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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 2:38:34 PM | I have concluded that the people and/or groups that protest the loudest and most vehemently usually are the same ones that harbor the traits that they are protesting!! Sen. Larry Craig of Idaho is a prime example!! People who do this are trying to deflect attention away from themselves. It's the same for "Right-To-Life" groups. Many are men who never have been a candidate for abortion. However, I wonder how many of them are responsible for impregnating a female who had an abortion? I ask "Have these "Right-To-Life" males had a vasectomy?"
Getting back on topic, whenever I see these anti-gay hate groups carrying signs like "God Hates Gays". How in the world do they have the audacity to link God with hate? The God that I carry in my heart and soul may hate our ACTIONS BUT NEVER OURSELVES.
GOD IS LOVE!!!
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:07:32 PM |
Woman dies while in airport custody(dont mention that this was a white wome,)
Yet another black man dies in police custody( mentions that this was a black man)
Well I am retired from an environment that was 99% white. Many times when people that I have spoken to over the telepohone came to see / find me in person the receptionist would describe me as the "black lady" who is sitting at such a such place. This is because the majority of the other co-workers were white!! They were never described as "the white man or white lady" they were described by hair color or as thin or heavy or tall or short!!
Could this be why the media does not have to distinguish White people as White because it is ASSUMED , for Whites are the majority population and to use the term "white" would be redundant? On the other hand, minorities are described as Black, Latino, Asian etc. to distinguish them from the majority population.
I liken these terms to LADY DOCTOR OR MALE NURSE. Most people ASSUME that doctors are men and nurses are women because the majority are!!. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 6:34:16 PM | | Blady, I was just thinking of you post#53. Black people and white people desciminate against each other, and against gays/lesbians. Gays are up set about being desciminated against, yet a black gay will desciminate against a white person for being white and a white gay person will desriminate against a black person for being black.Eveyone starts protesting about being desciminatined against, but yet we all desciminate against another groups as well.Look at this example. A white/black lesbian complains about not geting a promotion because of her sexuality. She complains saying she is as good as a streight person and everyone should be treated as equals. The next day, this his white/black lesbian women refuses to hire another women because she is black/white. All these women have complained about their civil rights being violated but they all have violated someone else's. Now lets throw in men vs womem, americans vs immigrants, Christianity vs muslim,Rich vs. poor. Old vs young, and the discriminations go on. I have enough common sense to believe that every person in this country falls into one of these categories to some degree. I am not saying everyone hates but we all have our prejudices.As far as you being called the black lady, I am guilty of this and I have also been referred to as the white lady. Today, I was refered to as the white bi-ch who always does what the 'N' lovers tell her to do. But I work in a mental hospital and I was only trying to do treatment ordered by the doctor. I refer to people as black/white when I am pointing out a certain person. On my previous post about the people dieing in police custody, why cant the both say man/women dies in custody or white women/black man die in custody. With the gay headlines, why did it not just say'Man beaten after leaving a bar or straight boy murdered by 2 gay men. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 7:08:14 PM | Friendlylass:
Have you stopped to consider why eating bottom feeders isn't recommended by God? Or why he dosn't like homosexuality? he gives us guidelines to abide by & we break them, then wonder why we are sick in mind or body. Guidelines from God? According to which divinely inspired text exactly... ????
Everyone, lets get something straight, God is LOVE, he dosn't hate anyone. Totally concur here... yet neither of us has proof ;)
God hates sin, not the sinner & we should do likewise You sound pretty sure of what God hates and wants.... based, I assume... on words written by men just as infallible as you are..
Sin, incidently is something that hurts us or others. Is it?? There are MANY definitions and interpretations of the word... one of the oldest being "to miss the mark"... a conecpt from archery...
Think about it, with the brain you have been blessed with. Right respectful that was.. is that how your preacher talks to you?
A gay pastor is a disgrace, they are supposed to be a representative of God. Hmmm... interesting... to some spiritual people gays and bisexuals are actually seen as being closer to God and spirit since they are naturally male/female and do not pander to the usual duality..
Not that I am either... I simply cannot stand prejudism in any form.
to pretend that a Gay pastor is ok is just openly going against His Word HIS word? Again... there are MANY books claiming to be divinely inspired... which then is HIS word?
