope you will look at some of these recient postings and figure out there are some women that hated their marriages enough to realize they will probably never be married again.
They don't want to cook for you, do your laundry and have sex when you want.
They are not desperate at all to get married, more desperate to convince each other men suck.
Somehow they think all their bashing of men will get them the one guy that is 'worth it' and scare all the others away but it's too bad for them Lola got him
Lola dear, I suggest you get a body guard as you are in peril of being run over by all these women that are jealous so he becomes available again. | |
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| Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?
Posted: 3/19/2008 1:59:00 PM | "Why are women over 40 so desperate to get married?"
I have yet to meet a woman over 40 that is desperate to get married. Maybe they were desperate before meeting me. Oh damn, maybe its just that after meeting me they lose all interest in marriage. Could it possibly be that I have single handedly cause women over 40 to find the idea of marriage so revolting? I have to go now, I'm starting to develop a complex about this.  | |
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