| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/30/2008 10:07:04 AM | IMO
Chivalry is a man using his power for good. It is an act of using his physical strenth for being nice, useful, protecting...etc. Nice people are nice, just to be nice , for their own sence of worth- not to gain by it from others. People don't nessarily donate: money; time; kidneys; blood...etc, for some sort of reward, they realize they gain more for themselves as the donor. And if they are seeking recognition, you can ususally tell.
A man who chooses to stand on the bus because he is strong and fit, and would not want to be seen as otherwise. It is part of his personal code of honour. If he gives his seat to a pregnant or elderly woman, he's doing so because he's proud to be fit and strong and able to, NOT to get a date.
Yes, women can open doors, we do it every day, and many women open them for others, regardless of their gender or ability, because it is the right thing to do. Their own code of honour would make them feel like sh!it if they didn't.
Men are stronger. If ours became a society of survival of the fittest, all the men would have seats on the bus, they would always be first in line, it would not be safe for woment to go out alone...etc. We all have to live with some sort of honour and sense of fair play, to maintain a civilized society.
Chivalry is not about inequality. We all have equal value, but we are not the SAME.
Vive le difference!
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/30/2008 10:39:01 AM |
now let chivalry die and stop trying to resurrect it for your own benefit and gain
That's what I'm saying: let it die.
I was never raised to expect special treatment from men. I don't notice when they don't give it to me, and am frankly suspicious when they do. I've been on the receiving end of too many "nice guys" to think for a second that anyone who goes out of his way to do something for me is just doing it for a smile and a thank-you. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/30/2008 8:27:07 PM | For me I feel that i am a chivlarous individual to most people, but I will not wast it on ingrates. I use the golden rule and give 3 strikes.
Furthermore, I like a woman to be chivalrous to me. It is about E...QUALITY. Emphases on the QUALITY> | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/30/2008 8:38:29 PM | I like to be chivalrous. It gives me an opportunity to show a woman how much better than her I am.
On the basis that any time I say something that I think is obviously ironic I get flamed for it, I'll post an ACTUAL opinion.
I think it's possible to be chivalric and polite without being demeaning. Treating the woman you're with respectfully and with (even slightly excessive) consideration is surely a good thing. You are, after all, trying to make the point that you favour her in some way. Isn't that just a matter of being NICE to her? Some aspects of "chivalry" I consider basic politeness. I hold the door for a range of people. Male or female, old or young. On a date I'd be ready and willing to pay, but also completely accepting if the lady wanted to go halves.
There are aspects of our society (particularly in dating) that are still very biased in terms of gender politics. In particular, the concept that men have to ask the woman out, the concept that men want sex and women decide whether to give it to them, the concept that women are sluts if they have sex... there are a lot of things that we should try to change about dating politics. I don't think "trying to be polite" is one of them. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 7:14:14 AM |
I was never raised to expect special treatment from men. I don't notice when they don't give it to me, and am frankly suspicious when they do. I've been on the receiving end of too many "nice guys" to think for a second that anyone who goes out of his way to do something for me is just doing it for a smile and a thank-you.
Years ago, I came to the conclusion that there's no such thing as a completely altruistic act: EVERYONE has a motive, and a hope for gain, for what they do. Your mistake, IMHANHO, is thinking that EVERY man displays kindness ONLY because he wants to have some lady curl his toes. I'm sorry that your experience has bred such cynicism in you, but sometimes a guy will hold a door for someone, or smile and say, "Good day!" because it makes him feel good to do so. That's selfish, right?
I love people, and I like to make them feel good because it makes ME feel good. Again, that's selfish, right? I'm looking to get something out of the transaction, after all. Has nothing to do, in my case, with hoping to get laid.
Arlo | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 7:22:28 AM |
I love people, and I like to make them feel good because it makes ME feel good. Again, that's selfish, right? I'm looking to get something out of the transaction, after all. Has nothing to do, in my case, with hoping to get laid.
The bluntness of this statement. And in many ways so true. You make someone smile, guess what, they make you smile. Good deeds are indeed contagious and before you know it you infect one and another person until it comes back to you and fills you again with joy. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 8:21:28 AM | OPer:
I posted this before. It's fairly interesting. It's from a website: Chivalry Today.
The Seven Knightly Virtues: by Scott Farrell
Essential elements of today’s code of chivalry
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There was no such thing as a “uniform” code of chivalry in the Middle Ages. Many people — from successful knights to contemplative philosophers — compiled lists of virtuous qualities, called the “knightly virtues,” which they felt defined chivalry. No two were exactly the same.