Fighthing & hatred is not from God, if we could love each other dispite our differences or our sins then this world would be a better place. I TOTALLY agree... unfortunately, many of your previous words do not match the sentiment ;)
Charlesedm msg 48.... Couldn't have said it better myself... amazingly... we agree! Lol...
My instructor once told me that general motors and religion have more in common than many would like to believe... I am sure the church will find a way to pay....
But at the same time, it will set a precedent and that gives me a really warm feeling inside :) | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 8:39:24 PM | Shame them into hiding their eyes, and occasionally killing them for their eye colour.
Ok, let me rephrase my statement--- Having a gay pride parade is just as illogical as having a straight parade, even though white straight people are discriminated against.(believe it or not, alot of us feel we are discriminated against.) I am white, I am straight, this makes me proud. This statement also labels me a bigot and a racist. I am proud to be a women, but saying this does not label me a man hater.I am proud to be a nurse, but this does not label me to hate people of other careers. I am proud to be 43 years old, but this does not label me to not like old people or babies. Minorities only tries to make it shameful to be proud of being white and straight. If you dont believe me, start a thread telling of your pride of being straight and white. Give reason why you are proud of who you are. See what kind of names you get called. I dare you to do it. I bet you won't do it because you know I am right.
sassyaquarius-- I dare you to do the same thing, or one of you start it and the other post claiming your pride with your race and sexuality. I will be very shocked if you do it. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 8:49:40 PM |
I dare you to do it. I bet you won't do it because you know I am right. ^^ And being right is the goal?
Hmmm..... in the process I think you may have missed his point...
When a group has been persecuted for MANY MANY years and then FINALLY they are protected by some laws.... they tend to feel vindicated and want to celebrate the fact that they CAN stand in a street and announce to the world that they are gay without fear of reprisal...
How about the women's liberation movement? Did they get loud and celebrate? And did SOME people take offense to that? Yup... sure did...
But they also did a lot of good toward equality, no?
So whose rights are more sacred? Gay rights? Or the rights of the church to speak out against it? In this case it was decided by the courts and I would concur :)
Edit:
sassyaquarius-- I dare you to do the same thing, or one of you start it and the other post claiming your pride with your race and sexuality. I will be very shocked if you do it. You dare me? Oh my, lol.... why would I do that? To prove your point for you? I am not proud that I am white, I am not proud of those things that you mentioned.. I am proud of who I AM.... I seriously doubt anyone would take offense to that....
Unfortunately that is NOT the case for many gay people... hence the parades ;) | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 9:31:47 PM | People are entitled to be just who they are as long as it does not infringe on another personal rights, does not hurt or harm another and does not break the law.
I may not agree with another persons choices, but I don't have a right to get in their face and put them down with my freedom of speech rights. On the other hand, just because I don't agree with another personals life style, does not give them the right to rub it in my face.
Be who you want, do what you want, go where you want......just keep it to yourself and respect my rights also. When people feel the need to draw attention to themselves and their lifestyle, that may differ from mine, they fail to respect my rights not to have to observe it.
You don't see me going around parading, wearing shirts or carrying signs that proclama my pride in being white/female/heterosexual......and rubbing it in anyone's face and I see no need for others to feel they have to do that to me or others to gain attention. They have their rights to .....just live life and enjoy it and STFU.
I'm just tired of people feeling the need to shove their rights in my face and forgetting that I have rights also. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/3/2007 9:46:19 PM | [I am white, I am straight, this makes me proud. This statement also labels me a bigot and a racist.]
And I'm proud to be a member of the human race. I don't feel the need to fear hate or label others. People are people. Get to know them before you decide to lable & fear them. Try seeing the planet as a whole. Try seeing the human race as all God's family. Try not seeing yourself as a victim. No one is trying to persecute you. We all just want acceptance. All of us.
p.s. If you are uncomfortable with gay clergy, definitely stay out of the Catholic church!! LOL... | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 1:52:23 AM | sassyaquarius------- I knew you would come up with an excuse, just as I know Charlesedm will come up with one.
Muppetkiss, Are you implying that because of my statement, I fear or hate others, that I have not got to know others, that I dont see us as all Gods children. Sounds like your labeling me a bigot or racist because of my statement. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 6:59:30 AM |
sassyaquarius------- I knew you would come up with an excuse, just as I know Charlesedm will come up with one. Those are quite the psychic skills you got there, lol...
So because I am not proud of the same things you are... that means I am making up excuses? Please, lol...
start a thread telling of your pride of being straight and white. I am NOT proud of those things, they are simply a part of who I am... why single out fragments or facets... ? I am a whole person ;)
I haven't had to face bigotry from others associated with my sexuality... but I HAVE faced it in other areas...
Until you have, I really don't think one can possibly know what it feels like..
Regardless, the church has to pay and I am glad | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 7:17:32 AM |
Be who you want, do what you want, go where you want......just keep it to yourself and respect my rights also. When people feel the need to draw attention to themselves and their lifestyle, that may differ from mine, they fail to respect my rights not to have to observe it.
You don't see me going around parading, wearing shirts or carrying signs that proclama my pride in being white/female/heterosexual......and rubbing it in anyone's face and I see no need for others to feel they have to do that to me or others to gain attention. They have their rights to .....just live life and enjoy it and STFU.
I'm just tired of people feeling the need to shove their rights in my face and forgetting that I have rights also.
...in a nutshell.
Bang each other silly any whichever fekking they want.
Leave the Children and Animals out of it.
..Cuz then I want their heads on a platter. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 8:04:36 AM | You feel descriminated against ----I do not. I dont care if they have one. I am only saying if they can have a parade displaying pride, a streight person, or blued eyed person can can show their pride. There is nothing wrong with being proud of who you are, no matter what lifestyle you leave. Everyone has something good to offer the other.If their rights are violated, they should protest. But, as church is an organization that is to preech against sin and show people the right way.This church felt being gay is the not the right way of life. My personal opinion of this church does not matter. I believe they are a bunch of brainwashed people led by the pastor. Did you know they are not allowed to marry outside the church which makes me feel they may be inbreeders. But who am I to judge them.
somehow means it's ok to beat him to death is fu*king deplorable.-- I absolutly do not believe in violence. No way. No way, no one deserves to get beaten because of there beliefes.And I have not said that. You are attempting to twist what I have said.
As for why white/straight pride parades are treated with such disgust? Maybe because people know damn well they're made up of KKK members, Neo Nazi losers, confederate flag waving inbreds, and closet bigots.-- This is not true, this is your bigoted thinking.This is only how white straight people are rumered to be. Saying that is like saying most gay men will rape little boys. You seem to think its ok for gay people to protest a church due to their beliefs but a church cant protest gays because of their beliefs. You are more closed minded than you think. Now about that thread, are you scared to start it. I know I am. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 9:40:02 AM |
You feel descriminated against ----I do not. Which actually proves my point, thank you ;)
Everyone has something good to offer the other.If their rights are violated, they should protest. But, as church is an organization that is to preech against sin and show people the right way.This church felt being gay is the not the right way of life. Are gay people insisting that all others be gay? No... big difference there ;)
The church has a right to discriminate regarding who enters their door... NOT who has a right to a peaceful funeral put on by a church with a different ideological stance than their own... in case you hadn't noticed, THAT is what this is all about...
NOT gay parades. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 10:32:07 AM | he church has a right to discriminate regarding who enters their door.---very true, but a group of gays have no right to protest outside a church because of what goes on inside it.
Which actually proves my point, thank you ;)-- your welcome
NOT who has a right to a peaceful funeral put on by a church with a different ideological stance than their own.--I never claimed this to be ok.
Are gay people insisting that all others be gay? No... big difference there ;)- but they insist others changing thir beliefs on weather its right or wrong. They want to believe its right and be gay/lesbian, fine. But a group of people not thinking its right and dont want to participate have that right as well. Neither should force the issue.What I have noticed about gay men(no offense to straight men)I have more in common with gay men. I know several lesbian women, we get along great. Some tell me off their relationships, thats cool. Now one grabbed my azz. I rejected this behavior. But I reject this behavior from men as well. And before when I said I believe Phelp's church is a bunce of inbreeders, its not onlybecause they can only marry within the church, the fact I read that out of its about 70 members, about 60 are related to each other. There are crimes commited against gays, I am not dening this. But do you actually believe gays dont commit crimes due to sexual advances being rejected or they commit crimes against themselves for pity.
http://www.cwfa.org/articles/8776/CFI/family/index.htm | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 10:50:44 AM |
a group of gays have no right to protest outside a church because of what goes on inside it. Is that the issue here? Didn't think so.