There were, however, several common themes found in these lists of knightly virtues. By combining these, we have created what we consider to be the seven knightly virtues of the modern code of chivalry:
Courage
More than bravado or bluster, today’s knight in shining armor must have the courage of the heart necessary to undertake tasks which are difficult, tedious or unglamorous, and to graciously accept the sacrifices involved.
Justice
A knight in shining armor holds him- or herself to the highest standard of behavior, and knows that “fudging” on the little rules weakens the fabric of society for everyone.
Mercy
Words and attitudes can be painful weapons in the modern world, which is why a knight in shining armor exercises mercy in his or her dealings with others, creating a sense of peace and community, rather than engendering hostility and antagonism.
Generosity
Sharing what’s valuable in life means not just giving away material goods, but also time, attention, wisdom and energy — the things that create a strong, rich and diverse community.
Faith
In the code of chivalry, “faith” means trust and integrity, and a knight in shining armor is always faithful to his or her promises, no matter how big or small they may be.
Nobility
Although this word is sometimes confused with “entitlement” or “snobbishness,” in the code of chivalry it conveys the importance of upholding one’s convictions at all times, especially when no one else is watching.
Hope
More than just a safety net in times of tragedy, hope is present every day in a modern knight’s positive outlook and cheerful demeanor — the shining armor that shields him or her, and inspires people all around.
Each of these concepts is important in itself, and every one of these virtues is an admirable quality, but when all of them blend together in one person, we discover the value, and power, of chivalry today. Modern-day knights should strive to keep these virtues alive in their own hearts, but, perhaps more importantly, they should work to bring these wonderful qualities out in the people they see every day — at home, in the office, at school or on the street corner. A person who lives by the code of chivalry in today’s world allows everyone to see their best qualities reflected in his or her shining armor. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 9:19:40 AM | Blue Knight 1,
Fantastic post!
These 7 virtues are applicable to women, as well. These qualities are beneficial to the community as a whole, not just one gender.
I have the honour of knowing people of such character - chilvary is not dead. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 9:28:21 AM | To further the cause of accuracy and honesty, here's yet another set of definitions based on the tenor of the times:
http://www.baronage.co.uk/chivalry/chival1a.html
V/R
Sir Herr Schadenfreudian von Deluzional-Psychosis | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 10:00:27 AM | Faith, charity, justice, sagacity, prudence, temperance, resolution, truth, liberality, diligence, hope and valour.
I was in agreement, virtues are virtues, regardless of gender, and beneficial to all. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 10:13:22 AM | Opening doors was just a minor point. My original profile showed all of your 7 points and I was cursed with "You are to good of a guy."
I had also noticed that I has been selected as an easy target for someone to use as a way to make themselves feel better.
Even as a young lad I was known to be a defender of the meek, and If I had a thank you or any acknowledgment anytime I protected a young womans virtue, I would not be so down trodden about it.
I still stand up for what is right and I still come to the aid of people all the time even if I have never met them, it is who I am and who I will likely always be.
I guess I would rather have someone look through me as if I am not there, then act as if I owed my services to them. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 1:46:23 PM | That's funny, you should post it in Urban dictionary. 
Now you're practicing gallantry.
Which is probably a closer discription than chivalry for the behaviour in the OP, and this thread of 'door holding'.
Ahem: Gallantry is adventurous courage, which courts danger with a high and cheerful spirit. Polite and attentive to women.
Hold the door for a gal who doesn't want you to? -- now you're really courting danger!
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 1/31/2008 2:44:57 PM | | Hi .Well I guess it's what you want.Do you want to be treated this way. If you like it ,and sounds like you do .Make it known.To be truthful with you he should.It's just good ethic morals. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 2/1/2008 1:39:31 PM | | Chivalry should be an expression of romance, but should be at a comfort level acceptable to both. I tend to open my car door to let a woman in when leaving for a night out, but she usually lets herself out. If we had just been hiking in the park, she might let herself in as well. Formalities are nice on occasion, but they can be overdone. They should be intuitively natural for the situation. | |
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| I need a male opinion on chivalry...
Posted: 2/2/2008 5:58:39 AM | "Chivalry" should not be confused with "common courtesy". Opening doors, giving up your seat on the bus, nodding and saying "Good day!" to strangers, or responding to such with a smile and a nod; these are all examples of "common courtesy", not "chivalry". "Chivalry" would be slaying Ralph from Accounting around the water-cooler because he told an off-colour joke, and offended a lady, thus endangering her virtue! Come on, people!
Arlo (who hardly EVER slays accountants!) | |
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