Everything else you have written is off topic and I feel no need to take this thread in an alternate direction....  | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 10:52:41 AM | arieann I went back and read all your post on this issue and just wanted to say, I follow your view points regarding freedom of speech for everyone. One person or group can not or should not be denied their rights to voice their opinion and then give another group the right to shove their voice or opinion in the face of others, who may have a different belief.
We can all speak out against, or for Frank Phelps and his group and their behavior and wither we agree or disagree....isn't the issue here......It's his right to say what he believes, that is at issue in this situation.
Frank Phelps has wanted and pushed for a court date with the supreme court in regards to the first amendment right of Freedom of Speech for years and now he has his opportunity.
He picked a very controversial subject and has been very in your face and vocal about his and his churches beliefs, knowing that at some point, someone was going to contest his right to say what he was. That is why so many states have been reluctant to take on any court case or pass any laws prohibiting his Freedom of Speech Rights.
There is a much bigger picture here, than his and his churches beliefs, their actions and where they chose to voice their beliefs. Trust me when I say....this case will go to the Supreme Court for a final decision on Freedom of Speech Rights.
There may not be anything that any of us like about his actions and behavior.....but we must all agree that under our constitution.....He has a right to believe and say what he does. Our Constitution gives him, you and I those rights. Would we really want it any other way? | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 11:14:28 AM | Gay is wrong, But how was this right? If what you say was meant to hurt someone who was already hurting, I am not so sure you don't need to end up poor for the rest of your life. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 11:19:24 AM | As for only being able or allowed to Marry Within The Church.....that may be a bit misleading....I would venture to say....the members are restricted (by chastising) or encouraged to marrying with those who have similar beliefs and who support the beliefs of the church.
But then, even the Catholic church or Mormon Church encourage this belief and families with strong religious convictions, encourage their children to marry folks with similar convictions.
Frank Philps and his wife have several adult children, some have stayed and aliened with the teachings of their father and some have distanced themselves, but all have married outside the original family unit. Those who have chosen to stay, I feel sure, their children have been indoctrinated to the teachings of their church, from early childhood and know little difference. I read an article on the family and they basically live in what amounts to a square block compound with open area in the back of all their homes, so they are a very interactive family unit, through the generations the family is comprised of. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 12:05:18 PM | sassyaquarius----Everything else you have written is off topic and I feel no need to take this thread in an alternate direction.-- then you should have left me alone after reading post 3.
whisper67520--thank yo for correcting me. I didnt research this church or the Phelps family. I just went by what one article stated. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 12:29:45 PM |
but they insist others changing thir beliefs on weather its right or wrong. They want to believe its right and be gay/lesbian, fine. But a group of people not thinking its right and dont want to participate have that right as well.
This is why you don't seem to understand what this is all about.
It isn't about trying to force people to believe that being gay is right, it is about their right to be gay.
Nothing in the gay rights movement is about forcing anyone to like homosexuality or to believe that it is right for them. People are free to believe what they wish.
Where it becomes a problem is when one group tries to force their practice on others through persecution and discrimination. This is what the church group is attempting to do.
This church is not simply expressing their belief that homosexuality is the wrong choice for them, they are expressing their practice that it is wrong for anyone and seeking to force that practice on everyone through intimidation.
This church IS trying to force people to believe that being gay is wrong, that NO-ONE has any right to be gay and that being gay is legitimate moral grounds (and should be legal grounds) for persecuting them.
The gay groups, however, do none of this (and no, a gay pride parade is not forcing your belief on others. If you don't agree then don't march or watch, no-one is forcing you to. Neither is asking for equal consideration under the law, it no more takes away the rights of heterosexuals than giving women legal person status took away the rights of men). | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 12:35:48 PM | Everyone's replies and gripes are valid. As I said before ,our own life's experiences determine how we view life. Vegeterians claim they do not eat meat, mainly, because they do not want to inflict harm to animals. Well, did anyone ever ask a lettuce leaf how does it feel to be tossed around in a salad ,drowning in salad dressing to be pierced with a fork before being chewed and swallowed?
I know that this is a ridiculous comparison, I only brought this to light to emphasize the fact that .. Into each and every life there is some pain and suffering | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 12:39:56 PM | This church IS trying to force people to believe that being gay is wrong, that NO-ONE has any right to be gay and that being gay is legitimate moral grounds (and should be legal grounds) for persecuting them.
Well said! As for white power parades the only ones I have ever seen is the looney neo nazis or the k.k.k.
The Stormfront White Nationalist Community is a white pride Internet forum with the motto "White Pride World Wide". Many organizations describe it as a neo-Nazi organization, and accuse it of promoting racism, hate speech, and violence.[1][2][3] It has been listed as a hate site, and a number of Internet content filters prevent access to it.[4][5] In Germany, access to Stormfront is blocked by some ISPs in the state of North Rhine-Westphalia.[6][7]
Stormfront is owned by Don Black, a former Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan who was a member of the American Nazi Party in the 1970s.[8][9]In 1981, Black was arrested as he prepared to board a boat stocked with weapons and ammunition to invade Dominica in what he and his accomplices dubbed Operation Red Dog. Black was sentenced to three years in prison for his role in the attempted invasion. He created the website after receiving his first computer training in prison.[10]
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 1:19:29 PM | Just because I have White Pride, does not make me a member of any hate group. Who I choose to associate with and my actions determine wither I am a hate person. I am affiliated with no one other than myself and those members of society who like myself, are proud of who we are, how we live our lives and who we support belief wise. Human pride may be the better word, but the fact remains......I am white.
I am a free thinker. I do not need to alien myself with anyone else other than those who view a pride in who and what we stand for. Being white/female/American/heterosexual/compassionate/loving/with intregrety. I will alien myself with anyone who is honest/has intregrety/morals/and respect for all other of Gods creatures, be they brown, yellow or green.
Will I participate in behavior I do not personally agree with? No and I don't have to explain that to anyone else, nor do I have to parade myself for any cause I disagree with, but I do have the right to parade and speak out to what I feel is correct for myself, when others feel the need to attract attention to their beliefs.
In no way do I support the manner in which Frank Philips and his group choose to demonstrate, but I do support his right to voice his opinion and beliefs. The format that he chooses, I personally find disgusting and it's my right to ignore him. I find his venue of voicing his message upsetting, but I also find I have an aversion to having same sex people, kissing and pawing all over each other in my presence, a turn off. So then I have a choice.....Stay and be subjected or walk away.
This does not make me a hate person.......it just points out.....I have a different belief system and under our constitution, that is my God Given Right. Freedom can not be given to just a choice few.......we either all have it or none of us do. Gays can parade, picket for changes in laws and voice their opinions, but it also gives all others the right to picket, parade and voice opinions also.......does not make it a hate crime....just differences of opinion. Granted by our Constitution. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 1:49:32 PM | Jed----This church IS trying to force people to believe that being gay is wrong, that NO-ONE has any right to be gay and that being gay is legitimate moral grounds (and should be legal grounds) for persecuting them.
Yes, this is exactly what the church is doing-- but gay protesters outside churches are them forcing the belief that its ok to be gay on the church. They both are forcing their beliefs, why is one wrong for it but not the other?
As for white power parades-- I am not asking about a white "power" parade, I am asking about a white 'pride' parade. | |
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| Church pays through the nose for its bigotry
Posted: 11/4/2007 1:59:18 PM | Yes, this is exactly what the church is doing-- but gay protesters outside churches are them forcing the belief that its ok to be gay on the church. They both are forcing their beliefs, why is one wrong for it but not the other?
Homosexuals and Jews dominated Nazi Germany...just as they now dominate this doomed U.S.A....The Jews now wander the earth despised, smitten with moral and spiritual blindness by a divine judicial stroke...And god has smitten Jews with a certain unique madness, whereby they are an astonishment of heart, a proverb, and a byword (the butt of jokes and ridicule) among all peoples whither the Lord has driven and scattered them...Jews, thus perverted, out of all proportion to their numbers energize the militant sodomite agenda...The American Jews are the real Nazis (misusers and abusers of governmental power) who hate God and the rule of law." If you can't see the difference between phelps hate speech and a peaceful protest there is nothing furthur to discuss. | |
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